Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => Rides and Touring => Topic started by: jackb on 15 June, 2018, 03:09:46 pm
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Hi,
In October, I am going on this www.freewheelholidays.co.uk/cycling-holidays-italy/venice-porec (http://www.freewheelholidays.co.uk/cycling-holidays-italy/venice-porec) cycling holiday and was wondering how best to get my bike there given I don't drive, anyone have any ideas or a similar experience?
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Ride there.
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Fly? Mestre is where Venice Marco Polo airport is. You can ask the hotel to keep your box/bag pending your return.
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Even if you could drive, Venice is a long way. Flying would be by far the most convenient. If you don’t have a bike box, go to a bike shop and ask them for one of the big cardboard boxes new bikes come in. You may need to disassemble your bike a bit (wheels, mudguards, pedals, turn handlebars). The outstanding issue is getting yourself and bike box to/from airport by public transport.
Getting there by ferry and train is doable also but that’s an adventure in itself.
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Venice is actually quite easy by train.
Eurostar to Brussels.
Belgian IC to Welkenraedt
cycle 11km to Aachen Hauptbahnhof
regional train to Cologne
Austrian nighttrain from Cologne to Munich (or Innsbruck)
Austrian daytrain from Munich (or Innsbruck) to Venice.
I would prefer this option.
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Sleeper train from Paris to Venice is also a very pleasant journey.
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Fly there. Hire a bike.
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Cost of taking a bike can be as much as hiring a bike, depending on airline. So bike hire may be best option. Just remember brakes other way round. You can usually take your iwn pedals and have them fitted. If the seat tube fits you may even be able to take your own saddle with you to fit.
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Sounds a very nice trip btw.
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Venice is actually quite easy by train.
Eurostar to Brussels.
Belgian IC to Welkenraedt
cycle 11km to Aachen Hauptbahnhof
regional train to Cologne
Austrian nighttrain from Cologne to Munich (or Innsbruck)
Austrian daytrain from Munich (or Innsbruck) to Venice.
I would prefer this option.
You can actually do a slightly better version that doesn't require the 11km ride to Aachen.
Take the Eurostar direct to Amsterdam, then from Amsterdam you have a choice of either a train to Arnhem, then the regional train to Dusseldorf for the train to Munich,
Or you can take the Berlin train, and change at Osnabruck, then on to Köln, and follow Ivo's route.
Hmm, thinking about it further. There is one slow train a day from Brussels direct to Basel via Luxembourg. So Eurostar to Brussels, then Brussels to Basel, then Basel to Innsbruck, Innsbruck to Venice. It may work better on timing to get the train from Basel to Zurich, then Zurich to Innsbruck. If you're in no rush, and want to enjoy your journey as much as your destination, between Zurich and Innsbruck get off at "Buchs" and cycle across the border to Liechtenstein. Have a coffee in the Capital Vaduz, then take the fantastic climb into the centre of the country via Steg to Malbune. Have lunch there, then descend back down to Buchs, to continue your journey. Liechtenstein is a fantastic place to visit. It's like a bitesize Switzerland. Does nice wine, which they don't seem to export. (Useless trivia, worlds largest exporter of false teeth...)
Long distance EU trains that accept bikes are not as common as they were, the High speed trains don't like you taking a bike. But there are a few trains each day that do accept bikes. (IC8/9 Hamburg<->Zurich for example). The Bahn.de planner has a useful "bike space required" option, that will only give you routes that accept bikes. Tho it can get a bit confused by some Benelux combos due to NS putting incorrect info in their system. (Officially you can carry a bike on the Brussels<->Amsterdam Slow train, but in the system it's marked as only between Brussels<->Essen, and Rosendaal<->Amsterdam, which confuses the planner).
This is my primary reason for my new bike being an S&S coupled bike. Means I can box it up and get on an ICE train, makes travel a lot easier.
J
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As I said, getting there by train is an (enjoyable) adventure by itself.
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You don’t really need to get S&S couplings if it’s just travel by train. Some friends of mine got a couple of ‘bike bags’ made from lightweight nylon into which they put their bikes into when on the train, which then fold up and go into their panniers once on the road.
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It is very difficult to get a normal-sized bike into a Eurostar-sized (max. 85cm length) package. It is pretty easy to do so with S&S couplers, Ritchey Breakaway or a Moulton.
TGVs and other European trains are easier to pack for (max. 120x90cm bag) but mudguards still have to come off unless you have S&S couplers.
We regularly travel to various parts of France by train with bikes and still have to select how we get to Hamburg in August. Using the Thalys means that bagging is needed even if you spend the money to put your bike on Eurostar ready-to-ride. Some TGVs and sleeper trains accept ready-to-ride bikes.
https://www.seat61.com/Italy.htm and https://www.seat61.com/bike-by-train.htm are useful if you don't want to fly. I'd tend to fly to Italy, given the time and cost needed to get there by surface travel.
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Hire a bike box and fly. When I went to GC last year I hired a box for £60 and flew there. No hassle or dramas, takes about 20 minutes to put the bike together/take it apart.
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Remove the wheels and pedals, turn the handlebars, and get the bike shrink wrapped for 12.50.
https://www.heathrow.com/airport-guide/terminal-facilities-and-services/bag-wrapping
You'll need some bubble wrap to pack the wheels against the bike before shrink wrapping.
