Author Topic: [HAMR] Current thoughts on the record attempt?  (Read 252688 times)

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #925 on: 24 December, 2015, 07:40:09 am »
Absolutely.  Steve has put an enormous amount into this and achieved much over 2015.  But it would be far better to recognise now that the restart can't work rather than ride himself into the ground to the detriment of his physical, and mental, health.  To encourage him to stick with it at this stage would be foolhardy and cruel.  The best message that those who are in contact with him could give him is that he has achieved a lot but the record is not realistic so it would be ok to stop.  And, if he does stop, he has not let anyone down.

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #926 on: 24 December, 2015, 08:01:07 am »
Personally, I reckon Steve should abandon the restarted attempt on the 31st, having done a spectacular job...
I totally agree. If a dispassionate look at things shows that the probability of breaking the record on the concurrent attempt is now out of realistic reach, I see no point in continuing it. Whatever happens, Steve will finish 2015 with an incredible total...
100% in agreement with Kim and TimC.  Sadly, what I suspect will happen is that Steve will plug on ("because that's what he does, heh?") and that no-one on the so-called team will brave the conversation with him that ought to be had.  It'd be marginally more likely to be taken on board coming from someone on the inside, but my two-penn'orth to Steve is that he's done amazingly, but there's no sense compromising long-term health in pursuit of the 08/15-08/16 attempt.
I'm a little bit shocked that Phartiphukborlz's and LWaB's offers of help have not been even acknowledged (let alone accepted), and about Fidgetbuzz's revelations about team communications.  I've got some personal opinions about the (dys)function of the team that are probably best not expressed on a public forum.

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #927 on: 24 December, 2015, 08:22:26 am »
A small correction. There was a reply from the team to my offer, basically "Thanks but no thanks"
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #928 on: 24 December, 2015, 08:32:54 am »
When did you get this?
It is simpler than it looks.

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #929 on: 24 December, 2015, 08:36:06 am »
Monday, after I'd complied with their requests and after I'd chased them up for a reply.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #930 on: 24 December, 2015, 08:38:12 am »
A small correction. There was a reply from the team to my offer, basically "Thanks but no thanks"
Okay, but the essence remains.  What you were offering would have been fantastic - a real tribute to your generosity - and the numbers are suggesting that Steve could use all the help he can get at the moment.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #931 on: 24 December, 2015, 08:41:38 am »
Monday, after I'd complied with their requests and after I'd chased them up for a reply.
It's Thursday today.
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #932 on: 24 December, 2015, 08:52:37 am »
Monday, after I'd complied with their requests and after I'd chased them up for a reply.
It's Thursday today.
Your point being?

red marley

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #933 on: 24 December, 2015, 08:53:56 am »
As Kurt brings home the miles at Flatwood Park, one of the photos posted on Facebook shows in part how he is able to ride 220 mile days after nearly a year of stamina-sapping days in the saddle (Kurt is in the middle in red):



Cycling conditions could not be any better for efficient use of effort. Not in any way a dig at Kurt or a suggestion that knocking out 220 is easy, as this seems like an entirely sensible strategy for him to take the record.
 
I know there have been plenty of calls here and elsewhere for Steve to find an equivalent environment and adopt a similar strategy. But for me at least, part of the attraction of Steve's attempt is the approach it represents. Riding it audax style is something I can identify with. It represents a way of cycling I admire and is in contrast to a more 'professional' approach that Kurt's world represents. For me it's not a question of which is 'better' or more effective, but which has more emotional resonance.

This isn't a call for business as usual as Steve slips down from the Godwin line, but a recognition that there is more to this than simply riding the most miles in a year.


Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #934 on: 24 December, 2015, 08:57:13 am »
Monday, after I'd complied with their requests and after I'd chased them up for a reply.
It's Thursday today.
Your point being?
You'll have to think a bit harder.
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #935 on: 24 December, 2015, 09:02:29 am »
Monday, after I'd complied with their requests and after I'd chased them up for a reply.
It's Thursday today.
Your point being?
You'll have to think a bit harder.
No, I still can't see what point you're trying to make.  Happy Thursday, though.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #936 on: 24 December, 2015, 09:13:04 am »
Monday, after I'd complied with their requests and after I'd chased them up for a reply.
It's Thursday today.
Your point being?
You'll have to think a bit harder.
No, I still can't see what point you're trying to make.  Happy Thursday, though.
I had hoped you would but it's really more for LWAB to have a think about it.
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #937 on: 24 December, 2015, 09:22:20 am »
Unless your point was along the lines of...

