Author Topic: Ubuntu, why it is crap (Read 44368 times)

pcolbeck · « **Reply #300 on:** 23 December, 2011, 09:31:09 am »

RPM used to be crap at resolving dependencies. With SuSE its not too bad these days if you use their YAST frontend. Don't know about Redhat as I haven't used it in years.
Debian based distros (Ubuntu, Mint etc) don't have dependency issues as the deb format is designed to list the dependencies within the deb then the tools you use to install a deb file (eg apt) automatically install any debs that are dependencies. It even suggests packages that are not strictly speaking necessary but might be useful, for example if you install say Gimp it will suggest you also might want to install gimp-print and some other gimp add on packages and if you say OK it will download and install these for you too.
Deb is the best packaging system I have found. Arch's pacman is a pretty good as well. Never tried Gentoo so I cant comment on portage/

inc · « **Reply #301 on:** 23 December, 2011, 09:31:21 am »

Quote from: Oaky on 22 December, 2011, 09:06:44 pm

No idea how ubuntu's package management (.debs ? via apt?) compares with rpm though.

The Debian package management system APT is probably the best for managing dependencies. Most Ubuntu users just use the Synaptic GUI and miss out on some useful dpkg functions like a simulated install or upgrade for example, where it will warn of any problems before committing. Like all systems it can be broken, using poorly packaged third party applications and using debs from different sources eg stable, testing, sid, experimental and the various Ubuntu and it's derivatives will usually cause problems eventually.

BrianI · « **Reply #302 on:** 23 December, 2011, 09:33:59 am »

Quote from: BrianI on 22 December, 2011, 05:52:54 pm

Now running Linux Mint 12

mutter mutter, turning on pc after suspend = corrupted menus in mint 12

-- edit -- now relaxing in comfy Xubuntu 11.10

Attitudeless Badger · « **Reply #303 on:** 23 December, 2011, 09:58:48 am »

For resurrecting notebooks and old PCs, I would recommend Joli OS. Linux based, simple interfaces and it just sort of works. Flies along on a Samsung NC10. Also allows you to install directly from within windows so no faffing around burning disks....

TimC · « **Reply #304 on:** 25 December, 2011, 10:11:51 pm »

Has anyone else upgraded to Ubuntu 11.10 and had problems? I upgraded from a fully-functional 11.04 and now have no network connections - it'll see wifi, Ethernet and Bluetooth devices, but it won't connect. On top of that, the cursor freezes from time to time. The upgrade was downloaded and installed through the upgrade centre, and no extraneous stuff was occurring at the time. Just to rulke out the hardware, I'm transmitting this on the same computer's Win7 installation via wifi, with my iPhone connected via Bluetooth.

sas · « **Reply #305 on:** 26 December, 2011, 12:04:04 am »

I upgraded my Netbook to 11.10 a few months ago, and haven't had any major problems. Have you installed all the updates? Network Manager has always seemed slightly unstable on my Fedora installation- whenever it fails I use wicd instead (comes as a daemon and a graphical client, can't remember what the Ubuntu package names are). It's not as complete as NetworkManager, but for WiFi it's a lot simpler.

TimC · « **Reply #306 on:** 26 December, 2011, 08:25:26 am »

Without any network connection, updates aren't possible! I downloaded a new ISO image last night (on Win7); hopefully that version will include whatever updates are relevant. But (as when I upgraded) I 'll probably lose the various mods I've made to make it look nice!

TimC · « **Reply #307 on:** 26 December, 2011, 10:05:23 am »

And why does Ubuntu trash the Windows bootup so I have to run Windows Startup Repair after every second or third time I run Ubuntu? Grrrr!!!

pcolbeck · « **Reply #308 on:** 26 December, 2011, 03:24:56 pm »

Quote from: TimC on 26 December, 2011, 10:05:23 am

And why does Ubuntu trash the Windows bootup so I have to run Windows Startup Repair after every second or third time I run Ubuntu? Grrrr!!!

It shouldn't. It should recognise Windows is their and give you a menu to choose Windows or Ubuntu on boot. Windows on the other hand never asks and will always trash your Linux boot.

