Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => Freewheeling => Racing => Topic started by: mr magnolia on 04 July, 2010, 12:10:39 am
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do we have one of these threads yet for this years race?
I watched a little of the Grand Depart team intros, and was quite taken with Mr Armstrongs approach and attitude as displayed. I'd been expecting him to be very defensive, in light of the current UCI / testing / Landis / 'Armstrongs last tour' - surely no connection (ha ha) type stuff thats going around.
Mr Wiggins seemed cool, and the Schleck Stormtroopers seemed a little bit like Armstrong and Contador were last year - not quite sure of how or what to say regarding their thoughts and tactics.
Didn't get to see Mr Cancellara's motor bike though!
Greatly looking forward to the next 3 weeks, especially given that maison magnolia has Eurosport now, courtesy of our Virgin TV thing. :thumbsup:
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Well done Lance. I find it hard to like the man but have to admire his grit and determination. Mind you you could say the same about many great sportsman. David Millar did really well too.
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Didn't get to see Mr Cancellara's motor bike though!
I assume by now that we'd have heard if the post race airport scanner devices had spotted anything untoward in the bike itself, so I can only assume that he's now gone a step further and implanted the motors in his thighs. That would also explain why they're so big ;) Still, I still don't understand the funny 'button pressing' motions of his hands on the brake hoods in the Spring Classics.
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I'm not sure what Sky's strategy was - could this be inexperience of Grand Tours at the team management level?
If Wiggo is targeting the Yellow jersey, then why did he gamble on the weather for the Prologue? This suggests a lack of focus.
In sailing, there is a widely practiced strategy which is to "follow the fleet" unless you are so far down that a gamble is worthwhile and so you take a different route and hope that the weather favours you over the fleet. The idea is that everyone will be disadvantaged or will benefit from the shifts in the winds. If this was the last TT of the race (and this is hypothetical because they wouldn't be allowed to choose the start order then) and Wiggo was nearly out of the running for a good GC place, then a gamble like this would have been worthwhile.
As it happens, if Wiggo had gone at his alloted time, he would have had the better weather that Contador et al benefited from. Had they got the weather right, Sky would only have lost to non-serious GC contenders such as Tony Martin and David Millar.
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Agreed. Stupid tactic to go it alone like that, he's lucky the roads didn't dry out even more than they did.
Those lost 30 seconds could haunt him for the entire tour.
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Looking beyond Wiggins, Sky had two riders in the Top Ten in the prologue, as did Garmin. Last year's pivotal moment was a break in crosswind conditions. A combined Sky/Garmin break in similar conditions would be interesting, but the whole peleton is watching out for that I suppose, but if it comes down to echelons there won't be any stopping them. I don't know how they would be able to isolate Armstrong in order to put Millar in yellow.
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Wiggo bottled it yesterday. Played it slightly too safe.
When Millar was interviewed after the ride, he made a point of saying the course "wasn't too technical, even in the wet" - a very thinly veiled dig at his ex-team-mate, I thought. ;D
Great ride by Geraint Thomas.
And by Tony Martin. Whose girlfriend is hot. The jammy beggar. Great cyclist and top totty magnet too. Curse him.
d.
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Danish tv2 have a camera in HTC Columbias wagon.
Comments between Brian Holm to Adam Hansen shows how tough these guys are
Adam says he think the collar bone is broken and he's having problems sitting in the rear of the peloton.
Brian : Go to the front and work until you can't any more, it's better than being dumped behind.
And the bloody rider goes straight to the front and works his A**e off trying to catch the 3 in front. ::-)
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Agreed. Stupid tactic to go it alone like that, he's lucky the roads didn't dry out even more than they did.
Those lost 30 seconds could haunt him for the entire tour.
But if the roads were just as likely to get wetter, then he made as good a gamble as anyone. Surely?
I don't know what the procedure is here - were the riders just picking from the 9 slots allocated to their team? Could they check what "the fleet" were doing before picking their slot?
We know how fickle forecasts are in GB - I can't imagine Dutch ones are much better at predicting summer rain +/- 1 hour.
Also, maybe Wiggo knows damn well he's not the favourite, so any gamble is worth taking, at least until he is in a healthy lead.
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Was Cav at fault in the first crash, the one at the hairpin? Looked like it to me. He overcooked it and ran wide, taking three other riders with him, including Freire. Silly boy.
d.
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It was a bit crash central of the final few kms today. Crashing early may have saved Cav a worse crash further on!
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Looks that way.
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Was Cav at fault in the first crash, the one at the hairpin? Looked like it to me. He overcooked it and ran wide, taking three other riders with him, including Freire. Silly boy.
d.
Chris B has just voiced the same opinion..
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The ITV4 bods seemed to think it was Cav's fault as well, although they couldn't work out who caused the crash at 500m, something seems to have happened in the middle of the pack.
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I read an interview recently, where someone said that a couple of teams had worked out home to beat Cav. I'm guseeing that could involve a lot of rough-housing a couple of k's out, either pushing him into a compromising position, or getting him rattled. Just a thought.
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Not exactly a triumph of course design today, was it?
TdF course designer: "I know, let's have a needless, almost 180 degree hairpin right before the final sprint. That should cause some crashes. And I know what else. How about some barriers with feet that stick out into the road. Oh, and hang on a minute. Check this one out, mon ami. Let's reduce the width of the course as it nears the finish line."
Other TdF person: "Oui. Tres bien."
???
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Tee Hee
YouTube
- Commuter Dreams
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI7T2iuGjjc)
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Not exactly a triumph of course design today, was it?
TdF course designer: "I know, let's have a needless, almost 180 degree hairpin right before the final sprint. That should cause some crashes. And I know what else. How about some barriers with feet that stick out into the road. Oh, and hang on a minute. Check this one out, mon ami. Let's reduce the width of the course as it nears the finish line."
Other TdF person: "Oui. Tres bien."
???
It's the finish they use in the Paris Brussels, these first few days are a nod to the classics, as a counterweight to the '100 Years of the Pyrenees'. They perhaps need to temper symbolism and nostalgia with a long cold look at modern road conditions, especially traffic calming. It proved Sherwin's oft-stated adage about riding in the first 15 though.
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I only caught the highlights. Did Phil come up with his regular line about how its "not safe to be at the back of the peleton" (he was right today)?
I though I might keep count of how many times he utters this this tour ;D
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I read an interview recently, where someone said that a couple of teams had worked out home to beat Cav. I'm guseeing that could involve a lot of rough-housing a couple of k's out, either pushing him into a compromising position, or getting him rattled. Just a thought.
I think we can expect a few Cervelo breakaways just before intermediate sprints, especially when Cavendish needs those points.
Watched the stage just north of Meise today. Great atmosphere. Will watch it tomorrow on some of the Ardennes hills and tuesday near Namur and the penultimate cobbles stretch.
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Lance Armstrong reveals secret weapon in Tour de France - Liverpool Echo - A Cyclist's Life
(http://blogs.liverpoolecho.co.uk/acyclistslife/2010/07/lance-armstrong-reveals-secret-1.html)
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Lance Armstrong reveals secret weapon in Tour de France - Liverpool Echo - A Cyclist's Life
(http://blogs.liverpoolecho.co.uk/acyclistslife/2010/07/lance-armstrong-reveals-secret-1.html)
Excellent ! ;D
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WTF was happening today.
Too dangerous? Did they ease up after the Passage de Gois in 1999 or after the cobbles in 2004? No the contenders got on with it and put the hammer down.
Deprived the green jersey contenders and sprinters of their moment of glory (and the fans who waited of the excitement)
IMO Cancellara abused the authority of the yellow jersey to protect Saxo's GC contender, Shleck, who was one of the riders affected by the mele.
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The big beneficiary of Spartacus today was Cav. I bet Hushovd was well p'd off.
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I've unticked Racing from my ignore boards preferences (as I don't want to know the result before I catch up) to post this but is there a quicker way of watching the nightly synopsis than waiting for itv player to schedule it ?
Martin
(Freeview outcast)
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Part of the Belgian TV coverage usually pops up at youtube sooner or later, quite often fairly soon after the finish.
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Lance Armstrong reveals secret weapon in Tour de France - Liverpool Echo - A Cyclist's Life
(http://blogs.liverpoolecho.co.uk/acyclistslife/2010/07/lance-armstrong-reveals-secret-1.html)
Thanks.
I wondered what Jack Eason was up to these days. :thumbsup:
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There was an odd noise coming from Boardman's bike when he was doing his ride of the end of the course. They should scan it for motors.
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IMO Cancellara abused the authority of the yellow jersey to protect Saxo's GC contender, Shleck, who was one of the riders affected by the mele.
Glad I'm not the only one who had that thought. Very suspect behaviour. If I was Hushovd, I'd be livid.
d.
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Hushovd does appear to have made the noises of a rather grumpy man after the stage.
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Very pleased for Chavanel though. He deserves it more than most.
d.
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IMO Cancellara abused the authority of the yellow jersey to protect Saxo's GC contender, Shleck, who was one of the riders affected by the mele.
Glad I'm not the only one who had that thought. Very suspect behaviour. If I was Hushovd, I'd be livid.
d.
Schleck would have been well stuffed if the sprinters teams put the hammer down in the closing kilometres.
Hushovd missed a good chance to score points on Cav too.
What next - riders getting onto buses on the top of a Pyrenean climb and all starting at the same time gaps when the bus has taken them safely down the descent?
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It's an interesting problem, the inclusion of elements of the classics can be seen as a criticism of riders who build their season around the Tour to the exclusion of the great one day races, but you can't really expect to have a series of one day races in a three week tour. What the Peleton expects is a first week where a suicide breakaway is reeled in by the sprinter's trains and the GC contenders get to stretch their legs in the early stage of the chase down or lead out. They don't want to be involved in a proper race. Will we see Voigt, Contador and Armstrong on the front today, essentially neutralising the race until after the cobbles?
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IMO Cancellara abused the authority of the yellow jersey to protect Saxo's GC contender, Shleck, who was one of the riders affected by the mele.
I agree. He took his authority slightly too far. I'd not have been pleased had I been waiting at the finish for 4 hours to see the sprint.
Good on Chavanel, though. Great ride. I think this is the first year in ages I've not put him in my fantasy team. ::-)
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Reading the riders quotes this morning, it seems evident that something was seriously wrong on that descent - oil seems to be a common thought. To have riders with such proven bike skills as Armstrong suddenly go down on a straight piece of road says everything. Cancellara - and Contador - were absolutely correct to take it upon themselves to neutralise the stage for a while at least. I'm less convinced about maintaining the neutralisation all the way to the finish though.
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It was Armstrong who used crashes and mayhem on dangerous roads to his advantage on the Passage de Gois in 1999 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T66LLvqgZS4) - no neutralisation there - just put the hammer down and get on with the job of winning the Tour. Can't find a video but he did the same when the Tour used the Paris-Roubaix cobblestones in 2004.
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I hope that today is different, every one knows the cobbles are coming and should be ready for them. Yesterdays decent having such poor conditions caught a number of people by supprise and Cancellara was correct to neutralise the race to let the GC contenders catch up. However I believe he should have allowed the sprinters their chance though I am unsure why Cav was so far off the back, unless he just didn't bother trying to catch up.
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The pertinent question is this: would Cancellara have been so keen to neutralise the race if it hadn't been his team affected?
d.
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From Cycling News
Alberto Contador (Astana) - 81st on stage, 7th overall @ 3:24: "It was a really crazy stage. On this road it was impossible not to fall. I fell on a straight part at about 60 km/h. I saw at every turn there were people on the ground, it was impossible to go without falling.
“As soon as I heard that Andy was behind I ordered all my teammates to stop. As I wished he'd do with me, I had to do with him. [There was disagreement] with some teams who wanted to go ahead in spite of everything, because there were many dangerous riders in front too. In the end they acted with logic and decided to stop in front too.”
Contador's living in a dream. IIRC Schleck was 6' down at one point according to the live feed on Eurosport. I really believe if Schleck hadn't been caught in the mele, Saxo would have put the hammer down and used the situation to their advantage.
If I had my way all the riders who damaged bikes in the crash would have had to pump the blacksmith bellows themselves to fix them too ;)
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I hope that today is different, every one knows the cobbles are coming and should be ready for them. Yesterdays decent having such poor conditions caught a number of people by supprise and Cancellara was correct to neutralise the race to let the GC contenders catch up. However I believe he should have allowed the sprinters their chance though I am unsure why Cav was so far off the back, unless he just didn't bother trying to catch up.
I was standing by the roadside at the Wanne and abt. 2km after the intermediate sprint. The first 5-6 chasing groups were really trying hard to close the gap. The last groups weren't, a.o. the group Petacchi. Didn't see in which group Cavendish was riding though.
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There was an odd noise coming from Boardman's bike when he was doing his ride of the end of the course. They should scan it for motors.
It took me a while to realise that it was coming from the electric buggy :-[
The road was obviously slippery but I wonder what effect carbon rims have in modulating braking in those conditions? I've heard they can be grabby?
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The pertinent question is this: would Cancellara have been so keen to neutralise the race if it hadn't been his team affected?
d.
Yes, it is pertinent.
But then he threw away the yellow jersey, so it doesn't seem clear-cut to me.
And anyway, Contador et al could have ignored him. Had the Schlecks lost 3min, I doubt Cancellara could have negotiated an amnesty with the commisaires after the event.
(You lot have seen GC contenders waiting for crahsed rivals before, haven't you? It's not exactly unprecedented.)
I think the cobbles will be different - they're a known challenge, like a climb.
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(You lot have seen GC contenders waiting for crahsed rivals before, haven't you? It's not exactly unprecedented.)
Yes, of course - I remember Ullrich throwing away his chances of winning one year by waiting for Lance after an incident with a musette...
So yeah, I take your point but I'm not wholly convinced. Like you say, it's not clear cut - either way.
Cancellara was never going to hang on to the yellow jersey for very long anyway. Keeping Andy Schleck within sight of the race was always his priority. I'm still not sure why the sprinters weren't given leave to contest the finish, though.
Today's stage could be very interesting. Some riders are going very tired and sore after yesterday. It's ripe for an attack. Could a repeat of this year's Giro stage 7 (http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/93rd-giro-ditalia-gt/stage-7/results) be on the cards?
d.
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(You lot have seen GC contenders waiting for crahsed rivals before, haven't you? It's not exactly unprecedented.)
The classic one being Ullrich waiting for Armstrong on the Alp de Huez (?) when the latter wrapped a spectators shopping bag round his handlebars - how did Armstrong re-pay the courtesy ;D
edit: beat me to it CS
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I'm still not sure why the sprinters weren't given leave to contest the finish, though.
Yup, would have been nice to have a sprint for 2nd. But I guess the problem was that not all the sprinters had crashed, so some sprinters had been 'forced' to wait for the others ... and so on ...
So a fair compromise, IMHO. You couldn't please everyone.
Today's stage could be very interesting. Some riders are going very tired and sore after yesterday. It's ripe for an attack.
Oooh yes, I may watch this one live :thumbsup:
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Re: Ullrich
Didn't he ride into a ditch one year, and his rivals waited for him?
I'll never forget him riding into the ditch - pure slapstick - but I cannot remember the other riders involved ...
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The organisation seems to have wanted to tell a story about the classics and all year round cyclists. The presentation of the harlequin jersey to Merckx by Hinault in Brussels and the routing through Eddy's home town were part of that narrative.
Armstrong responded by not participating in the roll-out in Brussels.
The actual story has become the responsibility of the elder statesmen of the Tour to ensure that the event is do-able. The next chapter might be a reassuring meeting with Voigt and some sort of accomodation as over the proposed radio ban. The story of aggrieved workers rebelling against a management wanting to alter the ground rules would resonate well at the moment.
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Yup, would have been nice to have a sprint for 2nd. But I guess the problem was that not all the sprinters had crashed, so some sprinters had been 'forced' to wait for the others ... and so on ...
Never mind the sprinters, I'm a bit non-plussed as to why Maxime Montfort didn't give it some beans in the last 500m when he saw the peloton closing him down very very slowly. The worst that could have happened was that the sprinters chased him back into the bunch.
Had I stood in the rain for five hours awaiting an exciting finish, I would now be seeking out Mr Cancellara with a bag of rotten vegetables in one hand and Mr Shovel in the other.
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Had I stood in the rain for five hours awaiting an exciting finish, I would now be seeking out Mr Cancellara with a bag of rotten vegetables in one hand and Mr Shovel in the other.
I agree - a stupid, petulent and thoughtless act. they need to remember who, ultimately, pays their wages.
The riders and teams knew the route and knew that it might rain. If they chose to race on their normal 22mm tubs and not slow down enough on the gnarly bits it's entirely their fault.
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Re: Ullrich
Didn't he ride into a ditch one year, and his rivals waited for him?
I'll never forget him riding into the ditch - pure slapstick - but I cannot remember the other riders involved ...
That was the 2001 Tour - IIRC, it looked from the initial camera view like Ullrich had ridden off a cliff. Armstrong actually waited for him on that occasion.
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I thought neutralising the stage was outrageous behaviour.
I've always heaped praise on the Grand Tour riders for their rufty tuftiness; perfect example - Adam Hansen on Stage 1 - continues to lead out the peloton, despite a broken collar bone.
So to have them give up racing for the day because it was a bit tricky was a poor show. I hope they get docked a days pay.
Chris Boardman had it right - sure, ease up whilst those who crashed get back on, but then restart racing. If I'd been in the crowd at the finish, I'd have been booing and throwing veg >:(.
God knows what's going to happen today. It's not like they didn't know about the difficult bits... ::-)
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Some reports are saying that the organisers considered cancelling the stage, but that the crashes were too dispersed to allow it under the rules. The compromise that emerged was interesting, Cancellara was seen in discussion with a Quickstep rider prior to reaching a deal with the race director, sealed with a handshake. The non-awarding of points shows the official nature of that agreement. Having Chavanel in yellow is useful, he's French, won't win and takes the pressure off.
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The narrow roads also prevented the team cars getting to the riders, some had support, others didn't, a complete lottery, Andy Schleck rode off on a bike from a shorter team-mate.
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I can vaguely recall a previous occasion (but can't recall the circumstances or the race) when an agreement was reached to allow the sprint finish to go ahead but that everyone in the bunch would be awarded the same time. I think that would have been more reasonable yesterday - the sprinters would have got their points and the crowd would have had an exciting finish. I don't see what a safety issue with the road miles back had to do with the road at the finish which seemed to be quite safe for a sprint.
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Fair play to the riders yesterday. I am sure I heard one Eurosport a couple of motorcycle riders had gone down as well as the riders.
I get the feeling something wasnt right with road, deliberate spillage etc.
Be interesting to see how Quick Step get treated from now on though.
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Fair play to the riders yesterday. I am sure I heard one Eurosport a couple of motorcycle riders had gone down as well as the riders.
I get the feeling something wasnt right with road, deliberate spillage etc.
Be interesting to see how Quick Step get treated from now on though.
I read that there was fuel on the road as a result of one of the motor cycle riders crashing. Didn't apply to the road for the remaining kilometres tho' and no reason to ruin the day for Hushovd and other green jersey contenders.
I could accept a temporary truce/re-group but not neutralisation for the rest of the stage. Still think a dirty tactic from Riis/Cancellara to protect their GC contender
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Surely this is all about respecting the yellow jersey, its Cancellara's call as he was wearing it.
We will never know what would have happened if his team mate hadnt crashed, but all the other teams went along with it, bar one.
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Surely this is all about respecting the yellow jersey
What a crap concept that is. It's a bike race for heaven's sake. Race.
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Surely this is all about respecting the yellow jersey
What a crap concept that is. It's a bike race for heaven's sake. Race.
I don't agree, I think it's partly a means by which a journeyman cyclist becomes a master, and it's the duty of masters such as Cancellara to aid young aspirants, this in a semi-symbolic sense of course.