'they said "no" on Monday but now it's three days later (Thursday!) and the attempt is still spiralling downward so the "Team" might (just might) have re-evaluated and considered how good an offer they were turning down...

then no, I'm at a loss.  But considering your IMHO-twattish attitude to LWaB upthread, that seems unlikely.

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #938 on: 24 December, 2015, 09:38:39 am »
Interpreting semi-cryptic stuff on the internet gives a lot of opportunity to misinterpret the actual meaning. Just say what you really mean using plain language.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #939 on: 24 December, 2015, 09:41:51 am »
Let us all hope that at the end of December and with over 100,000k Steve will make the sensible decision  (Whatever that is considered the best option).  He is some 1775 mls below the Godwin Line.  If he were to average 215 mls a  day from now on  (not possible being winter ) it would take some 6.5 months to claw back to the Godwin Line.  Let us all hope that the benefits of the better diet will kick in very soon.  Also let us hope that Steve can have more vehicle transfers to his advantage.  I would like to contribute more money to his efforts and it would be nice to hear from team member early in 2016 of adjusted strategy to enable him to maximise his miles to the maximum advantage.
Steve do  have a successful last week to the end of December and the completion of the first attempt and rightly take your place of fame amongst the greats (and hopefully onwards and upwards! )

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #940 on: 24 December, 2015, 09:42:32 am »
My guess is Jaded thought that:-

A small correction. There was a reply from the team to my offer, basically "Thanks but no thanks"

was a correction to what LWaB had said before (i.e. he'd made it sound like they never even responded), instead of it being LWaB correcting Legs' assumption:-

...
I'm a little bit shocked that Phartiphukborlz's and LWaB's offers of help have not been even acknowledged (let alone accepted), ...

If you misread it that way then it may look like LWaB was sitting on that information on purpose to make Steve's team look worse and only correcting it now.

[EDIT] Looking back LWaB said that he'd received no response on the 14th, but obviously the response came after those postings, and he's corrected that as soon as someone made a reference to there being no response.

Storm, teacup.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

LMT

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #941 on: 24 December, 2015, 09:48:21 am »
Let us all hope that at the end of December and with over 100,000k Steve will make the sensible decision  (Whatever that is considered the best option).  He is some 1775 mls below the Godwin Line.  If he were to average 215 mls a  day from now on  (not possible being winter ) it would take some 6.5 months to claw back to the Godwin Line.  Let us all hope that the benefits of the better diet will kick in very soon.  Also let us hope that Steve can have more vehicle transfers to his advantage.  I would like to contribute more money to his efforts and it would be nice to hear from team member early in 2016 of adjusted strategy to enable him to maximise his miles to the maximum advantage.
Steve do  have a successful last week to the end of December and the completion of the first attempt and rightly take your place of fame amongst the greats (and hopefully onwards and upwards! )

Well said.

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #942 on: 24 December, 2015, 10:01:59 am »
Ah - thanks for the detective-work, Greenbank!  Yep, I probably shouldn't have assumed that the 'sound of crickets' was ongoing... (but, come to think of it, if LWaB made his offer on or before 11/12 and the thanks-but-no-thanks wasn't given back until 21/12, that's pretty shabby)

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #943 on: 24 December, 2015, 10:07:05 am »


Well said.
[/quote]


Many thanks

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #944 on: 24 December, 2015, 10:14:49 am »
I'd like to remain positive about this attempt but it's not looking great given the great unknown of the health problems, but I can see why he's sticking to it for now.

