Sportives what are they like compared to Audaxes ?

[keeks]

I ask as I am thinking about giving one a try and curious as to what they are like.

An Audax I find is relaxed but you can push it if you want , but I do get annoyed when I lose my way etc.  Also most of the ones I have been on I might as well have been riding out on my own as the rides are thinly populated.

The distances for Audax I also like. 100k is good to get you back in ,200k is worth the day out and doesn't impact your evening . So these two distances  are covered by Sportives as well ?

Leaving the serious 300k + to Audax or is that to much of an assumption?

[Pete Mas]

I have ridden several Sportifs including the Dragon Ride, The Cheshire Cat and The Burgess Hill Rumble.Each one was slightly different, due to having different organisers.
A feature common to all was a choice of 2 distances, with the longer distance involving an extra loop. You pre-register for a particular distance, but on the day, depending on the weather (sportif riders are fair-weather cyclists? ), or how you are feeling, you can opt for whatever distance you prefer. They all had signed routes, with plenty of marshalls to keep people on course, and were all very popular, with lots of riders to ride with, whatever your preferred pace. Some give you timing chips, so you get exact ride info. Some are more low key -eg Burgess Hill Rumble had no official start at all last year, though the route was well sign-posted and marshalled.Food available also varies, likely to be mainly sweet rather than savoury, and energy drinks and bananas normally available at the feed stations.
If you have a lightweight race bike eg carbon or alloy with carbon forks, sportif rides are a good way to try riding shorter audax distances at a higher pace than you would normally ride an audax, as the numbers of faster riders and ethos of these events encourage you to go faster than on the average audax ride.
The extra organisation and support you receive (eg sag wagons, doctors,  ambulances) translate into more expensive entry fees than what we are used to on more self-supported audax rides.
I can only suggest you have a go at one or two, and don't forget to let the organiser know afterwards if you think their ride could be improved for the following year in any way.

[red marley]

Sportives vary in character hugely, so I would be a little wary of over-generalising. Having said that...

In my experience they tend to be much faster. This is because they will often include some very strong and fast riders (e.g. the 180km Fred Whitton that goes over all the big climbs in the Lake District has been completed in under 5 hours). But also because they tend to be ridden continuously with only the briefest of stops to pick up food, often eaten on the go. Many will tolerate a slower ride (although not the Etape), but there is a bit of "are you sure you belong here?" feeling you go for pootle/cafe stop mode.

As you have already recognised, navigation is usually more obvious on sportives due to marshalling and/or signage. Because they are often shorter and attract more riders, you also have the additional navigational advantage of being able to follow other riders.

Sportives tend to attract a more 'clubby' rider than 'touring' rider, so expect to ride in closer packs with the discipline that involves. Having said that, they can attract a few 'all the gear, no idea' riders who can be a bit of a hazard.

I really can't get worked up about which is 'best' and would recommend you have a go at one for the experience. I do have a personal preference for one over the other, but enjoy riding both.

[Chris S]

I wonder how long it will be before this dissolves into an Audax vs Sportif pissing contest  . Of course - we're all too polite on here  .

It's been a lifelong maxim of mine never to take up any pastime that has "Sport" in the title - which is why I do Audax instead. But I read Cycling Weakly, and judging by the write-ups in there, those who do Sportives all seem to have a good time.

[MSeries]

it's a difficult question to answer since audaxes vary so much as do the rders and I expect sportives do too. I have done one Sportive. The 1994 Etape du Tour. It was nothing like any audax I have even done. It had Mavic neutral service cars, closed roads, thousands of spectators and three cols and a mountain top finish.

[mattc]

In my experience they tend to be much faster.

I think it's worth noting that this isn't purely because the riders are faster and/or trying harder. The other things you mention tend (IMHO) to reduce ride times for no extra effort:

- food stops are streamlined. You can just grab and go, sometimes without putting your bike down, and it's the right food to eat in a hurry.
- bunch riding will always be faster, especially if you find that magic group that rides 3% faster than your normal speed, but not TOO fast uphill
- the navigation thing does speed things up a bit. On Audaxes I often slow down just to get my bearings, recheck the route sheet, look out for a known 'tricky' turning etc. (Then there's stopping at a few junctions to intrepret an ambiguous instruction - these things don't bother me, but they do add to your time overall).