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Remove the wheels and pedals, turn the handlebars, and get the bike shrink wrapped for 12.50.
https://www.heathrow.com/airport-guide/terminal-facilities-and-services/bag-wrapping
You'll need some bubble wrap to pack the wheels against the bike before shrink wrapping.
But make sure you can do the same thing for the return trip from Venice or you could end up looking a bit silly. When I organised a little welsh tour for the RCTL (8 years ago) one of the chief worries that could have scuppered the ride was making sure we had storage for our bike boxes for the return trip.
On the subject of boxes from cycle shops make sure they fit under the oversize scanner. Ours came from Decathlon and needed shortening to go through the system at Liverpool. One had not been shortened and the scanner operator very kindly hand-inspected it but that involved opening it up and the tape for reclosing it was in another box that had already gone through the system.
Bike boxes can be carried a certain distance to suitable storage folded into three and slung over the back with long luggage straps. I think the record for this is over 50kms (but that's Dominic and Lucien, they're a bit "special")
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Remove the wheels and pedals, turn the handlebars, and get the bike shrink wrapped for 12.50.
https://www.heathrow.com/airport-guide/terminal-facilities-and-services/bag-wrapping
You'll need some bubble wrap to pack the wheels against the bike before shrink wrapping.
But make sure you can do the same thing for the return trip from Venice or you could end up looking a bit silly.
Also shrink wrapping leaves the rear mech vulnerable unless removed and taped inside frame, and dropouts need spacers. Oh and baggage handlers. Hire a proper bike box.
ETA you can leave the box at the airport.
http://www.veniceairport.it/en/at-the-airport/left-luggage-and-porter-service.html
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It's a linear your so how does he get a proper box from one end to the other?
I've traveled plenty with cardboard boxes and always been fine, bit then I tend to do a bit more packing than the norm: I remove and tape the rear mech, and fit something between the dropouts.
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At Heathrow:
Charges
Left luggage prices
Duration Price per item
0 - 3 hours £7.50
3 - 24 hours £12.50
24 - 48 hours £20
48 - 72 hours £27.50
72 hours plus an additional £5 for each 24 hours thereafter
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Gatwick- Venice return on easyjet, get a cardboard bike box from a bike shop free at each end (£70 return for the bike); done this sort of thing many times
otherwise just get completely in the machine and hire one of their bikes?
It's a linear your so how does he get a proper box from one end to the other?
it's a ferry back from Porec (flying back from Pula on the advertised itinerary sounds improbable but he might as well go all the way back to Gatwick from there if possible as otherwise he's going to be stung another night in Mestre; but they don't fly every day)
you used to be able to get a pretty sturdy compact bike bag from Decathlon; it looked good and went into a small rucksack but prolly didn't give any more protection than the CTC clear version; worth looking for as it can go with you on the bike and gives you instant packing at the airport 10 min from arrival to check in.
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Taking bikes via eurostar is an absolute nightmare. If you don't get one of the extremely limited on board bike storage places you have to get it couriered, and there's no guarantee it'll be at the station when you arrive. They ask you set aside 24 hours before you can get your velo back. And the whole enterprise costs another £50.
It's such a joke, I ended up losing patience with trying to figure it out and just booked a ferry instead. No extra fee, friendly chap on the phone telling me I'll be able to lock it up on board, I'll be the first to roll off the ferry, and it's less than 1/3 the cost of the train. Marvellous.
In your position I'd just treat myself to a Pinarello or Bianchi for the duration of the trip via hire.
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We take bikes on Eurostar several times each year. Sometimes we take the ready-to-ride option, occasionally pre-booking but usually potluck. Never had a delay in getting our bikes back (edit - wrong, once when we were on the last train of the day) but you have to hand over the bikes 90 minutes before boarding, which is a pain. Sometimes the bikes are transported on a train before us.
Otherwise we pack our Moultons, S&S bikes or Bromptons into sub-85cm lightweight bags and take them on board with us. We've not yet chosen the dismantle into Eurostar's box option but it doesn't look difficult if you don't have low-rider racks and suchlike fitted.
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On the blurb it suggests that the price includes bike hire, although with a city style 3x9 speed bike. Given the distances are relatively short, why not just take your saddle?
Cost of taking a bike can be as much as hiring a bike, depending on airline.
BA consider sports equipment part of your luggage, when travelling I use the CTC clear bag http://www.wiggle.co.uk/ctc-cycling-uk-plastic-bike-bag on the basis that it looks like a bike and will tend to get handled properly, I've never had any damage. It's light enough to carry around with you, so if you have a 13Kg bike you have weight to spare when it comes to luggage, as you can carry on panniers. Normally, 23Kg is enough, if you are carrying everything with you. Again, as these folks seem to move your luggage for you, maybe they can move a bike box? Frankly, most are still more cumbersome than a plastic bag, though.
Only once had random snottiness checking in my panniers as well "Only ONE piece of luggage" but they relented when I said, OK, I'll just carry it on.... I carry light nylon straps to bind the two panniers together making it easier to carry and to check in.
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I got that snootiness on my flight over the Atlantic with TAP last week. I ended up running round the airport to get then bound together with plastic (the nearby stall for doing this being closed) and all while already running late due to check-in throwing a 20 minute spasm when I turned up with a US tourist visa rather than an ESTA. It rather rankled when I'd already had to pay €100 for the bike though my entire luggage setup weighed less then the limit. Not impressed with TAP!