A while ago (early/mid November) my thoughts were still good based on looking at jo's graph and unselecting the "Common start times" checkbox. You'll then see:-
  • Steve finishing the year about level (or slightly up) on Tommy's record pace (just taking into account August -> End of Year) if he'd continued his red line on from mid/early November to the end of the year
  • He then starts next year as he started his original attempt and trends nicely above Tommy's original effort (and by enough to also cover the extra ~1500 miles that Kurt will add)

In other words, he would have matched Tommy mile for mile from the restart in August to December 31st and then just has to beat Tommy (and soon to be Kurt) between January and August, which he looked like he was on track to do (if that graph picked up and the big miles appeared in the warmer lighter spring/summer).

However, the recent health problems have seriously dented this as (at the current rate) he's going to finish the year ~2500 miles down on Tommy's pace and although he was 2500 miles ahead of Tommy's pace after 3 months of his first attempt he'd need to be:-
  • back on it full gas very soon (in the New Year at the latest) as he was when he started his first attempt
  • able to push on and increase the miles in the summer (which is unproven). He was trending along nicely with the early part of the higher schedule but we've no idea if he can pile on the miles at the rate he was hoping for and would need to
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #945 on: 24 December, 2015, 10:23:06 am »
Ah - thanks for the detective-work, Greenbank!  Yep, I probably shouldn't have assumed that the 'sound of crickets' was ongoing... (but, come to think of it, if LWaB made his offer on or before 11/12 and the thanks-but-no-thanks wasn't given back until 21/12, that's pretty shabby)

More assumptions! LWAB did say "after I had complied with their requests" but didn't say how long that took. Certainly not as simple as crickets. Plus, given the vitriol that the whole "No reply" thing caused, perhaps something a little stronger than "A small correction" might have ben in order. I've highlighted the most judgemental bit of your post  :thumbsup:
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #946 on: 24 December, 2015, 10:23:49 am »
This isn't a call for business as usual as Steve slips down from the Godwin line, but a recognition that there is more to this than simply riding the most miles in a year.

And yet, might it be fair to say that Godwin's approach was more in line with Kurt's that it is with Steve's, using speed intervals and support on the road to keep the mileage high?
There seems to be an almost romantic assumption on the forum that Steve's approach is somehow more genuine, more authentic, somehow much closer in spirit to how the record was originally set in 1939, but apart from them both being English and riding on English roads, does the similarity really extend any further?
Garry Broad

red marley

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #947 on: 24 December, 2015, 10:34:39 am »
I wasn't making the comparison with Tommy's approach as such, more the connection with 'one of us'. Where 'us' is the stoic approach with a dash of self-sufficiency that characterises much of Audax. I realise this won't be the same for everyone, but it is why Steve's endeavour appeals to me.

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #948 on: 24 December, 2015, 10:41:14 am »

I know there have been plenty of calls here and elsewhere for Steve to find an equivalent environment and adopt a similar strategy. But for me at least, part of the attraction of Steve's attempt is the approach it represents. Riding it audax style is something I can identify with. It represents a way of cycling I admire and is in contrast to a more 'professional' approach that Kurt's world represents. For me it's not a question of which is 'better' or more effective, but which has more emotional resonance.

This isn't a call for business as usual as Steve slips down from the Godwin line, but a recognition that there is more to this than simply riding the most miles in a year.

Riding it Audax style is how it started at the beginning of the year. Steve had a timetable to stay with hosts stretching months ahead. That fits in with the Audax ethos of declaring your routes ahead of doing them. That lasted for a while, but clearly wasn't going to work, mainly due to the data upload problem. The attempt then evolved into 'Groundhog Day', after the 'Marsh Gibbon' interlude, which was curtailed by the moped incident. Meanwhile Kurt kept on putting in the 200 mile+ days.

I'm all for emotional resonance. Perhaps we could have this expressed graphically. There's nothing 'professional' about Kurt's approach. We see End to Enders supported by friends and family in a motorhome on a regular basis, and it pales into insignificance compared with a serious amateur attempt on the 24 Hours.

Re: Current thoughts on the record attempt?
« Reply #949 on: 24 December, 2015, 10:45:41 am »
I wasn't making the comparison with Tommy's approach as such, more the connection with 'one of us'. Where 'us' is the stoic approach with a dash of self-sufficiency that characterises much of Audax. I realise this won't be the same for everyone, but it is why Steve's endeavour appeals to me.
Sure, I understand that, I'm in the same camp myself really.
Garry Broad