Daylight only cycling in France

[hatler]

We're heading for a brief run to Normandy soon and will be cycling in daylight only.

Are we likely to be hassled by the Gendarmes because we don't have reflectors in our wheels and no hi-viz jackets ?  (If it's poor vis we prob won't be cycling.)

Do they worry if you don't have a bell ?

[Jurek]

Check in the latter pages here, Rob.
http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/a-day-ride-in-france-sat-11th-april.172044/

Not many bells, reflectors or hi-viz on that ride.
No hassle from John D'arme was experienced.

[Asterix, the former Gaul.]

I don't wear high-vis, don't have a bell, don't have wheel reflectors. For the last 10 years I have done most of my cycling in France and have never had problems.  It is quite a while since I cycled in Normandy.  Have been stopped a few times in the motor for routine stuff and find the Gendarmes are fine and don't tend to nit-pick.  Obviously, as with any police force, if you upset them they might start checking things they wouldn't otherwise..

[Ningishzidda]

Wear T shirts with the name of a British charity on them. Marie Curie will do. Although she was Polish, they know who she is. You'll get priority treatment. You might be given some money, which you WILL take to a Marie Curie shop when you return to Britain.

[hatler]

Ooo. Thank you all. That is reassuring. We'll have lights (start and finish in the UK will be in the dark) but not any of the other guff.

It does sound like we'll be alright, and I have the merest smattering of French, so if we are stopped that should help.

Having never done a charity ride I don't have any charity T-shirts. Instead I am intending to put my Fridays jersey to good use.

I can't begin to explain how excited I am about this one. It's something I've been aiming at ever since mini-hatler was about 6.

I promise you all a ride report when we are back (must remember to take photos).

[Attitudeless Badger]

having been in France for many years now, never seen anyone with hi-viz or reflectors in daylight, or heard any stories of it, including 2 years in local cycling club.   Another case, I think, where France make the law, but never apply it....

[Veloman]

having been in France for many years now, never seen anyone with hi-viz or reflectors in daylight, or heard any stories of it, including 2 years in local cycling club.   Another case, I think, where France make the law, but never apply it....

My bold

Could be because they are not required in daylight.

I have seen plenty of French cyclists wearing hi-viz at night when riding in France.  perhaps that is because it is the law in France.

[Asterix, the former Gaul.]

having been in France for many years now, never seen anyone with hi-viz or reflectors in daylight, or heard any stories of it, including 2 years in local cycling club.   Another case, I think, where France make the law, but never apply it....

My bold

Could be because they are not required in daylight.

..

Have you chapter and verse on that?

I do recall being told that high viz was to become compulsory in daylight a few years ago. I kept seeing cyclists clad entirely in black after that.  It was also the case that cars all had to carry high viz vests for each occupant and then breathalyzer kits.  The latter was abandoned but all the superstores did a roaring trade in high viz vests!  Last time I got stopped I got out of my van sans high viz and the gendarme was dressed in dark blue. 

[Veloman]

Have you chapter and verse on that?

I believe the organisers of PBP have and there is no requirement to wear hi-viz in daylight under normal conditions during that ride.  Rather like on their motorways, when visibility is very poor, fog/heavy rain, then you are expected to wear hi-viz.  But under normal circumstances, no requirement.  Hence no requirement during PBP during day light, and PBP is organised on lots of roads open to the public.

[Andrew]

Nothing like a hi-viz debate!

I too see many cyclists wearing hi-viz here in France. Not that they have to, they just do! They tend to be on old MTBs/hybrids etc a maybe on their way to work. Very rarely do I see club/racing kit wearing bods in it though. That doesn't help much with the legal requirements though does it?

Keep in mind it's not just at night (outside of the town limits) that you area supposed to wear it, it's also in times of poor visibility. So if it's raining/gloomy during the day then you ought be in it. How one accurately measures that though is a gendarmes call.

Personally, for the negligible cost and packing space, I'd carry one.