Compagnons du Tour de France - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compagnons_du_Tour_de_France)
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I thought it was something called 'sportsmanship'. I do understand that this is a terribly old-fashioned concept, and maybe not welcome in this modern society.
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I thought it was something called 'sportsmanship'. I do understand that this is a terribly old-fashioned concept, and maybe not welcome in this modern society.
So it's 'sportsmanship' that deprived Hushovd the chance of gaining points over his rivals in the green jersey?
Hushovd rode a good race, kept out of trouble and got to the finish with the peloton whilst green jersey holder Petachi finished over 9 mins down (?6 down on Hushovd).
Why was the race for the points jersey 'neutralised', whereas the race for GC wasn't (ie Cavendish still lost 9+ mins and wasn't given the same time as the peloton)?
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Today's stage is nuts!
Looking at those cobbled sections makes me think "Hell, those roads are almost as bad as Essex...".
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So it's 'sportsmanship' that deprived Hushovd the chance of gaining points over his rivals in the green jersey?
Yes - it wouldn't really be sportsmanship if noone lost out, would it.
Think of it like karma - maybe Hushovd has had, or will have, a favour from another rider one day. :)
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Today's stage is nuts!
Aye, abso-flipping-lutely mental! Properly exciting. :thumbsup:
d.
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I thought it was something called 'sportsmanship'. I do understand that this is a terribly old-fashioned concept, and maybe not welcome in this modern society.
So it's 'sportsmanship' that deprived Hushovd the chance of gaining points over his rivals in the green jersey?
Hushovd rode a good race, kept out of trouble and got to the finish with the peloton whilst green jersey holder Petachi finished over 9 mins down (?6 down on Hushovd).
Why was the race for the points jersey 'neutralised', whereas the race for GC wasn't (ie Cavendish still lost 9+ mins and wasn't given the same time as the peloton)?
Green jersey is for winning the sprint. The main sprinters weren't there to contend the sprint, so . . .
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So it's 'sportsmanship' that deprived Hushovd the chance of gaining points over his rivals in the green jersey?
Yes - it wouldn't really be sportsmanship if noone lost out, would it.
Think of it like karma - maybe Hushovd has had, or will have, a favour from another rider one day. :)
But the decision was made by a rider who was more concerned with the race for GC, it wasn't made by Hushovd, it's a decision that Hushovd wasn't happy with, but forced to accept due to peer pressure.
The cycnic in me still believes Cancellara's action had nothing to do with sportsmanship, but was purely a tactic to protect the interests of his teams GC contender, Schleck.
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I thought it was something called 'sportsmanship'. I do understand that this is a terribly old-fashioned concept, and maybe not welcome in this modern society.
So it's 'sportsmanship' that deprived Hushovd the chance of gaining points over his rivals in the green jersey?
Hushovd rode a good race, kept out of trouble and got to the finish with the peloton whilst green jersey holder Petachi finished over 9 mins down (?6 down on Hushovd).
Why was the race for the points jersey 'neutralised', whereas the race for GC wasn't (ie Cavendish still lost 9+ mins and wasn't given the same time as the peloton)?
Green jersey is for winning the sprint. The main sprinters weren't there to contend the sprint, so . . .
Hushovd would have got the points for staying out of trouble and getting to the finish with the main peloton?
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... and round we go again ...
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Excellent stage, vindicates the organisation I reckon. Better than a mountain stage any day.
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"Hell, those roads are almost as bad as Essex...".
Oi!! Watch it, sunshine :P
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Think of it like karma - maybe Hushovd has had, or will have, a favour from another rider one day. :)
Hushovd gets a win and the green jersey and Frank Schleck crashes out?
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The stage the organisers wanted.
They knew the cobbles were comming so why stay on 23mm tubs and puncture instead of using a bigger tire they have to add balast to the bikes so why not in larger tyres that will not pinch flat?
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The stage the organisers wanted.
They knew the cobbles were comming so why stay on 23mm tubs and p*nct*r* instead of using a bigger tire they have to add balast to the bikes so why not in larger tyres that will not pinch flat?
Tubs can't pinch flat, there's no sharp edge to snakebite on.
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How long can they persuade Thomas that he's still working for Bradley. I foresee a film; 'Geraint Thomas and the Hexagon of Self Deception'.
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The stage the organisers wanted.
They knew the cobbles were comming so why stay on 23mm tubs and p*nct*r* instead of using a bigger tire they have to add balast to the bikes so why not in larger tyres that will not pinch flat?
I know that Saxobank was using special bikes for this stage with a more comfy geometry so I'll guess they used slightly wider tubs too.
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How long can they persuade Thomas that he's still working for Bradley. I foresee a film; 'Geraint Thomas and the Hexagon of Self Deception'.
How do you know that Brailsford hasn't had a cunning plan from the start?
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The stage the organisers wanted.
They knew the cobbles were comming so why stay on 23mm tubs and p*nct*r* instead of using a bigger tire they have to add balast to the bikes so why not in larger tyres that will not pinch flat?
I know that Saxobank was using special bikes for this stage with a more comfy geometry so I'll guess they used slightly wider tubs too.
I expect that the relatively short distance over the cobbles had something to do with tyre choice.
What a ride by Thomas! Top fella. Could have only been better if he'd sneaked the yellow jersey. Best flat stage in a very long time. :thumbsup:
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Green jersey is for winning the sprint.
Up to a point, Lord Copper.
You don't have to win any stages to win the green jersey, just finish consistently high in the stage placings. And it hasn't always been a specialist sprinter who's won it overall - eg Jalabert and Merckx.
d.
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What a ride by Thomas! Top fella. Could have only been better if he'd sneaked the yellow jersey. Best flat stage in a very long time. :thumbsup:
Third change of jersey in 10 days, he's out of the National champion's top and into the Maillot Blanc. let's hope he's got into a shirt changing habit.
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How do you know that Brailsford hasn't had a cunning plan from the start?
Good point - let's not forget, he said "a British rider" would win the TdF within five years, not necessarily Wiggo. Maybe he signed Wiggo as a smokescreen to put the pack off the scent and disguise his true intentions. ;D
Btw, does today's result mean Thomas takes the white jersey off Martin?
[edit: ESL answered my question even as I was typing it.]
d.
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So. Thomas is from Wales. There are some hills in Wales. Does this mean he can climb, or doesn't anyone know yet?
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Boardman, part of the inner circle at BC said Thomas has the same size engine as Wiggins and has lost a lot of weight and he can't wait for the mountains !!
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Excellent stage, vindicates the organisation I reckon. Better than a mountain stage any day.
It was a corker for sure.
GO GERAINT!! ;D
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So. Thomas is from Wales. There are some hills in Wales. Does this mean he can climb, or doesn't anyone know yet?
I filmed him at the Nationals,
YouTube
- Broadcast Yourself.
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_eody32kQk)
That was a 7.5 km circuit with a lot of climbing, tackled 15 times in very hot conditions, Jeremy Hunt caused an early break and Thomas responded with Kennaugh and Stannard. Thomas was clearly still within his comfort zone at the end.
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Wow, I haven't enjoyed a flat stage so much for ages. Felt sorry for Chavanel though. Three mechanicals is a bit tough.
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Yes, that was a bit mad. The cobbles do seem to bugger up bikes very easily, and if you're unfortunate like Sylvain Chavanel, that's your time in Yellow buggered, which does seem a bit harsh. Still, sometimes getting into Yellow (or loosing it) can be down to a certain amount of luck, as well as planning and effort.
I would imagine those cobbles are pretty uncomfortable if you're bimbling along. Clearly hammering along them at speed utterly takes it out of you. The riders coming into the finish didn't seem to have that last bit of oomph that they normally hit the line with, a lot of them just seemed to be glad to be at the end, and this was the leaders, not the lantern rouge, who you expect to look like death lightly warmed over.
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So. Thomas is from Wales. There are some hills in Wales. Does this mean he can climb, or doesn't anyone know yet?
Nah. He's British! At least for the moment. ;)
Andy Murray. Now there's a Scotsman. Definitely not British.
Chris Boardman seems to think Thomas will climb well. I reckon he's on to something there!
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What a fantastic stage but I'm very sorry to see Frank Schleck out, and of course Christian Vandevelde from yesterday. Strange tactics from Vino at the finish, I guess he just put his head down and got carried away. Top ride of the day must surely go to Andy Schleck, who would've thought that one of the top climbers would finish so high up on the pave ? Glad to see Spartacus back in yellow and to see Hushovd's win (I'm sure G's time will come).
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Any one know how badly injured Frank Schleck is ?
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Luxembourg's Frank Schleck has become the latest big name to withdraw from an accident-strewn Tour de France.
The Saxo Bank rider, who finished fifth last year, suffered a broken collarbone after falling in a cobbled sector of the 213km third stage on Tuesday. ...
So not good, but it could have been worse. Typical racing cyclist injury.
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When Boardman says Thomas has a good engine he's referring to this from Geraint's Wikipaedia page.
On 30 October 2009, Thomas set the fastest pursuit time under current rules when he completed 4 kilometes in 4 minutes 15.105 seconds at the first round of the 2009–2010 UCI Track Cycling World Cup Classics in Manchester Velodrome. The time is only supassed by Chris Boardman, 4 minutes 11.114 seconds, set in 1996 on a bicycle position that has since been banned.
It tends to suggest that he might need holding back.
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What's he like at time-trialling on open roads though? He did brilliantly in the prologue but that's more like a sprint compared to a full TT. Looks like he's already shaping up to be this year's surprise package. Great stuff from the young Welshman/Brit.
d.
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Nicolas Roche was doing Ireland proud today too.
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We mustn't forget the great performance of Steve Cummings, his presence in the initial seven man break for Sky enabled Thomas to police the Cancellara/Schleck group, Geraint was last wheel for a lot of the time.
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What's he like at time-trialling on open roads though?
Judging by the Dauphine, very good. Coincidentally he finished only 10 seconds slower than Contador in both the prologue and the 46km ITT. He's a better than average climber and is improving. And he's a solid sprinter/consistent finisher (held the green jersey after the 6th stage and finished 5th in the green jersey competition). But he's not as good as Wiggins. Yet.
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When Boardman says Thomas has a good engine he's referring to this from Geraint's Wikipaedia page.
I doubt he has to read Wikipaedia to know about Thomas's physiology, he would have been tested enough times as part of the British Team. The relevant part in my post was that he said his engine is as good as Wiggins.
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I would imagine those cobbles are pretty uncomfortable if you're bimbling along. Clearly hammering along them at speed utterly takes it out of you. The riders coming into the finish didn't seem to have that last bit of oomph that they normally hit the line with, a lot of them just seemed to be glad to be at the end, and this was the leaders, not the lantern rouge, who you expect to look like death lightly warmed over.
Hammering makes them a lot smoother. I watched at the Tilloy-les-Marchiennes stretch. In the front groups the riders looked relatively at ease, Hushovd even having the time&energy to look around. Towards the back of the pack the riders looked terrible and I heard lot's of curses (especialy from riders hitting an especially nasty cobble in the verge). Also lot's of riders with crash-damage.
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Thomas also won that British Road Race in Pendle which Millar equated to a mountain stage of the tour. I'm trying not to get too excited.
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Thomas also won that British Road Race in Pendle which Millar equated to a mountain stage of the tour. I'm trying not to get too excited.
The competition will be much better in the Tour though. It'll be hotter and the hills are longer and higher. He will fail to show.
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He will fail to show.
'Kin 'ell lad. Top Flight optimism from t' Northern judge there :thumbsup:.
Nice work. I thought I was on a downer this evening... but I've been outclassed! ;)
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and the other racers will not be saving their legs for the Tour like they were at the Nationals.
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and the other racers will not be saving their legs for the Tour like they were at the Nationals.
A rule of thumb is that the best performances come 10 days after a maximal effort, so Wiggins should be to the fore in the next couple of days, to be on top form with Thomas in the Pyrenees.
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I would imagine those cobbles are pretty uncomfortable if you're bimbling along. Clearly hammering along them at speed utterly takes it out of you. The riders coming into the finish didn't seem to have that last bit of oomph that they normally hit the line with, a lot of them just seemed to be glad to be at the end, and this was the leaders, not the lantern rouge, who you expect to look like death lightly warmed over.
Hammering makes them a lot smoother. I watched at the Tilloy-les-Marchiennes stretch. In the front groups the riders looked relatively at ease, Hushovd even having the time&energy to look around. Towards the back of the pack the riders looked terrible and I heard lot's of curses (especialy from riders hitting an especially nasty cobble in the verge). Also lot's of riders with crash-damage.
I've not ridden on pavé, but I've ridden rigid and hardtail MTBs on long stretches of trails that have been cut up by horses' hooves and then dried out, and that's probably got a similar "eternal cattlegrid" effect.
Best way to tackle stuff like that was big ring, full gas... if you're going fast enough, you'll just skim over the tops of the cobbles/hoofprints*. ;) Using a bigger gear also reduces the chain shake that was quite evident in footage of one of the Sky riders near the end of the stage.
* delete according to cycling discipline.
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Think of it like karma - maybe Hushovd has had, or will have, a favour from another rider one day. :)
Hushovd gets a win and the green jersey and Frank Schleck crashes out?
Well there you go. See, sportsmanship pays :)
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Cancellara and Schleck seemed to be letting Thor sit on their wheel without asking him to do any work yesterday.
At one point, it looked like Cancellara tried to wave Evans through to take his turn on the front but Evans is a shameless wheelsucker. And I suspect Thomas was just hanging on for dear life.
So yeah, they gave Thor the stage. Karma works.
d.
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Cancellara back in yellow and Schleck kept in the game. They didn't have time to play games although Cancellara did try to break. The big winner of that lot was Evans.
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Think of it like karma - maybe Hushovd has had, or will have, a favour from another rider one day. :)
Hushovd gets a win and the green jersey and Frank Schleck crashes out?
Well there you go. See, sportsmanship pays :)
;)
Hushovd :)
Schleck :(
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And I suspect Thomas was just hanging on for dear life.
That's what he wanted them to think. He got 2nd in the sprint! You don't get to the finish line in the top 6 after all those cobbled sections by "just hanging on". I remember him going for sprints in the Dauphine this year and wondering if he was developing into a sprinter.
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Came across a section of cobbles next to the Loire earlier this year. Approaching it on the tandem at 20 anna bit mph, eased up to about 15mph to hit the first cobbles. By the time we got to the other end of the section we had settled to a steady speed of about 6mph.
I found a new level of respect for the riders of l'enfer du nord.
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And I suspect Thomas was just hanging on for dear life.
That's what he wanted them to think. He got 2nd in the sprint! You don't get to the finish line in the top 6 after all those cobbled sections by "just hanging on". I remember him going for sprints in the Dauphine this year and wondering if he was developing into a sprinter.
He could also argue that he didn't want to 'share the pace' as Sky team leader Wiggins was in the chasing group - an acceptable reason for sitting on the back
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And I suspect Thomas was just hanging on for dear life.
That's what he wanted them to think. He got 2nd in the sprint! You don't get to the finish line in the top 6 after all those cobbled sections by "just hanging on". I remember him going for sprints in the Dauphine this year and wondering if he was developing into a sprinter.
Remember he won the junior Paris Roubaix a few years back!
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...
He could also argue that [Thomas] didn't want to 'share the pace' as Sky team leader Wiggins was in the chasing group - an acceptable reason for sitting on the back
Yes, agree with that.
I think it was inevitable that Saxo would do all the work. Only Evans had any interest in time gained; and the Saxo riders were more likely to win the stage than him (either with a Spartacus long run, or simply thru team tactics).
So really those two just had to get on with it. Which they did :thumbsup:
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Came across a section of cobbles next to the Loire earlier this year. Approaching it on the tandem at 20 anna bit mph, eased up to about 15mph to hit the first cobbles. By the time we got to the other end of the section we had settled to a steady speed of about 6mph.
I found a new level of respect for the riders of l'enfer du nord.
Every time I ride over Batley market place which is about 50 metres I feel exactly the same .
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Without Frank Schleck, Jens Voigt is going to have to do a metric fuckton of work in the Scenery if Schleck 2 is going to be in with a chance.
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They knew the cobbles were comming so why stay on 23mm tubs and p*nct*r* instead of using a bigger tire they have to add balast to the bikes so why not in larger tyres that will not pinch flat?
It looks like most teams had bigger tyre/tubs and some had different bikes. VeloNews.com - Tour de France tech gallery: A look at the bikes used on the stage 3 cobbles (http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/07/news/tour-de-france-tech-gallery_126559)
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And I suspect Thomas was just hanging on for dear life.
That's what he wanted them to think. He got 2nd in the sprint! You don't get to the finish line in the top 6 after all those cobbled sections by "just hanging on". I remember him going for sprints in the Dauphine this year and wondering if he was developing into a sprinter.
He could also argue that he didn't want to 'share the pace' as Sky team leader Wiggins was in the chasing group - an acceptable reason for sitting on the back
All absolutely true - I'm just trying to inject a dose of Mr N style pessimism to stop myself getting over-excited about his stellar performance. ;D
He did say in the post-race interview that he thought about waiting for Wiggo but "Shane told me to go for it". And as noted, he does have a good record on the pavé. So yeah, "just hanging on" is perhaps overstating it - though really all of that group were just hanging on to Spartacus for ages. Thomas was never going to beat Hushovd in a straight sprint, though.
d.
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They knew the cobbles were comming so why stay on 23mm tubs and p*nct*r* instead of using a bigger tire they have to add balast to the bikes so why not in larger tyres that will not pinch flat?
It looks like most teams had bigger tyre/tubs and some had different bikes. VeloNews.com - Tour de France tech gallery: A look at the bikes used on the stage 3 cobbles (http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/07/news/tour-de-france-tech-gallery_126559)
When I raced (back in the year dot) a popular choice of tub was Clement Criterium or Strada(?). Clement also made a 'Paris-Roubaix' which was fatter and rounder in profile. I used these on my training wheels and in races where the road surface wasn't as good.
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And I suspect Thomas was just hanging on for dear life.
That's what he wanted them to think. He got 2nd in the sprint! You don't get to the finish line in the top 6 after all those cobbled sections by "just hanging on". I remember him going for sprints in the Dauphine this year and wondering if he was developing into a sprinter.
He could also argue that he didn't want to 'share the pace' as Sky team leader Wiggins was in the chasing group - an acceptable reason for sitting on the back
All absolutely true - I'm just trying to inject a dose of Mr N style pessimism to stop myself getting over-excited about his stellar performance. ;D
He did say in the post-race interview that he thought about waiting for Wiggo but "Shane told me to go for it". And as noted, he does have a good record on the pavé. So yeah, "just hanging on" is perhaps overstating it - though really all of that group were just hanging on to Spartacus for ages. Thomas was never going to beat Hushovd in a straight sprint, though.
d.
I think it's Sean (Yates) in the car, Shane (Sutton) isn't usually a DS.
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I think it's Sean (Yates) in the car, Shane (Sutton) isn't usually a DS.
Good point. It sounded like he said Shane, but now you mention it, it does sound unlikely it would be him.
d.
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Apparently the Cancellara group were those who managed to get through the F Schleck incident without being delayed. Geraint Thomas only just managed it and had to fight for a while to get the back wheel, and when he did they were on the next section of pave. It wasn't until the next bit of tarmac that he had time to have a breather and look around to see what was going on. It would have been a while before he was able to help out, even if a) he were able, and b) he didn't have his leader behind him.
I'm impressed by Cancellara's attitude (as well as his bike-riding!). That's two stage wins he has sacrificed now. It looks like he is taking over the role of 'patron' from Armstrong.
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Apparently the Cancellara group were those who managed to get through the F Schleck incident without being delayed. Geraint Thomas only just managed it and had to fight for a while to get the back wheel, and when he did they were on the next section of pave. It wasn't until the next bit of tarmac that he had time to have a breather and look around to see what was going on. It would have been a while before he was able to help out, even if a) he were able, and b) he didn't have his leader behind him.
