First Club Ride

[quixoticgeek]

I've signed up for a club ride with an Amsterdam cycle club. This will be my first club ride, I usually cycle alone, or maybe with a friend. The average speed is showing as more than I usually do (24kph), but I'm hoping that in a group I can push a bit faster.

I'm kinda nervous about this, I'm not great with groups of strangers at the best of times. Does anyone have any advice on cycling in a group on a club ride? The closest I've come to cycling in a group is the spring along from Fredericksplien at rush hour, I don't think that counts...

J

[D.A.L.E.]

Don't have a feckin flashing rear light.

[grams]

If you're worried about falling off the back, try to start off in the middle of the group rather than at the back, and it'll be much less likely to happen.

Try to ride exactly behind the person in front - in a tight group you shouldn't be able to see much of where you're going. Newbies tend to sit off to one side which messes up the whole formation.

[trekker12]

Don't get keen or feel guilty that you have to take a turn at the front. This will knacker you out and if it's a long ride you will regret it later. If near the end of the ride you haven't had a turn and feel OK then fine but I wouldn't respect a club that insisted you have to be on the front on your first outing or two with them.

On the other end of the scale try not to spend the whole ride on the back, you will have to accelerate out of every corner faster than you may be used to and they might leave you behind if you are at the back.

Tell them it's your first ride and try to stay within the back 1/2 to 2/3 of the group. Find a buddy who is happy to sit with you and guide you into the gaps if you can.

Enjoy it, say hello to the random stranger next to you and get to know people. Sitting silently in the group without introductions will make for a rather dull but fast ride.

[DuncanM]

Find the person who is leading the ride and tell them that you are new to group riding.  There will be hand gestures/shouts to tell others where potholes etc are, where you are going, when to change the person at the front, slow down, single out, etc. I don't know Dutch, so can't help with specifics - best to ask. If you are struggling, then don't take a turn at the front, but follow the wheels. Also, try not to drop off the back, or shout if you are going to do so.

Have fun - if you are consistently working too hard to talk to the person next to you (especially if in the middle/back), maybe you should ask if you can slow down for a bit - it's much more enjoyable if you can be social.

[giropaul]

All the above advice is good.
How much research have you done on local clubs? Every club has its culture, which can go from “ pace of the slowest rider” to being a virtual race. Bigger clubs typically have several rides, and will advise on where it might be best to start.
A social media check of what clubs Audax type riders go out with might lead in the right direction perhaps( you may already have checked out the club you are going out with of course)

[Zed43]

Never been on a club ride, but some experiences of riding in a group of randonneurs:

• never let your front wheel overlap with the rear of the person in front of you*
• leave just a little more space when the bike in front of you has discs and you don't ;-)
• close gaps quickly (and hope the people up front are considerate and pick up speed slowly after a sharp turn)
• 4 inches to the left or right make all the difference when roads are wet and grimy
• it is usually safer to go straight through potholes and bumps instead of swerving around them when someone is riding behind you

* unless you have severe cross winds and the group is lined up in a diagonal, but then your front wheel is probably near the cranks of the person in front of you and (s)he nows you're there

And some common Dutch shouts when riding in group (it varies, but I've heard these the most):

• voor we're overtaking an obstacle (cyclist, pedestrian) on the right, keep to the left
• tegen there is an obstacle (car) coming towards us, keep to the right
• achter we're about be overtaken (car, etc), keep to the right
• paaltje approaching obstacle (usually a bollard) in the middle of the road, be careful!

[zigzag]

know the route in advance and ask if there are any stretches where they put the hammer down. introduce yourself and talk to the ride organiser/leader before the ride. have fun!

[Samuel D]

If you’re not used to riding in a group, your main problem will be following the wheel closely enough (and offset by the right amount in a crosswind however weak) to optimally benefit from the draft while not constantly dabbing the brakes.

