Author Topic: Publishing rider names on club events  (Read 3054 times)

robgul

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Publishing rider names on club events
« on: 14 October, 2023, 03:18:02 pm »
Not sure if this is knowledge or what . . .

A cycling club I belong to has issued an edict requiring ride leaders to record the full name (i.e. first and surname) of riders taking part in every regular club ride . .  so far so good to create a record should there be a need if, for example, there is an accident/incident/dispute.

BUT the names are being listed in each ride's "Ride Report" on the club's website forum that is open to public view (posting to the forum requires registration, but not viewing) - search engines can and do access the forum content as results against a name.

As is probably obvious as I'm posting here, I'm unhappy with this situation . . . i really don't want the world to be able to see where and when I ride my bike.   

[The other club I belong to has a simple "runs book" that riders write their names in when they go on a club event - that's fine]

I'd be interested in views . . .

Kim

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Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #1 on: 14 October, 2023, 04:14:59 pm »
The BHPC approach is that names recorded for race sign-on and results are just that, and are unrelated to the names used for membership, card payments, forum logins, etc.

We do this to provide a degree of anonymity for riders, mindful that juniors and disabled people in particular might not want their full names published in the online results.

Obviously in practice this doesn't stop individuals shitting each others' data all over Facebook, but at least we're not making things worse.

robgul

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Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #2 on: 14 October, 2023, 04:41:39 pm »
The BHPC approach is that names recorded for race sign-on and results are just that, and are unrelated to the names used for membership, card payments, forum logins, etc.

We do this to provide a degree of anonymity for riders, mindful that juniors and disabled people in particular might not want their full names published in the online results.

Obviously in practice this doesn't stop individuals shitting each others' data all over Facebook, but at least we're not making things worse.

The forum ride reports were, until the edict, usually just a list of riders' first name - e.g. Tom, Dick, Harry and perhaps JimG if there are more than one Jim.   

In your example I assume that the "official BHPC enter the event record" is the actual full name of the rider which forms the information that my club wants/needs to record?

Have to say that I don't really give a toss who rode . . . and equally who cares about how far, how fast, how much climbed . .  but that's not at issue (my take on a club ride is that a) I want to enjoy it, and b) make it back home afterwards!)

Kim

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Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #3 on: 14 October, 2023, 04:52:23 pm »
It's an interesting question.  With my race timing hat on, I only see names as people enter them on the sign-on form (which I can't show you currently as there isn't a race to sign up for, but it asks for "Your name (as you would like it to appear in the results)" along with assorted race-class-related details.  This generates an item to be purchased in the webshop, for which a (usually) card payment is made, and a more 'official' name may be given.  We can fish those records out of the shop records as needed, but obviously there's the possibility of someone paying for another person's (usually a family member) race entry, in which case we'd never have an offical record of who "Tom D" or "HippyHandcyclist" might be.  You don't have to be a BHPC member to enter a race.

We do collect phone numbers, originally as a Test & Trace requirement, but we've kept it up as an emergency contact method in case we turn up to discover that the venue has been double-booked or the track has been trampled by Godzilla or something, and a phone call might save people the travel.

Prior to the online entry system, we'd have had someone writing "Tom D" in a spreadsheet in exchange for 8 quid in cash.

I'm not aware of our liability insurance requiring a list of participants (I read the small print a couple of years ago, and most of it pertains to not having a bouncy castle).  Indeed, an insurance claim against the organisers is as likely to be from a random member of the public who decided to ignore the signs and empty their dog on a live race track as from one of our entrants.  And we routinely have non-racers trying out machines on the track between races.

We're not affiliated with British Cycling or similar, so we don't have to conform to their arbitrary rules.  (Just those of the venues, which are mostly plastic-hat-related.)

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #4 on: 14 October, 2023, 05:16:55 pm »
I’d be very much against it, and isn’t it against GDPR as your personal data is not being used in ways commensurate with the reasons it was collected for?

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #5 on: 14 October, 2023, 05:21:58 pm »
I'd be against it. There isn't a need for it to be real details published for a club bimble ride - you should have an option for a nickname for published ride reports.

Kim

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Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #6 on: 14 October, 2023, 05:33:23 pm »
I’d be very much against it, and isn’t it against GDPR as your personal data is not being used in ways commensurate with the reasons it was collected for?

Indeed.  Part of the reason we allow arbitrary names for race entry is that it neatly means the race-related records (entry sheets, race files, results tables, bib number lists, etc) aren't full of identifiable personal data.

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #7 on: 14 October, 2023, 10:13:40 pm »
In my opinion, what is described is unlawful. It likely contravenes several of the data protection principles.

Fair - used in a way not expected.
Lawful - as consent is not mentioned as being sought, legitimate interest is the only other realistic option. The publication would fail a legitimate interest assessment, therefore no legitimate interest and no lawful basis.
Transparent - possibly/probably, depending on what the club publishes in advance about the information it collects.
Purpose limitation - the purpose isn’t limited to the one originally pursued. It would fail a compatibility test.

See also last sentence of Article 25 (2) of UK GDPR.

Only pragmatic course of action open to the controller (club) is to stop and delete the published information.

Option open to individuals is exercise their right to object to the processing. Given the circumstances, I suspect the club won’t know where to begin with this, and are best just stopping to make it simple for all concerned.