I'm impressed by Cancellara's attitude (as well as his bike-riding!). That's two stage wins he has sacrificed now. It looks like he is taking over the role of 'patron' from Armstrong.
Really? I'm surprised Cancellara didn't call for the race to be neutralised why they regrouped ;) ;D
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Saxobank are in an interesting situation, having the Yellow Jersey, a GC contender and the Pro-Tour rider's rep (Jens Voigt) on the team. The conflict of interest is bound to generate comment. Here's Jens on yesterday's stage.
Tour de France: Jens Voigt incensed following Stage 3's cobbles
(http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/4789/Tour-de-France-Jens-Voigt-incensed-following-Stage-3s-cobbles.aspx)
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Saxobank are in an interesting situation, having the Yellow Jersey, a GC contender and the Pro-Tour rider's rep (Jens Voigt) on the team. The conflict of interest is bound to generate comment. Here's Jens on yesterday's stage.
Tour de France: Jens Voigt incensed following Stage 3's cobbles
(http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/4789/Tour-de-France-Jens-Voigt-incensed-following-Stage-3s-cobbles.aspx)
Voigt responded, voice quavering with emotion: "I don't see it with a crying eye, but I see it with an angry eye. Back in the day, the first time they rode the Tourmalet, the Frenchman that won it, as he crossed the line, he said: 'You're murderers!' I want to take that quote and with all of that emotion and scream it again. Because of this reckless and dangerous game the organizers have played with the riders' health, I lost one of my best friends in bike racing due to a broken collarbone."
A collarbone is a 'common' break with cyclists it can happen at anytime - only needs a moments lapse of concentration and 'bang' you're on the deck.
Look at the result of the big sprinting accidents (Jalabert, Abdu***, Neilson(?)) The Pasage de Gois 1999, Mountain descents (Beloki in the centenary tour and even Casserteli's death). Is anybody asking for these to be removed?
That's bike racing, the riders have chosen to turn professional, it's the nature of the sport.
The excitement, the danger, the wind in my hair is why I chose cycling over football (and x-country running) when I was 12. It's why I still try to reach 60mph when I descend off the Clisham to Airdhasaig - I could be dead if something went wrong - it doesn't stop me from trying.
There were alot of comments on the forum yesterday about how excited we all were by yesterdays stage - The organisers need to attract the public to gain sponsors and money to run the thing.
Sorry Jen's if you don't want to get shot at, don't join the army.
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ISTR that in 2003 Tyler Hamilton b0rked his collarbone on stage 6 and completed the race, finishing fourth and winning stage 16. These youngsters? No stamina ;)
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Sorry Jen's if you don't want to get shot at, don't join the army.
It's more a case of not taking on the job of shop steward if you aren't prepared to have a moan about working conditions. It's an interesting situation for him as I say, it would be a lot easier for Jens if Saxobank had no competitive interest, after Monday Jens has to point out the costs of yesterday to Saxobank as well as the gains, and do it in as convincingly genuine way as possible.
The Assassins reference also points out that the Tour is skewed this year with the Pyrenees being highlighted. If the race is to be decided in the last week we may see riders eliminated close to Paris, which wouldn't go down well.
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The Assassins reference also points out that the Tour is skewed this year with the Pyrenees being highlighted. If the race is to be decided in the last week we may see riders eliminated close to Paris, which wouldn't go down well.
Perhaps that's what the cobbles were for - give riders the option to DNF earlier :P
Maybe you're right about Jens hamming it up a bit for the benefit of the other riders.
But he does sound a bit ridiculous in that interview:
"rather have Frank back than win the race"?!? He hasn't died, it's just a collarbone! I don't believe that statement for a minute.
Just found this:
Le Tour Stage 3: Cobbles In, But Arenberg Trench Out - Podium Cafe (http://www.podiumcafe.com/2010/6/14/1518034/le-tour-stage-3-cobbles-in-but)
... which explains why I failed to spot them riding over the infamous Arenberg bit. Slightly cunning PR there by Le Tour.
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I like to think of the Tour as a multi-day Audax with a variable cut-off time which is determined by how quick the winners ride. The interesting bit to me is the peer-group pressure of the peleton and how it limits the pure racing. Course design is obviously a big part of the debate within the peleton.
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I know I've gone on and on about my dissapointment at the stage neutralisation on st2 (a Staffordshire Bull Terrier doesn't let go of anything that they get their teeth into) - but this comment from Eurosport's (the only live feed I've found on works internet that isn't blocked) blazing saddles blog I did find funny (and OK - so it does mirror my thoughts too)
So, in summation: it's OK for Saxo Bank to ignore the carnage behind when it suits the team's strategy.
In fact, a Saxo sauce - sorry, source - even admitted to Saddles that there is a quasi-mathematical formula for the team's riders to follow in the event of tumbles. Two Schlecks down equals stage neutralisation; Andy Schleck down equals send-for-Frank and all-hands-on-deck; Frank Schleck down equals send-Jens-back-but-forget-it.
To be frank, to be Frank is to be expendable - for Frank is nothing without his brother (to be quite frank).
All that said - it made obvious sense to leave the older whippet sprawled in the dirt and writhing in agony. Schleck Senior's Tour hopes were as broken as his collarbone the moment he lost control of his bike. Saxo's job was to turn the nightmare round into something memorable. And that they did.
full link here (http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blog/blazin-saddles/article/523/)
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Well I still disagree with you, but that is very funny :thumbsup:
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Well done Pettachi but I didn't hear anything about Cav on the cyclingnews text feed, where was he?
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Cavendish didn't have the legs in the finale. He sat up at the end. Julian Dean was closing fast on Petacchi at the finish. Robbie McEwen and Robbie Hunter were 4th and 5th.
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Well done Pettachi but I didn't hear anything about Cav on the cyclingnews text feed, where was he?
When he realised he wasn't going to win the stage, he just sat up. Disappointing. Play to the whistle, boy! He doesn't seem to be quite as quick as he was last year.
Great move from Petacchi, though. Rumours of his demise appear to be premature. He looks as powerful as he did five years ago. Even Hushovd couldn't keep up with him. Dean and Boasson-Hagen did well to hang on to his wheel.
d.
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When he realised he wasn't going to win the stage, he just sat up. Disappointing. Play to the whistle, boy! He doesn't seem to be quite as quick as he was last year.
That rather implies he'e given up on the green jersey as some minor points would still have been useful to try to recover some of his defecit in that competition.
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He did seem to give up rather easily, but some of the discussion on ITV4 seemed to be saying that the lead outs for Cav and Hushovd didn't quite get it right, and went (and hence burnt out) too early.
It did seem like Cav had to go for it with quite a distance to go, although it can be hard to judge distances with the foreshortening of the camera's view.
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This year Cav is just another sprinter
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Brian Holm claims that the lead-out was ok, but Cavendish legs "weren't there"
(In Danish:)
Brian Holm erkender Cavendish-problem - Politiken.dk
(http://politiken.dk/sport/cykling/touren/article1012717.ece)
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He did seem to give up rather easily, but some of the discussion on ITV4 seemed to be saying that the lead outs for( Cav and Hushovd didn't quite get it right, and went (and hence burnt out) too early.
noone forced him to stay on Renshaw's wheel. In fact, he had a tow for longer than Petacchi did - he just didn't make as much of it.
Probably demonstrates that he is far from the best at judging a finish (although he might still be the fastest out there with a perfect leadout).
I reckon he'll win the Green jersey - maybe when he's older and wiser ...
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I Think Cav may well pull out before the mountains start especially as his chances of green seem to be fading.
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I Think Cav may well pull out before the mountains start especially as his chances of green seem to be fading.
I was just thinking the same thing this morning. If he's not back in contention for green by then, I predict he'll pull out on stage 14.
d.
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Do Columbia have a plan B if Cavendish isn't going to be worth supporting for the green jersey and doesn't cross the mountains?
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Do Columbia have a plan B if Cavendish isn't going to be worth supporting for the green jersey and doesn't cross the mountains?
They have Tony Martin.
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The impression I have is that he is there as a mere nod to the GC classification - he's not got a significant chance and wasn't going to be receiving the support to match the more favoured GC contenders.
It does appear that the number of baskets in the team is one and it carries all their eggs.
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Renshaw is quite handy in a sprint, isn't he?
Tony Martin is definitely a future GC contender but not this year.
d.
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Tony Martin is a white jersey contender at this time not yet a GC contender.
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Well, it looks like we might have written him off prematurely. Looked like quite a large winning margin in the end. :thumbsup:
And EBH wasn't far off again. :thumbsup:
d.
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He was blubbing like a little girl on the podium - and that's why we love him.
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Other stages Cav can win: Tomorrow, stage 11, stage 19 and stage 20 (Paris) plus just possibly stage 13 if he and the team try really really hard. With a bit of luck they could still win green, but it'll also take a heck of a lot of hard graft.
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Fuck me that is him back to his best. That will do his confidence so much good and shit up everyone else
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So many people have been on the ground for reasons other than Cav that he longer has to hide in the shadows.
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Well, it looks like we might have written him off prematurely. Looked like quite a large winning margin in the end. :thumbsup:
And EBH wasn't far off again. :thumbsup:
d.
looking forward to seeing this tonight then!
O/Tcan't beat the Liggett / Sherwin mob for highlights, I think. I was just a skinny boy when they started and I've grown to be a tubby man with them. Great programmeO/T
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I was heartened to see Contador tucking into some Welsh food of the gods today - a Tregroes waffle...
(http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01674/Alberto_Contador_1674878i.jpg)
Tregroes Waffles (http://www.tregroeswaffles.co.uk/Cymraeg/index.php?page=3)
There's tidy.
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Ardderchog! And there's that Geraint Thomas with his Welshcakes.
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Nice one Cav. Tears in public too, love it when riders show their 'human' side and get all emotional about winning. Great stuff
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I was heartened to see Contador tucking into some Welsh food of the gods today - a Tregroes waffle...
(http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01674/Alberto_Contador_1674878i.jpg)
Tregroes Waffles (http://www.tregroeswaffles.co.uk/Cymraeg/index.php?page=3)
There's tidy.
Alas, though it pains me to say it, I don't think Tregroes have a monopoly on stroopwafels (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stroopwafels) ...
Tidy thought, mind.
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Nice one Cav. Tears in public too, love it when riders show their 'human' side and get all emotional about winning. Great stuff
He's a sweetie really under all that hard man bluff.
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I was heartened to see Contador tucking into some Welsh food of the gods today - a Tregroes waffle...
(http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01674/Alberto_Contador_1674878i.jpg)
Tregroes Waffles (http://www.tregroeswaffles.co.uk/Cymraeg/index.php?page=3)
There's tidy.
I was perplexed by Tuesday, two thirds break, one third Eisteddfod, with Cadel Evans and Geraint Thomas.
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Well done Cav :thumbsup:
I think part of the problem this year is his lead out train is nowhere near so dominant as it was last year. The departure of Hincapie to BMC was a big loss, and then of course they also lost Hansen early on. But also this year there are much stronger lead out teams from Garmin and Lampre to jostle contend with. Last year Columbia were just able to line out the race at 5K with an uninterrupted team time trial, each doing their bit and swinging off, until with a few hundred metres to go Renshaw hit top speed with Cav on his wheel. We haven't seen this at all this year.
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... which is of course exactly how Petachi won every 1st week sprint back in his day.
(but Cav has done somewhat better than him on the Champs Elysees :) )
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Boy dun good. After the World Cup finishes, we ought to petition Paul the Psychic Octopus to predict the results of the Tour.
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Boy dun good. After the World Cup finishes, we ought to petition Paul the Psychic Octopus to predict the results of the Tour.
I imagine it would do his poor little psychic head in if ~190 pots of food in garish team colours were introduced into his tank!
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Seen on the BBC website: (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/cycling/8804176.stm)
From anon via text: "At the mention of Cipollini (see 1125) I feel obliged to confess that I still cycle to work in my Cipollini zebra kit!" But not brave enough to put a name to that text?!
I think we can hazard a guess at the sort of person who would ride around in zebra stripes.
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All three of the Brits (Cav, Wiggins & Thomas) are great track cyclists. I don't recognise any names from the rest of the peleton who have also shone on the track. Have I missed any?
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Stuart O'Grady has done some useful performances on the track (e.g. Gold, silver and bronze Olympic medals, several World Championships).
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All three of the Brits (Cav, Wiggins & Thomas) are great track cyclists. I don't recognise any names from the rest of the peleton who have also shone on the track. Have I missed any?
You missed the other Brits....
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:thumbsup:
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It would appear he has his mojo back.
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It would appear he has his mojo back.
And then some. That was a huge winning margin.
What happened to Thor? That's the second consecutive sprint finish where he hasn't even been close. Has he lost his mojo at the same time Cav has rediscovered his?
d.
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The boy done good, again :thumbsup: And Geraint Thomas is tantalisingly close to yellow - I'm glad that our forecast is for rain tomorrow, it will give us the perfect justification for spending the afternoon willing him on in front of the telly :)
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I'm impressed by Geraint's confidence. It's one thing to be in the white jersey following a cracking prologue, but I don't think he's finished outside the top 20 any day. He could easily retain his GC position by making sure he stays near the front in the last 20km, but he's right in there mixing it up with the sprinters.
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Geraint does seem to have lost a bit of weight this year just like Wiggins last year. Maybe he can do OK in the mountains? Has a Welshman ever worn the yellow jersey before? (apologies if I'm showing my ignorance here!)
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I can't help noticing that Thomas gets the podium girls in the most glam dresses - motivation?
[The stage winner outfits are hideous - surely french women wouldn't choose such things. Sacre Bleu!]
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What happened to Thor? That's the second consecutive sprint finish where he hasn't even been close. Has he lost his mojo at the same time Cav has rediscovered his?
I think Thor wasted himself at the cobbles stage, he was flying there.
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I'm impressed by Geraint's confidence. It's one thing to be in the white jersey following a cracking prologue, but I don't think he's finished outside the top 20 any day. He could easily retain his GC position by making sure he stays near the front in the last 20km, but he's right in there mixing it up with the sprinters.
He seems to be leading out Edvald Boasson-Hagen, whch is why you see so much of him in the last 400metres.
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I can't help noticing that Thomas gets the podium girls in the most glam dresses - motivation?
[The stage winner outfits are hideous - surely french women wouldn't choose such things. Sacre Bleu!]
Yes the girls in the strappy black dresses are winning my vote so far too. We don't get to see nearly enough of them on the telly/cycling web sites. :(
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Anyone else see the bitchfight at the finish?
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Anyone else see the bitchfight at the finish?
if not HERE (http://www.sporza.be/cm/sporza/videozone/MG_Tour/MG_Tourtips/1.822146) it is again
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Shame about G today. But congrats to Chavanel, and also to the Footen rider who came 2nd. That's quite a paint job on the Fuji bikes, it partially makes up for the awful khaki of the jersey and shorts :)
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[The stage winner outfits are hideous - surely french women wouldn't choose such things. Sacre Bleu!]
Have you seen what the poor filles presenting the GPM have to wear?
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Anyone else see the bitchfight at the finish?
if not HERE (http://www.sporza.be/cm/sporza/videozone/MG_Tour/MG_Tourtips/1.822146) it is again
and what was that about? hadn't seen that before?
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I can't help noticing that Thomas gets the podium girls in the most glam dresses - motivation?
[The stage winner outfits are hideous - surely french women wouldn't choose such things. Sacre Bleu!]
Yes the girls in the strappy black dresses are winning my vote so far too. We don't get to see nearly enough of them on the telly/cycling web sites. :(
This thread is useless without, etc.
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I can't help noticing that Thomas gets the podium girls in the most glam dresses - motivation?
[The stage winner outfits are hideous - surely french women wouldn't choose such things. Sacre Bleu!]
Yes the girls in the strappy black dresses are winning my vote so far too. We don't get to see nearly enough of them on the telly/cycling web sites. :(
This thread is useless without, etc.
this might help (http://girls.gunaxin.com/the-podium-girls-of-cycling/23555)
I've read about George Hincapie and his podium wife before, but never seen a photo of their first meeting - surely there must be one?
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I was surprised that the commentary failed to comment on Chavanel's lack of number on his jersey. I'm sure any BCF commissaire from my youth would have disqualified him for that !
Still, it was good to hear instead about the sedimentary origins of limestone. Keep them coming Paul :thumbsup:
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Two things occurred to me watching yesterdays stage. One is that Armstrong was on his own. Not a sign that he has a weak team, I think, but that his team were resting in advance of today. It looked to me that some other teams were doing the same. A sign that the gc contenders will try and thresh things out today.
The other thing, and someone may be able to enlighten me on this, is that I couldn't understand why BBox were on the front chasing Chavenal.
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The commentator on Eurosport said that Chavanel had parted company with his race number as a result of a vital jersey change in the early part of the stage , and that BBOX had their own aspirations for the stage which had been blown by missing the breakaway , so I guess the chase was an attempt to salvage their plans for the day.
I was almost sent off to sleep by the heat and the gentle rise and fall of Sean Kelly's voice during his seemingly interminable sentences.
Snake
My Library (http://www.yudu.com/library/6690/Snakehips-s-Library)
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I fall asleep everyday during the repeated itv4 +1 coverage, at about 5.45pm. Sherwin has a bit of a drone on him too, especially when he starts reading from the script about whatever cathedral the helicopter is hovering over
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No-one drones like Kelly ,he could drone for Ireland which is a pity because he knows his stuff .
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Do you guys that get Eurosport have to endure as many ads as we plebs that only get ITV4?
At the start of the last climb, we had 5 min of ads, 5 min of the race and another 5 min of ads. >:( ::-)
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No, def not as many ads on eurosport.
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Oh dear, another Sky tactic fails dismally :(
Schleck would be looking good if it wasn't for his time trial record.
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Bit harsh, Charterhall - not really surprising that Brad couldn't keep up the pace set by Navarro. Some bigger and better climbers did worse than him.
d.
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Bit harsh, Charterhall - not really surprising that Brad couldn't keep up the pace set by Navarro. Some bigger and better climbers did worse than him.
d.
If he hadn't used his team up on the earlier climb then he could have limited his losses on the final climb much better.
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As Chris Boardmsn has just said, it's unlikely his teammates would have been much use towards the end when Astana were putting the hammer down. And by attacking when they did, they dropped some key members of other teams - there weren't many Saxo Bank left on the final climb either.
d.
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Wonder if Lance will have a beer and a Jack Daniels with Johann tonight, then go on a massive solo break tomorrow? ;)
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As Chris Boardmsn has just said, it's unlikely his teammates would have been much use towards the end when Astana were putting the hammer down. And by attacking when they did, they dropped some key members of other teams - there weren't many Saxo Bank left on the final climb either.
d.
Pah !, Chris Boardman, what does he know ? ;)
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Contador may live to regret the stage 2 'truce'
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Pah !, Chris Boardman, what does he know ? ;)
More than me...
I think you're essentially right that Sky misjudged the tactics - Wiggo may well have benefited from having Flecha with him on the final climb.
But I think "fails dismally" is slightly overstating it - you just have to wonder if he was ever really in with a shout when you look at who he's up against and how well they're riding.
d.
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Do you guys that get Eurosport have to endure as many ads as we plebs that only get ITV4?
At the start of the last climb, we had 5 min of ads, 5 min of the race and another 5 min of ads. >:( ::-)
eurosport seem to show as many ads but usually only around 2 mins so never seems so bad. ITV4 is a nightmare, 4 1/2 mins minimum each time. one day last week there was the 4 mins chat at the start ofthe program followed by ads b4 coverage started, 5 x 4 1/2 mins adverts in the first hour plus a further couple of mins about the comp. fair enough they have to pay for the coverage somehow but they take the P! little wonder adverts keep popping up at vital moments in football matches, oh and while im having a rant, why does chris boardman have to over pronouce everything, he looks like a goldfish on E
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ITV4 ads: they always interrupt coverage of the descents! Always! That's one of the best things to watch >:(
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Schleck looks like he may have enough in the mountains this year to compensate for any time-trial losses.