All the short haul European carriers such as Ryanair, easyJet, Jet2 are fine though. You have to pay a few quid for the bike but from then on it's a stress-free experience.
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Gatwick- Venice return on easyjet, get a cardboard bike box from a bike shop free at each end (£70 return for the bike); done this sort of thing many times
otherwise just get completely in the machine and hire one of their bikes?
It's a linear your so how does he get a proper box from one end to the other?
it's a ferry back from Porec (flying back from Pula on the advertised itinerary sounds improbable but he might as well go all the way back to Gatwick from there if possible as otherwise he's going to be stung another night in Mestre; but they don't fly every day)
you used to be able to get a pretty sturdy compact bike bag from Decathlon; it looked good and went into a small rucksack but prolly didn't give any more protection than the CTC clear version; worth looking for as it can go with you on the bike and gives you instant packing at the airport 10 min from arrival to check in.
In our experience bike shops don't get delivered every day and most don't have the space to keep large lumps of waste cardboard. Checking which day of the week is delivery day and/or negotiating can be worthwhile activities.
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On the blurb it suggests that the price includes bike hire, although with a city style 3x9 speed bike. Given the distances are relatively short, why not just take your saddle?
Cost of taking a bike can be as much as hiring a bike, depending on airline.
BA consider sports equipment part of your luggage, when travelling I use the CTC clear bag http://www.wiggle.co.uk/ctc-cycling-uk-plastic-bike-bag on the basis that it looks like a bike and will tend to get handled properly, I've never had any damage.
thanks; useful to know. The BA website says "recognised bike bag or box" so I've always used a proper padded bag or a Halfords box (for one way trips)
and yes I always do the *panniers / Caradice as cabin baggage" thang.
BA have been threatening to charge for bikes for several years now but thankfully they are still free; made a very big difference on my last US trip (compared to eg Delta who charged £85 each way)
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Ham said:
BA consider sports equipment part of your luggage, when travelling I use the CTC clear bag http://www.wiggle.co.uk/ctc-cycling-uk-plastic-bike-bag on the basis that it looks like a bike and will tend to get handled properly, I've never had any damage.
BA flying out of the US says there is no additional cost on Premium Economy (the only way to fly over the pond IMO) to carry a bike as long as it does not exceed the 51 lb limit and the bike is no longer than 6' 3".
I like the clear bag versus my bike box (which box becomes an issue for leaving it at Heathrow) but wonder if the clear bag will pass muster with the airport check-in people?
On the other hand, I would rather like the bike to arrive at the other end in one piece and undamaged so a somewhat fragile - ie. no protection - plastic bag would seem to be counter intuitive to that end. As another poster commented: 'Baggage handlers'!
Karla, you've been over lately, what was your experience?
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Ham said: BA consider sports equipment part of your luggage, when travelling I use the CTC clear bag http://www.wiggle.co.uk/ctc-cycling-uk-plastic-bike-bag on the basis that it looks like a bike and will tend to get handled properly, I've never had any damage.
BA flying out of the US says there is no additional cost on Premium Economy (the only way to fly over the pond IMO) to carry a bike as long as it does not exceed the 51 lb limit and the bike is no longer than 6' 3".
I like the clear bag versus my bike box (which box becomes an issue for leaving it at Heathrow) but wonder if the clear bag will pass muster with the airport check-in people?
On the other hand, I would rather like the bike to arrive at the other end in one piece and undamaged so a somewhat fragile - ie. no protection - plastic bag would seem to be counter intuitive to that end. As another poster commented: 'Baggage handlers'!
Karla, you've been over lately, what was your experience?
Out of interest, looking around to see if I could find negative reports of the CTC bag, I came across this page (http://travellingtwo.com/resources/flying-with-a-bicycle-in-a-plastic-ctc-bag) which is interesting not just for the pictures but the comments. That includes one from a real actual baggage handler that discussed the issue with his mates at work with the conclusion posted below for convnience
OK, hopefully a definitive answer! We only operate from a small regional airport (Newquay, Cornwall) but I have a colleaguee who has worked at larger airports which use the container boxes used on the larger jets.
Cardboard Box: Will offer more protection but the consensus is, some baggage handlers will not even consider what might be in there and just handle more firmly (throw!), with also the chance of bags been placed on top. Not ideal.
Hard Case: The perfect answer but no good for the touring cyclist. Unless returning to the same airport on departure and it can be stored there.
Padded Bag: Again falls into the same category as the case. I had my bike in a padded bag and it still got a dent in the frame, luckily steel so only cosmetic damage.
CTC Clear Plastic Bag: The overhaul agreement is, if we know what it is, it would be treated with some care. All attempts would be made to place the bike on top of bags in a cargo hold last. Ideally suggested to pad the front dropouts (rag/pipe insulation) and protect the rear mech. The Dash, ATR, CRJ etc…. (regional) type aircraft, it is easier for the handler to stand the bike up once bags are in. The bike is then seen first by the handler on landing. If the aircraft is a CRJ, 737 or A320 type then a baggage belt will be used. If so the bike will generally be placed on it, it could get knocked, belts are not particularly wide but are slow, so not really a concern. It would also be prudent when travelling to or from some countries or continents (Africa) to remove everything (pump, lights etc..) that looks Gucci! it will go walk about otherwise!