TimC · « **Reply #309 on:** 26 December, 2011, 08:26:32 pm »

I get the menu on boot up. Linux will always start fine (and only then hang up). Every third boot of Windows after I've had Linux up, Windows objects and requires Startup Repair. It did this with 10.10 and 11.04 too.

inc · « **Reply #310 on:** 27 December, 2011, 10:08:28 am »

An interesting post from a well know UK Ubuntu dev www.jonobacon.org/2011/12/21/quality-in-ubuntu/ It seems they are finally publicly acknowledging they have got some problems

fred the great · « **Reply #311 on:** 27 December, 2011, 11:03:34 am »

Interesting read

Can you imagine M$ being so open and honest - never

TimC · « **Reply #312 on:** 31 December, 2011, 02:12:14 pm »

Quote from: TimC on 25 December, 2011, 10:11:51 pm

Has anyone else upgraded to Ubuntu 11.10 and had problems? I upgraded from a fully-functional 11.04 and now have no network connections - it'll see wifi, Ethernet and Bluetooth devices, but it won't connect. On top of that, the cursor freezes from time to time. The upgrade was downloaded and installed through the upgrade centre, and no extraneous stuff was occurring at the time. Just to rulke out the hardware, I'm transmitting this on the same computer's Win7 installation via wifi, with my iPhone connected via Bluetooth.

Just tried another 11.10 download upgrade on top of a fully-working but entirely clean (no extra apps) and brand new installation of 11.04. Again, no network capability - not even an icon or access to the network dialogue. The upgrade subsequently failed, but there is no rollback to 11.04.

All I can say is - avoid 11.10 until you have evidence Canonical have got it working properly. Right now, it's a heap of shit that makes Vista look like a well-realised and delivered OS!!!

sas · « **Reply #313 on:** 31 December, 2011, 02:23:25 pm »

Ubuntu usually provide a LiveUSB version of their releases- next time I'd recommend trying it first

TimC · « **Reply #314 on:** 31 December, 2011, 02:49:20 pm »

From what I read around the net, 11.10 is a turkey whichever way you install it.

sas · « **Reply #315 on:** 31 December, 2011, 03:03:08 pm »

I must be one of the exceptions then

. LiveUSB worked fine, installed fine, runs fine. OTOH Fedora 16 is proving to be a real PITA, though admittedly I'm trying to get it running on older hardware.

Andrew · « **Reply #316 on:** 01 January, 2012, 08:23:51 am »

My 2 11.10 installs were fine. One, my desktop, was an update. My netbook was a clean install. I've since replaced it on the netbook with Crunchbang.

TimC · « **Reply #317 on:** 01 January, 2012, 11:43:16 pm »

Funnily enough, I've finally got it working - the laptop installation, that is. I managed to connect to a very strong and fast wifi network here in Japan before Ubuntu froze up, and got a huuuuge update installed. All now seems well, though I'm still a bit pissed off by the difficulties of getting it there. I'm also not convinced at all by Unity, which still seems an exercise in difference for difference's sake and is obviously not guided by intuitive usability! The new Software Centre is a big improvement, and is very (VERY) similar to the Apple App Store for OSX devices. The lack of customising options in Unity is a real letdown (why must the dock be on the left?), and the Dash Home page is a very clunky way of getting to apps.

I'm now using Win 7 Pro 64-bit, Win 8 Dev, Mac OSX Snow Leopard, Ubuntu 11.10 and 10.10 and iOS5 on a regular basis on my collection of gadgets (i4S, iPad2, iMac with Paralleled Win7 VM, Sony Vaio and Dell Studio XPS). in this group, Ubuntu 11.10 comes a solid last! Win7 and OSX are both excellent, and each has strengths the other lacks. iOS5 is a delight until you need to use it like a computer, when the lack of discreet file storage is a real pain. But it's fascinating to have so many options!

Andrew · « **Reply #318 on:** 02 January, 2012, 10:23:27 am »

Nah, I don't like Unity either... but that's another story.

dave r · « **Reply #319 on:** 02 January, 2012, 11:59:20 am »

Quote from: Andrew on 02 January, 2012, 10:23:27 am

Nah, I don't like Unity either... but that's another story.

I haven't used unity yet, I'm running 10.04, but I have looked at it and I wasn't impressed, I think a lot of people have tried it and gone back to Gnome. I've been on Ubuntu for 3 or 4 years, started with 8.10 and stuck on 10.04, its been good most of the time and I like it.