If he can keep taking time off Contador in the final kilometre of every big climb that is.
I was really suprised to see Wiggo drop out of the lead group, he looked so comfortable up until that point. I had a sneaking suspicion that he was the dark horse on the big climbs.
I don't think SKY got it tactically wrong, Wiggo was safely tucked into the lead group at all the right moments. Schleck just looked like he was riding to the shops.
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ITV4 ads: they always interrupt coverage of the descents! Always! That's one of the best things to watch >:(
However the comment about the maths that there was plenty of time after the first group finished to go to ads and then watch Armstrong finish did rather emphasize how emphatically he was dumped out the back today.
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What's with Gary Imlach's shirts. Even my dad would hesitate when faced with that wardrobe!
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ITV4 ads: they always interrupt coverage of the descents! Always! That's one of the best things to watch >:(
Often the camera bikes can't keep up with the riders on the descents, they, the motorcycles, have to slow too much for the corners and get in the way of the riders so are moved forward and out of the way
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ITV4 ads: they always interrupt coverage of the descents! Always! That's one of the best things to watch >:(
Often the camera bikes can't keep up with the riders on the descents, they, the motorcycles, have to slow too much for the corners and get in the way of the riders so are moved forward and out of the way
That's not the point.
We don't even get to see the grainy helicopter shots, or whatever is on offer - as soon as the leaders start going downhill, they cut to ads. It's been the same on Saturday and Sunday.
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ITV4 ads: they always interrupt coverage of the descents! Always! That's one of the best things to watch >:(
Often the camera bikes can't keep up with the riders on the descents, they, the motorcycles, have to slow too much for the corners and get in the way of the riders so are moved forward and out of the way
That's not the point.
We don't even get to see the grainy helicopter shots, or whatever is on offer - as soon as the leaders start going downhill, they cut to ads. It's been the same on Saturday and Sunday.
the producers don't think it's interesting enough.
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Yes, that's the point. They are wrong.
I'd appreciate a mix of descending and climbing in the coverage. I don't want to see endless shots of skinny blokes gurning and grimacing uphill, I like to see the pay-off where they swoop along the descents like swallows. With ITV4's coverage, we don't get the blend.
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Never got it with Channel 4 either and IIRC nor with Eurosport. The descents are exciting I agree. A static camera might show the action well
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Whilst I don't like the adverts either, ITV4 do (in general) squash them into the less decisive parts of the race. In a 2 hour programme, there are far more ad breaks in the first hour and a bit. It seems to me that they're doing their best to avoid disrupting the key points of the race, within the confines of a commercial broadcaster.
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Whilst I don't like the adverts either, ITV4 do (in general) squash them into the less decisive parts of the race. In a 2 hour programme, there are far more ad breaks in the first hour and a bit. It seems to me that they're doing their best to avoid disrupting the key points of the race, within the confines of a commercial broadcaster.
My thoughts too. And I'm especially grateful to them for picking the sport up after it was so disgracefully cast aside by C4.
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Whilst I don't like the adverts either, ITV4 do (in general) squash them into the less decisive parts of the race. In a 2 hour programme, there are far more ad breaks in the first hour and a bit. It seems to me that they're doing their best to avoid disrupting the key points of the race, within the confines of a commercial broadcaster.
My thoughts too. And I'm especially grateful to them for picking the sport up after it was so disgracefully cast aside by C4.
Indeed given the choice is to pay and have ads on Eurosport or free with ads on ITV then I am glad of the coverage ,thats not to say I dont find the ads a bit annoying .
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I found a way round the ads, but not much use if you want to watch it live.
Get the stage you want playing over the internet once it is available, then simply let it run for the hour. Go and do something else. This first playing will include the ads. Then, head back to your 'puter, and start the program again; it remembers that you've been shown the ads and gives you a clean, ad-free play through.
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Time-lapse viewing is one of the things I love about Sky+. If only it weren't putting money in the Dirty Digger's pocket... :-\
d.
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Wonder if Lance will have a beer and a Jack Daniels with Johann tonight, then go on a massive solo break tomorrow? ;)
Judging by his showing so far, setting off today maybe the only way he'll get ahead of the pack ;)
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Judging by his showing so far, setting off today maybe the only way he'd get ahead of the pack ;)
;D
He was clearly riding well within himself by the end of the stage. Saving his energy to help Leipheimer later on?
d.
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I'd appreciate a mix of descending and climbing in the coverage. I don't want to see endless shots of skinny blokes gurning and grimacing uphill, I like to see the pay-off where they swoop along the descents like swallows. With ITV4's coverage, we don't get the blend.
Eurosport had some great pics of Nibali's fearless descending on the Giro this year. The motos were finding it hard to keep up, but that only heightened the sense of just how mentally fast he was going.
There seems to be footage on YouTube, but it's blocked in the UK, unfortunately.
d.
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He was clearly riding well within himself by the end of the stage. Saving his energy to help Leipheimer later on?
d.
Agree, he had some unfortunate tumbles yesterday, but then that's not the Lance of yester-year where he was very good at staying out of trouble. Riding comfortably and conserving energy so that he can support Leipheimer for the rest of the Tour was a good option
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He had one hell of a crash that was only captured on private video by a spectator. Having seen it I'm not surprised he gave up the chase. He said he slid down the road at 35 miles an hour.... he wasn't lying. I'm quite surprised he got back on after it, but it clearly knocked the wind out of his sails.
Much as he is a controversial figure, he has not whined about it at all. Got to admire him for that.
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He had one hell of a crash that was only captured on private video by a spectator. Having seen it I'm not surprised he gave up the chase. He said he slid down the road at 35 miles an hour.... he wasn't lying. I'm quite surprised he got back on after it, but it clearly knocked the wind out of his sails.
Much as he is a controversial figure, he has not whined about it at all. Got to admire him for that.
Agreed. He knows how to lose with dignity.
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I am not anti or pro Lance (must be the only one) but found his dignity in such an emotional situation impressive. Quality athlete.
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Indeed given the choice is to pay and have ads on Eurosport or free with ads on ITV then I am glad of the coverage ,thats not to say I dont find the ads a bit annoying .
Frustrated by the endless adverts on ITV4 I have gone back to Eurosport.de its free with very few ads and the commentary although in German makes as much sense as the chuckle brothers ramblings After the finish I go back to ITV4 for the interviews with the brit riders.
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The look of dejection on Lance's face after the final incident (when a pair of Garmin? riders came off and fell into him) made me feel quite sorry for him.
One thing Lance has never been is a quitter. You can't take that away from him.
d.
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They were Euskatel riders. Seem to be crashing quite a lot.
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The look of dejection on Lance's face after the final incident (when a pair of Garmin? riders came off and fell into him) made me feel quite sorry for him.
One thing Lance has never been is a quitter. You can't take that away from him.
d.
I'd like him to go out with a bang and win a significant climb. However, in reality, I can't see him doing it now.
I'm just amazed at his sheer bulk when compared to the "real" climbers, like Schleck, who are a collection of bones. He looks more like a track sprinter.
I certainly hope he doesn't quit mid-race, riding down the Cd'E into Paris for a final time would be the proper way to bow out, especially considering what an achievment it is just to finish a Tour.
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They were Euskatel riders.
Thanks. Knew it was something orangey. Nearly said Rabobank.
d.
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I'm just amazed at his sheer bulk when compared to the "real" climbers, like Schleck, who are a collection of bones. He looks more like a track sprinter.
Which is why his duffing up specialist climbers - drug fuelled specialist climbers at that: "he came past us like an aeroplane" R. Virenque - was simultaneously thrilling and repellant.
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Not unlike Indurain!
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Yes
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Very unlike Indurain, who defended time trial gains in the mountains.
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Fair point, but Big Mig was bigger :)
You'd expect him to be a little more biased towards TT than Lance. (8kg difference from a quick google). Lance was often happy to get to the final time trial with a negligible lead over the nearest "climber".
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Indurain was a grinder. Armstrong was capable of stunning attacks. I didn't find them repellent as in a curious way I felt the playing field was level.
I don't get that feeling this time round when I see A Schleck looking like he's freewheeling whilst everyone else is clearly battered
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I think we forget the influence of weather on the Tour, many of Lance's best performances were in bad weather, Indurain loved the heat.
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To return to the subject of descending, here's an classical reminder of Cancellara's skill in that department
YouTube
- Cancellara’s Descent « An Ordinary Cyclist
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxXqQqAc2pA)
PS - Look out for the near miss with the car of the Tour doctor...
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The descending is spectacular, but so is ski-jumping; once I've seen one, I don't need to see footage of every descent.
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Don't look at it then. ::-)
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The TV shows are a zero-sum game, silly. ::-) ::-)
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Eurosport had some great pics of Nibali's fearless descending on the Giro this year. The motos were finding it hard to keep up, but that only heightened the sense of just how mentally fast he was going.
The motorcycles quite often find it difficult to keep up with the more insane riders when they're at the front and have a clear road to go down as fast as they can.
That's part of the reason they shift away to ads during these bits, because they know they're not likely to get much good coverage. I would imagine it's hard enough work for the cameramen to hang on to the bike, which is accelerating along the straight bits, and then braking hard into the corners, let alone actually point the camera at a cyclists, and keep the image reasonably centred, in focus, and zoomed consistently. :-\
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THE descender of all time is currently behind the wheel of the Sky car - Mr Yates.
I was bringing a team car down the Ventoux from a finish at Chalet Reynard (Paris Nice), and he was racing, and passing, the gendamerie who were having their own race down after the stage finish!
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yeah :D
attacks from 1 km, it's going to be a long tough day for the sprinters today.
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I can't help feeling that Schleck and Contador made the climb of the Madeleine look just a little bit too easy. ::-)
d.
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I can't help feeling that Schleck and Contador made the climb of the Madeleine look just a little bit too easy. ::-)
d.
Why did you think that? They just looked like the best two riders in the race to me.
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I can't help feeling that Schleck and Contador made the climb of the Madeleine look just a little bit too easy. ::-)
d.
I think they made it look extremely difficult, for all other riders...
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Usually when riders appear to float away up hills from other top climbers without much effort, the d-word is involved.
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No don't forget there was a break ahead of them for all but the last 200 yards.
But when the same two riders do it day after day...
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As ever the mountain stages have blown apart the relatively close positions in the GC. Unless something dramatic happens (which it could), Contador and Schleck are the most likely contenders for the top of the podium in Paris.
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I have a rather empty feeling now that Evans and Wiggins have been blown out. I have a sad sense of inevitability that his year's winner will be a cheat.
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As ever the mountain stages have blown apart the relatively close positions in the GC. Unless something dramatic happens (which it could), Contador and Schleck are the most likely contenders for the top of the podium in Paris.
Although there are still plenty of others who could threaten them if they make an error. One spill would be enough (and there have been enough). We have for example Sam Sanchez as a master descender who can really bridge a gap downhill.
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I have a rather empty feeling now that Evans and Wiggins have been blown out. I have a sad sense of inevitability that his year's winner will be a cheat.
Nothing new then ;)
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Are there question marks over Schlek, then?
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Although there are still plenty of others who could threaten them if they make an error. One spill would be enough (and there have been enough). We have for example Sam Sanchez as a master descender who can really bridge a gap downhill.
Mmmm. Descent into Gap today. Remember Beloki, anyone?
I wonder what tyres Lance will be using today...
d.
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Are there question marks over Schlek, then?
It's called Ricco syndrome
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Ricco syndrome ???
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08 TdF Ricco and Piepoli did what AS and AC have been doing and just made it look a bit too easy. Eyebrows were raised, CERA positives followed pretty quickly. (they were caught out by not realising there was a new test for the products they had used)
Who knows what they are doing, but it is interesting how everyone else has just fallen away.
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Are there question marks over Schlek, then?
Frank was implicated a couple of years ago:
Frank Schleck suspended after admitting funds transfer - Cycling - ESPN (http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/cycling/news/story?id=3623535)
Sky Sports | Cycling | News | Schleck suspended by team (http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,15264_4241239,00.html)
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Cheers Flatus, I just had him 'guilty by association with Riis'.
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Well, only they know what they are doing, let's just say I wouldn't be shocked if either of them went down in flames.
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Its sad but I wouldnt feel shocked if any of this turned out to be a fact. I guess following cycling you know its going to happen again.
Also Wiggins comments to the media. There is something about them that just dont seem right. Maybe he knows something we dont :-\
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So there I was, pointing and laughing as the Whinging Wheelsucker went rapidly backwards, and now it transpires that he b0rked his elbow on Saturday. Moreover, he's even managed to be gracious in both victory and defeat this year :o
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I think at one time everybody knew who was doing what because of team organised programmes and riders swapping teams with that knowledge.
If what Pevenage alleges is true, then doping became the responsibility of riders rather thank managers in the early 2000s after the development of a test for epo.
Who knows what they know. Everyone would prefer to marvel at a feat of athleticism rather than medicine. Wiggins seems to be a little quieter on the issue of doping now that he is considered a future podium contender
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Also Wiggins comments to the media.
I thought Wiggo was very restrained in his post-race interview yesterday, though you could see he had stuff on his mind...
I suspect it's a case of not wanting to ruffle any feathers now that he's considered a contender, rather than keeping quiet because he has something to hide - doesn't want to make life hard for himself by bringing down the wrath of the big boys on his head. Plus the Sky set-up is very well drilled when it comes to handling the media, so any public comments are going to be closely managed.
Yesterday's stage killed my interest in this year's Tour. But maybe I was naive to expect anything else. It's a magnificent spectacle but it's not a race.
d.
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So the only reason anyone can pull out a gap of a couple of minutes on a mountain stage is because they are doping ? It seems that unless every finish has most of the riders within in few seconds of each other than there must be a doping issue.
The first 25 riders came in within 2 and a half minutes and the first 50 within 10 on a stage designed to cause gaps. How small a gap would it have to be before some people automatically assumed doping was involved ?
Not that I think that all riders are clean, there will always be cheats.
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So the only reason anyone can pull out a gap of a couple of minutes on a mountain stage is because they are doping ?
Yesterday you had guys like Mark Renshaw and Charlie Wegelius saying it was one of their hardest ever days on a bike. Admittedly, Renshaw is a sprinter but they're a tough lot, and Charlie's something of a climber. In that context, when you have guys at the head of the GC who can seemingly attack at will, it raises suspicion.
Sad but true.
Maybe it was simpler when they were all doping...
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So the only reason anyone can pull out a gap of a couple of minutes on a mountain stage is because they are doping ?
To do it as a one-off is one thing, but to do the same thing day after day after day?
I'm reminded of Virenque in 2004 - it was stage 10, also Bastille day, funnily enough (I didn't remember that, I just looked it up) - when he went on a lone breakaway on a stage with five massive cols and won by over five minutes. But even though he was caked up to the eyeballs, even he couldn't keep that up every day.
That was the same year Lance blitzed Basso on the TT up Alpe d'Huez...
I suppose at least you knewsuspected all the main contenders were doing it that year.
d.
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I don't know why some of you bother following bike racing - you are never going to take any pleasure in it until some mythical drug-free utopia is achieved.
I understand why you are all so cynical, but I also wish we had started a topic like:
"TDF Comments for fans prepared to suspend disbelief for 3 weeks."
:(
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I don't know
No you don't know.
You don't know which of the many aspects of racing people enjoy, and which piss people off. Who wins is just one facet of the race. You probably didn't even know that ::-)
;)
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Cynical I may be, but I still enjoy bike racing in my own warped way
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Me too
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you are never going to take any pleasure in it
Actually, I take lots of pleasure in it, and that's why I continue to follow it.
d.
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Nice stage today, with Saxobank riding tempo to compensate for yesterday. It looked like Jens had decided to neutralise the peleton until after that perilous decent.
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Andy's performance doesn't seem to super-human. He is a pure climber and so it's not surprising that is where he excels. He's built up time so far by some great team work (eg. following Spartacus on the cobbles). Contador on the other hand...
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Andy's performance doesn't seem to super-human. He is a pure climber and so it's not surprising that is where he excels. He's built up time so far by some great team work (eg. following Spartacus on the cobbles). Contador on the other hand...
Not that I agree with the suspicions voiced here about the riders (but each to their own), but if you doubt Contador, who has been winning well for several years now, how do you reconcile Schleck staying on Cancellara's wheel on the cobbles if some of the world's best classics riders can't manage it? Sure, they're team mates, but if Cancellara had measured the undoubted pace he can muster over the cobbles to allow Schleck to keep up, why didn't others then go past him?
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you are never going to take any pleasure in it
Actually, I take lots of pleasure in it, and that's why I continue to follow it.
d.
^^^^
Wot he said .
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Nice stage today, with Saxobank riding tempo to compensate for yesterday. It looked like Jens had decided to neutralise the peleton until after that perilous decent.
The peloton was so slow. They must all be on drugs.
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Nice stage today, with Saxobank riding tempo to compensate for yesterday. It looked like Jens had decided to neutralise the peleton until after that perilous decent.
The peloton was so slow. They must all be on drugs.
Somebody swapped their amphetimines with diazepam ;)
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Sounds like it has been much much harder for them this year. The high temperatures will be a factor, as are all the extra crashes from the Stockeu and the cobbled stages.
Of course, you could speculate that all the heat generated from the Landis expose and federal investigation means a cleaner peleton this year.
2 days of mountains and it is already a two horse race. Granted that Armstrong and Evans are out of contention through crashes.
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Shame about that. I didn't think Lance could win or really have much chance of getting on the podium this year and don't really want him to win any more tours anyway but I would have liked to see him go out in style with a heroic effort pushing the eventual winner all the way round. Maybe he will be able to do something memorable in the Pyrenees if he rests up in the pelaton for a few days. Whatever he may be he has never been a quieter so I hope he hangs in to the end.
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Sounds like it has been much much harder for them this year. The high temperatures will be a factor, as are all the extra crashes from the Stockeu and the cobbled stages.
Of course, you could speculate that all the heat generated from the Landis expose and federal investigation means a cleaner peleton this year.
2 days of mountains and it is already a two horse race. Granted that Armstrong and Evans are out of contention through crashes.
One thought that has gone through my mind. Ligget and Sherwin have commented many times that Radioshack have the strongest team on paper - where are they? Is a poor show due to not following previous doping regimes thro' fear of a 'bust' following Landis' allegations?
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Team Radioshack is second in the team standings by only 30"....
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They benefited from getting Paulinho in a break yesterday when the main GC contenders took an easy day. Apart from Leipheimers usual solid riding who else from Radioshack has excelled this year?
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If Lance was in the top3 you wouldn't be asking the question.
I guess their week 1 was built around getting Lance in the top 3 => they've done very little for their own glory. Be interesting to see if this changes.
Lance's best possible outcome is to bury himself (Voigt stylee) getting Levi onto the podium.
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There are so many 'ifs'
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There are so many 'ifs'
Which is what makes it fascinating.
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Exactly (and one of the reasons I love the sport so much)
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We'll have to see. He's talked about winning a stage. Be interesting to see if he is able to get up the road, and if he is chased.
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Charlie Wegelius is DNS today
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Damn. Wonder why, his tweet last night didn't give any indication he was going to bail out.
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there was no explanation for Wegelius, but Robert Hunter is out too, another broken arm
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I'll see if I can find out. His mum walks her dog past my house most days.
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on cyclingnews:
"Wegelius was hit by the intestinal virus, and is unable to retain any food or drink. You just can't ride under those circumstances!"
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Bad luck then. These things whip round I wonder how many other will go down with it.
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Also just noticed that yesterday the sprint from the peloton was won by Cavendish for 9th place. Does he think he can claw his way back into green contention?
Including today there are five more stages designated flat, though I don't know whether there are complications in any of them to prevent them being solely for the sprinters (assuming they don't miscalculate the capture of the daily breakaway). So there are potentially enough points available to him if he gets into the habit of winning these sprints.
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Also just noticed that yesterday the sprint from the peloton was won by Cavendish for 9th place. Does he think he can claw his way back into green contention?
