Yet Another Cycling Forum

General Category => The Knowledge => Health & Fitness => Topic started by: T42 on 25 November, 2020, 10:39:58 am

Title: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: T42 on 25 November, 2020, 10:39:58 am
What it says in the title.  Couldn't settle to anything under first lockdown, didn't really recover during the summer and it's twice as bad now. :(
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: arabella on 25 November, 2020, 01:41:54 pm
flibbertigibbet brain!
I used to have to play loud music when I was revising (in the days when I did exams) so that the bits of my brain that would otherwise be distracting me would instead be occupied ignoring the music.
More recently I came across some focus tips (https://psychcentral.com/lib/15-adhd-friendly-tips-to-fire-up-your-focus/), don't see why they wouldn't apply to neurotypicals as well.
Or the advice I was given was to force myself for 5 minutes and then I might find myself deep enough in to keep going.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: L CC on 25 November, 2020, 01:44:48 pm
Standard by-product of anxiety.

Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: citoyen on 25 November, 2020, 02:56:17 pm
Or the advice I was given was to force myself for 5 minutes and then I might find myself deep enough in to keep going.

This sounds like good advice to me - setting smaller, shorter-term targets means you're more likely to hit them, and that in turn might motivate you to gradually build up your ambitions.

I mean, it sounds good in theory, but I am utterly incapable of following this advice myself. Anxiety is definitely part of it.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: T42 on 25 November, 2020, 03:18:30 pm
Or the advice I was given was to force myself for 5 minutes and then I might find myself deep enough in to keep going.

I do that with hills.  Tried it in the workshop, doesn't work.  I've ruined a lot of wood in the last couple of weeks.


Standard by-product of anxiety.

Yes.  The pandemic also coincided with various other worrying occurrences/minor disasters, and when you add going stir crazy on top...
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Greenbank on 25 November, 2020, 03:22:59 pm
Or the advice I was given was to force myself for 5 minutes and then I might find myself deep enough in to keep going.

This sounds like good advice to me - setting smaller, shorter-term targets means you're more likely to hit them, and that in turn might motivate you to gradually build up your ambitions.

I mean, it sounds good in theory, but I am utterly incapable of following this advice myself. Anxiety is definitely part of it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pomodoro_Technique often works for me when I'm stuck.

That or writing a todo list and putting some really easy items on there so you feel there's a sense of progress.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: ScumOfTheRoad on 25 November, 2020, 03:38:18 pm
Plus one for Pomodoro.  I find https://rainymood.com/ helps also.
For me, I would love a website blocker which would block Twitter. I know such things exist, just cant be arsed setting it up.
I have a bad habit of checking Twitter before settling down to any work.

I try to use Toggle for time tracking of projects, and this now has a Pomodoro function. SO you can say 'I am now spening 25 minutes working on Project X'
and you will get a countdown and an alarm when the timer is finished.
I wish Toggle would have a site blocker or a 'Do Not Disturb' function.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: ian on 25 November, 2020, 04:45:03 pm
I always had the attention span of a fruit fly. I buzz from things to things. I'll do 30 seconds here, 30 seconds there, 30 seconds elsewhere, except they overlap, so for instance in the middle of this sentence, I span around on my chair and updated and saved a Powerpoint slide (between elsewhere and except).

There's absolutely no way in god's great creation that I can spend an entire 5 minutes concentrating on a single thing. I would go mental. I don't sweat it though, I figure that's how my brain works, and shit gets done.

(I also sent two emails while writing this.)
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: L CC on 25 November, 2020, 04:52:05 pm
It's fine while shit does get done, but what if it doesn't?

I'm supposed to finish work at 16:30 but at 16:51 I still haven't actually done any of today's ordering.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: T42 on 25 November, 2020, 04:53:12 pm
I'm currently measuring the regression of my concentration in terms of Guardian crosswords.  This time last year I could make a fair showing on the Cryptics, I romped through the Quiptics and did the Quicks for limbering up.  Nowadays it can take up to half an hour to do a Quick, I do the Quiptics on and off over a couple of days (I do do other things in between) and I don't look at the Cryptics.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: ian on 25 November, 2020, 05:08:29 pm
It's fine while shit does get done, but what if it doesn't?

