Electricity Smart Meter

[ian]

I pretty much lost interest in mine within a day and, indeed, consigned it to the dusty IT cupboard under the stairs. I'm not sure they really contribute to more efficient energy usage – I imagine it's a mechanism of terror if you're struggling to pay your energy bills and of little arbitrary interest to everyone else. Sure, I could sit in the cold and dark, scratching out emails on a chalkboard. That might get the numbers down, I suppose.

I just went to check that's it's OK in there, and we're using 13p/hr for electricity and 0p/hr for gas at the moment. I guess that's two computers and assorted monitors, the fridge, and the multitude of devices with lights on top (wifi, speakers, security cameras, cats).

[Flite]

(wifi, speakers, security cameras, cats).

You didn't think we would notice the cats, did you?

[Kim]

What's far more useful is this kind of analysis:



Unfortunately, you need a lot of power meters^[1] and a bit of programming-fu to achieve it.

(No apologies for my use of canonical SI units.  They're more intuitive than kilowatt-hours per minute or dollarpounds per fortnight or whatever.)


_{[1] The 'other' bar comes from the electricity meter itself.  Via the blinkenlight on the front in this case, but it could be obtained from the smart meter API.}

[Lightning Phil]

The monitors are only designed to have battery backup, not operation, they should run from mains.

So that having a smart meter monitor on means you use more electricity than without.

[DaveReading]

Gotta love the Daily Heil

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11321855/Chinese-smart-meters-threat-power-supplies-Britain-critics-fear.html

"Mr Hunn said it ‘shows a frightening lack of complacency'".

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'd have thought that a lack of complacency was highly commendable ...

[Ham]

The monitors are only designed to have battery backup, not operation, they should run from mains.

So that having a smart meter monitor on means you use more electricity than without.

Indeed, consumption of mine doesn't seem to be more than 500mw (doesn't register on my meter)

[rogerzilla]

My monitor was consigned to the dusty cupbiard of cables when I realised it shows the wrong tariff all the time.

[Diver300]

Our smart meter wouldn't communicate with a test device where the gas meter is, so we've been left with the mechanical gas meter and I have to brave the spiders every now and then to read the digits.

The monitor made connection with the the smart meter about once and then refused to talk, in spite of being within 2 metres. The supply company's website has much better historical information anyhow.

[Kim]

A few days ago I had an email from someone at Octopus asking for photos of my gas meter.  It wasn't deja-vu, so I forwarded a copy of the ones I sent them in September, which apparently they'd failed to attach to my account or something.

Shockingly, I've just noticed my script downloaded some new gas consumption data from the API this morning.  On further investigation, there's now data available as far back as July.

Even more impressively, the pointless IHD thing is now showing the correct unit rates.


Place your bets on when the next cockup happens...

[Mrs Pingu]

 

[Kim]

They pointed me at https://octopus.energy/blog/solving-smart-meter-issues-octopus-energy/ which is well into "someone is always having a worse day than you" territory.

[SoreTween]

Yay!  Just finished commissioning 11 new solar panels on my garage roof.
Boo!  Now to switch them all off while I wait goodness knows how for a smart meter to be installed.  Double boo.

[aidan.f]

Yay!  Just finished commissioning 11 new solar panels on my garage roof.
Boo!  Now to switch them all off while I wait goodness knows how for a smart meter to be installed.  Double boo.

Why do you need a smart meter to consume the solarelectrons personally? - Not that many will be generated in December...

[Kim]

Place your bets on when the next cockup happens...

I was going to reply to this with something along the lines of "suspicious absence of gas meter readings since midnight on the 3rd", but a full set just came in for the 4th, so it's merely a missing day, rather than reinstatement of the previous b0rkage.  (Presumed karmic retribution for making my data fetching script more efficient by way of celebration.)


Meanwhile, I got a satisfaction survey about my recent interaction with customer services.  On the basis that they were very polite and reasonable, but it's still taken forever to resolve this, I selected 'meh'.

[SoreTween]

Yay!  Just finished commissioning 11 new solar panels on my garage roof.
Boo!  Now to switch them all off while I wait goodness knows how for a smart meter to be installed.  Double boo.

Why do you need a smart meter to consume the solarelectrons personally?

Basically because peak production could in theory all go to the grid, my system isn't able to only produce what we consume.  Even down to the street level the grid needs to be balanced, if everyone starts pushing out 5kW unannounced bad things could happen if we were all on the same phase.
Previously we only had 2 panels / 800W peak, the grid operators don't care about that little.  It was legal without being registered.  Now I need to register our system with the DNO and they won't sign it off without a meter that measures outgoing power.  Our current one doesn't, I've just been giving away our excess uncounted not that it amounted to much.  The meter doesn't actually have to be smart, if they turn up & find there's no signal they can still upgrade us to a dumb 2 way meter & I'll be fine.  That is a real possibility, the guy who redid the roof for me lives in the next village a mile away.  They could not get a smart meter because no signal.  I'm nearer to the mast but my house with it's 18" thick stone walls is between the meter box & mast.