Including today there are five more stages designated flat, though I don't know whether there are complications in any of them to prevent them being solely for the sprinters (assuming they don't miscalculate the capture of the daily breakaway). So there are potentially enough points available to him if he gets into the habit of winning these sprints.
Assuming that Hushovd and Petacchi (I'm discounting the miserable, whingeing Aussie) don't keep picking off the intermediates and finish low enough in bunch sprints.
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Most of the intermediate sprint points seem to have gone to breakaways so far. Without giving too much away, looking at the situation out on the road at the moment, I predict the same will happen today, but the peloton will reel in the break in the closing kilometres and Cav will take the stage.
Is it classified as a "flat" stage today or a "medium"? Either way, I can't see Cav getting enough points to overtake Hushovd, though Petacchi could nick it off him if Hushovd doesn't finish well.
Hushovd still has to be favourite to be wearing green in Paris though.
d.
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Just been reading Dave Brailsford's comments on the live Tour feed. He's predicting Cav to win the stage, EBH to come second and Petacchi third. Apparently, a Sky official was spotted recceing the final 5km this morning with a helmet cam, carefully studying the roundabouts...
d.
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Interesting that Thor gets lots of intermediate sprint points. Is this due to him being a better general rider than Cav (Cav being a better pure sprinter) or due to better tactics from Cervélo ?
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Is this due to him being a better general rider than Cav (Cav being a better pure sprinter) or due to better tactics from Cervélo ?
He's a much better all-round rider than Cav - for a start, he can climb reasonably well for a sprinter.
Cav is a one-trick pony, but he can perform that trick better than anyone else in the world.
d.
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That's kind of what I was thinking.
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Cav doesn't even bother trying for the intermediate sprints.
Even the stage into Reims where everyone was expecting him to win, as soon as he realised he didn't have the legs to win, he sat up rather than keep going to get as many points as possible.
Hushovd now is like Boonen and Oscar Freire, they're not out and out sprinters in the way that Cav, Petacchi, and Tyler Farrar are.
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Cav doesn't even bother trying for the intermediate sprints.
ISTR he did on a couple of occasions last year - and I suspect if he had a green jersey to defend, he would do so again.
Even the stage into Reims where everyone was expecting him to win, as soon as he realised he didn't have the legs to win, he sat up rather than keep going to get as many points as possible.
I thought that was an impetuous decision. At that point, with all the early crashes, he probably thought this year's Tour was already a lost cause so no reason to chase minor placings. But then he went and rediscovered his mojo and won two stages in convincing style. If he finishes the Tour within touching distance of Hushovd, he may well regret that decision to sit up.
d.
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this is going to be a great finish...
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this is going to be a great finish...
You're not wrong... How fast? :o
Good boy, Renshaw, taking one for the team - he was a bit naughty, but looking at the overhead pics, I think Dean started it by moving onto Renshaw's line.
d.
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That's given me some ideas for when I get cut up when audaxing.
* goes out to buy helmet *
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this is going to be a great finish...
You're not wrong... How fast? :o
Good boy, Renshaw, taking one for the team - he was a bit naughty, but looking at the overhead pics, I think Dean started it by moving onto Renshaw's line.
d.
Well the TdF didn't like that , they kicked him out of the tour. ???
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Nightmare - poor Cav. And poor Renshaw, though he did go a bit mental!
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Harsh.
d.
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I thought Cav was very unfortunate last year when he was penalised for blocking, but this time he's going to be disadvantaged by the antics of a team mate.
Right decision though - Renshaw's antics were well OTT.
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Renshaw's antics were well OTT.
But apparently it's OK for Dean to stick his elbow in Renshaw's face?
d.
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Renshaw's antics were well OTT.
But apparently it's OK for Dean to stick his elbow in Renshaw's face?
d.
It's rufty tufty at that stage of a race, sure - but Renshaw escalated it massively. An elbow back would have been more appropriate, no? Not a salvo on the shoulder with a bike helmet.
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Renshaw's antics were well OTT.
But apparently it's OK for Dean to stick his elbow in Renshaw's face?
d.
It's rufty tufty at that stage of a race, sure - but Renshaw escalated it massively. An elbow back would have been more appropriate, no? Not a salvo on the shoulder with a bike helmet.
In my view, the safest way to react to someone closing you down towards the barrier. Elbows/pushes affect the handling of the bike. Using a head is/certainly was, commonplace in kierans (and Aussie track meets).
The Commissaires have sanitised track racing, looks like they're taking on road sprints now - shame!
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I think they kicked him out because it was the only way they could punish cav/htc. As the aussie commentators I was listening to before the penalty was announced said, Renshaw won't mind being demoted to last place and getting a 200 euro fine.
Shame. It was a fantastic last 15km
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Robbie McEwen must be laughing his socks off
(http://www.theage.com.au/ffximage/2005/07/05/ogrady_wideweb__430x354.jpg)
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Is the 6th place in today's sprint for Yukiya Arashiro the best placing for a Japanese rider in a Tour stage? Well done.
Edit, just checked and he was 5th in stage 2 last year.
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Well, as usual - Chris Boardman on the highlights programme gave a considered view. The first infringment was provoked. To my mind, the response was OTT. The second (blocking Farrar against the barrier) was premeditated and a blantant attempt to remove him from the sprint, and therefore worse.
Was getting kicked out of the whole Tour an over-reaction? Maybe. I don't think so. Taking the two instances together - Renshaw was a Bad Boy.
For me - the best part of the highlights programme was the interview with David Millar. I never had much time for him after the dope thing - but this tour he's properly vindicated himself. Sure, maybe he shouldn't keep crashing - but he keeps going - despite all the damage, not to mention getting a stomach bug. And he still aims to finish.
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YouTube
- Coups de tête Mark Renshaw étape 11 TdF 2010
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJVp3P2YQhE)
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Dean came off his line and did the big lean so that set off Renshaw. Renshaw checked over his shoulder and saw that Farrar was coming up on the inside so it was not good at all to block him, deliberately.
But I think it is harsh to send him home.
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I think he was given the boot for the headbutts, not for cutting up Farrar.
Watch the bid again and see where Renshaw is at the start of the melée and see where he is at the end. Dean was shoving him way to the left. He hooked him with his elbow. What was Renshaw meant to do? Brake?
Looked a lot worse than it was IMO.
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They could at least have awarded Renshaw the Keirin Jersey before they threw him out.
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The commissar afterwards said the penalty was severe as they were taking both infringements into account.
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One head butt he might have got away with, but three then the cut up.
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I'm surprised that Cav's win was allowed to stand.
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Why? It was nothing to do with him
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Sorry, I thought same team and directly benefitted.
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Snot how it works
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One head butt he might have got away with, but three then the cut up.
But he was still being forced into the barriers at the time of the 3rd.
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Snot how it works
Well it should be!
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The headbutting looks bad, but it's fair enough I think. Dean was leaning right into him. Dean knew exactly what he was doing.. trying to box in Cavendish, as that is the only way they can beat him.
Don't know why Renshaw then swept Farrar as Farrar was already beaten.
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I think he was given the boot for the headbutts, not for cutting up Farrar.
Watch the bid again and see where Renshaw is at the start of the melée and see where he is at the end. Dean was shoving him way to the left. He hooked him with his elbow. What was Renshaw meant to do? Brake?
It was obvious that Renshaw was quite rightly defending his line (Dean was clearly leaning on him with no justification). If he's smart as he seems so far, he was protecting the space on his left for Cav to accelerate through. (Which worked out perfectly) :thumbsup:
Cutting up Farrar looked like deliberate 'afters', and worthy of some sanction. I don't know much about TdF commisars, but I wonder if they acted because the headbutts were soooo blatant on the main TV feed. A need to be seen to keep the sport clean.
The opposite of the footy World Cup - referees ruining a really good scrap!
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The headbutting looks bad, but it's fair enough I think. Dean was leaning right into him. Dean knew exactly what he was doing.. trying to box in Cavendish, as that is the only way they can beat him.
Don't know why Renshaw then swept Farrar as Farrar was already beaten.
Caught up in the adrenalin aftermath of the "fighting Dean out of the boxing-in position" manoeuvre, I'm guessing.
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Earlier on I was watching my recorded (Eurosport) version of the coverage whilst also knowing about the Renshaw/Dean incident/DQ, but not having seen it.
At some point mid-stage the commentators started, for the benefit of someone who had emailed/twitted/texted in a question, talking about the different colours of race numbers.
The red numbers (for the combative display in previous stage, if I understand correctly) were described as being for "the most aggressive ride in the stage" which made me laugh, knowing what I did that they didn't at the time. Renshaw (or at the very least Dean) should get the red numbers. (although I assume being DQed also DQs you from that award -- boring rules!).
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Don't forget Renshaw has already been in trouble with the commissars earlier in the race.
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In my view, the safest way to react to someone closing you down towards the barrier. Elbows/pushes affect the handling of the bike. Using a head is/certainly was, commonplace in kierans (and Aussie track meets).
The Commissaires have sanitised track racing, looks like they're taking on road sprints now - shame!
Yup, doesn't look that bad to me. Nobody even got close to coming down.
It used to be standard practice to have your final lead-out man butting his way for a clear run and to have a sweeper on your wheel to gap or close down your competition. Obviously the current commissaires are planning to mark individual lanes on the finish straight in the future and will require every sprinter to stay in their own lane.
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So... can the rest of HTC Columbia's lead-out train take up the strain? ISTR that Eisel has deputised in the lead-out position when Renshaw was incapacitated in the past (virus or something like that).
EDIT: and should there be a "dads' race" in Acorn #1's first school sports day tomorrow should I Rnshaw it or not? (Not that I think there will be one - health and safety ("unfit dads might kark it running 100m/ jumping in a sack etc. assuming they can stop smoking for long enough to take part") or political correctness ("some children might not have dads") have almost certainly put paid to it.)
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Don't Renshaw it, Cav it instead and just win by several lengths and then let out a few fucks in joy ;D
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On the plus side, I was pleased with Cav's reply to the media that ambushed him immediately after he left the podium and was told of the decision to expel Renshaw. I thought he handled it very well although you could see he was very upset with the prospect of no MR.
This is from Cyclingnews:
Finally, he was asked whether his lack of agreement with the commissaires' decision meant that he thought it was alright to head butt people in a bunch sprint. Now visibly annoyed, Cavendish countered: "I didn't say that. I didn't say that I don't agree. If you listen to your tape I didn't say that. I said that the commissaires have made a decision. We think a bit different, but we'll see what happens. I did not say I disagree with the commissaires."
Perhaps he has learnt from last year's mistake?
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Top marks to Cav yesterday, both for his win and for the mature way in which he dealt with the media and Tour officials afterwards. The Tour have obviously got it in for him, we saw that after last year's DQ and again yesterday. I really hope that he wins again just to spite them.
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No penalty for Julian Dean then? Despite moving off his line? Cav got relegated to last place last year for allegedly doing that. The tour really don't like him do they!
I wonder what Renshaw has to say about why he moved across in front of Farrarr. As Chris Boardman said, thats a more significant action.
Dave
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The headbutting looks bad, but it's fair enough I think. Dean was leaning right into him. Dean knew exactly what he was doing.. trying to box in Cavendish, as that is the only way they can beat him.
Don't know why Renshaw then swept Farrar as Farrar was already beaten.
My sentiments exactly.
FWIW I think it should have earned him a fine. Kicking him out of the race is disproportionate.
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No penalty for Julian Dean then? Despite moving off his line? Cav got relegated to last place last year for allegedly doing that. The tour really don't like him do they!
I wonder what Renshaw has to say about why he moved across in front of Farrarr. As Chris Boardman said, thats a more significant action.
Dave
Agree - Dean should have been penalised for starting it all ... my personal jury is still out on whether Renshaw should have been kicked out ...
I guess that if the offender had been French he would have been awarded the stage win :demon: (and perhaps 100 green jersey points as compensation)
Rob
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Crazy decision imo.
It's like an over-reacting football referee, now they have drawn a line in the sand everyone will expect them to stick to it.
Action like that is likely to catch the interest of the general public (it got the attention of my non-cycling family). Put Renshaw in last place, fine him and the team and hopefully he can do exactly the same thing on another stage. It was very exciting.
I think the point about a French rider getting away with it is moot (until a French rider is in such a position) and probably why the authorities are in a 25 year bad mood with non-french riders. It must be painful having an American win 7 tours and then, just when his career ends, a bloody Rosbif starts winning all the bloody sprint stages
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Don't Renshaw it, Cav it instead and just win by several lengths and then let out a few fucks in joy ;D
LOL ;D
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Disproportionate - yes, compare it with Cav's penalty in the Tour of Switzerland, for an incident which a) caused mayhem and a lot of injuries, and b) was hugely unpopular with both riders and fans.
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Crazy decision imo.
>>>>> Put Renshaw in last place, fine him and the team and hopefully he can do exactly the same thing on another stage. >>>
... the "fines" the TdeF impose are traditionally about £25 IIRC - dunno why?
Rob
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When asked whether Julian Dean should be punished for his infringements Curchod was unapologetic. "In every sprint you have some movements. You can analyse every sprint and you will always find some movements.
::-)
After setting up Cavendish he's forcing the riders who finished second and third to the barriers.
So actually it made no difference to the result!
Elsewhere, two riders attack each other with wheels after the finish line and get wrist-slaps.
I guess it would be no fun without some controverys!
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Apparently it was Renshaw's summary of the incident that cause all the ire with the race comms.
"I don't see what all the fuss is about. He is a sheep shagging Kiwi".
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Perhaps every stage should have a Cairn o'Mount equivalent at the end :thumbsup:
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Arrrgh..
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The Tour should do something about the green jersey competition - in seeking to recognise consistency its actually recognising mediocrity. That Cav should win 6 stages last year but not green was bad enough but this year its even worse - Hushovd is well below par and struggling to even finish in the stage top 10 but is still in the running to win green.
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The Tour should do something about the green jersey competition - in seeking to recognise consistency its actually recognising mediocrity. That Cav should win 6 stages last year but not green was bad enough but this year its even worse - Hushovd is well below par and struggling to even finish in the stage top 10 but is still in the running to win green.
He is running to win green because he won his stage. A stagewin on a cobbled stage is worth the same as an easy sprinters runin. It's not the sprinters jersey but the regularity jersey.
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The Tour should do something about the green jersey competition - in seeking to recognise consistency its actually recognising mediocrity. That Cav should win 6 stages last year but not green was bad enough but this year its even worse - Hushovd is well below par and struggling to even finish in the stage top 10 but is still in the running to win green.
Any system you choose will have some disadvantage.
You could count wins first, then have a countback system; but then a rider might get Green by just winning 1 stage then finish all the rest 2m in front of the broom wagon, so people would moan about that!
[Such a system might also have the problem of less breakaways staying away, which I think would make for a duller tour.]
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Thor was a very deserving winner of the green jersey last year for his all-round performance. As already noted, it's for consistency, not sprinting per se. Winning a stage is its own reward.
Zabel won at least one of his green jerseys without winning a single stage. A consistently high placing is far from being a mediocre achievement.
d.
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Being out on breaks to get sprint points also means that Thor makes allies, riders who might otherwise languish in the peleton get exposure. It's noticeable that Hushovd can get help from a wide range of sources and that he repays those favours.
Cav is useful to the peleton only in that his lead out train controls flat stages, he is not in a position to do anyone any favours, hence his unpopularity with other riders, who do however respect his speed. They'd all want someone like him to make the team money, but they don't need to like him.
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Did I hear that right on EuroSport?
The rumour of the day-
Contador and Schleck will be on the same team next year :o
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Being out on breaks to get sprint points also means that Thor makes allies, riders who might otherwise languish in the peleton get exposure. It's noticeable that Hushovd can get help from a wide range of sources and that he repays those favours.
On the hilly etappes Thor Hushovd escapes with a sizeable group, does a lot of work untill the first sprint, takes that sprint and then takes it easy untill he's back in the peloton. The group has a nice lead and Thor netted another 6 points. A nice trade for all.
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... he is not in a position to do anyone any favours, hence his unpopularity with other riders
You mean it's nothing to do with gob-shite-itis after all?!?
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Zabel won at least one of his green jerseys without winning a single stage.
but, how many did he win without being doped up to the eyeballs ::-)
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Did I hear that right on EuroSport?
The rumour of the day-
Contador and Schleck will be on the same team next year :o
I didn't see the Eurosport coverage, but Saxo Bank don't currently have a sponsor for next year and are struggling to find one I believe. I'm sure I read somewhere that a possible Saxo Bank-HTC Columbia merger had been discussed, but I guess Stapleton's budget isn't big enough and I would expect that keeping so many top riders satisfied would mean the departure of several anyway. I can't see how a dominant sprinter requiring a lead out train and a GC contender needing team mates for the mountains would be happy bedfellows.
If Schleck became available, I reckon Radioshack could be the destination as there are some rather large shoes being vacated soon...
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I'm not sure RadioShack will last very long, with all the bad press they are getting courtesy of LA.
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Lemond has been subpoened to the Grand Jury. That should be interesting. They have asked him to bring along all his paperwork about the spat he had with Trek and how they dropped his Lemond brand too.
Pressure is mounting against LA.
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Lemond has been subpoened to the Grand Jury. That should be interesting. They have asked him to bring along all his paperwork about the spat he had with Trek and how they dropped his Lemond brand too.
Pressure is mounting against LA.
Pressure is one thing. Proof is another. Until someone turns up some of the latter, he's a great champion in my view.
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The Tour should do something about the green jersey competition - in seeking to recognise consistency its actually recognising mediocrity. That Cav should win 6 stages last year but not green was bad enough but this year its even worse - Hushovd is well below par and struggling to even finish in the stage top 10 but is still in the running to win green.
He is running to win green because he won his stage. A stagewin on a cobbled stage is worth the same as an easy sprinters runin. It's not the sprinters jersey but the regularity jersey.
He was also deprived points on stage 2 where he rode a 'true roadmans stage', and unlike Pettachi and Cavendish stayed on his bike and out of trouble
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Did I hear that right on EuroSport?
The rumour of the day-
Contador and Schleck will be on the same team next year :o
I didn't see the Eurosport coverage, but Saxo Bank don't currently have a sponsor for next year and are struggling to find one I believe. I...
I did see the Eurosport coverage of a previous stage, and there was talk of one team, which I thought was Saxo bank, which had apparently just secured sponsorship. There was one of the minor sponsors on the kit mentioned as being part of the deal and another unnamed sponsor (who would apparently remain unnamed until later in the season.
As I say, I thought it was Saxo Bank that were talked about, but could be misremembering. I'll take a look at some TdF kit pictures, because the other minor sponsor might be enough to remind me.
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I though the Schlecks were going to be the core around which a Luxembourg-based team were going to be formed.
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...
I did see the Eurosport coverage of a previous stage, and there was talk of one team, which I thought was Saxo bank, which had apparently just secured sponsorship. There was one of the minor sponsors on the kit mentioned as being part of the deal and another unnamed sponsor (who would apparently remain unnamed until later in the season.
As I say, I thought it was Saxo Bank that were talked about, but could be misremembering. I'll take a look at some TdF kit pictures, because the other minor sponsor might be enough to remind me.
it was Saxo Bank that they were talking about. I just remembered on the basis of the sponsor named on the back of their shorts, Sungard, who were the other company named in the discussion as having definitely continuing in their sponsorship.
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Watched the highlights program for the first time tonight. The hairpins looked familiar then realised I had gone down 'em in 2006 (Port de Pailheres).
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Zabel won at least one of his green jerseys without winning a single stage.
but, how many did he win without being doped up to the eyeballs ::-)
About as many as his contemporaries at the time is my guess - so a level playing field ;)
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2010 Tour de France: Stage 14: Brad Wiggins talks about his lack of form | www.cyclingfans.com (http://www.cyclingfans.com/node/1105)
Amazingly honest interview. "I'm fucked mate", "last year was a bit of a fluke", "I just haven't got it"
Nice to not hear the psychobabble he often comes out with.