I'm supposed to finish work at 16:30 but at 16:51 I still haven't actually done any of today's ordering.

Well, it does tend to explain while I'll usually be working after 6 pm, but I have enough discipline to put a hard stop at 7pm (as I have the sort of job that doesn't have an endpoint, I could work 24/7 until the end of the time without denting my to-do list). I did buy an enormous whiteboard though. More enormouser than anticipated because I wasn't paying much attention.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 25 November, 2020, 06:06:10 pm
I'm a flibberty gibbet.

No concentration span. Frequently conducting 2-3 conversations (work, online), while 'working' on something else or in a meeting.

Gaps between meetings are often only 30min, which doesn't enable me to fully pick up a work piece (I'm often working on things akin to coding).

Depression destroys me.

Stress from work pressure is fine. Recently took my BP while I was in a very pressured work situation; perfectly normal BP, heart rate mid 50s. So I cope with stress.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: quixoticgeek on 25 November, 2020, 06:10:22 pm
What it says in the title.  Couldn't settle to anything under first lockdown, didn't really recover during the summer and it's twice as bad now. :(

Trouble concentrating is a common symptom of Burnout.

Have you had any time off work since the plague hit? Consider either calling in sick, or taking a few days leave. Rest, and do what ever it is you find relaxing. Maybe go for a bike ride.

J
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Auntie Helen on 26 November, 2020, 05:48:24 am
T42 is a retiree in France stuck to cycling max 1 hour per day and 1km from home, so I suspect it’s a different stress cause.

As much as I am enjoying the quieter life of German lockdown, it does have its stresses. For me, not seeing colleagues (I am WFH, the rest are in the offices) is definitely loosening the bonds and this in a bad way. I think about work more than I should.

I also find my concentration is worse and I seem mentally exhausted by the end of the day - but I’ve done nothing taxing really!
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Chris S on 26 November, 2020, 10:01:25 am
Trouble concentrating is a common symptom of Burnout.

Oh yes! I worked on a pretty intense (complicated database work) project between July and end of October, and I was basically a zombie at the end of it. I took a week off and literally did nothing except actively not work. Even now, I can't concentrate on work for long - before my brain is mush.

But as AH says, I don't think that's T42's issue; I think he has classic Cabin Fever.
#internetdiagnosis.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Asterix, the former Gaul. on 26 November, 2020, 10:02:21 am
Have redecorated the house literally from top to bottom since covid.  And now I have some shelving Mrs A wants done :facepalm:
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: T42 on 26 November, 2020, 10:19:17 am
Agree w. AH & Chris S.  I've done the burnout bit (c.f. Y2K) and it feels different.  With burnout you're delighted to be able to do nothing, though it may be hard at first. With cabin fever, doing nothing sends you up the wall. Oh, there are things to be done around the house but they're all repulsive (e.g. when you're up the wall you can see the dust on top of all the cupboards).

The big laugh is that as of Saturday the lockdown exercise limit goes up to 3 hours in a 20-km radius, and next week the max temperature is forecast as 3°C.  Cardiologist tells me not to go out if it's less than 5°C. :(
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: geraldc on 26 November, 2020, 10:27:27 am
My concentration has got so bad after working from home for 7 months, that the other half insisted I get help. I have an ADHD assessment in 2 weeks...
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: geraldc on 26 November, 2020, 11:57:52 am
The hospital have asked to assess how often these things have occurred over the last 6 months, I'm putting down often or very often to pretty much everything.

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/QByHSN_gyeckUta4b6XvYnT5pPiiCOdp4TvpUpdF8L1zZ-pBjkE6O9uI-CqP7fFixxMFmcfKJDatT0P7ZagySDTVKHtpylq_w4i68M8pey9KbZbpUq0l7J7M9YvC8cwDr57rK4bqpM4=w2400)
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: rob on 26 November, 2020, 01:18:35 pm
The hospital have asked to assess how often these things have occurred over the last 6 months, I'm putting down often or very often to pretty much everything.