Aircraft types been; Dash series, ATR, CRJ series, generally all smaller regional aircraft and 737 to Airbus A320 size. These are all hand loaded, no containers. 757-767-777 and up, A300, A330, A340 and up all containered aircraft.
Container aircraft the bike will be placed on top of the bags in the container, if they can see it is a bike it generally will be treated accordingly. If it is in a box it might be forced into a smaller opening or placed in first and bags placed on top. Then you are looking at something like 500-700kg pushing down on the box/bike, not ideal!
As with anywhere human nature can take its toll!
I hope this insight helps.
FTR, when Iasked have I removed some air from the tyres, I just lie use alternative facts and say "yes" as an extra 10 psi will not cause any issue.
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Seems the hard case box is the best choice if one can find a less expensive way to store it and if the plan is to return to the same airport, otherwise the clear bag is the most practical for touring but the potential for damage sounds very iffy. The baggage handlers at US airports are not know for their considerate handling and if the bike were to be sent down the chute onto the turntable, then I can see a potential there for damage since the handlers always throw the bags down the chute.
A solution is still elusive.
Thanks for the info.
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.... if the bike were to be sent down the chute onto the turntable, then I can see a potential there for damage since the handlers always throw the bags down the chute.
A solution is still elusive.
Thanks for the info.
FWIW, my experience is that it is always delivered at the bulky luggage handling, never onto the belt. No guarantee, obv. The dynamic appears to be that it is easier for the handler to hold it like they would a bike, via some combination of top tube, saddle, handlebars, than it is to find a new, awkward way eg using seat stay, wheels or whatever. That leads to it being managed like they would a bike rather than an odd shaped, heavy object.
In contrast to the delivery, I have sometimes at Heathrow had to put it onto a belt (the "bulky object belt") on check-in, to be swept off to an uncertain place in the bowels. No idea of the capacity for damage there, but given that it is a bulky object belt, you have to imagine there won't be a drop at the other end. Other airports, you walk it to the bulky bar.
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Well, I think I'll give the clear bag a go, for touring it may be the best option, so I'll order it.
Thanks again.
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The dynamic appears to be that it is easier for the handler to hold it like they would a bike, via some combination of top tube, saddle, handlebars, than it is to find a new, awkward way eg using seat stay, wheels or whatever. That leads to it being managed like they would a bike rather than an odd shaped, heavy object.
As a rider of odd-shaped heavy objects, and who occasionally has to deal with helpy people grabbing them in completely inappropriate places[1] when manhandling them through railway infrastructure and the like (no air travel as yet), I'd say this makes very good sense. People generally know what to do when they come to lift a conventionally shaped bike, but take away that cue and they'll grab it by the first bit that looks like you can grip it, with no consideration for balance points or a particular part's ability to bear weight.
[1] Cranks, non-structural chainguards, lights, GPSes, all sorts.
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Karla, you've been over lately, what was your experience?
See the minor rant in my last post!
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Concerning the plastic clear bag, the opinion of those who have transported bikes overseas - particularly to the PBP - is that this is a no-go and buying a cardboard box at each end and discarding same makes more sense if the bike is to arrive undamaged. These boxes cost $40 on-line this end and I don't know yet how I would arrange to pick up a box in Britain, but it is a consideration.
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Yanks tend to be paranoid about using anything that isn't an absolutely bombproof hardcase. I've used everything from a padded bike bag to cardboard boxes to unpadded bags and flown bikes to four continents. I'm a fan of unpadded bags but I don't use fragile bikes and figure lost paint is regretable but nothing more.
Cardboard boxes are generally free from bike shops, particularly if pre-arranged.
How you pack your bike is key, regardless of the outer packaging. Bubblewrap can be powerful magic.
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Forty dollars, really? Bike shops are usually only to please to get rid of them. I've scored free boxes in four countries, and only had to pay in one other - when the hire shops in Morzine had had flood damage and wanted to keep their voices for selling used bikes at the end of the season. I still got one for 20 Euros though.
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Thanks Karla and Little Wheels, I read you comments, called my favourite bike shop and they will keep a box for me that their bikes come in, so free!! ;D ;D ;D ;D
And I expect I will probably be able to do the same thing the other end.
Lots of bubble wrap, got it. :thumbsup:
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Concerning the plastic clear bag, the opinion of those who have transported bikes overseas - particularly to the PBP - is that this is a no-go and buying a cardboard box at each end and discarding same makes more sense if the bike is to arrive undamaged.
Out of interest and given the factors discussed, is this based on any experience? The cardboard box option, whilst being visually satisfying, appears to me to be the worst choice, offering no real protection from being slung around and squashed, yet being bulky and awkward and demanding more disassembly.
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Out of interest and given the factors discussed, is this based on any experience?
None what so ever, but the respondents have travelled across the pond extensively - mainly to the PBP - so their experience with shipping bikes is far superior to mine and unless and until I get more feed back on the value of the clear bags, I have to go with what I know.
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Out of interest and given the factors discussed, is this based on any experience? The cardboard box option, whilst being visually satisfying, appears to me to be the worst choice, offering no real protection from being slung around and squashed, yet being bulky and awkward and demanding more disassembly.
