Bike packing trends

[salar55]

Is bikepacking going around in a circle, panniers and racks are starting to show up on gear lists now. Went down a famous route years ago and it was high FRONT racks, small panniers or Bob yak trailers . Today its strap on bags, perhaps due to the race starting in 2004. They say its for aero and single-track but how often are you in tight singletrack or fast out on bike packing trips? I would bet most are only out for a day or two. Bikepacking in the UK is fine when the weather is good, its when the rains start and you are away for days.  Becomes a pain unless it's the bare minimum on an event. Going back to the rack gear this winter for the bothy weekends, no way will winter bothy / camping gear fit in bags.

[quixoticgeek]

Is bikepacking going around in a circle, panniers and racks are starting to show up on gear lists now. Went down a famous route years ago and it was high FRONT racks, small panniers or Bob yak trailers . Today its strap on bags, perhaps due to the race starting in 2004. They say its for aero and single-track but how often are you in tight singletrack or fast out on bike packing trips? I would bet most are only out for a day or two. Bikepacking in the UK is fine when the weather is good, its when the rains start and you are away for days.  Becomes a pain unless it's the bare minimum on an event. Going back to the rack gear this winter for the bothy weekends, no way will winter bothy / camping gear fit in bags.

You do you... cycling is a broad church and there is no One True Way™ to do things

How often am I on single track? more often than I intend to. I had great fun in the Veluwe back in March after not realising that my gravel training ride was actually on the local MTB XC course. Slick tyres, TT bars, bike packing luggage, totally inappropriate, but so so so much fun. On events I tend to avoid the single track if I can, but it depends on the parcour. I had some fun single track in Finland last month too. Tho that was much shorter.

One of the things that I really like about the way my bike is setup on summer trips, is that everything is in the plane of the bike. It makes things very well balanced. The other thing about the limited capacity is that it encourages me to take only that which I need. Even then I still seem to have more than many others. There's a point where if you are fast enough you can stop less, so need less kit. If you are willing to take a higher risk of being cold, you can carry less kit. I've seen people arrive at controls wrapped in space blankets cos they got caught out on the mountain pass.

Right now I am planning for my next big trip, which is hopefully going to be a festive 500 ride. Having proven to myself that I can do 375k in one go, I'm wondering if I can do the ride in one go. The aim is Amsterdam to Paris. For me it will be about being as fast as I can for the ride. If I can average 20kph, it's just 25 hours on the bike, plus any faff time.

What any one rider chooses is their own business, there's no right, and there's no wrong way. But, no matter what kit you choose, someone will be along to say "Why aren't you using a rack and panniers?", and if you are using a rack and panniers, they are going to ask why you chose those panniers?

Oh, and panniers have been on bike packing events for ages. There's usually at least one person who rocks up with panniers. I saw one person at the start of TCRno7 with them, a few on RatN, Ruska. Panniers have always been around. They just aren't common.

J

[Cudzoziemiec]

Things rarely go round in actual circles. It's usually an ellipse. Things come round again, but in slightly altered form. Look at photos of Edwardian or Victorian era cycle tourists and you'll see they used framepacks, saddlebags and bar rolls. Not a pannier in sight! But of course back then their luggage would have been made of canvas and leather. Oh hang on, look at Brooks' current range of bikepacking luggage! Fork bags seem to be the only cycling luggage innovation of recent times, though that's probably because I just haven't seen the right antique photos.

[Kim]

Of course there's an element of fashion.  Most people don't put lots of effort into researching bike luggage, they use what their bike shop stocks or what they see working for other cyclists, which is itself dictated by industry trends.

Meanwhile, there are always going to be the outliers - either the ones who've got perfectly good kit from when something else was in fashion, or the ones with very specific needs that override whatever's currently trendy.

And then there's an element of what sort of riding people are doing changing, and luggage requirements adapting to suit.  Both at an individual level and more generally.

It's all good (up to the point where you can't obtain something you want because it's too unfashionable, which is more of a components problem than a luggage one), and the n+1 rule applies.

[psyclist]

I used panniers for the first time in 18 months on Friday night for a one-night camping trip. These are the same panniers I used for years commuting into London, and will do so again as and when I need to work there again. The panniers were just fine for Friday’s camping, though they wouldn’t be my choice for a multi-day or longer trip.

For longer distance bikepacking trips I favour spreading the load along the plane of the bike, as QG mentions. It’s not just narrow single track that benefits from this setup. An off-road trip across Germany that I did in 2019 involved hauling the bike over numerous fallen trees (and many more I could negotiate around). A balanced bike helped in this respect.

There are numerous choices for load carrying, and new innovations coming along all the time. In my mind it is just a case of each individual working through what works best for their own needs. Often this is not just a single setup, but multiple.

As for carrying winter bothy/ camping gear, I would have thought combinations of ‘bikepacking’ bags could be used, but equally panniers could be used. Comes down to what’s available to the rider, and what choices they wish to make if they are in need of a new setup.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Meanwhile, there are always going to be the outliers - either the ones who've got perfectly good kit from when something else was in fashion, or the ones with very specific needs that override whatever's currently trendy.