Drafting is everything in a group. Without it a group would travel slower than an individual. It’s the mechanism that allows the group to ride fast and efficiently, but it takes many hours of practice before you can do it well. You might know all the right things – although in my experience, many experienced cyclists still do it wrong the moment there’s a breath of crosswind – but putting it into practice takes practice. I know how to juggle four balls but cannot do it for lack of that practice.

Groups usually give too many commands, only a few of which are useful or necessary. Let the others do the theatrical shouting and waving on your first ride. There will be plenty of volunteers.

[Bolt]

My only experience of anything like a club ride was back in the early 80s when I entered a 150 mile reliability trial organised by Doncaster Wheelers.  The ride was led by the legendary founder of LEL Bernard Mawson on a tandem trike with a partially sighted stoker.  The rest of the group consisted of a very capable club rider, a very young me, an older chap wearing woollen shorts and a pair of brogues and an even older chap wearing long trousers and bicycle clips! There were lots of stops for tea and fags and no silly shouting and pointing at things on the road.
It was, a perfect day... I hope yours is too!

[quixoticgeek]

If you’re not used to riding in a group, your main problem will be following the wheel closely enough (and offset by the right amount in a crosswind however weak) to optimally benefit from the draft while not constantly dabbing the brakes.

I'm used to drafting. I keep myself amused on my commute by drafting e bikes, I recently had a passer by object to me slip streaming an e bike 30mm off the back wheel. Apparently it's not common in Amsterdam...

On a recent ride home from work, I was sat just off the side of an e bike through the crosswind, as I ride I felt someone else was on my leeward side, another hundred meters and there were four of us who seemed to have formed an informal echelon against the cross wind. It split when we hit a roundabout and went 3 different directions.

So drafting I'm used to, drafting people who are aware of it... less so...

Cheers

J

[quixoticgeek]

Turns out that in force 7 winds, they cancel the club rides... it seems a mixed ability group in gusty crosswinds is not a good idea.

Which seems sensible.

Will have to try again in a month...

J

[Feanor]

I did my first club ride a few weeks ago, and found it a rather frustrating experience. The range of experience and expectation was too large.  I got shouted at! We did split up later and the dynamics improved.

But it did remind me why I do most of my rides solo.

[zigzag]

^^ doesn't sound like a group you'd want to find yourself in.. on the other hand, riding in a group where everyone is of similar ability (and skill) is pure joy

[quixoticgeek]

Well I did the club ride today. It was a disaster.

I signed up expecting 24-27kph. Turns out they wanted to do 26-28kph. I was expecting 65-80km. The ride was going to be 90km. And the no drop policy was a joke. I fell off the back after 10km as I couldn't do the 28+kph they were doing(looking through it on strava, just before I fell off, they were doing 29-30), It took them over a 1km to notice, and then after an argument with the ride leader, she basically told me to go home.

Now I'm back at the laptop, I've checked the website. Both the ride leader and myself were right. I was expecting 24-27kph, which is what it says in one place on the website, she was expecting 26-28kph, which it says in another place on the same website. I've emailed the shop that this ride is associated with, as well as the contact address for the ride, and asked them to fix their website, so noone else has to suffer this experience.

It's completely put me off ever wanting to join another group ride, ah well. I'll have some lunch, then go for a relaxed solo ride.

This ride wasn't fun, wasn't relaxed, and wasn't social.

J

[Vince]

Which part of NL are you in? There is an ex-pat cycle group called The Not Possibles based north of The Hague, which might suit you. The are contactable via Faceache.

[quixoticgeek]

Which part of NL are you in? There is an ex-pat cycle group called The Not Possibles based north of The Hague, which might suit you.

I'm in Amsterdam. Do you have any details of the above club? Google doesn't give me anything other than a blog post about riding with them.

J

[Vince]

https://www.facebook.com/groups/notpossibles/about/

Just read the current 'About' page and seems that their speeds have gone up since I last rode with them. Sorry.