I used a CTC plastic bag for a Gatwick -> Salzburg flight last year without any problems, however the baggage throwers at Salzburg managed to stack a rather large bag on top of my bike on the way back bending the derailleur hanger slightly. :-/ Suppose I should maybe invest in something like the Bopworz derailleur guard for future trips?
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OMG no, that looks like it would make things worse! You have to take the back wheel out so having that thing only makes it more likely the frame will be bent (by compression). It is probably useful when transporting with the back wheel in place.
What you need is one of the spacers that come with new frames. And another for the forks. And take the derailleur off, wrap in bubble wrap, tape or zip tie to the chainstay. That way your hanger is less likely to be damaged.
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Out of interest and given the factors discussed, is this based on any experience? The cardboard box option, whilst being visually satisfying, appears to me to be the worst choice, offering no real protection from being slung around and squashed, yet being bulky and awkward and demanding more disassembly.
I used a CTC plastic bag for a Gatwick -> Salzburg flight last year without any problems, however the baggage throwers at Salzburg managed to stack a rather large bag on top of my bike on the way back bending the derailleur hanger slightly. :-/ Suppose I should maybe invest in something like the Bopworz derailleur guard for future trips?
Would this be prevented by simply detaching the derailleur? (I think you can tape it to the frame without breaking the chain or doing any other drastic things - we're just talking about 1 bolt, 1 allen key. I think ... I've never done this!)
i.e. And take the derailleur off, wrap in bubble wrap, tape or zip tie to the chainstay. That way your hanger is less likely to be damaged.
I'd be amazed if no bike-in-a-clear-bag had ever been damaged. But I've seen hardly any such stories - whereas stories abound about the other methods.
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What you need is one of the spacers that come with new frames. And another for the forks. And take the derailleur off, wrap in bubble wrap, tape or zip tie to the chainstay. That way your hanger is less likely to be damaged.
The plastic spacers were't enough to stop the hanger on my steel MTB being well and truly bent out of shape on the outward trip to Thailand in March. Whatever happened must have been of significant force to actually close up the axle slot (rectified by a security guard's metal truncheon at Bangkok airport with comic consequences).
From now on I'll be using old hubs in front and back.
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OMG no, that looks like it would make things worse! You have to take the back wheel out so having that thing only makes it more likely the frame will be bent (by compression). It is probably useful when transporting with the back wheel in place.
I'm assuming this was a response to my posting mentioning the Bopworx? If so then I'm very curious as to why you think the rear wheel needs to be removed to use it?
(https://www.bopworx.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/r/e/rear_derailleur_guard_in_use_1.jpg)
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The back wheel needs to be removed to allow compact packing in most circumstances IME. It's also less likely to incur damage BUT, as said, the rear mech should be removed and the rear stays reinforced.
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The back wheel needs to be removed to allow compact packing in most circumstances IME. It's also less likely to incur damage BUT, as said, the rear mech should be removed and the rear stays reinforced.
The rear wheel doesn't need to be removed for using the CTC plastic bag in my experience, and certainly not if you're flying a 406-wheeled recumbent! However protecting the derailleur hanger from getting bent does seem to be required.
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The rear wheel doesn't need to be removed for using the CTC plastic bag in my experience, and certainly not if you're flying a 406-wheeled recumbent! However protecting the derailleur hanger from getting bent does seem to be required.
I had a look at the Bopworks derailleur guard you linked to and that would have been snapped off/bent instantly (and take your rear mech with it) under the force that bikes sometimes experience by baggage handling in my (bitter) experience.
Imagine your bike being dropped from the aircraft hold onto the tarmac, or having a couple of tons of stuff piled on top. That's what I plan for these days.
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Yes @Matt you can remove the mech and tape it to the chainstay without having to break the chain. I'm amazed anyone doesn't tbh - leaving it on is playing with fire IMO
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What do people with S&S couplings do? I have them. In the past I've cut up cardboard boxes to make a box of the desired size. I've tried to make the box crush-proof with lengths of plastic pipe but it's never really worked. So I try to protect the frame with clothing etc.
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I got my S&S bike for PBP99 (cut up cardboard box) and got the soft case a couple of years later. Padding the frame tubes, axles, etc. is key to keeping paint in place. Some toestraps or big zipties can be useful to keep the pieces in the right relative positions. S&S do velcro tube padding that is good stuff but expensive.
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S&S make several hard cases that are supposed to be quite good. But they are not cheap, all >$400
J
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Well, it's so easy with cases that it doesn't need thinking about. What about the times when cases are not an option?
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S&S hardcases are a pain. There is no 'give' so the packed bike absolutely cannot exceed 26x26x10", which can be tough with a big 700C bike. A softcase is much more forgiving.
The softcase can actually be carried on your back, which helps and the stiffeners can be moved to allow the unloaded bag to pack down a fair bit but not enough to carry on the bike.
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We took bikes on Eurostar last month, including the box option for one bike. A nightmare! I had to remove both front and rear racks and then the purpose-built box was not wide enough to accept the wheels in with the frame. They supplied a second box for the wheels at no extra charge - it seems they are familiar with this problem. Then there was the right pain of putting it back together on a railway platform. There were 4 of us so plenty of people to guard luggage, but I would hate to do it on my own.