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #8 on: 15 October, 2023, 05:16:08 am »
On the AUK website anyone can see who participated in which rides and then see what other rides they've done and when, what awards they've achieved, which clubs and CTC groups they're in, all going back to 1999. So whatever the legal position, such information is sometimes available.
The current CTC/CUK guidance to member groups is to collect riders names and an emergency contact before a ride but not keep them any longer than necessary and not to use them or any purpose other than contact on that ride.
My local group publishes several ride reports each week, on facebook and the website.  We don't use names, either in the report or as a list, I don't see what that would add.  We do publish photos with a lot of them, all riders in them have consented and some choose not to be photographed. Names are occasionally published for competitions, with consent, even then we tend to use abbreviations, club members will know who Paul H is and I can't see why anyone else would need to.
Regardless of the legal position, I'd consider it a matter of politeness to ask the members if they're happy to have their names published. I'd expect those asking to  make a case for it being beneficial and respect the wishes of anyone who declined.
 

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #9 on: 15 October, 2023, 08:17:16 am »
The AUK example is a different case as the results are similar to competition records. Although reading through this thread AUK should publicise the fact to entrants.

bhoot

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Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #10 on: 15 October, 2023, 09:39:07 am »
AUK do, it is part of the event entry terms and conditions https://www.audax.uk/about-audax/audax-uk-regulations/event-entry-terms-and-conditions/.
Whether the results should only be available to those with an AUK account (for example) is an interesting point. It could be controlled but has never to my knowledge been requested.

TimC

  • Old blerk sometimes onabike.
Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #11 on: 15 October, 2023, 10:00:52 am »
None of the clubs I’ve ridden with around here collect names of riders on club rides. They don’t even record the number of riders.

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #12 on: 15 October, 2023, 10:05:00 am »
AUK do, it is part of the event entry terms and conditions
I assumed it would be somewhere, or at least that AUK had met whatever the requirements are. I wasn't questioning what AUK does, or making any criticism.
Rather I was pointing out that when the OP says "I really don't want the world to be able to see where and when I ride my bike." it isn't uncommon for that to be the case and AUK is an example of that.   

robgul

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Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #13 on: 15 October, 2023, 10:27:38 am »
I think Spacebadger has covered the issue that is basis of my concern - a missive to the Chairman and Secretary of the club will be winging its way through the ether shortly.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #14 on: 17 October, 2023, 03:57:13 pm »


I can't see any reasonable arguement for why this should be published on a website. Gdpr should be the goto for killing this.

Information collected needs to have a clear reason. And there no justification for publishing riders names.

J
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Beer, bikes, and backpacking
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rogerzilla

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Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #15 on: 17 October, 2023, 07:12:51 pm »
There may be a Hugh Janus, Isaac Hunt, Seymour Butt and Tina Salmon on next week's run.
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

robgul

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Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #16 on: 18 October, 2023, 03:28:03 pm »
There may be a Hugh Janus, Isaac Hunt, Seymour Butt and Tina Salmon on next week's run.

Or Mike Rafone who rode with us last week  ;D

I'm awaiting a reply from the club chairman having raised the issue in an email.

I was out with my other club today - the "runs book" was duly passed around the table in the pub, with a pen, for everyone to record their name - simples.

Kim

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Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #17 on: 18 October, 2023, 04:49:36 pm »
I can't see any reasonable arguement for why this should be published on a website. Gdpr should be the goto for killing this.

Information collected needs to have a clear reason. And there no justification for publishing riders names.

Quite.  It's one thing when there's an element of competition, as with the BHPC or AUK results.  If it's just people going for a bike ride, then it's hard to see the need for publishing more than a headcount (maybe with some demographic breakdown).

If names need collecting for insurance or a governing body or something, they can be kept in a GDPR-appropriate manner.

Morat

  • I tried to HTFU but something went ping :(
Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #18 on: 25 November, 2023, 09:53:15 pm »
I'd start with a request to see the club's data protection policy, and a reminder that you can refuse permission for the club to process your data.
They might find this useful: https://www.wrighthassall.co.uk/knowledge-base/guide-to-the-gdpr-for-sports-clubs
Everyone's favourite windbreak

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #19 on: 26 November, 2023, 05:46:59 am »
It’s not that simple that you can refuse anything. It depends on the lawful basis. Your article covers it.

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #20 on: 26 November, 2023, 12:15:27 pm »
Is there a minimum age limit to take part in the rides?  It would be inappropriate to publish a minor's details like this online.
simplicity, truth, equality, peace

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #21 on: 26 November, 2023, 01:11:58 pm »
Shame they already know your name otherwise you could have joined as Seymour Gifford or some such.

TimC

  • Old blerk sometimes onabike.
Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #22 on: 27 November, 2023, 10:46:40 am »
I'd start with a request to see the club's data protection policy, and a reminder that you can refuse permission for the club to process your data.
They might find this useful: https://www.wrighthassall.co.uk/knowledge-base/guide-to-the-gdpr-for-sports-clubs
I am the Mem Sec of my club (and thus the Data Controller). If you expressed a wish to join my club but refused to allow me to have a record of who you are, where you live and how you pay, I would invite you to find another club to annoy!

Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #23 on: 27 November, 2023, 11:16:58 am »
If you asked for permission to process personal data for membership administration purposes, your club would be doing it wrong.

Just out of interest, why does the club need to know where a member lives? I’ve not come across a club in quite a while that still needs this information.

TimC

  • Old blerk sometimes onabike.
Re: Publishing rider names on club events
« Reply #24 on: 27 November, 2023, 11:55:06 am »
Just out of interest, why does the club need to know where a member lives? I’ve not come across a club in quite a while that still needs this information.

Good point. The days of needing an address to verify a payment are long gone. However, for children and their guardians it is helpful.