Tewdric · « **Reply #320 on:** 02 January, 2012, 12:09:58 pm »

I have just installed 11.10 on a laptop and the interface seems a lot more useable than in 11.04. The sidebar seems to slide in and out a lot more predictably and responsively.

I'm sticking to 10.04 notebook edition on the Eee PC though.

dave r · « **Reply #321 on:** 02 January, 2012, 12:57:27 pm »

Quote from: Tewdric on 02 January, 2012, 12:09:58 pm

I have just installed 11.10 on a laptop and the interface seems a lot more useable than in 11.04. The sidebar seems to slide in and out a lot more predictably and responsively.

I'm sticking to 10.04 notebook edition on the Eee PC though.

I like 10.04, when 12.04 comes out I'll put a copy on disc and if the computer goes tits up I'll move to 12.04, mean while I'm happy on 10.04.

mattc · « **Reply #322 on:** 04 January, 2012, 02:56:36 pm »

Quote from: Attitudeless Badger on 23 December, 2011, 09:58:48 am

For resurrecting notebooks and old PCs, I would recommend Joli OS. Linux based, simple interfaces and it just sort of works. Flies along on a Samsung NC10. Also allows you to install directly from within windows so no faffing around burning disks....

Thanks for this - my poverty-spec ASUS seems to be able to run Joli1.2. I've tried the LiveUSB, and it's a little odd. Couple of Qs for you:
- Were you able to access 'local storage'* using LiveUSB?
- Do you have any issues with Wireless strength? My WiFi never drops below "90%" on the Asus, but running Joli it fluctuated around 40-50%. I thought this stuff was handled at a lower level than the OS, so this is surprising, but also worrying.

Matt
*I know this will actually be stored in RAM (not permanent storage), but I'd like to see what the interface looks like before a full install

Attitudeless Badger · « **Reply #323 on:** 04 January, 2012, 03:18:42 pm »

Hi Matt

You can access the local storage on the hard drive (or plugged in USB drives) quite easily. To the left of the search bar on the main desktop there is are a number of icons, one of which is a folder. Clicking on this brings up a display of the various folders/drives, and if you select a folder in this display then choosing "Open" in the bottom RHS opens up a Linux file manager type window to allow you full movement through the drives. It works on my normal install, so presume it would be the same for a Live USB.

With regards the wifi strength; it is noticably lower than I would have thought (never really noticed before, as it just works) at c50%, whereas my work laptop running Xp says the signal is "Very Good". Whilst there is flagged a difference; I haven't really noticed it in day to day use. The laptop stays in one place, though so not a major issue for me.

Further comments to add are that still happy with it, but would only recommend for basic stuff. Lots of windows open at the same time (these often being different skins of the Chromium browser) can cause things to drag as not enough memory available. This may be specific to my machine, but worth bearing in mind.

MikeFromLFE · « **Reply #324 on:** 05 January, 2012, 12:10:46 pm »

My Aspire One AA150 is now very happily running Joli OS, and I've come to really quite like it. I had a bit of trauma working out how to add locally held applications (KMyMoney and PySol) but got there in the end (don't ask how, I don't think I could replicate it now I've had a sleep).
I bought a cheap(ish) refurb'd Aspire One 512 off Ebay to run as a back-up Windows machine for the odd programs that I can't use Linux for - mainly Adobe Digital Editions and for my electricity monitoring device (and no, I can't get my head around Wine or VirtualBox). The new AspireOne was so good (I suspect it was actually new) that it's now got quad booting to JoliOS, Windows XP, Linux Mint, and Bhodi Linux. (all except Windows loaded from Live USB's created in NetUBootin)
I dumped Ubuntu for Mint, but became disolusioned with their crippled browser (search engine and extension install issues) so use Bhodi much more - very pretty, and is quite fast. My only concern with Bhodi Linux is the longer term support of it. My issue with Ubuntu was partly around the desktop and partly around speed on the older netbook (I ended up using LXDE which helped - but Joli OS was the answer). I decided not to even go with Ubuntu ion the new netbook, and give Mint & Bhodi a try, just because I could (TM).