Author Topic: Beginner wheel building mistakes...  (Read 5310 times)

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Beginner wheel building mistakes...
« Reply #50 on: 15 August, 2020, 03:01:58 pm »
Still with parallel spokes at the valve hole? Spokes crossing over the valve is an actual error, rather than just aesthetics.

Yep. Parallel spokes at the valve hole.

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Beginner wheel building mistakes...
« Reply #51 on: 15 August, 2020, 03:08:12 pm »
Good stuff.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Beginner wheel building mistakes...
« Reply #52 on: 15 August, 2020, 07:00:54 pm »
Doing it my way meant I didn’t even have to look at the wheel and cordless screwdrivers are faster (even going twice round) than me handcranking a Bicycle Research nipple driver (which I also had).

pardon me if this is obvious but nor do need to look at what you are doing with a nipple driver which is positively engaged with the nipple. If anything you need to look less.  And there is zero danger of chewing anything up with the drill. 

I've used the BR nipple driver relatively little, in good part because it seems somewhat unwieldy to me, being bigger and heavier than it needs to be.  Needless to say this goes double or more for using cordless drill/drivers; after a few wheels this way my wrists are sore; you are wafting a casing, motor and battery around for hours, all to drive nipples that weigh virtually nothing; it seems a bit mad to me.  I found myself wistfully thinking of those tool suspension units they use in car factories, inbetween thinking "there must be a better way".  If the drill slips at all it can make a good mess of the rim too. 

To get the nipple set ready for the final stages of building only takes ~16-18 turns, which takes only a few seconds with any hand crank tool. If it were fifty, there would be more merit in the drill(s), as it is, it is at best swings and roundabouts.

  The BR tool has a crank offset and handle angle that suited the chap that designed it but it won't suit everyone; at least with the nipple drivers I make I can have the crank length and handle angle exactly as I like it, and the tool weighs virtually nothing, so is in no way tiring to use. 

  I've also used (with varying degrees of success)

- a small 'electrician's screwdriver' with a rubber sleeve over the shank, so that it can be spun quickly and easily
- jeweller's screwdrivers (with a spinner that sits in the palm of your hand, and as slim a shank as I can find)
- the electrician's screwdriver fitted with a top spinner
- a spiralux screwdriver (like a Stanley yankee, but smaller)
- Stanley Yankee
- various 'push-out' nipple setting driving bits (some bought, some made)
- above in about a dozen different cordless drill/drivers (of which I guess an AEG would have been favourite)
- various nipple setting tools (again some bought, some made)

They all got the job done, but they all have pluses and minuses too, some of which will bother some folk more than others. As I said before, none of the 'push-out' setting tools were really accurate when it came down to it.

One of the things I really value about the DIY nipple driver approach is that once the nipple is on the driver, it pretty much can't come off accidentally; even if you only drop one nipple per wheel doing it some other way, it soon gets old, especially if the little so-and-so drops off inside the rim..... ::-)

One of the things I've long thought might do the job best of all is adapting a wire-wrap termination tool.  This was a popular method for certain types of wiring, decades ago, and you could (and still can I think) get a hand-operated 'pistol' tool which was arranged with a simple rack and pinion drive such that one pull of the trigger spun the tool end about fifteen or twenty times, at low torque. The tool is small and lightweight, and is meant to be handled easily for long periods.   They look like this;



just needs a bit of fettling to make a bit that holds the nipple well and gives an accurate 'set'. Probably it'll look a bit like the end of a DIY driver in the first instance.  I think this will work really well provided the nipple is perfectly free to turn on the spoke end and isn't binding in the rim drilling in any way.

cheers

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Beginner wheel building mistakes...
« Reply #53 on: 15 August, 2020, 07:21:40 pm »
We are arguing about angels dancing etc, particularly since neither of us are making our living off building wheels now. I know what worked for me and you know what worked for you. I will leave it at that.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Beginner wheel building mistakes...
« Reply #54 on: 15 August, 2020, 07:28:26 pm »
We are arguing....

no, just sharing ideas and experiences.....

I'm very happy to try new things out (if they are new or different) and see how I get on with them.  I don't take any such suggestions as 'arguing'....?

cheers

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Beginner wheel building mistakes...
« Reply #55 on: 15 August, 2020, 07:33:53 pm »
I tried Yankee screwdrivers and jeweller’s screwdrivers. My electric screwdrivers were lightweight, had low torque settings and high revs. They worked best for me in high volume wheel production. You know what works best for you.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Beginner wheel building mistakes...
« Reply #56 on: 15 August, 2020, 09:04:48 pm »
well I've tried a lot of things but I'm quite happy to try out new stuff too.   BTW I've tried about three different cordless screwdrivers and they were obviously smaller and lighter than cordless drills, but maybe I chose poorly because the spindle also turned much more slowly too; there was no real benefit in the speed at which the nipple actually got turned vs other techniques.  The batteries also only lasted a short while too (capacity and number of cycles), all very disappointing.

Thinking about it even now I rarely go a week without building wheels (can't kick the habit...?) and I am messing about with them nearly every day. Some of my chums still build wheels daily and sometimes I come up with different ways of doing things and occasionally they become 'the way'.   The DIY nipple driver is one such; it is the preferred (over anything and everything else that you can buy) tool/method with quite a few current rims, but to my surprise folk prefer a wide variety of different handle shapes, some of which I don't like at all.

cheers

hulver

  • I am a mole and I live in a hole.
Re: Beginner wheel building mistakes...
« Reply #57 on: 15 August, 2020, 10:37:51 pm »
My first wheel I couldn't get it to tension, and found that I'd laced it 2 cross instead of 3.

Then when I fixed that, I got the spokes in the wrong sides on the rim, so that the spoke for the right side went in the left hand holes.

That took a while to fix.

My second wheel I got the dishing badly wrong, and fixing it made it twice as bad.

They both look great now though, and ride just fine. I'll see what the longevity is like.