And the ones who are deliberate contrarians. They'll be touring with a backpack on 23mm tubs today, and back in the 80s they were sewing their own framepacks and using fat 650Bs.

[Lightning Phil]

Rack and panniers suits my needs when on a road based trip. I’ve come full circle with that.  My road bike has a rear rack. I’ve just finished the setup to add a rear rack to my recumbent.

The only true bike packing I’ve done is on my since retired mtn bikes.  For those I just used what I had from my mountaineering gear.  A 30 litre backpack with a hydration bladder. 

In summary for me.

For true technical off road adventures. Rough ground. Where I might need to man handle the bike or wade through rivers. It would definitely be bike packing type luggage or stick with my 30 litre back pack for me. My off road adventures haven’t tended to be more than 50-80km per day and no more than a week. The back pack has worked fine for those.

For road based tours which may include some non technical forest tracks.  I like my pannier setup. But I’d call this touring rather than bike packing. For touring I want my dry and warm change of clothes for the evening. Maybe a book, a hip flask. Plus change of footwear. Toiletries etc. Therefore appreciate the greater capacity options my racks give me.

I think the more choices out there for carrying gear the better.  After all we don’t have just one set of gear if going mountaineering. We have a range of options based on our preferences and the type of trip and terrain we are undertaking.  No reason it should be different for bike based trips.

[nobby]

Very similar happens with camping kit, doesn't it and you get improvements in the technology as you go forward.
TH Holding, the doyen of cycle camping, and one of those Victorians with frame bag and handlebar roll, started out with a quilt and later went to sleeping bag. He had a tin plate, nesting cooking set made not unlike the Gilwell I used in the early 1960's, but now I use titanium.
In 1962 I used to drool over the Bukta Wanderlust single pole tent at 14 guineas and having gone through double poles, hoops and single hoops I am very happily back with a single pole central pole.

[Lightning Phil]

You’ve reminded me that I have a single hoop Phoenix Phreeranger tent from the 80s. Still in loft though how intact it is I don’t know.   I think it weighs 1.5kg. Not so shabby compared to 35 years later. Must get it down and pitch it to see how well it’s fared up in that dark dry environment

[Paul H]

Is bikepacking going around in a circle, panniers and racks are starting to show up on gear lists now.

When were they not?  Even the Tailfin had a pannier option, right from the launch.
So obviously panniers have always been on some people's gear list, they've stopped being on everybody's, cos more choice, how's that not a good thing?
Be a bad thing if panniers disappeared, but that's not going to happen. 

[Kim]

Be a bad thing if panniers disappeared, but that's not going to happen.

Yes, I think panniers are reasonably immune to fashion whims, because they (at least the sturdy ones) will always have a place in utility cycling.  Frame-specific bags and clever widgets for attaching things to odd places like forks, not so much.

[bhoot]

You’ve reminded me that I have a single hoop Phoenix Phreeranger tent from the 80s.

I had one of those, it was great when I went camping with a group of friends and we each took our own tent, and I also managed some backpacking with it. It had that rather clever free floating mini pole at the apex which increased the headroom. At a push you could just about get two in it, but really it was a one person tent. Mine went very smelly and was thrown away about 5 years's ago, but with many regrets.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Very similar happens with camping kit, doesn't it and you get improvements in the technology as you go forward.
TH Holding, the doyen of cycle camping, and one of those Victorians with frame bag and handlebar roll, started out with a quilt and later went to sleeping bag. He had a tin plate, nesting cooking set made not unlike the Gilwell I used in the early 1960's, but now I use titanium.
In 1962 I used to drool over the Bukta Wanderlust single pole tent at 14 guineas and having gone through double poles, hoops and single hoops I am very happily back with a single pole central pole.

Perhaps tents are an area in which there has been genuine innovation rather than repeating variations. From ridge tents with a pole at each end and maybe one at the top, to central poles, to an external framework of poles. But all without displacing the older varieties. In materials I'd say there has been displacement though. Yes, you can get a canvas tent if you want to, but it is more a retro fashion thing now than a serious camping thing. Though I'm pretty sure glamping goes back to the 18th century at least (for the wealthy).

[mmmmartin]

You’ve reminded me that I have a single hoop Phoenix Phreeranger tent from the 80s. Still in loft though how intact it is I don’t know.   I think it weighs 1.5kg. Not so shabby compared to 35 years later. Must get it down and pitch it to see how well it’s fared up in that dark dry environment

i have exactly the same and in fact i was thinking of getting rid of several tents and this is one that should go.
Is it worth anything? Any ideas?
 Haven't unwrapped it for decades so i suspect it might not be wholesome.....