[giropaul]

Personally I’d avoid any “ club” ( was it actually a club, or a shop bash.) that has a stated km/hr. strava has done more to ruin cycling than anything, and there are a lot of people who fret too much about their averages, etc etc.

Around here are loads of groups that go out. Shop groups tend to be very focussed upon their “ performance “ except that few have the cohones to actually race. Other groups are “ pensioner” types,and there is everything in between.

I’m selective about the groups I ride with,on a ride by ride basis. What is ok one week soon gets spoilt by one muppet. I ( selfishly perhaps) use each group as I need, but don’t fall out over it, just drift off on my own. The only time I worry about being dropped is when I do have a number on my back in a real race.

There WILL be groups that suit you. Maybe look for Audax type gatherings, or lurk in cafes and look for suitable people ( maybe those without the full carbon bling). Once you connect with a few of the right sort of people for you your network will spread rapidly I’m sure. Stick at it!

[DuncanM]

Stated speeds are useful when the club has a broad spectrum of riders. The club I'm part of will have rides that go at 14mph all the way up to 25mph - different groups, sometimes same meeting point and meeting time. Expected speed should allow a rider to join a group that suits them.
26-28 and 24-27 on a non-drop ride should overlap enough that not dropping is simple if they actually cared about not dropping you. Sounds like they didn't (care).

[mzjo]

I think one of the best ways of finding a club that suits you is by NOT going looking for it. If you want to find people who ride at your speed and with whom you would want to ride, the best place to do it is on the road by meeting people while they are riding. Ask them who they ride with regularly (if you get on with them). The ones that are too fast will be eliminated straight away because you will never catch their reply!!

Even though I am in a club I have always preferred riding alone and finding company on the road by chance; they're always the best companions and you never meet them if you're in a big group.

[BobScarle]

Personally I’d avoid any “ club” ( was it actually a club, or a shop bash.) that has a stated km/hr. strava has done more to ruin cycling than anything, and there are a lot of people who fret too much about their averages, etc etc.

I couldn't agree more with this. I am finding that the only way to avoid people who are "improving" is to ride alone. Sad really.

[Kim]

Stated speeds are useful when the club has a broad spectrum of riders.

Quite.  Otherwise you end up with meaningless subjective descriptions like "moderate ride" or "a social pace" that guarantee it'll be somewhere between a leisurely pootle and something you have to slog your guts out to struggle to keep up with.

Of course, that's assuming that the numbers are accurate.  And doesn't preclude the statement of speed (rather than it being something you have to coax out of GPS logs^[1] from people who've done the ride before) being a red flag for a certain attitude.


_{[1] Strava is brilliant for this.}

[Samuel D]

Although it’s hard, I wouldn’t take this personally. (And maybe you already feel better about this today.)

There is a tension between people wanting the thrill and pleasure of exercising close to their limits and the wish to ride together in a group. For the group to stick together seems to require strong leadership. Try stopping a horse or dog from tearing up a field when it’s let loose. Fit cyclists are similar: you can’t rein them in without clear, enforced rules. Groups often lack this discipline. That doesn’t make them bad, it just makes them different from the groups with strong leaders and enforced behaviour.

Another thing to note is that there is a fine line between comfortably keeping pace and going over the edge and getting dropped. You might remember this ride as impossibly hard, but on another day with slightly better fitness, you might merely find it an enjoyable challenge to keep up. In the meantime, find either a more disciplined or slightly slower group and see what you’re missing, because group rides can be a load of fun.

[andrew_s]

Of course, that's assuming that the numbers are accurate.  And doesn't preclude the statement of speed (rather than it being something you have to coax out of GPS logs

Another point to check is what the average speed means.

Does "17 mph" mean that the group is expected to cover 50 miles in 3 hours, or does it mean that the pace will usually be about 17 mph on flat/moderately undulating roads?

There's a considerable difference in pace between the two - to get a 17 mph overall average, you'll be doing 20 quite a lot of the time.