Not that many will be generated in December...

You might be surprised.  Enphase microinverters work down to below 10W (IQ7A, 366W peak).  Yesterday was a very dull day and they were all producing 20-35W as the cloud thickness ebbed & flowed.  It has to be a tremendously dull day to get nothing at all.  At 25W per panel production we were producing a third to half house load as stuff cut in & out.  I have another 14 matching panels in the garage to be installed when the wallet allows.  I'm hopeful it'll make us close to self sufficient daylight hours year round.

[andyoxon]

We're with Octopus & still not taken the SMETS2 plunge yet, despite continual notifications.

How long before the companies start charging more for peak rate energy use, rather than payments to users for avoiding high demand times?   Stick rather than carrot.

[DaveReading]

We're with Octopus & still not taken the SMETS2 plunge yet, despite continual notifications.

How long before the companies start charging more for peak rate energy use, rather than payments to users for avoiding high demand times?   Stick rather than carrot.

A good reason not to have a smart meter, then ?

[andyoxon]

We're with Octopus & still not taken the SMETS2 plunge yet, despite continual notifications.

How long before the companies start charging more for peak rate energy use, rather than payments to users for avoiding high demand times?   Stick rather than carrot.

A good reason not to have a smart meter, then ?

Probably, if it were to likely to happen...    Atm, my guess it would be a customer relations disaster for any company attempting 'peak price gouging' unilaterally - unless it was a govt mandated 'drastic times/drastic measures'.  Probably unlikely until SM 'targets are met', & most people have one. 

[FifeingEejit]

Pretty much what Economy 7 is...

[Kim]

How long before the companies start charging more for peak rate energy use, rather than payments to users for avoiding high demand times?   Stick rather than carrot.

1978 I think.

It's down to what tariff you chose.  I don't think flat-rate ones are going away any time soon, but if you have the ability to shift your load a variable rate tariff is likely to be a better deal.

You don't have to have a variable rate tariff if you have smart meters.

[felstedrider]

We're with Octopus & still not taken the SMETS2 plunge yet, despite continual notifications.

How long before the companies start charging more for peak rate energy use, rather than payments to users for avoiding high demand times?   Stick rather than carrot.

A good reason not to have a smart meter, then ?

Probably, if it were to likely to happen...    Atm, my guess it would be a customer relations disaster for any company attempting 'peak price gouging' unilaterally - unless it was a govt mandated 'drastic times/drastic measures'.  Probably unlikely until SM 'targets are met', & most people have one.

Hmmmm.....gouging.   I'm no defender of the industry but there's a reason peak prices can/will be high.   It's because it costs the supplier more to deliver power at that time of day - wholesale, distribution, transmission and balancing costs all hit their highest at that point.   At the moment the cost is included in domestic tariffs, it's just blended in so no-one can see it.   If you increase peak prices and decrease off-peak it's a zero sum game if you don't change your consumption pattern.

Time of day tariffs in business supply have been common for 20+ years.    If you switch from flat rate to time of days but don't change your habits then the cost is the same.   You then make savings as you change the way you use your energy.

[mrcharly-YHT]

This is a bit POBI . . .

It seems that if you have a smart meter, you can be switched (remotely) onto a prepay tariff.

Approval for this requires a magistrate, however, magistrates are being presented with lists of hundreds of people at a time, and are block-signing permission for the switch.

[Mrs Pingu]

This is a bit POBI . . .

It seems that if you have a smart meter, you can be switched (remotely) onto a prepay tariff.

Approval for this requires a magistrate, however, magistrates are being presented with lists of hundreds of people at a time, and are block-signing permission for the switch.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2022/11/smart-meter-prepayment-switched-remotely-rights/#:~:text=If%20you're%20on%20a,warrant%20(in%20some%20cases).

They're not allowed to do that without communicating with you.

[mrcharly-YHT]

This is a bit POBI . . .

It seems that if you have a smart meter, you can be switched (remotely) onto a prepay tariff.

Approval for this requires a magistrate, however, magistrates are being presented with lists of hundreds of people at a time, and are block-signing permission for the switch.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2022/11/smart-meter-prepayment-switched-remotely-rights/#:~:text=If%20you're%20on%20a,warrant%20(in%20some%20cases).

They're not allowed to do that without communicating with you.

You have faith in suppliers both:

• Following the law
• Having IT systems and processes that are rigorous and function correctly

After all, it's not like suppliers have ever sent out spurious ridiculous bills because of internal errors, is it?

[rafletcher]

This is a bit POBI . . .

It seems that if you have a smart meter, you can be switched (remotely) onto a prepay tariff.

Tip of the iceberg, there will be surge pricing, supply limiting etc. ect. rolled in eventually I have no doubt.