Humans didn't evolve to ride bikes

[cycleman]

and trike seats are good for carrying bags of shopping  safely and towing trailers is easy behind the trike .  .

[sojournermike]

I was comparing the Moulton using a modified classic road position with a large frontal area (about hip high) to the Beastie (about thigh high) with the riding position that supposedly has power advantages. It obviously doesn't have that power advantage.

Although Obree has an open hip in that position, I'm not sure it's that we'll configured for power - lying on his stomach and not having anything to brace his shoulders against. It's not a conclusive argument for or against an open hip for power.

The Aerovelo hpv is a completely different kettle of fish with some very detailed science and design in both shell and every other detail. It also features a relatively open hip as far as I can see.

As to Auntie Helen's Milan, the claim of 150 watts at c31kph and 200 watts at just over 37kph seems quite efficient.

Mike

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Obree's wasn't the first prone bicycle. They've been raced before with shoulder braces and they aren't fast enough.

[Phil W]

And who hasn't cycled back from the shops with a carrier bag hanging off the bars?

[Mr Larrington]

Obree's wasn't the first prone bicycle. They've been raced before with shoulder braces and they aren't fast enough.

Though Tim Elsdale did win the BHPC unfaired championship one year on one, with his tame gorilla Matt Norman coming second on account of having done fewer races.  And I once saw one of Tim's bikes parked outside Condor, which suggests at least one person was mad enough to ride one on the road.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

http://birdofpreybicycles.ning.com

[mrcharly-YHT]

http://birdofpreybicycles.ning.com

That's a very interesting machine, and very elegant frame. I wonder how comfortable it is for long periods.

[LEE]

http://birdofpreybicycles.ning.com

That's a very interesting machine, and very elegant frame. I wonder how comfortable it is for long periods.

Well it won't win any manoeuvrability competitions.  It has a Tri-bar front end and it seems you can't ride it without elbows on the pads (Hence why everyone looks very wobbly riding it). The frame is gorgeous, looks like something from American Chopper.

Possibly OK if you ride up and down a beach promenade all day (and don't have a full bladder).

[zigzag]

http://birdofpreybicycles.ning.com

i quite like it although it needs to be improved in many ways. not as versatile as a traditional bike, but i would like to give it a go!

[Cudzoziemiec]

I missed the part where the author covered:

- Seeing where the f**k you are going
- Carrying the bike upstairs and onto trains
- Going up and down kerbs

To be fair, most of these are achievable on more normal recumbents.

- Climbing inside a fairing to nip to the shops

See Auntie Helen's blog (or almost every motor car on the road) for an example of a fairing that's practical to climb into to nip to the shops - yes, it's more faffy than throwing your leg over a bike, but that's more than cancelled out by it acting as a container for the shopping, so you don't have to strap things on with special bags.   And you wouldn't do your shopping on a TT bike either.

Auntie Helen is most definitely A Cyclist rather than someone who uses a bike to get to the shops. She's interested in her bike pedal cycle for its own sake not just as a means of reaching a place and she consorts with others who like similar devices. Her velomobile is definitely both practical and fun for her, or you or even me or LEE, but not for Johan Schmidt to get to work in the morning or even for my sister who actually does go shopping by bike (using a detachable wicker basket which she carries round Sainsbury's – I fear she's becoming infected with twee), not to mention that it weighs about 20kg so would be a right pain if you had to haul it up to a third floor flat every day but at the same time you wouldn't want to leave it out overnight because all that fibreglass would prove irresistible to drunks with boots. And you can just imagine the reaction when she takes it to Karl Halford und Sohn for a service: "Was die Pfick ist das?" the mechanics would say, scratching their heads. (I could be wrong about this; it might be der or die Pfick.)

[LMT]

I agree with LEE and mrcharly’s latest post. The article combines that smugness and real-world ignorance typical of pop writing by academics whose views are seldom robustly challenged. Even though it’s a fun topic, that sours the article for me. The diamond frame was not arrived at by chance but by both disruptive and iterative design by scores of outright geniuses. It was found to be essentially perfect and remains so. The UCI has nothing to do with that except its persistence in racing, and in racing you need rules or sport becomes farcical. (I believe the UCI hasn’t been restrictive enough in racing.)

The bicycles found in Amsterdam, China, Paris, my home, etc., have very little to do with the UCI.

WTF?

Egg lost the hour record to Faure, people lobbied the UCI and the rest is history. The modern DF is about as inefficient as you can get for a HPV, so much so that the power needed to go 23mph means 70 watts more DF vs recumbent - essentially perfect? You're 'aving a bath surely.

And given that the 3:1 rule has been lifted I'll be interested to see what happens now in TT's going forward.

[Peter]

The short title of this thread (as shown on the right hand side, under "unread posts") could, sadly, be earth's epitaph!

[Mr Larrington]

My chum Dr Reichert says that it's only hard work getting Eta to go quickly once you're doing more than 120 km/h   Of course no-one's ever going to ride to the pub in anything like that, except possibly for a bet...

[fd3]

In fairness to Obree, that bike was a first attempt at an idea he thought up.  Frankly getting a record with that bike in the time he had to prepare is rather impressive.

[Mr Larrington]

But how much better might he have done after a little homework?  One reason why the Liverpool team have done so well so quickly is because Pat and Ben came and had a look the year before they first entered a bike at Battle Mountain.

[mzjo]

I have come to this thread a little bit late so sorry for that.

I read the article, which seemed to promise a lot, and came to the conclusion that the author simply hadn't learnt the basics, let alone any detailed research. Darwinian evolution implies a lot of failed mutations before the imposition of a successful one, a small fact that he appears to forget. Bicycles don't escape this rule! (nor a lot of other everyday things). Some, even very good, technical changes don't manage to impose themselves - in spite of all the efforts of people like this guy. An example of this is the alternative to the computer keyboard developed in the late 70's or 80's which used 5 keys arranged in the shape of your fingertips. I can't remember what it was called; one of the vets at Gloucester AHO used one and swore by it.

He is a bit off the mark with the Mochet bikes. Guy's son kept making them after his father's death. The ban was a setback but not an end of the affair. A Mochet bike also won the Paris-Limoges road race in I think 1934 although the result was changed after the ban and the entry has disappeared from the records. Another recumbent was the Wonder Véloriz, made in St Etienne, which took part in the Cyclo-tourist trials in 1935 but which was penalized by a weight of around 15kg when the winning machine was just over 10kg (fully equipped!). An evolution which did not impose although Raymond Henry's
history of french cyclotourisme has a photo of a Mochet bike in a group of senior cyclotourists apparently in 1938. (After that came WW2 and then the development of Solexs and 2cvs which could be seen as a different evolutionary direction).

I am of course not using a QWERTY keyboard to write this   

[Quint]

And who hasn't cycled back from the shops with a carrier bag hanging off the bars?

                 Only once, I can't remember what I shouted (Barbara said it was completely unrepeatable) as I saw the baguette fall out of the bag and lurch into the front wheel.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Sliced bread isn't the best thing for you since then?

[Quint]

It was more sort of bread crumbish, flat ones at that, I have an ICE 26 NT now and bake my own bread, it's a damn sight safer oh, and it doesn't realign ones nose either.

[ElyDave]

haven't read the article yet, but the evolution of the recumbent came in handy today as two partridges crossed my path mid flight at just where my head would have been on a conventional bike.  It I thought I was going to be strafed at one point.

[Kim]

haven't read the article yet, but the evolution of the recumbent came in handy today as two partridges crossed my path mid flight at just where my head would have been on a conventional bike.  It I thought I was going to be strafed at one point.

Don't be complacent.  IME it just gives them more target area.