[mzjo]

The law is indeed only outside built-up areas in night time or bad visibility. I personally carry one at am
ll times on the bike with the Carradice, along with lights and lock. I don't usually have to wear it, being rarely out at night. On the other bikes I don't carry one unless I know I will need it.
It is unlikely the gendarmes would bother you during daylight unless conditions are really bad. You might get some verbal from car drivers if they felt aggrieved (justified or not). Explaining that you are english and you got caught out would be sufficient to discourage the law from the hassle of filling in forms.
Personally I would carry them. Normandy has a reputation for fog in the mornings. The weight of a high viz vest is not discouraging. You may have a high viz soft shell jacket or vest that would do the job as well, I wouldn't worry about the absence of reflective panels.

I did have a copy of the official wording in an old copy of Le Randonneur which I really should look out for quoting when necessary.

[bikenrrd]

I saw many cyclists in Brittany wearing normal club / pro team / plain jerseys, including an entire club run of about 20 cyclists.  No hi-viz or reflectors in sight on their carbon fibre Times, Looks, Colnagos, etc.   This was in mostly rural areas, such as the Forest of Camors.

This small amount of data doesn't indicate whether you'll get hassled by the Gendarmes, though.

[T42]

If you're out after dark sans hi-viz you might well get hassled if they're bored or pissed off at something, but it's common enough to see riders without lights in dark clothing in the dusk - pretty well standard in towns & villages.

There is a CEE standard for hi-viz, though. It's met by the nasty flappy things you can buy in service stations but not by most soft shell jackets and those gilets with a few reflective blobs on. French law says CEE standard, or else.  I could tell you the reference but that would mean unrolling mine.

Pedal reflectors? Can't fit them to clipless pedals.

ETA I unrolled it after all, only to find I'd cut the label out because it tickled the back of my neck.

[Polar Bear]

We cycled in France during daylight hours for two weeks in June.   We were not wearing high viz and my bike did not have pedal reflectors.   We did have the reflective panels of Ortliebs though.

Babylon didn't bother with us even though we saw them in passing on a regular basis.   I was surprised by the apparent higher level of general visibility of police than in UK.   

[T42]

Haven't been in the UK for 20 years so couldn't say, but for the last 10 years here there's been a great effort to get road deaths down so police checks have become more common, ditto speed traps.

[Psychler]

I've been cycling in France for at least a week every years since 2008, including Normandy. 

I've never worn hi-viz or had reflectors on the bike and haven't had any problems with les flics.  In fact, I don't remember seeing many at all!

[Andrew]

French law says CEE standard, or else.

Ah yes, but which standard? 

(Btw, I think you mean EN. CEE is for electrical goods, no?)


(Gosh I miss that thread )

[T42]

French law says CEE standard, or else.

Ah yes, but which CEE standard? 

(Gosh I miss that thread )

As I said above, no label. GIYF.

[Andrew]

You miss the point T42. I'm quite sure your gilet conforms to a standard.

What is not stipulated by French law is which standard is required for the cyclist. As I recall there are 2 standards (if not more) of conformity dependant on the activity.

It's all rather moot in all likelihood as I'm sure either would do but that's not what the law says.

Perso, I care less than two fifths of f-all but the debate amuses me.... hence the 

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Both EN standards are accepted for use by cyclists.

[T42]

As I said, the label's missing.  You want me to remember sh*t like that?

[andrew_s]

When I looked up the French law, when it came in, I'm sure it said EN1150.
EN417 (the industrial version) is a higher standard, and will also be OK (i.e. building site vests)

[Asterix, the former Gaul.]

As I said, the label's missing.  You want me to remember sh*t like that?

 

[Veloman]

From the PBP website (just in case they know anything about the law as applied to cycling in France):

Article 9 : Equipment

According to French traffic law, a high visibility vest MUST be worn when riding at night (safety standard number EN 1150 or EN 471).]Article 9 : Equipment

According to French traffic law, a high visibility vest MUST be worn when riding at night (safety standard number EN 1150 or EN 471).

[Kim]

Pedal reflectors? Can't fit them to clipless pedals.

Sure you can, at least with SPDs.

Is it worth it?  Only if you want a platform IMHO.

You can conform to the spirit of the law by sticking Scotchlite tape to the cranks (of an upright bike without panniers).