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2010 Tour de France: Stage 14: Brad Wiggins talks about his lack of form | [url=http://www.cyclingfans.com]Tour de France Live Video Streaming, Photos, Results - Guide to Pro Cycling Live Race Coverage - Watch Cycling TV | [url=http://www.cyclingfans.com]Tour de France Live Video Streaming, Photos, Results - Guide to Pro Cycling Live Race Coverage - Watch Cycling TV | www.cyclingfans.com (http://www.cyclingfans.com/node/1105)[/url][/url]
Amazingly honest interview. "I'm fucked mate", "last year was a bit of a fluke", "I just haven't got it"
Nice to not hear the psychobabble he often comes out with.
You have to wonder if this is a conversation he should be having with his team management, not in a public setting. Was he better suited to the Garmin set-up?
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looks like a fast etape today, 48 km/h for the first 90 km ::-)
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And the sprinters and climbers appear to have swapped roles for some obscure reason.
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Lemond has been subpoened to the Grand Jury. That should be interesting. They have asked him to bring along all his paperwork about the spat he had with Trek and how they dropped his Lemond brand too.
Pressure is mounting against LA.
lemond is bitter and twisted cause trek dropped him and lance got more tour wins. anything he has to say about LA and radioshack/usps etc is pure speculation regarding doping seeing as he was never part of any of those teams. He's been bad mouthing LA since 1999 when the spotlight shifted away from him
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[/quote]
Was he better suited to the Garmin set-up?
[/quote]
10 times the money at sky, probably why he didnt bother telling anyone last winter that his 4th place was a fluke!
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Does etiquette say he should have waited at that point or was it fair to move on up the road?
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Should have waited.
Descending fans: there's a terrifying descending display going on right now. :o
d.
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lemond is bitter an 2009 d twisted cause trek dropped him and lance got more tour wins. anything he has to say about LA and radioshack/usps etc is pure speculation regarding doping seeing as he was never part of any of those teams. He's been bad mouthing LA since 1999 when the spotlight shifted away from him
Eh? He was long gone by then and the spotlight had been on Indurain for most of the 90s.
If he is bitter about Trek, it is because Armstrong forced their hand. If you do your homework you'll see that Lemond has won that case in court and Trek have had to pay up.
As for not knowing anything, I think you are being a little naive. What has come out is the doping is/was an open secret amongst riders and management. Landis, simeoni, kohl and others will tell you what happens if you grass up your mates
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lemond is bitter an 2009 d twisted cause trek dropped him and lance got more tour wins. anything he has to say about LA and radioshack/usps etc is pure speculation regarding doping seeing as he was never part of any of those teams. He's been bad mouthing LA since 1999 when the spotlight shifted away from him
Eh? He was long gone by then and the spotlight had been on Indurain for most of the 90s.
If he is bitter about Trek, it is because Armstrong forced their hand. If you do your homework you'll see that Lemond has won that case in court and Trek have had to pay up.
As for not knowing anything, I think you are being a little naive. What has come out is the doping is/was an open secret amongst riders and management. Landis, simeoni, kohl and others will tell you what happens if you grass up your mates
if you bother doing ur homework, u will see lemond was jealous of armstrong way back in 1999, and as continued to bitch about him ever since. ive got the cuttings to prove it Whoot whoot!
if doping was an open secret LA would have been banned long ago, ur just quoting whats been in floating about in the press.
and by the way u belong on veloriders, bitter and twisted over there about LA too
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Should have waited.
too true :) if he wins like that its totally undeserving. certainly not a champion to be respected
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For those of us who don't get to watch this, *who* should have waited? And what for?
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Contador should have waited for Schleck on the last climb after Schleck's chain fell off and jammed. The yellow jersey has changed hands.
At least it will force Schleck to attack, attack, attack for the rest of the race.
StanChris Boardman just said he thought it was right for Contador not to wait because it was Schleck's own fault for not using a chain guard. ???
d.
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quote off CN - Alberto Contador (Astana) moved into yellow by eight seconds in the most controversial of circumstances as he attacked Andy Schleck (Saxo Bank) while he was suffering from mechanical trouble
Contador ignored one of the unwritten rules of cycling etiquette by responding and attacking the yellow jersey in his moment of difficulty. Rather than waiting for the Luxembourger, Contador blasted clear
bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad bad
oh and he rides for the same team as cheat 'please sir, i didnt know they injected me with someone else's blood' vino
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Not a great advert for his gears.
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I would have liked to have seen Contador wait (especially as I'm not a big fan of his and I am of Andy's), but in some respects I can understand why he didn't. Firstly, he didn't really know what was going on and secondly they weren't at the head of the race, so he could be losing time to other riders further up the hill. If they had been, he should definitely have waited.....
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Schleck chasing back up the rest of the climb - practically sprinting, in fact - was great to watch, even if he isn't normally aspirated.
Contador is a reasonably experienced cyclist, it should have been fairly obvious what was happening. He would pretty soon have got the full story over his radio anyway. Plus the only riders ahead on the road weren't GC contenders anyway, so he could easily afford to lose 30 seconds to them.
d.
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StanChris Boardman just said he thought it was right for Contador not to wait because it was Schleck's own fault for not using a chain guard. ???
d.
That confused me too. Chain guards at the Tour? Come on. It's racing, not audax! Will the next rider who bonks be accused of bringing it on himself for not having a suitcase-sized handlebar bag to carry enough sandwiches? ::-)
I can see how sometimes absent parts can be the fault of the rider/team when a mechanical occurs. I remember David Millar missing out on a yellow jersey when he lost his chain in a prologue. It later turned out that he didn't have a front mech fitted. This doesn't seem to be quite the same thing to me.
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Contador ignored one of the unwritten rules of cycling etiquette by responding and attacking the yellow jersey in his moment of difficulty. Rather than waiting for the Luxembourger, Contador blasted clear
The difference in this situation was that Shleck was actually attacking Contador when he had his mechanical.
Between that and Voeckler's solo attack it made for a masterclass in descending though :thumbsup:
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I agree. A great descent. Even though ITV4 put an advertisement break in the middle of it. I guess they weren't expecting the descent to be so important after the climb.
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The difference in this situation was that Shleck was actually attacking Contador when he had his mechanical.
Yes, admittedly, that is a mitigating factor in Contador's favour.
d.
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StanChris Boardman just said he thought it was right for Contador not to wait because it was Schleck's own fault for not using a chain guard. ???
d.
That confused me too. Chain guards at the Tour?
I'm assuming that he was referring to a chain catcher such as one of those K-edge chain catcher thingies (I saw them fitted on more than one TdF bike featured in a "Pro-Bike" feature on Bikeradar or similar (Cav's definitely had one)).
I was relatively sure I'd seen one fitted in an article about Schleck's bike too (with custom graphics on it), but can't find it so perhaps I imagined that one.
EDIT: found it --- Race tech: Special machines for Cancellara, Schleck brothers - BikeRadar Gallery (http://www.bikeradar.com/gallery/article/race-tech-special-machines-for-cancellara-schleck-brothers-26899?img=16&pn=race-tech-special-machines-for-cancellara-schleck-brothers&mlc=news%2Farticle) You can just make it out in picture 16 of the series. There's an explicit picture of one in pic 26 too.
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Maybe they don't make them in yellow? ;D
A black K-Edge looks very nice on my R3.
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Contador ignored one of the unwritten rules of cycling etiquette by responding and attacking the yellow jersey in his moment of difficulty. Rather than waiting for the Luxembourger, Contador blasted clear
The difference in this situation was that Shleck was actually attacking Contador when he had his mechanical.
Between that and Voeckler's solo attack it made for a masterclass in descending though :thumbsup:
difference being what exactly? there is no excuse for what contador, and later menchov and sanchez did today.
Lance Armstrong had attacked jan ullrich in 2003 up luz ardiden when he crashed, did jan ullrich then attack LA when he rode past him on the deck ?, nope, he waited (well kind of) until LA had rejoined the leading group
quote from Jonathan vaughters
Hmmmm... Not sure what happened there, couldn't see from the car, but I hope no one attacked while there was a mechanical!!
I'd tend to go with him and others involved at the highest level on this one
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.....where was Cancellara when he was needed !
Bad day for Saxo Bank, just neutralise the stage :hand:
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.....where was Cancellara when he was needed !
Bad day for Saxo Bank, just neutralise the stage :hand:
yay!! lets go back 2 weeks to stage 3 and neutralise the stage when Armstrong punctures on the pave'
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That confused me too. Chain guards at the Tour? Come on. It's racing, not audax! Will the next rider who bonks be accused of bringing it on himself for not having a suitcase-sized handlebar bag to carry enough sandwiches? ::-)
I can see how sometimes absent parts can be the fault of the rider/team when a mechanical occurs. I remember David Millar missing out on a yellow jersey when he lost his chain in a prologue. It later turned out that he didn't have a front mech fitted. This doesn't seem to be quite the same thing to me.
Boardman is talking about one of these:
(http://www.parker-international.co.uk/ProductImages/fullsize/DedaDogFang.jpg)
Stops the chain jumping off onto the BB. I think most riders use them. I have them on the bikes I have with compacts as they are a bit more prone to dropping the chain.
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Thanks, Oaky and Flatus - I assumed he didn't mean the plastic thing that goes between cassette and spokes, or between chainring and crank, but I couldn't for the life of me work out what he did mean. I've seen those things before but it didn't occur to me that's what he meant.
Anyway, should Schleck have had one fitted? Why didn't he?
d.
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Don't know, and I couldn't see which way the chain went anyway, nor why it popped off. I expect he had one on the bike he used for the cobbled stage
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When someone falls/has a problem due to outside reasons (like the musette incident with Armstrong a few years ago) it's logical to wait. When the problem is due to another riders stupidity (like Schleck using a wrong gear/shifting improperly), waiting is not needed. It's not only he who is the fastest cyclist but also he who doesn't do stupid things.
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When someone falls/has a problem due to outside reasons (like the musette incident with Armstrong a few years ago) it's logical to wait. When the problem is due to another riders stupidity (like Schleck using a wrong gear/shifting improperly), waiting is not needed. It's not only he who is the fastest cyclist but also he who doesn't do stupid things.
hmmmm, chains come off, jam up, mechanicals happen, nothing to do with stupidity
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quote from an unknown source shortly after todays stage ended
"The hidden motor in my bike frame died and no one in the peloton waited for me."
;D ;D ;D
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When someone falls/has a problem due to outside reasons (like the musette incident with Armstrong a few years ago) it's logical to wait. When the problem is due to another riders stupidity (like Schleck using a wrong gear/shifting improperly), waiting is not needed. It's not only he who is the fastest cyclist but also he who doesn't do stupid things.
hmmmm, chains come off, jam up, mechanicals happen, nothing to do with stupidity
That depends on how much you crash the gears while stamping on the pedals, or whatever other bad shifting you may indulge in.
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When someone falls/has a problem due to outside reasons (like the musette incident with Armstrong a few years ago) it's logical to wait. When the problem is due to another riders stupidity (like Schleck using a wrong gear/shifting improperly), waiting is not needed. It's not only he who is the fastest cyclist but also he who doesn't do stupid things.
hmmmm, chains come off, jam up, mechanicals happen, nothing to do with stupidity
That depends on how much you crash the gears while stamping on the pedals, or whatever other bad shifting you may indulge in.
we're talking the best of the best of the best here, not audaxers, cum 3rd cat chippers ;D
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When someone falls/has a problem due to outside reasons (like the musette incident with Armstrong a few years ago) it's logical to wait. When the problem is due to another riders stupidity (like Schleck using a wrong gear/shifting improperly), waiting is not needed. It's not only he who is the fastest cyclist but also he who doesn't do stupid things.
hmmmm, chains come off, jam up, mechanicals happen, nothing to do with stupidity
That depends on how much you crash the gears while stamping on the pedals, or whatever other bad shifting you may indulge in.
we're talking the best of the best of the best here, not audaxers, cum 3rd cat chippers ;D
F Schleck's crash in the 3rd stage was a classic beginners error, loose your balance, go of the edge and try getting on it at a too sharp angle. Off you go.
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It's not difficult to make your chain come off through poor gear choice + shifting while stomping hard on the pedals.
Still think Contador was a tad unsporting though.
d.
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When someone falls/has a problem due to outside reasons (like the musette incident with Armstrong a few years ago) it's logical to wait. When the problem is due to another riders stupidity (like Schleck using a wrong gear/shifting improperly), waiting is not needed. It's not only he who is the fastest cyclist but also he who doesn't do stupid things.
hmmmm, chains come off, jam up, mechanicals happen, nothing to do with stupidity
That depends on how much you crash the gears while stamping on the pedals, or whatever other bad shifting you may indulge in.
we're talking the best of the best of the best here, not audaxers, cum 3rd cat chippers ;D
F Schleck's crash in the 3rd stage was a classic beginners error, loose your balance, go of the edge and try getting on it at a too sharp angle. Off you go.
well, frank schleck is frank schleck, didnt he get off with having a dodgy doctor last winter ::-), probably still high on the training advice he was given to think too much about the cobbles he was riding over
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Great win by Voeckler :thumbsup:
....and yes, an odd decision by Contador. He was hooning past him looking straight ahead at about the moment Schleck dropped his chain. He may not have seen Schlecks back wheel lifting, but you'd have thought he'd have heard on the radio soon after. He'll not win friends doing this.
Shlecks recovery up the hill was out of this world....
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Stephen Roche considered the mechanical was Schleck's "fault" and that the attack was therefore in order. He knows better than I, so I'll go with that!
Clumsy shifting IMO.
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Although, equally, Contador would not necessarily have known that. For all he knew Schlecks chain may have snapped.
Contador was on one. He was expecting an attack, and having to counter it.
He wasn't expecting Schlecks chain to come off
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Outrageous behaviour - and interview comments - by Contador today. I'm glad the crowd booed him, I was booing too (at the telly). I'm really hoping that he crashes tomorrow.
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Boardman doesn't agree with you, nor does Roche.
Bet Lance does though ;D
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Stephen Roche considered the mechanical was Schleck's "fault" and that the attack was therefore in order. He knows better than I, so I'll go with that!
Clumsy shifting IMO.
My sentiments too. I'm in the Boardman/Roche camp on this one - Did anyone wait for Eugene when his forks broke (I think not) ;)
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I'm really hoping that he crashes tomorrow.
You've crossed a line there. ::-)
d.
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Tomorrow looks like it could be a good day, really glad that I have a day off :)
Though not really because I'm going to the dentist while they will be climbing the Tourmalet, hope he does a quick job.
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Outrageous behaviour - and interview comments - by Contador today. I'm glad the crowd booed him, I was booing too (at the telly). I'm really hoping that he crashes tomorrow.
There is something about the French I admire :)
There would be something sweet where Contador to suffer a misshap. I hope Schleck can turn this around, but I think he might have blown it now :(
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I'm hoping that the fans who were booing today take it a stage further tomorrow and hold a one rider blockade (after all, it is a French speciality!)
As an aside, has anyone else noticed Phil Ligget talking out of his arse this tour? "Contador was only following the other two", said whilst he was on the front clearly giving it his all.
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Man, that would be so great if Schleck's fans blocked Contador tomorrow then Schleck could really feel like a true champion in Paris, if he manages to pedal there without the chain falling off ::-)
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Boardman doesn't agree with you, nor does Roche.
Bet Lance does though ;D
Not according to this (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/armstrong-refuses-to-criticize-contador) headline. (But not necessarily the story beneath).
Riis was fairly sanguine about it, while suggesting he would have waited in those circumstances.
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Maybe they don't make them in yellow? ;D
A black K-Edge looks very nice on my R3.
Cancellara has a yellow one on his bike so I don't know why Schleck didn't have one on his.
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Anyway, Riis is quite stoic about it all, so perhaps we should be too:
To the thorny question of whether Contador should have waited for Schleck as he attempted to fix his chain, Riis shrugged again. “I would have hoped he would have waited, and I think I would have waited... I think he did wait at the beginning but then it was a while before Andy was on the bike again.
“I don’t know. Was it possible for Contador to wait in that situation, with [Samuel] Sanchez [Euskaltel] and [Denis] Menchov [Rabobank] attacking? He has to follow those guys, for sure. He might not need to pull [with them] or attack, but he has to follow those guys.
From: Riis Preaches Calm In Aftermath Of Schleck's Disappointment | Cyclingnews.com (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/riis-preaches-calm-in-aftermath-of-schlecks-disappointment)
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Riis was fairly sanguine about it, while suggesting he would have waited in those circumstances.
Looking to Riis for a moral stance on sportsmanship is like taking dietary advice from Karen Carpenter.
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From one of the side views shown (on Eurosport) it looked like he had the chain running on the diagonal (which made it go a bit loose and flappy) and then the crank caught the chain. He looked more annoyed with himself than anything to me.
What Contodor did didn't surprise me, he strikes me as a bit of a snake when I see him interviewed and a snake in his race tactics (like befriending and chatting to Andy and getting him to agree to work together a couple of stages back where Andy could clearly have put some time into him otherwise ....)
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Man, that would be so great if Schleck's fans blocked Contador tomorrow then Schleck could really feel like a true champion in Paris, if he manages to pedal there without the chain falling off ::-)
How about putting spartacus on the front next time Contador takes a piss? We've already established that Contador isn't too worried about following the rules of the peleton.
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wouldnt want contador to crash, except, if its like ullrichs slow motion crash back in 2001(i think) the look and comments by the old woman he almost mowed down were hillarious. Would be good though if contador punctured prior to the tourmalet and saxo (a team i dont like, along with mr 60%) road full gas and distanced him by 5 mins, doubt it will happen though, lady luck seems to be with him
Schleck could now struggle to finish on the podium altogether unless he's prepared to ride hard with contador on his wheel in order to out distance the other two.
boardmans a good one to comment on judgement of others considering his own bad judgement in the 1995 tour prologue, riding at a suicidal pace down a dangerous deeeeeecent (a boardman over pronounciation) ending up with a broken ankle and 12 months training down the drain!
roche is probable peed off that his son was distanced due to puncture a few mins earlier and hes always one for siding with his fave ( re run a few dvds from the lance era if youre not convinced)
having seen the rerun, its clear contadors lying through his back teeth with regards to not knowng what had happened,
vino was on schlecks wheel when he unshipped his chain and not contador, just incase theres any doubt out there
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Riis was fairly sanguine about it, while suggesting he would have waited in those circumstances.
Looking to Riis for a moral stance on sportsmanship is like taking dietary advice from Karen Carpenter.
did he ever return the yellow jersey after admitting he doped in 1996 (a fact that was known at the time seeing his nickname was mr 60%)
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Schleck flunked a gear change and un-shipped his chain. He has only himself to blame for the incident.
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Vino was not on Schlecks wheel according to the video I'm watching. You can see Contador just behind Schleck when his back wheel lifts. That's when he loses his chain although he carries on pedalling for a bit
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Vino was not on Schlecks wheel according to the video I'm watching. You can see Contador just behind Schleck when his back wheel lifts. That's when he loses his chain although he carries on pedalling for a bit
when scheck went clear it was defo vino who responded, the contador came up on the left side
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Have a look at this photo:
Alexander Vinokourov (Astana) looks back to check out the situation as Andy Schleck has a mechanical Photos | Cyclingnews.com (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/photos/schleck-promises-fireworks-on-the-tourmalet/131868)
Vino on Schleck's wheel and Contador ~20m further back, apparently at the moment Schleck's chain unshipped. Make of it what you will ...
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2010 Tour de France: Stage 15: Schleck chain incident | www.cyclingfans.com (http://www.cyclingfans.com/node/1111) video here if it works
all happens in a split second, vino there first followed by contador just as schleck peddaling to no where, almost went up his ass
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Have a look at this photo:
Alexander Vinokourov (Astana) looks back to check out the situation as Andy Schleck has a mechanical Photos | Cyclingnews.com (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/photos/schleck-promises-fireworks-on-the-tourmalet/131868)
Vino on Schleck's wheel and Contador ~20m further back, apparently at the moment Schleck's chain unshipped. Make of it what you will ...