[onb]

I do the Pendle Pedal every year ,I too am hopeless with routefinding ,I have been known to take a wrong turn on a road I know ,I even took a left a few weeks ago when someone was saying right to me (the perils of going deaf)so in that respect signage is really good for me ,I dont fall into opinions for me anything that gets peeps out on bikes is good.There is a go faster get out of my way element in sportives but mostly I have found people very friendly.

[Philip Whiteman]

The other difference is the number of riders entered into an event.  Audaxes do tend to have a smaller populas riding events simply, in part due to the nature of the event and in part due the fact that they are not mass participation exercises.  Audaxes events can include anything from a handful of riders to about 400 (as in the case of George Barker's Cotswold audaxes).  Sportives on the other hand may often cater for a 1000 riders  - though I do feel that saturation of sportives in conjunction to the fees and economic climate mean that they are becoming unsustainable.

Sportives vary hugely in terms of value for  money from downright ripoffs to the fantastically brilliant worth every penny.  Audaxes can vary too but if end up on a duff event, all you loose is a small fee and a day.

As for the routes, it is probably difficult to compare.  I can think of a broad range of sportives that follow very similar routes and reach similar destinations as typical 200km or less audaxes. Some are ridiculously hilly and some are quite flat.  My main concern with mass sportive events comes with some event organisers funnelling lots of riders down narrow lanes. With audaxes that is less of a risk due to fewer riders.  Equally, for the less navigationally savvy, sportives can support riders negotiate the complexities of the rural roads network.

Quite simply, base your judgement on whether you will enjoy the route, what the event organiser provides for your money and whether you will enjoy the day.  I ride both sportives and audaxes and it works for me.

[Si]

So, if you turned up at a sportif on your old Galaxy, with guards and racks and saddle bag, and you were wearing baggies and sadles and had your pipe in your mouth, would you feel really out of place or would there be a few other entrants that took a similar approach (as is common on audaxes where IME you get all sorts)?

[Philip Whiteman]

So, if you turned up at a sportif on your old Galaxy, with guards and racks and saddle bag, and you were wearing baggies and sadles and had your pipe in your mouth, would you feel really out of place or would there be a few other entrants that took a similar approach (as is common on audaxes where IME you get all sorts)?

Funny you should mention that.  I rode a sportive earlier this year and a beardie-bloke did almost just that (minus the pipe and he was riding a Mercian).  If I recall correctly, he held his own, was not deterred by the 'lycra louts' and he packed in a few punches when it became 'sporty'.  My hat went off to him and I quietly smirked at the Audax Haters.

[keeks]

I was kinda hoping it would be like one of those regular running events that aren't as main stream as say the london marathon. So that it attracts the serious runners but also the " not so commited but want to do well types"

Reading the thread sounds like it does . Going to give it a go anyways , but riding through the night up Llanberis pass only then to shoot down the other side barely able to hang on to the bike/brakes as you are shivering , can only ever be done on an Audax ..............which is nice , innit ?

[phil d]

So, if you turned up at a sportif on your old Galaxy, with guards and racks and saddle bag, and you were wearing baggies and sadles and had your pipe in your mouth, would you feel really out of place or would there be a few other entrants that took a similar approach (as is common on audaxes where IME you get all sorts)?

When I did the Wicklow 200 a few years back, I did feel just a little out of place on my steel bike with mudguards (and yes, beard and sandals, too), but once people realised I was just as strong as them going up the hills I found quick acceptance.  A most enjoyable day.

I have done few sportives, but that's more to do with my preferring the 200km distance that is more readily available in audax.

I was kinda hoping it would be like one of those regular running events that aren't as main stream as say the london marathon. So that it attracts the serious runners but also the " not so commited but want to do well types"

That pretty much sums up my limited experience.

[Andrew]

I ride both. In fact, this year I've ridden more sportives than audaxes... but that's a bit smoke and mirrors because there are no audaxes around here!

I digress, the main differences have been covered; speed, signs, marshalls  and feed stops - reflected in the increased cost.  I'll just emphasis that they are different and, imo,  should be treated as such. That's not to say you can't ride a sportive in an audax style (and risk being 'swept up' by the broom wagon!), or indeed vice-versa, just that that's not the point.