For the return trip, we changed our last night’s accommodation from Ghent to Brussels and took the bikes to the station to be transported whole the night before we travelled. They left on the 8pm train, we were on the 11.56 the following day.
The people operating the system were very amenable and supplied kit for our use, but it is a lousy system.
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I’ve used the CTC plastic bag on multiple occasions. I’ve had to argue with check in staff a few times though. The last time I used Nice airport they flat out refused & I had to buy a box (they had them for sale). A few scrapes & minor dings.
I’ve got the soft case for my S&S Nomad, it’s good for transporting the bike but it’s a nightmare to fit the disassembled bike in the case. Allow at least an hour to do this if you are not in regular practice!
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ISTR that the 26" measurement for S&S cases is to cater for some US domestic airline rules. Or is 26" a common limit elsewhere?
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I’ve used the CTC plastic bag on multiple occasions. I’ve had to argue with check in staff a few times though. The last time I used Nice airport they flat out refused & I had to buy a box (they had them for sale). A few scrapes & minor dings.
I’ve got the soft case for my S&S Nomad, it’s good for transporting the bike but it’s a nightmare to fit the disassembled bike in the case. Allow at least an hour to do this if you are not in regular practice!
No connection, obv... ;)
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I’ve used the CTC plastic bag on multiple occasions. I’ve had to argue with check in staff a few times though. The last time I used Nice airport they flat out refused & I had to buy a box (they had them for sale). A few scrapes & minor dings
Funny you should mention Nice. Mattc and I were in Nice when the BA IT fiasco hit last summer.
Our bikes went through BA check-in inside the CTC plastic bags without a hitch. We were at the end of the runway and waiting to take off when the plane was recalled and we cast adrift.
Next day we tried to fly home with Easyjet but the check-in staff insisted the bikes were boxed. Cue mad dash to buy boxes from the customer service depot at the other end of the terminal. By the time we got back to the gate it had closed. It took us two more days to get home. You couldnt make it up....
Top tip: Make sure you know how to remove pedals before travelling with a bike, and that they do actually come off...
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62" is a standard total max. measure and a 700C wheel just fits into a 26" x 26" square.
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With all the conflicting advice flying (::-)) around, I think it'd be best to pack the bike inside the clear bag and put that inside a padded bag and put that inside a cardboard box and put that inside a hard case and rent a freight airplane to fly the whole lot to London for me.
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I’ve used the CTC plastic bag on multiple occasions. I’ve had to argue with check in staff a few times though. The last time I used Nice airport they flat out refused & I had to buy a box (they had them for sale). A few scrapes & minor dings
Funny you should mention Nice. Mattc and I were in Nice when the BA IT fiasco hit last summer.
Our bikes went through BA check-in inside the CTC plastic bags without a hitch. We were at the end of the runway and waiting to take off when the plane was recalled and we cast adrift.
Next day we tried to fly home with Easyjet but the check-in staff insisted the bikes were boxed.
I'll add a possibly significant fact here - BA & Easyjet use different terminals at Nice. (BA's was much nicer.) Possibly different baggage handlers? Or
Top tip: Make sure you know how to remove pedals before travelling with a bike, and that they do actually come off...
Airport luggage assistance have a toolkit with the right allen key - sadly it bent before actually undoing my pedals :facepalm: in my defence, your pedals can stay on with the CTC bags!
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62" is a standard total max. measure and a 700C wheel just fits into a 26" x 26" square.
Do you know of any airlines which have a 62" limit? The only one I've checked so far is Easyjet, which says 275 cm, or 108 inches, or 9 feet. That's colossal - you could have a 4 ft x 3 ft x 2 ft box. Big enough for a bike which doesn't have couplers.
https://www.easyjet.com/en/help/baggage/cabin-bag-and-hold-luggage
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Plenty of airlines have a 62" limit, if you don't want to pay the oversize baggage or sporting equipment premium. I don't just fly within this continent.
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If buying the cycling charge means that I receive 20-30kilos of extra luggage allowance for some 30-40 Euro's, I gladly pay it.
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I notice Flixbus say you can take a bike on the bus. Some buses have bike racks. https://www.flixbus.co.uk/travel-tips/bike-travel
Costs £9. Anyone tried it? Maybe some cheap tickets from London to the continent.
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That looks brilliant, though it seems you either need to book well ahead or be fairly flexible. Thanks for the tip!
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The Airlines and Train companies do not want your bike! It is a nuisance to them. So they are not interested in making your life easier if you insist on travelling with it. You can't fight them, as it's their plane or train. I now avoid travelling with my bike as much as possible. My life is so much more pleasant without it. I can stroll through the airport or station with just my hand luggage.
I now wonder why anybody would bother using their own bike, if bike hire is available, it is so much easier. This is a very pleasant low mileage trip and the touring unisex bike they describe would be more than fit for purpose. I would not entertain taking my own bike on this. Personally I could not be bothered.
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The Airlines and Train companies do not want your bike! It is a nuisance to them. So they are not interested in making your life easier if you insist on travelling with it. You can't fight them, as it's their plane or train. I now avoid travelling with my bike as much as possible. My life is so much more pleasant without it. I can stroll through the airport or station with just my hand luggage.
I now wonder why anybody would bother using their own bike, if bike hire is available, it is so much easier. This is a very pleasant low mileage trip and the touring unisex bike they describe would be more than fit for purpose. I would not entertain taking my own bike on this. Personally I could not be bothered.
