Recommendations for a Low Trail Frameset

[canny colin]

No I am not a disciple of Jan Heine.
It just happens low trail geometry, works well with a trike conversion axel.
So I am after a classic French style randonneur frame . But I can't afford bespoke prices .
 
Any material                                                                       but probably steel is best .
10mm trail is good                                                              but  30mm / 40mm  will do.
Disc front brake & provision for deep drop callipers.         I have no rear brakes  & need two brakes for sanity/ legality
Room for 700c x 28 & mudguards .                                      But will consider 650b
Quick release rear axel                                                        so  I can bolt on the rear trike conversion .
27.2 seat post                                                                     makes bolting on the conversion easy .
Only frameset I can find is the Soma Grand Randonneur v3 with the rear clamp plates swooped from  through axel to qd . But I don't need loads of allen bolt bosses every were  . This to replace my low trail 1951 Claud Butler frameset So I don't bugger up the frame with winter road salt & have brakes that work well .                                                        There must be others framsets out there ?     colin 

     

[rogerzilla]

Just get a custom fork with more offset?  Or have the existing forks bent by a framebuilder.  They may need repainting, but maybe not: a mere 1% strain would cause a huge increase in offset and may not crack the paint.

Expedition touring bikes should have next to no trail but would be a bit clunky.

[canny colin]

Hi Mr Zilla . I have hunted around but every one is heading to gravel bike territories  with 60mm plus  of trail . I can get a soma fork with 65mm of trail & 400mm fork length .  but I need a frame with 73 / 74degree headset, low bottom bracket height  & a short rear triangle . The conversion Axel bolts on the outside of the rear  triangle & I don't want the turning circle of a bus .

[mzjo]

Redundant 1990's steel race frame with a custom made fork to reduce the trail. You shouldn't have to pay much for a steel race frame from that period (at least this side of the Manche you shouldn't!) so the cost is in the fork!
The only off the peg randonneuse frames are likely to be USA origine (Soma Grand Randonneur or Surly Packrat) and not necessarily adapted to your project. Berthoud or Cyfac could build you something but at a price! The Confrérie des 650 have some frames (which would have all the brazings you don't want) but they are only interested in selling a complete randonneuse (2500-2800€ at present; they weren't interested in selling me a frame to build my own randonneuse and I'm a paid-up member!) so they would refuse a project like that.
ETA Funnily enough this is something that has crossed my mind as a project for my Gitane race frame (1990, Chromor tubes) but now I have given up that idea - no garage space for a trike and I like the Gitane converted to 650 as it is.

[rogerzilla]

Without being arsed to do the calculation, you probably want about 50mm of offset, assuming a 700c wheel.  My Harry Quinn track bike has a steep head angle and this amount of offset, and it has very little self-steer.  It is still totally stable and rideable - I did the Dunwich Dynamo on it and it didn't bite me even when tired.

[canny colin]

Thank you rogerzilla & mzjo . I have lost the plot again & have just purchased A Newton ( Tadpole style ) tricycle . For not a lot more than an bespoke  set of forks . With twin front discs & a conventional rear end it should make a canny winter trike . Colin