Sportive Punch Up at "The Dragon Fiasco"

[DanialW]

They're profit-driven, usually. Even if sometimes that profit goes to a charity.

Nothing wrong with that, and nothing wrong too if they're criticised when they fail to deliver.

[Philip Whiteman]

I found the BikeRadar thread very useful - I've learned a new cliché:

Dentist on a Pinarello

Yep, what a great a cliche. So are dentists the new estate agents?

And what about an audaxer:

Academic/social worker/geography teacher on a Mercian.

[Exit Stage Left]

I found the BikeRadar thread very useful - I've learned a new cliché:

Dentist on a Pinarello

Yep, what a great a cliche. So are dentists the new estate agents?

And what about an audaxer:

Academic/social worker/geography teacher on a Mercian.

Hedgelayer/ Film maker on a Hewitt in my case, but that is a very small part of the sample.

[Greenbank]

I found the BikeRadar thread very useful - I've learned a new cliché:

Dentist on a Pinarello

Yep, what a great a cliche. So are dentists the new estate agents?

And what about an audaxer:

Academic/social worker/geography teacher on a Mercian.

IT worker on a Pompino?

[Bairn Again]

I am doing an Audax on Saturday ,will cost me double ethe Dragon price with fuel to get there cafe stops etc but what price is a good day out?

Indeed. Reminds me about a similar conversation I was having during a recent 600km Audax:-

£12 entry fee.
£30 train tickets to/from the start (~300km each way).
£60 hotel on Friday and Sunday nights.
£30 on food during the event (not bad for ~15,000kcal).

= £132

Plus probably £5 of wear and tear on the bike (~£100 a year for 10,000km is about right).

This is what I came to see as the 'hidden' cost of audax. 

To avoid this you could organise (and ride) an event that starts near where you live. 

[itinerant]

The main drawback of Sportives seems to be the complete lack of a Full-English Breakfast option at any of their controls.  
[/quote]

 
I did a sportive a year or so ago, one of the end of season 'Cotswold Something or other', and at the first feed station they were doing bacon sandwiches.  Times went out of the window and most settled in for a long stay and an enjoyable feed!
 
I do handful of sportives a year versus lots of audax. Virtually all are well organised and enjoyable.  You pays your money and makes your choice....

[AndyH]

IT worker on a Pompino?

Builder on an Enigma

[Exit Stage Left]

I am doing an Audax on Saturday ,will cost me double ethe Dragon price with fuel to get there cafe stops etc but what price is a good day out?

Indeed. Reminds me about a similar conversation I was having during a recent 600km Audax:-

£12 entry fee.
£30 train tickets to/from the start (~300km each way).
£60 hotel on Friday and Sunday nights.
£30 on food during the event (not bad for ~15,000kcal).

= £132

Plus probably £5 of wear and tear on the bike (~£100 a year for 10,000km is about right).

This is what I came to see as the 'hidden' cost of audax. 

To avoid this you could organise (and ride) an event that starts near where you live. 

Here! Here!

[GruB]

Or just not bother. 

[Dan_K]

I rode this event at the weekend largely because I wanted to enter a huge mass participation event and in that regard, it didn't disappoint.
If i'm honest, I don't ride a large number of events, mainly due to the associated costs - hotels etc.
I tend to do most of my riding close to home and if there is a cheap event on, I may enter.
I knew when I entered that with 4000 people, there would be delays at the start and food might run out at the feed stations, so I arrived as early as I could (and still waited an hour) and carried enough food that I was self sufficient.
I thought the course was well signposted, which meant I could concentrate on riding and enjoying the route.
The food stops were well stocked and the helpers all seemed to be really cheery which was nice to see. The marshalls were helpful and the motorcycle outriders did a fantastic job - I overheard one chatting to a motorist when we were waiting at a junction and he seemed to be doing a great PR job.
The thing I enjoyed most was riding en masse and seeing the local community come out to support us. There were loads of people clapping along the route and a good 50 spectators at the top of the Bwlch, cheering us on, which was much appreciated.
Sure, there were a few idiots riding but I just steered clear of them. I've read about the accidents (and witnessed one) but you can't really blame the organiser for this. If people are stupid enough to go full pace into corners for which they have no prior knowledge on road surface etc, then they take their own chances.
You can complain about the cost but if you don't want to pay, don't sign up. I think the issue is that people have different expectations of value for money. I went in with low expectations and was pleasantly surprised at how well the day went. I was a little ticked off about the timing fiasco but I have a Garmin which logged my time so all i've really lost is a few bragging rights.
I'll be signing up again next year I reckon and so is my other half, who is relatively new to cycling. I know that even though she won't want us riding together, she'll be well looked after throughout and I won't have the same fears that I would have if she was doing a similar ride solo.
It's a shame that people have to put down other groups within cycling. I enjoy all aspects of the sport and think as long as people are on 2 wheels and enjoying themselves, that's all that matters. Live and let live.
I would imagine any event of this size would have it's faults regardless of who was organising it.

[Exit Stage Left]

This point you made is interesting.

I'll be signing up again next year I reckon and so is my other half, who is relatively new to cycling. I know that even though she won't want us riding together, she'll be well looked after throughout and I won't have the same fears that I would have if she was doing a similar ride solo.

I've persisted with Audax for that reason, among others. It was always frustrating to do day rides and tours with Heather, I'd end up going too slow and she'd end up feeling pressured to go too quick. She doesn't like the idea of a tandem so Audax does what you describe.

[Jaded]

Audax doesn't look after the rider though.

[Dan_K]

This point you made is interesting.