Hiring a bike wouldn't work for me on most foreign tours. Where would I get a rigid MTB with mudguards, a rear rack that fitted my panniers and 2 bottle cages?
Even if I found one, could I rely on it to take me over all sorts of terrain for hundreds of miles without component failure?
Finally, I really wouldn't fancy doing a long tour on a bike that I wasn't completely sure fitted me well. Could end up being very unpleasant experience.
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I hired a Hybrid [he did mtbs as well] in France last year for a nine day tour. It came equipped with mudguards. rack, bottle cages and panniers. It never missed a beat. He informed me on it's last outing a guy had ridden it to Rome and back. The tour you were asking about is not the kind of tour that would necessitate your own bike. For a long tour arriving at one destination and returned from another hundreds of miles away, I take my own bike. But only because there is no other choice.
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Adenough, that's very fine if your body can cope with a standard setup. A typical hybrid with straight bars would play havoc with my shoulders so no way I'd consider hiring a bike.
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What are the chances of finding a
I hired a Hybrid [he did mtbs as well] in France last year for a nine day tour. It came equipped with mudguards. rack, bottle cages and panniers. It never missed a beat. He informed me on it's last outing a guy had ridden it to Rome and back. The tour you were asking about is not the kind of tour that would necessitate your own bike. For a long tour arriving at one destination and returned from another hundreds of miles away, I take my own bike. But only because there is no other choice.
What are the chances of finding a bike that meets all my requirements in any city I happen to be flying into? Virtually zero.
What happens if I'm flying into and out of different cities or countries? No chance of bike hire.
Even if there was the option of hiring a bike I may well choose to take my own. Usually cheaper and if I've spent months planning a tour, usually at significant cost, I'm not prepared to take the risk of the bike not being up to the task. If my own bike fails then I can blame myself. It's about minimising risk.
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We all worry about our bikes being damaged in transit but few people have stories of serious damage. I once lost track of time in the bar at Stansted and suddenly realised I was looking at my bike through the window, just as it was being offloaded from the flight I was about to miss. The handler lobbed it several yards on to a trolley, breaking one of my carbon saddle rails. Served me right.
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What are the chances of finding aI hired a Hybrid [he did mtbs as well] in France last year for a nine day tour. It came equipped with mudguards. rack, bottle cages and panniers. It never missed a beat. He informed me on it's last outing a guy had ridden it to Rome and back. The tour you were asking about is not the kind of tour that would necessitate your own bike. For a long tour arriving at one destination and returned from another hundreds of miles away, I take my own bike. But only because there is no other choice.
What are the chances of finding a bike that meets all my requirements in any city I happen to be flying into? Virtually zero.
What happens if I'm flying into and out of different cities or countries? No chance of bike hire.
Even if there was the option of hiring a bike I may well choose to take my own. Usually cheaper and if I've spent months planning a tour, usually at significant cost, I'm not prepared to take the risk of the bike not being up to the task. If my own bike fails then I can blame myself. It's about minimising risk.
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Well at the end of the day it's your choice. I was only trying to be helpful.
By the way when I fly usually by Ryanair the bike costs £120 return. Plus I need to take a cab to the airport with the bike at £23. So my budget for a hire bike is £143. I've never paid that much to hire a bike.
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What are the chances of finding aI hired a Hybrid [he did mtbs as well] in France last year for a nine day tour. It came equipped with mudguards. rack, bottle cages and panniers. It never missed a beat. He informed me on it's last outing a guy had ridden it to Rome and back. The tour you were asking about is not the kind of tour that would necessitate your own bike. For a long tour arriving at one destination and returned from another hundreds of miles away, I take my own bike. But only because there is no other choice.
What are the chances of finding a bike that meets all my requirements in any city I happen to be flying into? Virtually zero.
What happens if I'm flying into and out of different cities or countries? No chance of bike hire.
Even if there was the option of hiring a bike I may well choose to take my own. Usually cheaper and if I've spent months planning a tour, usually at significant cost, I'm not prepared to take the risk of the bike not being up to the task. If my own bike fails then I can blame myself. It's about minimising risk.
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Well at the end of the day it's your choice. I was only trying to be helpful.
By the way when I fly usually by Ryanair the bike costs £120 return. Plus I need to take a cab to the airport with the bike at £23. So my budget for a hire bike is £143. I've never paid that much to hire a bike.
That's why it's often cheaper to fly BA or other non-budget airlines - no extra charge for cycles.
Btw you can save a lot by cycling from and back to the airport (as I've done countless times). Just means you have to book suitable first night accommodation.
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Most of the small airports I fly to are only served by budget airlines. I'm not prepared to ride to an airport at 5 in the morning and then start packing a bike up. But that's just me. I do ride back though.
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My experience on this so far is hiring a bike in Salzburg and taking my own to Majorca.
Hiring cost more than taking my own, even taking into account the cost of hire of a bike box, which I didn't have to do as I borrowed one. The easyjet fee is pretty low all told. I've also brought a frameset home from the USA in its delivery box with no issues.
Salzburg, I rang around ahead of time, found a place, when I got there they were set up all for MTB hire, not road bikes. I ended up with a specialised which fit well enough but was not well cared for, was poorer spec than my bike and had very poorly adjusted gears which was the last thing I needed in the mountains.