YAY! knew i wasnt seeing things
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Vino was not on Schlecks wheel according to the video I'm watching. You can see Contador just behind Schleck when his back wheel lifts. That's when he loses his chain although he carries on pedalling for a bit
which video were u watching then ? ;)
good way to boost ur posts this init
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Anyway, Riis is quite stoic about it all, so perhaps we should be too:
To the thorny question of whether Contador should have waited for Schleck as he attempted to fix his chain, Riis shrugged again. “I would have hoped he would have waited, and I think I would have waited... I think he did wait at the beginning but then it was a while before Andy was on the bike again.
“I don’t know. Was it possible for Contador to wait in that situation, with [Samuel] Sanchez [Euskaltel] and [Denis] Menchov [Rabobank] attacking? He has to follow those guys, for sure. He might not need to pull [with them] or attack, but he has to follow those guys.
From: Riis Preaches Calm In Aftermath Of Schleck's Disappointment | Cyclingnews.com (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/riis-preaches-calm-in-aftermath-of-schlecks-disappointment)
Riis is a man who knows about mechanical mishap (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFzteK_y1b4) (and chains coming off) ;)
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YouTube
- Tour De France 2010 - Stage 15 - Andy Schleck lose the yellow jersey
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcN2HrkrnF4)
(Scandinavian{?} commentary).
Worth watching to the end to see the replay of Schleck's chain incident. He attacked the group, with Vino trying to hang on and Contador in their wake. Then the chain thing. Difficult to tell, but it happens when you might expect Schleck to shift to a steadier gear. It looks like a bad shift - Vino and Contador are past in a flash.
Also - from the fuller coverage earlier in that clip - it looks as if Sanchez was up the road ahead at that stage as he appears to be caught by Contador.
Finally - there's some scary descending in that clip as well: recommended, even if you (like me) don't really understand the the commentary.
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which video were u watching then ? ;)
One which cut straight from an Astana rider reaching Schlecks wheel to Contador further up the hill ;D
You are right it is Vino.. and Contador takes his time. Puts a different complexion on Contador's ability to respond and also the time he had to consider what to do. Total attack from Alberto having seen Schlecks mechanical
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If it had happened while they were riding together I would hope that others wouldn't attack to take advantage. However, Schleck shipped his chain while (and probably because) he was himself attacking. Contador was responding to that attack when he caught and swerved around a hardly moving Schleck. Furthermore, it was Saxo's tactic that had left Schleck alone and without a team mate to provide a quick bike swop. So, bad luck for Schleck but I don't see why the others should wait.
I'm not sure why Contador denied knowing Schleck had a problem though - I find that difficult to believe.
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I'm not sure why Contador denied knowing Schleck had a problem though - I find that difficult to believe.
Agreed... he swerves round Schleck a little. He knew what was going on.
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These unwritten rules can only be enforced by the peleton, normally you'd be looking to senior pros such as Voigt for an indication of the general mood, but the neutralisation of stage two worked in Saxobank's favour. Contador was quick to equate the two incidents, that may well satisfy the peleton, or at least part of it.
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My gut reaction is to blame Contador, but I'm not a pro bike rider, rules written or unwritten are one thing, but in the heat of battle people will do anything.
The bike is part of the package, if his bike has a mechanical then it's their own fault like in motor racing maybe?
BTW, Liggett and Sherwen's commentary is laughable at times. But it was funny the pair of them disagreeing.
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Let's not forget...
...it is a race :)
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My gut reaction is to blame Contador, but I'm not a pro bike rider, rules written or unwritten are one thing, but in the heat of battle people will do anything.
The bike is part of the package, if his bike has a mechanical then it's their own fault like in motor racing maybe?
Particularly if (as suggested upthread) it's a case of (contributory) operator error ...
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2010 Tour de France: Stage 15: Schleck chain incident | [url=http://www.cyclingfans.com]Tour de France Live Video Streaming, Photos, Results - Guide to Pro Cycling Live Race Coverage - Watch Cycling TV | www.cyclingfans.com (http://www.cyclingfans.com/node/1111)[/url] video here if it works
all happens in a split second, vino there first followed by contador just as schleck peddaling to no where, almost went up his ass
Have to agree, that's how it looked watching live too.Note that Andy waited till Cont was boxed in, which presumably is why he let the group reform after the earlier attack.
I would have given Contador the benefit of the doubt, if he hadn't claimed in a (very calm) interview that he didn't know Shrek had a problem.
SchleckII has got Alberto rattled. Lets hope we get a good stage on the Tourmalet (and I find somewhere to watch it!), so that this incident doesn't decide the whole race..
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I'm not sure why Contador denied knowing Schleck had a problem though - I find that difficult to believe.
Because he is a lying toad?
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I'm not sure why Contador denied knowing Schleck had a problem though - I find that difficult to believe.
Because he is a lying toad?
Having been audibly booed while on the podium he probably felt some pressure to make an excuse whereas it's easy for me sitting here to suggest that no excuse was necessary.
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Boardman is talking about one of these:
http://www.parker-international.co.uk/ProductImages/fullsize/DedaDogFang.jpg
Stops the chain jumping off onto the BB. I think most riders use them. I have them on the bikes I have with compacts as they are a bit more prone to dropping the chain.
I don't understand CB's comment about the extra weight of these things - I thought pro bikes were all carrying ballast to make the weight limit these days. ???
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I'm not sure why Contador denied knowing Schleck had a problem though - I find that difficult to believe.
Because he is a lying toad?
Having been audibly booed while on the podium he probably felt some pressure to make an excuse whereas it's easy for me sitting here to suggest that no excuse was necessary.
That is as maybe but he came out with a lame and obvious lie. It would have been better to have said nothing.
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Tomorrow looks like it could be a good day, really glad that I have a day off :)
Though not really because I'm going to the dentist while they will be climbing the Tourmalet, hope he does a quick job.
Col d'Aspin too - perhaps they'll get overtaken by a granny :D
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And fast she was too.
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Why should Contador wait?
I would like Schleck to beat him but really, why should Contador wait?
If his shoe cleat broke should he wait? If anything at all goes wrong should he wait? Is there a list of things that warrant him waiting?
Schleck's problem was that he had burnt out his own team and had no support. Should Contador wait because Schelck's team failed him?
I didn't see anyone waiting for Armstrong on the Pave when he had a puncture.
The good news is that it makes for a very interesting 2 days. Will Schleck have what it takes to put 2 minutes into Contador? I hope so, it should be fun watching him try.
100km/hr descents into hairpins for 21km...no thanks.
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Let's not forget...
...it is a race :)
Yep, and the Yellow Jersey winner in Paris will get £380000 for it (with another £465000 odd won over the entire race for wearing the yellow jersey, at a guess split evenly as 27500 Euros for the first twenty stages, but I can't find a reference to exactly how it's divided up).
Getting the yellow jersey, and keeping it to the end is likely to be worth a bucketload of cash to the winning team.
Alls fair in love and war etc.
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I didn't see anyone waiting for Armstrong on the Pave when he had a p*nct*r*.
Armstrong wasn't in the yellow jersey when he punctured.
Come to think of it, I think Chavanel was in yellow, and he punctured or crashed... but I don't remember a blatant attack, maybe he'd lost too much ground by then anyway.
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Re: the chaincatcher question...
Going by the Roche/Hayles discussion afterwards (and the position of the derailleur cage before the chain unships) it would appear that Schleck was going from the little chainring to the big at the time.
I imagine, therefore, that he unshipped outside the big ring, not inside onto the BB. In that case, the chaincatcher is irrelevant. (It's hard to see for sure which way the chain went on the replays I looked at though).
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Following on from that...
I'm pretty sure that the video I saw didn't show Schleck making a gear change when his chain jammed. I couldn't see his hands/fingers moving on the bars. It looked like two things happened to me. 1. Schleck's chain jammed - caising the rear wheel to jump off the tarmac by a few inches. 2. Schleck's chain then came off at the crank, either as a result of him fixing the problem at the rear, or following the first issue. He then proceeded not to put it back on properly at the crank (didn't turn the pedals far enough, I think), which resulted in it falling off again when he tried to start riding again, costing him more time.
Simple chain suck, perhaps? You wouldn't want to be SRAM, right now, would you?
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Schleck was unlucky
But you make your own luck in the TdF
Everyone knows if you shift under power there is a chance of the chain falling off
Some of the commentators thought that the chain fell off crank side, so a dog fang wouldn't have made any difference
Should Contador have waited? No, it's a race
Should Andy have got his chain back on quicker? Yes, it's a race
Andy's climbing on the little bit of the ascent that was left was exceptional
Andy's descending was very good. Considering the people ahead were following Sanchez he didn't loose much at all
Dennis Menchov has gone from 2:58 to 2:13 since saturday. There's still 2 mountain days left and a time trial
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Why should Contador wait?
Lee:
Your post suggests you are unaware of Tour riders ever waiting for their adversaries - is this the case?
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If (on a sprinters stage) Cavendish slipped his chain with 300m to go would everyone sit up and wait while he corrected things? What's the difference? Schleck attacked. He was saying 'Come on boys, let the racing commence'. He can't then say 'Come on chaps, all take it easy while I sort me chain out'.
If Contador had slipped his chain trying to get in the right gear to follow would Schleck have waited (he would know it had happened thanks to the communication systems they all ride with)? Personally I don't think so.
You can back through years of Tour's and find examples of where riders sit up, or riders take advantage (Cobbles 2003 (?), Passage de Gois 1999). Did Armstrong say 'Come on lads, I think we should all sit up until we find out if Beloki is OK'?
As for Contador knowing what was happening, he did seem to hesitate, maybe he was thinking 'should I wait?' But I bet the message he would be getting through his earpiece was 'ATTACK, ATTACK, ATTACK!!!'
It's a bike race FFS, Schleck is young and will have his day, maybe there is still time during this Tour - If so I hope it's not through mis-hap to Contador, the gloating will be vomit inducing!
Edit: BTW as for Contador being a 'snake'. Any 'big' winner needs to have a nasty side to their character (IMO) - why was Hinault the 'Badger' and Poulidor 'Pou-Pou'?
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Wot Oaky said. If Schleck's chain had come off on the inside then he'd more likely have indulged in a Several of minutes of undignified tugging and swearing before the team car arrived and gave him another bike.
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Contador has apologised. :thumbsup:
EDIT: I only heard a 20-word radio news item, no idea of the details!
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Contador has apologised. :thumbsup:
and he has yellow too ;)
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Contador has apologised. :thumbsup:
That's a pity. I was looking forward to seeing what the informal sanctions from the peleton would consist of. I tend to think that the natural impulse of the riders is to get through the Tour with the minimum of energy expended.
All the sprint and KoM points are indicative of the tension between that aim simply to get round and the organisers desire to have some racing on show. I reckon these informal rules are there to accommodate that tension, Sherwen is one of the group of riders and former riders who would be having a moan about Contador, the other Astana riders can do without any hostility.
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Contador has apologised. :thumbsup:
Mmmm...... not exactly. It is heavily qualified
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I have it! The solution to all Andy Schleck's problems (http://www.sturmey-archer.com/products/hubs/cid/3/id/22)
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who cares, it's yesterdays news....
Looks like they ride like mad men again today, classement riders are dropping off, the peloton
with the yellow jersey are down to 17 riders :thumbsup:
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It's ironic for Specialised though, they had the first two riders on their bikes and then a mechanical causes controversy.
YouTube
- Alberto Contador & Andy Schleck In It To Win It
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzPq0hDdDhs)
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I have it! The solution to all Andy Schleck's problems (http://www.sturmey-archer.com/products/hubs/cid/3/id/22)
or this (http://davesbikeblog.squarespace.com/storage/Fontan29.JPG?__SQUARESPACE_CACHEVERSION=1238587573187) ;)
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They are now coming down from Col de Aspin where I was airborne two times :o
(before I slowed down and others just flew past me)
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itv4 supassed themselves today. started their coverage at 3 rather than the usual 2.30, and completly missed every climb of a classic mountain stage. turned out to be a damp squib but still, sums up their entire coverage of this years race.
They do however, seem to have invented a new trend in tv sports coverage. several hours of adverts, with a few minutes of sports thrown in every now and again.
fortunately, i watched the entire stage on the net ;D saddo is me
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The scenery on today's stage looked absolutely stunning. Schleck's accepted Contador's apology and told his fans to stop booing. All is well in the world. (Apart from the Petacchi story, that is).
And an impressive ride by Hushovd today.
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I wonder how they do the coverage on ITV, because they use Sherwen and Liggett and here in the US, Liggett is constantly talking about Versus (the channel its on), maybe Sherwen broadcasts in the gaps. Mind you there's quite a delay on the ITV coverage (like 10 mins I think).
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Ligget quote from today - "his back legs are full of lactic"
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If so I hope it's not through mis-hap to Contador, the gloating will be vomit inducing!
It would be worse than that, studied not gloating.
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Nice enough scenery today - but the cycling was dull. What's with this concept of cycling "days off"?
Yawwwnnn....
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no mention of this Saying No to the SAG Wagon | Bicycling Magazine (http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/tour-features/saying-no-sag-wagon) on itv, unless I missed it - Jens is ledg' (as the kids would say)
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fortunately, i watched the entire stage on the net ;D saddo is me
Was that on the ITV site, or some other?
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Cyclingfans and steephill.tv are your friends if you do not have cable.
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no mention of this Saying No to the SAG Wagon | Bicycling Magazine (http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/tour-features/saying-no-sag-wagon) on itv, unless I missed it - Jens is ledg' (as the kids would say)
That's just brilliant, it matters so much to finish, if you're French finishing last can be a good thing.
Lanterne Rouge: Honor in Finishing Last In the Tour de France - Versus (http://www.versus.com/blogs/2010-tour-de-france-and-cycling-events/lanterne-rouge-honor-in-finishing-last-in-the-tour-de-france/)
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no mention of this Saying No to the SAG Wagon | Bicycling Magazine (http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/tour-features/saying-no-sag-wagon) on itv, unless I missed it - Jens is ledg' (as the kids would say)
Top link, although after listening to him talk yesterday I suspect the editor took out his stilted German sounding English. ;D
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From Cyclingnews.com
Dean's rude awakening
Many's the time (well, it's happened about twice) that we've been driving to the start of a stage of the Tour de France and spotted some wannabe dressed head-to-toe in team issue Garmin-Transitions kit, riding a team issue bike in the opposite direction, and thought: he bears an uncanny resemblance to Julian Dean.
Only to then realise that...it is Julian Dean. Because the Kiwi is one of a very rare breed among pro cyclists: he warms up. Think about it - although athletes in every other sport limber up with stretching exercises, shuttle runs, the lotus position, cyclists - we're talking about road stages here; time trials are obviously different - tend to step casually out of the bus, swing their leg over the bike, and go.
Tuesday's sixteenth stage was different. Because they started with the climb of the Col de Peyresourde, many riders warmed up, some going for a ride, others opting for a turbo trainer.
Dean, of course, set out on his spin, but in the course of his spin he encountered a problem familiar to many cyclists riding the course of the Tour. On the lower slopes of the Peyresourde a gendarme - thinking he was punter rather than pro - told him to stop and walk. Dean refused - obviously.
At which point the officer got angry and aggressive, and shoved him off his bike. "He crashed hard," said the team's spokeswoman, "and broke both wheels."
;D ;D He must have been a Mark Renshaw supporter ;D ;D
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no mention of this Saying No to the SAG Wagon | Bicycling Magazine (http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/tour-features/saying-no-sag-wagon) on itv, unless I missed it - Jens is ledg' (as the kids would say)
Fuck me, he's well nails!
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I do hope he can get to Paris after all that.
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no mention of this Saying No to the SAG Wagon | Bicycling Magazine (http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/tour-features/saying-no-sag-wagon) on itv, unless I missed it - Jens is ledg' (as the kids would say)
Fuck me, he's well nails!
Paul Sherwen had a number of close calls with the cut-off in the 1980s, being timed out in one Tour and being re-instated in 1985.
In the Tour, Sherwen finished 111th in 1982 and 116th in 1984. During the last mountain stage of 1984, he diced with the cut-off time. Riding with Australian cyclist Allan Peiper towards the summit at La Plagne, Peiper was knocked from his bike by a Dutch enthusiast. Sherwen – aware of the cut-off – told him to get back on his bike and they crossed the line just inside the limit.
[edit] 1985 tour
On the first day in the mountains of the 1985 Tour de France, Sherwen crashed in the first kilometre before the race had left Epinal. With Bernard Hinault setting a fast pace, Sherwen had little chance to regain the other riders. He rode solo for six hours over six mountains, accompanied by a motorcycle outrider, and was over an hour behind the stage winner, and 23 minutes outside the cut-off – the Tour publicity caravan had started its return journey and had to move to one side to allow Sherwen to complete the stage. However, again, his courage and endurance were rewarded by reinstatement – he did continue and went on to finish this Tour which would be his last.
I was researching the question of dropping the Yellow Jersey when they are in trouble and I came across the story of The Stolen Vuelta, where Robert Millar lost a 6 minute lead in the Tour of Spain after a puncture in yellow, an interesting story because it touches on the way that teams out of contention are paid to ride for the leaders.
YouTube
- Robert Millar - The Stolen Vuelta
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4NZg6Vx2kQ&NR=1)
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fortunately, i watched the entire stage on the net ;D saddo is me
Was that on the ITV site, or some other?
some other, lots of links, many but not always with foreign commentary. I usually mute the sound and listen to eurosport audio, if its sync'd. I would have been rather upset yesterday if Id had to rely on ITV and missed ALL the climbs
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I wonder how they do the coverage on ITV, because they use Sherwen and Liggett and here in the US, Liggett is constantly talking about Versus (the channel its on), maybe Sherwen broadcasts in the gaps. Mind you there's quite a delay on the ITV coverage (like 10 mins I think).
theres also a delay on eurosport coverage, yesterday was watching online while there was a delay of over 10km on eurosports audio!!
on ITV paul sherwen seems to have periods when he talk continually. I thought Phil Liggett was taking numerous comfort breaks but maybe its when hes talking on versus
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I wonder how they do the coverage on ITV, because they use Sherwen and Liggett and here in the US, Liggett is constantly talking about Versus (the channel its on), maybe Sherwen broadcasts in the gaps. Mind you there's quite a delay on the ITV coverage (like 10 mins I think).
theres also a delay on eurosport coverage, yesterday was watching online while there was a delay of over 10km on eurosports audio!!
on ITV paul sherwen seems to have periods when he talk continually. I thought Phil Liggett was taking numerous comfort breaks but maybe its when hes talking on versus
You can often hear Liggett doing commentary in the background while Sherwen is reading from the Tour literarture commentating.
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Marvellous Liggettism on the highlights programme last night:
And Contador is totally concentrating on the back brake of Schleck's saddle!
WTF ???
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Sh!tty weather on the Tourmalet today - cold and wet.
For a Tour that's seen a lot of drama, I'm curiously disinterested. I think it's because I'm ambivalent about who wins out of Schleck and Contador. I would have preferred to cheer on a Menchov or Evans or "anyone but Armstrong" if Larry had been in contention. Daft, really.
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Who goes best in bad weather? I'd predict a hard man breakaway looking to claim back time. Is this a Bradley day or will he refocus on the TT and ignore GC?
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Who goes best in bad weather? I'd predict a hard man breakaway looking to claim back time. Is this a Bradley day or will he refocus on the TT and ignore GC?
You'd think Menchov might have a go but will probably fall off as it's wet. I wonder how Cadel's elbow is... he's one for when it gets tough.
The latter for Brad, he's got a better chance of winning the TT.
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You'd think Menchov might have a go but will probably fall off as it's wet. I wonder how Cadel's elbow is... he's one for when it gets tough.
The latter for Brad, he's got a better chance of winning the TT.
