Author Topic: ACME Miscellany (Read 521686 times)

Oaky · « **Reply #700 on:** 05 April, 2016, 04:08:39 pm »

Seriously - do it on fixed - walk a few steep bits

tippers_kiwi · « **Reply #701 on:** 05 April, 2016, 04:13:16 pm »

Quote from: tedshred on 05 April, 2016, 03:25:50 pm

Right, I have spoken (again) to Thomas Cycle Revolution. They didn't sell me the bike but they are my local trek dealer.

Apparently the rate I am chewing through bottom brackets on my bike (this will be the 3rd since last February) is my fault.

Every time you have ridden a Trek Domane or Trek Madone with a BB90 in the rain you should remove the cranks from the bike and remove any water or other crud from the shell, the spindle and the exterior of the bearings and then rebuild it. I was told the system is not remotely weatherproof. It must therefore only be designed for short rides in the dry. The Trek Domane is sold as an endurance bike.

I am assured that if it is raining when I leave Chepstow then no damage will happen to the bearings by the time I have returned. How the bearings will remain greased and functioning while awash with water during this period is presumably the work of Trek fairies.

Research on the internet would suggest that this is all bollocks but I need the bike back so I will fit the v2 bb and see what happens. I doubt it will be ready in time for Saturday though.

How, that is an awesome answer. Did they also suggest that a normal pleb cyclist such as ourselves would not be capable of doing such things and that it should always taken to them so they can charge £20 an hour labour and then keep the bike for a whole weekend at a time to do this......you can pick it up, ride it home and take it straight back.

To be honest, it's this kind of stuff that drives me away from Thomas' for most things, they are good at getting Trek specific parts but other than the experience of buying the new bike (which I must say they made very enjoyable) I've had quite a few experiences that have made me wonder why I bother.

tedshred · « **Reply #702 on:** 05 April, 2016, 04:16:10 pm »

I get the feeling they are working from a Trek script or approved responses at least.

The same answer was given to me at Activ in Folkestone where I bought the bike.

It doesn't even make sense.

When (rather than if) the v2 bearings give up the ghost it will have to be direct to Trek.

bobb · « **Reply #703 on:** 05 April, 2016, 04:59:20 pm »

Quote from: tedshred on 05 April, 2016, 03:58:20 pm

I could bring along an anchor as well.

Ponce. I rode PBP on my Surly LHT which weighs about 500 kilos. And you're worried about a poxy 200 on your Galaxy? Pffft...

tedshred · « **Reply #704 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:08:36 pm »

I bet you and OD won't be out on your Surly LHTs on Saturday though

bobb · « **Reply #705 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:09:38 pm »

I would be if I had no other option!

tedshred · « **Reply #706 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:17:33 pm »

I have the option of a long lie and a nice MEWBS style ride

Oscar's dad · « **Reply #707 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:33:51 pm »

Quote from: tedshred on 05 April, 2016, 05:17:33 pm

I have the option of a long lie and a nice MEWBS style ride

And condemning me to the vagaries of the rail replacement service! Git.

tedshred · « **Reply #708 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:34:41 pm »

Let's see what I can do.

Oscar's dad · « **Reply #709 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:35:25 pm »

And I would happily take Fred and his new lightweight wheels if I didn't have to leave him in the bike cage for 24 hours.

Carlosfandango · « **Reply #710 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:38:23 pm »

Quote from: bobb on 05 April, 2016, 04:59:20 pm

Quote from: tedshred on 05 April, 2016, 03:58:20 pm
I could bring along an anchor as well.

Ponce. I rode PBP on my Surly LHT which weighs about 500 kilos. And you're worried about a poxy 200 on your Galaxy? Pffft...

Exactly, steel is real and fixed is where it's at until there's a proper ride and the carbon bike is broken, then it's stay at home and have a lie in. What a poseur.

tedshred · « **Reply #711 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:40:35 pm »

Thanks for that Titanium and bacon wheels man.

How are you getting to Greenwich on Saturday ?

Carlosfandango · « **Reply #712 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:45:02 pm »

I was hoping you could give me a lift in your mini person carrier. Looks like I'll have to drive myself now.

tedshred · « **Reply #713 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:47:27 pm »

It's all becoming clear now:

"Oh Ted please come, we'll miss you if you're not on the ride"

meaning

"Oh Ted, how are we travelling if you and Tippers aren't going to be there ?"

Carlosfandango · « **Reply #714 on:** 05 April, 2016, 05:50:58 pm »

Exactly, you two only think about yourselves, you're all rapha underwear and new radiators.

jiberjaber · « **Reply #715 on:** 05 April, 2016, 06:00:49 pm »

Looks like that BB90 is a issue on all of the Trek Madone and Domaine bikes from a quick search of t'internet.