Majorca, I would have hired, but I was going in the summer and everywhere had said that the busy cycling season ends in May and they are then into maintenance mode. Looking at their ads though, they are well geared up for it. I borrowed the bike box, biggest issue was getting it in the car.
Half an hour reassembly at the other end in thr comfort of the hotel room, and a quick test ride. Then the joy of riding my own bike.
I've not tried with a recumbent yet, but will be taking my Cruzbike on CalMac ferries this summer. They take bikes , but no booking ahead as far as I know.
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When I flew my bike to Sofia I used the small airport of Eindhoven. It cost me € 30,- out and € 30,- back to transport my bike with Wizzair. Transporting the bike in the busses between home and the railway station plus Eindhoven railway station and the airport terminal was no issue at all, no extra charge.
When I fly with my bike I usually check the prices for bike transport first and then the rest.
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I've not tried with a recumbent yet, but will be taking my Cruzbike on CalMac ferries this summer. They take bikes , but no booking ahead as far as I know.
Correct - bikes on Calmac is very easy, we've done it loads of times. The helpful staff will normally tell you where to wait, just be sure you don't upset them by trying to cycle on board instead of walking. We have never booked, and in fact as a foot passenger with bike, you can't actually make bookings on all services.
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Sorry for thread hijack, but in your experience, have hey ever run out of spaces?
I've got a pretty tight schedule of three ferries from Ardrossan to Islay
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The early morning Ardrossan to Brodick ferry can get very busy on a weekend with cyclists doing the '5 ferry challenge'. It is not unheard of to have 100 cyclists making the crossing. I never heard of anyone being turned away but Calmac have a notice that bikes are taken subject to capacity.
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Thanks, I'm planning Friday morning out to Islay, following Monday back. The Monday is the tightest schedule, needing to catch the 0700, hopefully the hotel can do an early breakfast or pack me something
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The Airlines and Train companies do not want your bike! It is a nuisance to them. So they are not interested in making your life easier if you insist on travelling with it. You can't fight them, as it's their plane or train. I now avoid travelling with my bike as much as possible. My life is so much more pleasant without it. I can stroll through the airport or station with just my hand luggage.
I now wonder why anybody would bother using their own bike, if bike hire is available, it is so much easier. This is a very pleasant low mileage trip and the touring unisex bike they describe would be more than fit for purpose. I would not entertain taking my own bike on this. Personally I could not be bothered.
This very much assumes that you're going both ways by plane/train. My next Big Trip™, will involve 1500km to a station, to get a train, ferry, train, train, train, back... I very much doubt 1 way bike hire exists...Not to mention it wouldn't fit me right, it wouldn't have the setup I have tuned on my bike, and getting a frame bag to fit it would be hit and miss...
J
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Fair enough. But my reply was to the OP, who was describing an entirely different situation to the one you are planning.
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Been studying the Ryanair baggage charges. If you buy the cheapest ticket with no baggage extras you can take 2 bags. Your 'Small Personal Bag', up to 35cm x 20cm x 20cm, goes in the cabin. Your 'Larger Bag', not exceeding 10kg and dimensions 55cm x 40cm x 20cm, goes in the hold.
Then you can add a 20 kg bag to go in the hold, for £25 each way. There's no stated limit on the size of this bag, except for a clause saying that for H&S reasons they won't carry anything bigger than 119 x 119 x 81 cm. So I reckon you could put your bike in a plain box, and not tell them there's a bike in it. The usual fee for a bike is £60 each way. Ker-ching! Nowhere does it say in the Ts and Cs that you can't do this.
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Is there a 'sporting equipment' clause somewhere? The odds that *Ryanair* have left a loophole in their T&C's seems... slim.
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There are bicycle clauses and sporting equipment clauses. This dodge relies on them not knowing you have a bicycle. I've read and reread the Ts and Cs umpteen times. It's very odd that there's no size limit for the 20 kg checked bag.
https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/useful-info/help-centre/terms-and-conditions/termsandconditionsar_368204930#section-article-termsandconditionsse_912765800
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I wouldn't want to rely on this; my reading of the T&Cs is that bicycles must be boxed and shipped as such. Trying to ship it as generic oversize baggage works until the check-in person says 'and what's in the box?', at which point you either lie (which in the context of airport security seems unwise, to say the least), or they charge you the non-prebooked bicycle fee. I mean yes, it's ridiculous that boxed bikes are treated differently from random oversize baggage, but it's Ryanair - as the joke goes, they'd charge you for emotional baggage if they could.
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I wonder how that would work for a S&S coupled bike in a case, or a Brompton in a case...
J
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When I'm asked what's in my luggage I say 'bicycle parts'.
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I always seem to fly with a 'mobility aid'. Luckily I walk with a limp, so generally no further questions.
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I had the same question once in a Polish train. Luckily in the bike bag were also my tent, mat and sleeping bag. The guard didn't speak English so I used a broken Russian expression 'touristic material' which can mean anything from indeed a tent to a bike ;).
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This reminds me of uni where I wasn't allowed to keep a bike in my room, but was allowed a unicycle. So I used to store a unicycle and a spare wheel in my room... yet I turn my unicycle into a means to help transport that spare wheel at the door...
J