The Grumble Thread - No energy for a full on rant.

[citoyen]

PS I'm still a clot for my poor diary management skills, so the grumble stands.

[Kim]

I don't have any recollection of a formal transition into sixth form - my A-level choices were pretty much the default options. They seem to make a much bigger deal of it these days. To what end, I don't know.

We got some "how to chose your A-level subjects" advice sessions.  Which was based largely on teacher misunderstandings of the UCAS process (see above), and vague ideas of what A-levels were expected for various degree courses.

This, combined with the general enthusiasm by teachers for high-achieving pupils to go on and study their subject at A-level, is how I ended up with the erroneous impression that sciences were to be more useful for studying engineering than all-you-can-eat maths.

I suspect it's a bigger deal when you have the temptation of more non-traditional subjects available.

Btw, Kim, the comedy gig is at your old stamping ground. Any techies you want me to day hello to?

Assuming that's the Kent stomping ground, rather than the Brizzle or Sheffield ones, I suspect they've mostly moved on.  Except for the ones I'm still in contact with.

[Dibdib]

You're overlooking the potential for droning teacher comedy, of course.

You know the sort of thing: "Universities now rate A-level results by points, so if you do 4 A-levels you'll have a better chance of getting in.", "General Studies is recognised as a proper subject by universities."  "We have no bullying at $school.", etc

 

(An awful lot of my year group believed the first one, until it was too late.)

Yeah I got burned by that one too. Oh well. All worked out in the end though - I think I was happier at my second-choice uni than I would have been at my first.

[mrcharly-YHT]

These days it is very very important to check what the individual unis' require. UCAS points aren't the be all and end all.

My step daughter dropped maths, as she was told she would struggle to get a good mark (but after that the results of first exam came through and she was top of the class  ). Then 3 months down the line discovers the course she wants to do at a uni, the subsequent career path, etc. For that course, for that uni, they want maths or physics A level. Too late for her to get back into A level maths.

[Kim]

These days it is very very important to check what the individual unis' require. UCAS points aren't the be all and end all.

I don't think they ever were.  Except in the mind of my headteacher.   

[clarion]

No.  they weren't.  Even setting aside preferential offers for chaps from good schools, or applying to their father's old college, the assessment of candidates has depended more on the person than the sausage machine grade. 

I was given a place at Uni based on me and what I'd done, rather than my A Level results (which were then nearly a decade in the past, and in a different discipline).

[hellymedic]

Don't the kids still have access to 'A Compendium of University Entrance Requirements'? Is this not produced in these Modern Times?
It was my Bible in the mid-70s and nobody in our Sixth Form had a nasty surprise if they turned out to be doing 'wrong' A Levels.
We made basic choices about our higher education long before we entered the Sixth Form.

[Kim]

TBH, having done it both ways, I reckon that applying to university before you know your A-level results is more than a little bit bonkers.  Everything's so much less complicated when offers are unconditional.

[L CC]

I think you're fooling yourself if you think most universities, for most subjects, give places based on anything but the numbers. Admittedly you need the right subjects, but for example, No1Son had 3 offers based purely on points and wasn't interviewed at any of the establishments concerned. Having said that, he was aiming for Maths, which as we know, requires an absence of personality. 

Mature students (by which I mean anyone applying after they have their results in) are a whole different entrance criteria.

[T42]

Wonderful weather (sunny, 12°C, light wind) and I'm stuck indoors for a fortnight. Wish it was pissing down.

[mrcharly-YHT]

Don't the kids still have access to 'A Compendium of University Entrance Requirements'? Is this not produced in these Modern Times?
It was my Bible in the mid-70s and nobody in our Sixth Form had a nasty surprise if they turned out to be doing 'wrong' A Levels.
We made basic choices about our higher education long before we entered the Sixth Form.

Nope.

It's all online - but not in any one single place. Each uni lists their entry requirements, course by course. They don't even all do it in same way.

It's not *just* about points, it is also about the subjects you take. UCAS applications have to be in well before you even take your exams, let alone before knowing results. Yeah, all a bit bonkers.

[orienteer]

Wonderful weather (sunny, 12°C, light wind) and I'm stuck indoors for a fortnight. Wish it was pissing down.

If it's any consolation, it is certainly pissing down here in London.

[Basil]

Wonderful weather (sunny, 12°C, light wind) and I'm stuck indoors for a fortnight. Wish it was pissing down.

If it's any consolation, it is certainly pissing down here in London.

Yes, we've finished with it over here.  We thought that you lot might like it next. 

[hellymedic]

Don't the kids still have access to 'A Compendium of University Entrance Requirements'? Is this not produced in these Modern Times?
It was my Bible in the mid-70s and nobody in our Sixth Form had a nasty surprise if they turned out to be doing 'wrong' A Levels.
We made basic choices about our higher education long before we entered the Sixth Form.

Nope.

It's all online - but not in any one single place. Each uni lists their entry requirements, course by course. They don't even all do it in same way.

It's not *just* about points, it is also about the subjects you take. UCAS applications have to be in well before you even take your exams, let alone before knowing results. Yeah, all a bit bonkers.