[LateStarter]

A trend I very very much like is that some "main stream" kit manufacturers are producing good, well designed & made items that are only just moderately expensive rather than the eye watering outrageously over the top expensive bits from the niche suppliers (who seem to justify the expense by the kit being "made in the USA" or some other backwoods area). I recently was looking for a replacement for my Ortlieb handlebar bag (Ultimate 5 or something, it wasn't ), interviewed the Ortlieb Handlebar Pack QR and was arranging the bank loan to purchase when my eye spied a Topeak Barloader (my first rack was a Topeak many years ago before I though I really really needed more expensive Targus ones, front & back). Barloader ticks a few more boxes ( lighter, less complicated bar connection, more appropriate size and seems well made too) AND half the price from one of those helpful German online stores. Looking through their range there are a few other items I might "need". Bike packing seems to be moving out of the religious phase into just another way of carrying stuff phase.

[Lightning Phil]

You’ve reminded me that I have a single hoop Phoenix Phreeranger tent from the 80s. Still in loft though how intact it is I don’t know.   I think it weighs 1.5kg. Not so shabby compared to 35 years later. Must get it down and pitch it to see how well it’s fared up in that dark dry environment

i have exactly the same and in fact i was thinking of getting rid of several tents and this is one that should go.
Is it worth anything? Any ideas?
 Haven't unwrapped it for decades so i suspect it might not be wholesome.....

I suspect there’s a market for them but no idea how much.  This guy is making modern replacements using Silnylon.  Came across him when reading a blog the other night.

http://www.trekkertent.com/home/home/10-phoenix-phreeranger-replacement-flysheet.html

Plus he also has a page showing the 1980s Phreeranger tent in better detail. I suspect his photo is one with silnylon rather than the original pu nylon. But the outline design is the same.

http://www.trekkertent.com/home/content/39-phreeranger-instructions

[morbihan]

I've gravitated from a leaner, faster bike packing set up to a more Rando style affair.
 Racks and Rando box, more relaxed geometry, wider tire clearance etc. After a few thousand km on the newer rig my hunch is I have lost at least 1kph, perhaps slightly more. What I have gained is accessibility to supplies and a more comfortable set up that allows me to ride longer without getting beat up.
I imagine it's very much a horses for courses situation. Some riders seem to be able to push out KM day after day on a very unforgiving set up, but that's not for everyone.
It's an interesting conundrum. I reckon, in a race scenario on tarmac I would opt for the faster rig for up to 3 or 4 days, or up to 1500km depending on the elevations. After that, or if there was a good deal of off road, I'd go with the Rando bike.
Simple touring where speed was secondary and comfort was primary I'd go Rando set up every time.
I have a rear pannier top box with fold away side panniers as well as the Rando bag.

[Cudzoziemiec]

I've gravitated from a leaner, faster bike packing set up to a more Rando style affair.
...

I think we need photos of both rigs to compare and understand exactly what you're doing.

[Tommyp27]

https://youtu.be/Dvj0C_JjDoM

Variety of different styles in here and Ronnie is pretty amusing.

[phantasmagoriana]

Most things tend to go around in circles, with revisions. I'm just waiting for triples to come back into "fashion"!

[morbihan]

https://youtu.be/Dvj0C_JjDoM

Variety of different styles in here and Ronnie is pretty amusing.

That was a good watch.

[morbihan]

I've gravitated from a leaner, faster bike packing set up to a more Rando style affair.
...

I think we need photos of both rigs to compare and understand exactly what you're doing.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CUqJobfM34F/
https://www.instagram.com/p/CC809WAFZqw/
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bl3Y2eOhZGl/

S'cuse the instagram, I haven't fathomed how to upload photos on the site here.

Top two are the new set up with and without panniers.
Bottom one the original bike packing set up.

The new rig has a good degree more comfort.  The one issue I have found is that with the extra weight on the front and the higher stacked aero bars there is a tendency for the very light steering to swing when I'm off the bike, and its harder to track straight on very steep climbs.  Once speed is picked up its not an issue at all though. There is a little more toe overlap too.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Nice photos, Morbihan.

https://youtu.be/Dvj0C_JjDoM

Variety of different styles in here and Ronnie is pretty amusing.

Yeah. I don't quite get the big difference he makes though between pushing and pulling weight. I mean, it's not like the difference between pushing and pulling a suitcase or trolley, cos obviously the whole bike and all that's on it moves together. The differences between front and rear loading are down to other things than pushing versus pulling.

[Tommyp27]

Having worked with Cargo bikes, I have to say its much easier to push a load than pull. I worked on both a Bullit and a Mike Burrows Freight 8. The Freight 8 with the load at the back was an absolute pig to ride.

I think Ronnie definitely has his preferences and is also pushing what he personally finds practical. Behind the goofy, irony drenched humour there's someone who's learning what he feels works from testing in some fairly extreme conditions. But his extra wide handlebars, reworked carradice camper bag as a handlebar bag might be a little too extreme for some. I prefer a wider handlebar, due to having a relatively large chest size, but not quite the widths he's selling. But he also rides a lot off road.

I think also there's an element of what works best for you with this type of stuff.

[Cudzoziemiec]

You're not really pushing or pulling, is what I'm saying. If the Freight 8 was a pig, it was because of weight distribution or some other factor. Your propulsive input is made in the same way whether the load is in front of or behind you, or under or even on top of you.