There's a hugh buzz from taking part in a big organised event. If you can carry that buzz into your riding and ride in a group, pushing yourself as and when, then it's a real adrenaline rush. And being able to charge through otherwise busy junctions, police holding up cars and waving you through is worth the entrance fee alone! Suffice to say, I've done a 175km sportive far far faster than I'd ever dream of doing an audax and, in complete honesty, far faster than I thought I could!

The last one I rode (Les Copains in Ambert, France) has an absolutely brilliant course. And the organisation was top notch. I had an incredible time. BUT, it wasn't an audax and neither would I ever consider it such. They're different beasts to be enjoyed in their own right.

All I can advise is 'try one'.

 

[StanThomas]

If you like to get on with riding, on a signed route of around 100 miles with food stops included, they're for you. Take a look at the events calendar on Mark Harding's site : http://www.cyclosport.org/events2009.aspx for something that takes your fancy.

[Datameister]

Done both and enjoyed both. Both have more merits than drawbacks, the important thing is to get out on the bike.

I started Audax to 'train' for a Sportive (Etape du Tour last year) but am now moving towards Audax as the way to go, and I loved the whole LEL experience. Where else can you get that sort of multi-day event?

Particularly liked the 'explanation' of the difference from another forum.

"On a Sportive riders pretend they're really racing, but they aren't. On an Audax riders pretend they're not racing (but they all know they really are)   "

Not my personal viewpoint of course.

[Rich753]

The Cumberland challenge sportive has a section with lots of unmarked crossroads, on audax you'd slow down look both ways and proceed to the next one having lost momentum, the CC had marshals on each one waving you through - it was surprisingly wonderful at the end of a hard ride to be able to maintain speed through them.  A minor point but perhaps helpful in telling the difference?

[Hummers]

Interesting you should post this as I have a hankering to give this a go.

H

[Philip Whiteman]

The Cumberland challenge sportive has a section with lots of unmarked crossroads, on audax you'd slow down look both ways and proceed to the next one having lost momentum, the CC had marshals on each one waving you through - it was surprisingly wonderful at the end of a hard ride to be able to maintain speed through them.  A minor point but perhaps helpful in telling the difference?

I rode this event two years ago, it was an excellent event and not one of these profiteering rackets.   Border City Wheelers were brilliant in terms of what they provided.  I would certainly recommend it.   Surplus monies went to charity if I recall correctly.  

[MSeries]

The Cumberland challenge sportive has a section with lots of unmarked crossroads, on audax you'd slow down look both ways and proceed to the next one having lost momentum, the CC had marshals on each one waving you through - it was surprisingly wonderful at the end of a hard ride to be able to maintain speed through them.  A minor point but perhaps helpful in telling the difference?

I rode this event two years ago, and it was certainly an excellent event and not one of these profiteering rackets.   Border City Cycles CC, laid on a brilliant event.  I would certainly recommend it.   Surplus monies went to charity if I recall correctly. 

Border City Wheelers ? I rode with some of them on an Audax, really nice people, I am not surprised they put on a good event. Maybe I'll look into doing this.

[rae]

Funny you should mention that.  I rode a sportive earlier this year and a beardie-bloke did almost just that (minus the pipe and he was riding a Mercian).  If I recall correctly, he held his own, was not deterred by the 'lycra louts' and he packed in a few punches when it became 'sporty'.  My hat went off to him and I quietly smirked at the Audax Haters. 

There was a bloke who did the 07 Etape on something that looked like a shopper.  OK, he'd clearly fiddled with the gears and put some thin tyres on, but it was still a shopper.   He finished as well - all credit to him.   

I've never done an Audax, but people seem to occasionally talk to each other and stuff like that.   On a sportive there's no time for talking - you hardly stop at the "stops" and it is all about the finish time.

[nic]

I can confirm the Cumberland Challenge is a superb ride. Border City Wheelers put on a great show. It has become a yearly ride for me and a few at my club (Lune RCC).

I promised myself that I'll keep riding the event every year until we get good clear weather conditions. This is my 4th CC and certainly not my last. 

[keeks]

hmm that Cumberland Challenge does look good. Damnable thing is I'm in Newcastle the week before . Probably keep that one in mind for next year.