It was always about subjects.
In my day,you could not study Medicine without an A Level in Physics (or Chemistry, which was fair enough), though that requirement was dropped later.
UCCA (as was) closing date was 15 December (15 October for Oxbridge) so many months before A Levels for those not planning a gap year.

[clarion]

Wonderful weather (sunny, 12°C, light wind) and I'm stuck indoors for a fortnight. Wish it was pissing down.

Oh dear.  I'm sorry to hear that.  Why so?  Have I missed something?

[Clare]

It's not *just* about points, it is also about the subjects you take. UCAS applications have to be in well before you even take your exams, let alone before knowing results. Yeah, all a bit bonkers.

Applications have always had to be in before results are known for anybody applying for a place to start immediately after they have completed their 'A' levels. If applicants were to wait until they had got their results they would either have to start later (the following January at the earliest) or it would be complete carnage.

Imagine the scene in a single provincial ex-poly:

14th August 0830: results are out.
14th August 0831: 50 000 applicants chasing 5 000* places start to fill in online forms, phone to ask if they have been successful, e-mail extenuating circumstances or get their mothers to do it for them.
14th August 0831 and 30 seconds: BT put out a press release stating that they are trying to re-connect Provincialmouth but everybody needs to be patient.

Than there's the problem of getting academic references from school teachers in mid-August when they are already dealing with 'A' level result issues.

Meanwhile Student Housing has three weeks to get all housing applications in, processed and allocated, timetabling have less than a fortnight to allocate the rooms for the year as this can't be done until numbers are known, thus academics have no idea when they will be lecturing and course administrators have no idea what numbers they will have or even if courses will run.

At about 0846 on 14th August the UCAS system will go into meltdown, shortly followed by all University systems, nobody will get a place and there will be a mass zombie attack.


The current situation means that at this time of the year we have a good idea how many students we will have on each course so timetabling can begin and administrators and academics can plan. In March applicants with a conditional offer are able to apply for Halls places.

It is still mayhem in August.

*Edit: Apols, number changed to approx first year places from approx all places (my error).

[Pingu]

No, our application hasn't stopped working. You've been trying to type a number in with NumLock off 

[Dibdib]

Don't the kids still have access to 'A Compendium of University Entrance Requirements'? Is this not produced in these Modern Times?
It was my Bible in the mid-70s and nobody in our Sixth Form had a nasty surprise if they turned out to be doing 'wrong' A Levels.
We made basic choices about our higher education long before we entered the Sixth Form.

Nope.

It's all online - but not in any one single place. Each uni lists their entry requirements, course by course. They don't even all do it in same way.

It's not *just* about points, it is also about the subjects you take. UCAS applications have to be in well before you even take your exams, let alone before knowing results. Yeah, all a bit bonkers.

It was always about subjects.
In my day,you could not study Medicine without an A Level in Physics (or Chemistry, which was fair enough), though that requirement was dropped later.
UCCA (as was) closing date was 15 December (15 October for Oxbridge) so many months before A Levels for those not planning a gap year.

Depends on the course. None of my offers (for LLB Hons Law places) had any mandatory subjects, just either grades or UCAS points.

[phantasmagoriana]

My Durham offer was entirely points-based (which suited me, doing 4 A levels), though I don't think any of the others were. No idea whether they still do it that way, though, as that was 13 years ago.

I suspect it's more common for degrees that don't have particular subject requirements.

[fuzzy]

Having read all of the above and codgitated upon it, I have come to the conclusion that electing to be too fick for uni was a good career choice for me

[Clare]

Most offers are points based, some will just ask for e.g. 340 UCAS points (AAB in old language) others will specify subjects as well e.g. 340 UCAS points of which 120 Mathematics (AAB with an A in Maths).

In certain subjects raw ability is important and in these cases you tend to get interviews as well, but there will always be a points requirement regardless.




P.S. Well said Fuzzy 

[tom_e]

I don't have any recollection of a formal transition into sixth form - my A-level choices were pretty much the default options. They seem to make a much bigger deal of it these days. To what end, I don't know.

In case of less-than-useful school advice, the Russel group advice may be a useful starting point:

http://russellgroup.org/Informed%20Choices%20final.pdf

Note long lists of generally advised subjects for different courses.  Unfortunately, given the source I suspect this has a strong academic bias and won't help if your question is traditional university course vs anything else.

[Clare]

Listen secret customer, standing in front of me texting 'higher up person' to find out what to ask next is a little bit of a give-away.

[clarion]

That is a whole new level of crapness.

[David Martin]

I don't have any recollection of a formal transition into sixth form - my A-level choices were pretty much the default options. They seem to make a much bigger deal of it these days. To what end, I don't know.

In case of less-than-useful school advice, the Russel group advice may be a useful starting point:

http://russellgroup.org/Informed%20Choices%20final.pdf

Note long lists of generally advised subjects for different courses.  Unfortunately, given the source I suspect this has a strong academic bias and won't help if your question is traditional university course vs anything else.

It is also a bit out of date on biology. For Life Sciences we are now requiring (from next years applicants) Maths at Higher (anything other than an A grade or better in maths at GCSE/standard grade and you are unlikely to be considered.)