I've got BB86 on the Rose and from looking at the BB references, it's similar but with some internal cups, so if the bearing seizes its the cups that take the wear not the frame itself.

http://problemsolversbike.com/files/tech/Bottom_Bracket_Standards_Reference.pdf

The BB90 appears to be a direct interference fit to the carbon frame, so if it seizes or gets notchy (i.e. the bearings start to drag) its likely to rotate in the frame and start to wear the carbon, the V2 looks to be a slightly oversized bearing to get a better interference fit once the originals have worn the frame a bit.... not a good engineering design!

If you do stick the V2 in as an interim to get you going, my Rose came lathered in thick grease (like old treacle car grease if you know what I mean) on the outer surfaces of the BB bearings which might give you some protection from ingress of muck etc...

You can get bearings with different shields which might slow down the ingress and deterioration but it wont cure the problem and will still be a consumable part.
http://www.astbearings.com/bearing-closures.html

You might be better thinking about a replacement BB solution to remove the issue all together Ted? Where's BFC when you need him???

Some guys have been through 3 warranty claims on frames apparently according some reports...

http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=40004&t=12672607&p=15861080&hilit=madone+bb90+bearing#p15861080
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=587645
http://www.braveheartfund.co.uk/Community/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12204

jiberjaber · « **Reply #716 on:** 05 April, 2016, 06:01:13 pm »

Quote from: Carlosfandango on 05 April, 2016, 05:50:58 pm

Exactly, you two only think about yourselves, you're all rapha underwear and new radiators.

You missed the baggy pub shorts.....

BFC · « **Reply #717 on:** 05 April, 2016, 06:39:22 pm »

If any damage by water ingress has occurred on standard bearings it would be better to try to source something better. The BB90 bearings are variants of standard 6805 - these have a 25mm inner diameter and require the shimano plastic bush to pad out the 24mm crank axle. Upgrade options include stainless steel versions which don't rot at the first hint of moisture, or Phil Wood replacements which are much better quality than any standard or SS parts. Ceramic bearings don't make sense for BBs (or any other bike bits) - they are recommended for high speed low load applications.

Damage to bearings often occurs during fitting or removal - the bearing should only be pressed in with force on the outer bearing shell, never on its center. Removal often can only be achieved with force/impact on the center, if this is the case the removed bearings are scrap even if there were OK before the removal. The bike shop that fitted the bearings last time may have damaged them during installation.

Loctite engineering adhesives cover a range of options for bonding into a damaged shell - range includes screwlock (weakest) through nutlock to stud and bearing fix (strongest) with gap filling options for bigger gaps. The strongest version is permanent and difficult to service, it is aimed at industrial and automotive applications, only way to break the bond is heating.

Oscar's dad · « **Reply #718 on:** 05 April, 2016, 06:46:45 pm »

Blimey! Clever isn't he! I'm impressed!

Oscar's dad · « **Reply #719 on:** 05 April, 2016, 06:57:09 pm »

Just a thought, how come tippers hasn't had BB problems with his Trek?

BFC · « **Reply #720 on:** 05 April, 2016, 07:50:32 pm »

Anyone looking for replacement bearings for bikes - look beyond the bike shops/websites. There are lots of industrial bearing suppliers that deal direct with the public.

For the BB bearings 37mm OD, 25mm ID, 7mm width the base part number is 6805 or 61805. A suffix of RS or 2RS for rubber seals gets a standard off the peg bearing with options from recognized manufacturers. A prefix of W specifies stainless steel, usually intended for food industry. The 25mm inner will require the shimano plastic bush from a scrap shimano BB or equivalent to reduce the inner to 24mm for standard axle.
Type W68052RS into a search engine, or go to a bearing company website - simplybearings.co.uk come in at £8.07 plus VAT each plus p&p.
On simply bearing website they also sell enduro cycle bearings, including 37.1mm oversized units.

Then all you need is a 37mm bearing press adaptor to avoid killing the bearing when fitting, or trust a bike shop to do it properly?

All of my bikes are traditional threaded BBs with BSA threadings- I have decided not to buy bikes because they are fitted with press fit or Italian threaded BBs when looking at the detailed spec.

Tomsk · « **Reply #721 on:** 05 April, 2016, 08:04:20 pm »

Hope might do something suitable? The BB86 replacement for Bernardette [the Genesis Day One Fixie] has been fine - a million times better than the original creaky Shimano press fit. The Hope unit is screwed together internally.

jiberjaber · « **Reply #722 on:** 05 April, 2016, 08:44:42 pm »

There's a bearing shop in Maldon iirc from when I used to buy helicopter bearings

tedshred · « **Reply #723 on:** 05 April, 2016, 08:51:24 pm »

As far as I understand it, the BB90 is only found on the Domane and Madone.

You can get a converter for BB30s from Praxis which looks good and there are various options for BB30s and BB86s but I am not sure that anyone has thought it worthwhile to do something for such a relatively limited market as the BB90.

I will apply plenty of waterproof grease and keep taking the cranks off until such time as they inevitably fail and then I will look to make a claim against the lifetime frame warranty...

Incidentally, the BB90 is £34 a pop which makes it even harder to swallow.

jiberjaber · « **Reply #724 on:** 05 April, 2016, 08:55:13 pm »

£34 for 2bearings???