Denis doesn't need it to be wet to fall off. Falling off when it's wet is probably too predictable for him :)
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Lance always used to go well in bad weather. He may well have another crack at the stage win.
Given how well Lance and Alberto were getting on this time last year do you reckon Lance would be willing to help Andy up the mountains. Bit of cooperation from those two? Stage win for Lance, no yellow jersey for Alberto?
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Lance always used to go well in bad weather. He may well have another crack at the stage win.
Given how well Lance and Alberto were getting on this time last year do you reckon Lance would be willing to help Andy up the mountains. Bit of cooperation from those two? Stage win for Lance, no yellow jersey for Alberto?
I reckon Lance will be completely knackered after giving it everything yesterday and his recovery time won't be as good as that of the 25 year olds. He'll survive today.
<breaking news>After Sky said they'd focus on stage wins now Bradley's out of the GC, the first break contains both Flecha and EBH</breaking news>
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I reckon Lance will be completely knackered after giving it everything yesterday and his recovery time won't be as good as that of the 25 year olds. He'll survive today.
I never thought I'd see the day when Christophe Moreau would ride as well as Lance Armstrong
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I never thought I'd see the day when Christophe Moreu would ride as well as Lance Armstrong
With Moreau, Horner and Lance involved, that must have been the highest average age for a breakaway group in years. ;D
Slightly more depressing, all three are older than me and still able to ride a bike up a mountain like that. :-\
d.
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;D ;D ;D
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I'm currently watching the live feed from Canal Alpha Sport on justin.tv. One of the commentators sounds like a French version of Whispering Bob Harris.
The weather looks 'orrible out there today.
d.
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Some awesome descending going on at the front considering the conditions.
d.
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I'm currently watching the live feed from Canal Alpha Sport on justin.tv. One of the commentators sounds like a French version of Whispering Bob Harris.
That's probably Laurent Fignon who, as you probably know, is suffering very badly from cancer.
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That's probably Laurent Fignon who, as you probably know, is suffering very badly from cancer.
Yes, I expect you're right. I thought they said on ITV the other day that he'd given up commentating because of his illness, but maybe I misheard.
Anyway, the sound quality got too bad so I switched to a Eurosport feed and have been enjoying hearing about Sean Kelly racing up the Tourmalet yesterday on a 1910 singlespeed. Brilliant!
d.
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That's probably Laurent Fignon who, as you probably know, is suffering very badly from cancer.
Yes, I expect you're right. I thought they said on ITV the other day that he'd given up commentating because of his illness, but maybe I misheard.
Anyway, the sound quality got too bad so I switched to a Eurosport feed and have been enjoying hearing about Sean Kelly racing up the Tourmalet yesterday on a 1910 singlespeed. Brilliant!
d.
The ITV4 highlights programme showed an interview with Laurent Fignon a couple of nights ago. I'm not sure if he is still commentating but he still seemed to be very much involved with the race. I didn't catch all of the interview, but I got the impression that he was saying his cancer is getting worse but only slowly. TBH, he looked a lot better than I expected.
He was a rider of great panache.
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I liked Fignon's style, though I can well understand why the media weren't fond. His loss to Lemond was heartbreaking.
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It's a bit foggy on the descent of the Soulor! :o
(http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k170/smutchin/soulor-descent.jpg)
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Hopefully there won't be any sheep on the road while descending, like on the way up :hand:
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I'm in a hotel bar watching it on my laptop on the weakest wireless signal possible. Nice of Shropshire Gold and crisps though :thumbsup:
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Hopefully there won't be any sheep on the road while descending, like on the way up :hand:
Sheep on the road are the reason I will never beat my maximum speed down off Widdop. I learned a valuable lesson without even being injured. I hope that the roads are clear for all the riders.
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There's nothing worse than hitting a sheep on a tricky descent. Especially a good-looking one.
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Well done ITV - ad break when shleck went!!
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I've just seen Hummers running alongside Schleck and Contador.
;D
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Well done ITV - ad break when shleck went!!
not unexpected really considering the poor coverage through out the tour
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It's a lot better than it used to be!
My new prediction: Saxobank pull out a Spartacus special two-up break tomorrow with Schleck tied to his back wheel in a last bid to put time into Contador before the ITT. I can always hope.
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Well done ITV - ad break when shleck went!!
not unexpected really considering the poor coverage through out the tour
I disagree. If it wasn't for ITV picking up the TdF, we'd all be reliant upon satellite, cable or t'internet. I'd rather have their coverage, which is good apart from the odd ill timed ad break, than none at all on terrestrial TV.
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Hopefully there won't be any sheep on the road while descending, like on the way up :hand:
I reckon if the camera had panned back to Geraint Thomas at that moment, he'd have been the most excited rider in the race. ;D
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I've just seen Hummers running alongside Schleck and Contador.
;D
In a mankini by any chance?
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Schleck has got to develop a better way of celebrating a win. That's twice I've seen him do that one handed arm waving-dance thing with an odd facial expression to match. Remminds me of a Dad at a school disco, or perhaps an irate orang-utan. :hand:
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Well done ITV - ad break when shleck went!!
Eurosport is my friend ;D
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Schleck has got to develop a better way of celebrating a win. That's twice I've seen him do that one handed arm waving-dance thing with an odd facial expression to match. Remminds me of a Dad at a school disco, or perhaps an irate orang-utan. :hand:
Could be worse, he could do a daft pretend pistol shooting or something ;D
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It'll make for an interesting discussion if Contador wins overall by 30 secs or less.
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I've just seen Hummers running alongside Schleck and Contador.
;D
In a mankini by any chance?
And brandishing a root vegetable?
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well I am now am now an Andy Schleck fan.
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well I am now am now an Andy Schleck fan.
Gr-Granville! F-fetch yer cloth!
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Anyone else hoping for a karmic mechanical on Saturday?
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What an epic stage today ! Chapeau's to them both :thumbsup:
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well I am now am now an Andy Schleck fan.
Lots of guts out there. But Contador is being the absolute Terminator. I'm liking and admiring Schleck, but hugely impressed with the C-800.
Anyone else hoping for a karmic mechanical on Saturday?
Naughty thought! :thumbsup:
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What an epic stage today ! Chapeau's to them both :thumbsup:
Yeah, that was pretty impressive. I thought Schleck had Contador on the ropes towards the end, but Contador just hung on in there magnificently. The highlight for me was Schleck staring out Contador with a few km to go.
d.
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In the interview after the win I think it was Ned Boulting that asked Andy Schleck whom was the better climber out of him and Contador as today they had looked identically brilliant.
Schleck replied brilliantly with force but not rudely - "You tell me" and then did a Jens Voigt at the camera :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
He was also humble towards Contador's performance and laughed when he explained what he had said to Contador on the run up to the finish.
He is certainly a very likeable 25 yr old.
I hope in the near future he can get to the top.
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Yes, he's still at the age where just finishing the Tour is good progress.
He'll make a better champion than Contador, more personality and passion, rather than just ending up in yellow by default as the race hits the mountains.
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He'll make a better champion than Contador, more personality and passion, rather than just ending up in yellow by default as the race hits the mountains.
That is a bit harsh on Contador - he is a very good all rounder. He won the TT last year and this year coped well with the cobbles - what the hell last year he even won with his own team was against him!
They are both outstanding riders and a joy to watch.
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Yes, you have a point there. He's had Vinokourov attacking him for a week as well!
The duel today was indeed a joy to watch, especially the Schleck Glare, but it's a shame that it ended as practically a draw.
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He's had Vinokourov attacking him for a week as well!
Employ Vino as a team-mate and you can expect that.
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I don't like Contador, but you cannot deny that he's an outstanding cyclist, having won both the Vuelta, Giro and Tour the same year and seemingly keeps on winning the tour. That alone makes him a better rider than Lance ever was.
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He'll make a better champion than Contador, more personality and passion, rather than just ending up in yellow by default as the race hits the mountains.
That is a bit harsh on Contador - he is a very good all rounder. He won the TT last year and this year coped well with the cobbles - what the hell last year he even won with his own team was against him!
They are both outstanding riders and a joy to watch.
+1.
Agreed. 'Yellow by default' is a bit harsh. Schleck hasn't managed to demonstrate the capability to put significant time into Contador (and the ITT is still to happen). If there hadn't been a neutralisation on stage 2 he would have been in yellow a lot earlier. Also Cancellara/Schleck took advantage of Contador and attacked when he was trapped by the crash involving Frank Schleck on the cobbles. Contador did a great job to limit his losses on that day and didn't winge afterwards - unlike Schleck after the chain incident.
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I don't like Contador, but you cannot deny that he's an outstanding cyclist, having won both the Vuelta, Giro and Tour the same year and seemingly keeps on winning the tour. That alone makes him a better rider than Lance ever was.
Yes but Contador is obviously doping.
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I don't like Contador, but you cannot deny that he's an outstanding cyclist, having won both the Vuelta, Giro and Tour the same year and seemingly keeps on winning the tour. That alone makes him a better rider than Lance ever was.
Yes but Contador is obviously doping.
Yeah, they should ban paella. :)
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Yes but Contador is obviously doping.
I'm not convinced Schleck is a pure and untainted as the colour of his jersey would suggest.
But even if they were both swimming in a lethal cocktail of epo, steroids and horse tranquilisers*, yesterday's stage was incredible - a bit like watching two heavyweights pounding each other half to death in the boxing ring. Gruesomely fascinating.
d.
*and we're not saying they were, are we? - legal ed
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<naive_comment>
I thought they were regularly tested for dope
</naive_comment>
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There's a lot of dopes riding for professional teams.
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In the interview after the win I think it was Ned Boulting that asked Andy Schleck whom was the better climber out of him and Contador as today they had looked identically brilliant.
Schleck replied brilliantly with force but not rudely - "You tell me" and then did a Jens Voigt at the camera :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
He was also humble towards Contador's performance and laughed when he explained what he had said to Contador on the run up to the finish.
He is certainly a very likeable 25 yr old.
I hope in the near future he can get to the top.
Yeah, I thought that question wasn't great, and he handled it brilliantly. As a first time avid TdF follower, Schleck is awesome to watch, and gives so much more away than Contador. My 4 year old and I sat together cheering him manically at 4km to go. Amazing spectacle.
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Yes but Contador is obviously doping.
I'm not convinced Schleck is a pure and untainted as the colour of his jersey would suggest.
But even if they were both swimming in a lethal cocktail of epo, steroids and horse tranquilisers*, yesterday's stage was incredible - a bit like watching two heavyweights pounding each other half to death in the boxing ring. Gruesomely fascinating.
d.
*and we're not saying they were, are we? - legal ed
Gladiators in the mist - gripping stuff.
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But Schleck's missed his chance, now, hasn't he?
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He could use Cancellara's 'special' bike in the TT ;)
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Can Cav take green?
If he wins and Petacchi is 7th or later and Hushovd 3rd or later.
There are 12 points available for intermediate sprints. If Cav gets both of those and Petacchi doesn't place then all Cav has to do is win.
We may yet see him go for an intermediate sprint, and the difference between win and lose the green may be him sitting up on stage 2.
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He could use Cancellara's 'special' bike in the TT ;)
And today will have allowed him to recharge his batteries, so to speak :)
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Come on Bradley - go full gas today and get that first stage win for Sky.
Go Wiggo go.
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Yes but Contador is obviously doping.
I'm not convinced Schleck is a pure and untainted as the colour of his jersey would suggest.
On what evidance do you base that statement?? Or is it that any sucessful tour cyclist must by definition be doping...
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Can Cav take green?
I predict he'll go for the stage win and not worry about green, just see what happens.
IIRC, the green jersey contenders never contest the race to be first onto the Champs Elysee. It might be seen as bad form if he tries to steal those points from a glory-huntuing breakaway.
That was another incredible performance from Cav yesterday. Who needs a lead-out man? He was so far ahead by the time he crossed the line, he was looking back round to see where the hell everyone else was. Simply astonishing. ;D
Looking forward to seeing Brad go for broke today. The course should suit him nicely. Guess it's just a question of whether Cancellara has recovered from his monster pacemaking effort on the Tourmalet.
If Brad does win today and Cav wins in Paris, that would mean Brit riders have won the final three stages. And six overall - the same number of stages won by French riders this year.
d.
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Yes but Contador is obviously doping.
I'm not convinced Schleck is a pure and untainted as the colour of his jersey would suggest.
On what evidance do you base that statement?? Or is it that any sucessful tour cyclist must by definition be doping...
Have a look back through the thread - he's not been implicated but his brother has.
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On what evidance do you base that statement?? Or is it that any sucessful tour cyclist must by definition be doping...
Only that he has at times made the climbing look too easy. But that's not an outright accusation... I just don't know. I'd like to think he's clean but I can't wholly convince myself. It's not like I'm alone in voicing suspicion. And as Tewdric says, there's a certain amount of being tainted by association with his brother. And not to mention Bjarne Riis.
It's clear he's a phenomenally gifted rider, though - loads more natural talent than his brother - and a very deserving wearer of the white jersey.
d.
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Can Cav take green?
If Brad does win today and Cav wins in Paris, that would mean Brit riders have won the final three stages. And six overall - the same number of stages won by French riders this year.
d.
Wow, I didn't know that statistic. That would be a fantastic result.
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Wow, I didn't know that statistic. That would be a fantastic result.
Well, it's contingent on Brad actually winning the TT and Cav winning in Paris...
But at least one of those is pretty likely. :thumbsup:
d.
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Just watched the replay of yesterday's finish again, this time with overhead shot...
The gap was HUGE. Cav should have been given a different time to everyone else! ;D
d.
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Just watched the replay of yesterday's finish again, this time with overhead shot...
The gap was HUGE. Cav should have been given a different time to everyone else! ;D
d.
I searched for that but Google let me down. Linkee please.
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Andy Schleck giving it a good go !
And I wish Contador would sort his saddle out, he's hitching himself backwards every 3 revolutions, which cant be efficient and looks bloody awkward
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I searched for that but Google let me down. Linkee please.
It was on the ITV highlights programme, which I recorded last night. Might still be available to watch on the ITV website?
d.
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Here you go: http://www.itv.com/itvplayer/video/?Filter=160736
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I don't like Contador, but you cannot deny that he's an outstanding cyclist, having won both the Vuelta, Giro and Tour the same year and seemingly keeps on winning the tour. That alone makes him a better rider than Lance ever was.
won all 3 but not all in the same year :)
tdf 2007, 2009,
vuelta, giro 2008, year he was excluded from le tour
tdf 2010 baring accidents etc
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It'll make for an interesting discussion if Contador wins overall by 30 secs or less.
assuming schleck, contador would have finished in the same time without schlecks mechanical, contador would now be 8 secs ahead ;D, then again, if stage 2 hadnt been neutralised schleck would probably have been out of the running before the cobbles
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It's a bit foggy on the descent of the Soulor! :o
(http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k170/smutchin/soulor-descent.jpg)
same when rode the soulor a few years back, couldnt see more than 5 feet for the entire 29km climb, luckily the sheep all have bells on ;D
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I don't like Contador, but you cannot deny that he's an outstanding cyclist, having won both the Vuelta, Giro and Tour the same year and seemingly keeps on winning the tour. That alone makes him a better rider than Lance ever was.
won all 3 but not all in the same year :)
tdf 2007, 2009,
vuelta, giro 2008, year he was excluded from le tour
tdf 2010 baring accidents etc
In light of several comments appearing here suggesting drug taking, I think it's important to point out that Contador himself wasn't excluded from le Tour. The team he signed for was excluded for their past behaviour, which was before Contador signed for them.
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In my Cycle Sport magazine that visited the 4 major contenders whilst training for the tour, it mentions that Contador has a very high anaerobic threshold. It would appear that he is a 'special' person not dissimilar to Evans or Armstrong.
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I don't like Contador, but you cannot deny that he's an outstanding cyclist, having won both the Vuelta, Giro and Tour the same year and seemingly keeps on winning the tour. That alone makes him a better rider than Lance ever was.
won all 3 but not all in the same year :)
tdf 2007, 2009,
vuelta, giro 2008, year he was excluded from le tour
tdf 2010 baring accidents etc
In light of several comments appearing here suggesting drug taking, I think it's important to point out that Contador himself wasn't excluded from le Tour. The team he signed for was excluded for their past behaviour, which was before Contador signed for them.
not suggesting dope here at all, just that he wasnt allowed to race in 2008 and won all 3 but not the same year, in which case i may have been suggesting dope ;D
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The clip here about 'On the Podium' is most amusing...
News & Video - Tour de France 2010 - Cycling - ITV Sport
(http://www.itv.com/sport/tourdefrance/newsandvideo/)
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contador seems to be suggesting he may go for the giro vuelta double again next season, though cant see him missing the tour myself
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Wow, I'd missed all those videos. I might be some time ;D ;D
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That was some finish.. He made everyone else look distinctly ordinary.
..d
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And if Petacchi gets DQ'd as a result of the Italian drugs investigation he gets the green too.
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I always find the last day a bit boring and ceremonial; after all the winner rides around with a glass of champagne before the stage has even started
I believe it's down to the fact that France was humiliated in the 1989 finish when Lemond beat Fignon in the ITT to win the GC
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That was some finish.. He made everyone else look distinctly ordinary.
It's interesting the way the head-on camera angle they use on most stage finishes tends to make it look very close, but the side-view tracking camera they use on the Champs Elysee gives a much better impression of how much faster he is than anyone else. Phenomenal.
Must be on drugs. ;)
d.
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That was the shot where it is panning Hushovd as he starts to sprint, and you see petacchi coming onto his shoulder and are just starting to ask your self "Where's Ca..." and before the words can be spoken the Manx missile is flying across the back of shot like a rocket.
Absolutely fantastic..
..d
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It was, it made me burst out laughing - he just came from nowhere ......zooooooooom
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it made me burst out laughing
Me too!
d.
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That was the shot where it is panning Hushovd as he starts to sprint, and you see petacchi coming onto his shoulder and are just starting to ask your self "Where's Ca..." and before the words can be spoken the Manx missile is flying across the back of shot like a rocket.
Absolutely fantastic..
..d
:o :thumbsup: ;D
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The money shot of the Tour I reckon, amazing speed and his style on the bike was so forward too.
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YouTube
- Mark Cavendish Interview [Stage 20, Tour de France 2010]
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyNFr-x1dOU)
At 1 min 22 Ned asks Mr Cavendish if he can compare his two very different wins on the final stage in the Tour.
He laughs and throws it straight back at him. Mr C is getting more and more likeable.
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Talking of money, the UCI have fined Radioshack for the jersey debacle. Mostly due to the disruption of the race and TV schedules. However, they have stated that they appreciate the reason behind the jersey change and will donate the fines to the Swiss League against Cancer.
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That was the shot where it is panning Hushovd as he starts to sprint, and you see petacchi coming onto his shoulder and are just starting to ask your self "Where's Ca..." and before the words can be spoken the Manx missile is flying across the back of shot like a rocket.
Absolutely fantastic..
..d
That was exactly what I was thinking as I watched it. He's just unbelievably fast. The overhead shot was good too, showed how far ahead he was by the time he got to the line at least a bike length.
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That was the shot where it is panning Hushovd as he starts to sprint, and you see petacchi coming onto his shoulder and are just starting to ask your self "Where's Ca..." and before the words can be spoken the Manx missile is flying across the back of shot like a rocket.
Absolutely fantastic..
..d
That was exactly what I was thinking as I watched it. He's just unbelievably fast. The overhead shot was good too, showed how far ahead he was by the time he got to the line at least a bike length.
One bike length - but one of these bikes..
(http://www.thebicycle.org/images/Tandem_bicycle1.jpg)
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;D
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One bike length - but one of these bikes..
Columbia's lead-out secret rumbled!
I can just imagine Tony Martin on the front, with Maxime Monfort behind, then Michael Rogers, Mark Renshaw and finally Cav. There's a secret switch he can flick to detach his section as they approach the line and launch himself off like a Sidewinder.
d.