I'll be signing up again next year I reckon and so is my other half, who is relatively new to cycling. I know that even though she won't want us riding together, she'll be well looked after throughout and I won't have the same fears that I would have if she was doing a similar ride solo.

I've persisted with Audax for that reason, among others. It was always frustrating to do day rides and tours with Heather, I'd end up going too slow and she'd end up feeling pressured to go too quick. She doesn't like the idea of a tandem so Audax does what you describe.

We went out together yesterday for 30 miles and it was nice to be together but a slow ride for me. If it was an actual event, i'd have been frustrated.
I think organised events be it audax, sportives or whatever, offer the flexibility for couples to ride and enjoy an event at their own pace. The only added bonus that sportives have over audaxes, is a fully signposted route and a broom wagon/mechanical support which for the sake of a few quid offers peace of mind.

[phil d]

It's a shame that people have to put down other groups within cycling. I enjoy all aspects of the sport and think as long as people are on 2 wheels and enjoying themselves, that's all that matters. Live and let live.

Here here.

[Exit Stage Left]

This point you made is interesting.

I'll be signing up again next year I reckon and so is my other half, who is relatively new to cycling. I know that even though she won't want us riding together, she'll be well looked after throughout and I won't have the same fears that I would have if she was doing a similar ride solo.

I've persisted with Audax for that reason, among others. It was always frustrating to do day rides and tours with Heather, I'd end up going too slow and she'd end up feeling pressured to go too quick. She doesn't like the idea of a tandem so Audax does what you describe.

We went out together yesterday for 30 miles and it was nice to be together but a slow ride for me. If it was an actual event, i'd have been frustrated.
I think organised events be it audax, sportives or whatever, offer the flexibility for couples to ride and enjoy an event at their own pace. The only added bonus that sportives have over audaxes, is a fully signposted route and a broom wagon/mechanical support which for the sake of a few quid offers peace of mind.

Heather has got a lot of stamina and is a good navigator, so she sometimes gathers a 'Lantern Rouge' group. She's made some good friends over the years. I ride in a very inconsistent way, which means that I get to film lots of different people. I only ride at a consistent pace when I need a consistent subject in shot. Often this means that I get the bonus of some very good company. Sometimes I drop all the way back to Heather if I think she might like some company or a bit of help into a headwind.

[Domestique]

It's a shame that people have to put down other groups within cycling. I enjoy all aspects of the sport and think as long as people are on 2 wheels and enjoying themselves, that's all that matters. Live and let live.

Here here.

+1 I dont want to be part of the 'back slappers cycling elite club' but just ride my bike!

[Billy Weir]

Whilst applauding people enjoying a sporting activity, as a cycling community I feel we have to recognise there is a risk that the increasing volume of events and field sizes will result in organised cycling events being, at best, regulated.

As an audax rider (and organiser), it's perfectly legitimate to worry about this prospect, given any regulations are unlikely to distinguish between a sportive and an audax event.

[Dan_K]

As an audax rider (and organiser), it's perfectly legitimate to worry about this prospect, given any regulations are unlikely to distinguish between a sportive and an audax event.

Perhaps Audax will become an underground organisation like time trialling used to be and we'll all be using coded courses for events to prevent this from happening. That combined with the SAE entry system should keep things nice and quiet.

[mattc]

As an audax rider (and organiser), it's perfectly legitimate to worry about this prospect, given any regulations are unlikely to distinguish between a sportive and an audax event.

I mainly agree with you, but most Sportives are overt races, whereas Audaxes aren't; so there is a simple distinction available for the authorities/lawmakers/enforcers.

<that should flush out a few nitpickers ... >

[Philip Whiteman]

As an audax rider (and organiser), it's perfectly legitimate to worry about this prospect, given any regulations are unlikely to distinguish between a sportive and an audax event.

I mainly agree with you, but most Sportives are overt races, whereas Audaxes aren't; so there is a simple distinction available for the authorities/lawmakers/enforcers.

<that should flush out a few nitpickers ... >

Yep, I refer back to my earlier message on racing legislation and the publication of ranked results.

[Dan_K]

I think sportive organisers get around it by publicising results but not ranking them in order but providing the user with the facility to sort results by time, therefore ranking them personally.
Like providing a gun and bullets but not firing the weapon themselves.
Think accessory to race, rather than race.....

[Martin]

As an audax rider (and organiser), it's perfectly legitimate to worry about this prospect, given any regulations are unlikely to distinguish between a sportive and an audax event.

I mainly agree with you, but most Sportives are overt races, whereas Audaxes aren't; so there is a simple distinction available for the authorities/lawmakers/enforcers.

<that should flush out a few nitpickers ... >

Audax rides do not exist as such, riders are out on a private excursion obeying the highway code. All the organiser does is suggest a route between controls and provide cake at some of them;

regulate that...

[DanialW]

Audax rides do not exist as such, riders are out on a private excursion obeying the highway code. All the organiser does is suggest a route between controls and provide cake at some of them;

regulate that...

Actually, LEL is making itself known to the police, loud and clear.

There's no way I'm going to put my neck on the line for a bike ride.

[phil d]

Audax rides do not exist as such, riders are out on a private excursion obeying the highway code. All the organiser does is suggest a route between controls and provide cake at some of them;

regulate that...

Actually, LEL is making itself known to the police, loud and clear.

There's no way I'm going to put my neck on the line for a bike ride.

Matter of interest, what is their response?  Are they generally helpful and supportive, or do you hear a sharp intake of breath?

[DanialW]

Helpful and supportive. I say the magic words 'it's not a race, it's just a ride' and they're cool. I suspect that one day I'll be asked for meetings or risk assessments, but that's fine.