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/QByHSN_gyeckUta4b6XvYnT5pPiiCOdp4TvpUpdF8L1zZ-pBjkE6O9uI-CqP7fFixxMFmcfKJDatT0P7ZagySDTVKHtpylq_w4i68M8pey9KbZbpUq0l7J7M9YvC8cwDr57rK4bqpM4=w2400)

We had J assessed when he must have been maybe 7 (?)   It looks like it's a lot easier when you can respond to questions as an adult rather than having to be observed by a professional.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: arabella on 26 November, 2020, 01:55:22 pm
My son got pointed at this neurodiversity pic (https://slpmommyofapraxia.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/d615b55d202d2636629720725d033110-aspergers-autism-gifted-education.jpg) when the uni sent him for a dyslexia test, age 20, same as his bro.  School screenings missed them both. So my brain is probably squiffy - but then I do (didn't this year) audax, so is that necessarily a surprise?  ;D
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: rob on 26 November, 2020, 02:39:30 pm
My son got pointed at this neurodiversity pic (https://slpmommyofapraxia.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/d615b55d202d2636629720725d033110-aspergers-autism-gifted-education.jpg) when the uni sent him for a dyslexia test, age 20, same as his bro.  School screenings missed them both. So my brain is probably squiffy - but then I do (didn't this year) audax, so is that necessarily a surprise?  ;D

Yeah, I've seen that.   J is in the bottom right hand corner - also initially thought to be dyslexia.   It was picked up early enough that we could manage it.   The more we learned the more I recognised my own traits.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Notsototalnewbie on 27 November, 2020, 10:41:28 am
The hospital have asked to assess how often these things have occurred over the last 6 months, I'm putting down often or very often to pretty much everything.

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/QByHSN_gyeckUta4b6XvYnT5pPiiCOdp4TvpUpdF8L1zZ-pBjkE6O9uI-CqP7fFixxMFmcfKJDatT0P7ZagySDTVKHtpylq_w4i68M8pey9KbZbpUq0l7J7M9YvC8cwDr57rK4bqpM4=w2400)

May I ask if this is NHS? I've heard it's tough to get a diagnosis on the NHS.

I've read loads over the last year or so that's made me think I've got ADHD tendencies but can't quite face trying to get help from my GP. I could also answer often or very often to a lot of that though I think I've masked a lot of it most of my life. When I started primary school the teacher made my parents take me for a hearing test because I tuned out things I didn't find interesting so very effectively to the point I couldn't hear the teacher calling my name. The specialist was angry at my mum because 'this child's hearing is perfect' and nothing more was done except to tell me to stop daydreaming.

I can relate to having to have a certain kind of music on in the background to 'occupy' part of my brain while I work (and if it's a really mindless task like unloading the dishwasher or putting away laundry I absolutely can't do it without a really absorbing podcast playing).
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: geraldc on 27 November, 2020, 11:27:00 am
It's through the NHS. Had a chat with my GP. My GP was very sympathetic, we're pretty much the same age, and background, and my GP was telling me how he has some of the traits too, and how when he was a kid, his parents were told not to feed him to try improve his concentration (he never actually told me if he was diagnosed or is on any treatment now though). Then we just exchanged stories about near misses regarding deadlines and exams, and what I'd tried to do about over the years, and he then wrote a letter to the hospital to get me a referral. Then it was a blood test and an ECG, and then a zoom assessment in a couple of weeks. I did look at going private, I think it's about £600 quid to be assessed, and then they hand you back to the NHS.

It's more of a focus regulation issue.  They used to think that kids with ADHD wouldn't have done well in education. eg if you've gone to a good uni, and have a good job etc, you wouldn't have problems concentrating. But now they're reappraising everything. In a book I read, the author states that most people he met who didn't finish their phd write ups, have ADHD. Lockdown and working from home has screwed up a lot of people.  All the strategies I developed over the years to get stuff done, don't work when I'm working from home with a toddler running around. Also getting help is more to help those around me, I'm fine with how I am, it's my wife that suffers.

I'm the same regarding the need for podcasts to do any housework. However the one trait that really rang the alarm bells for me, was when it asked in a book do you feel the need to buy a new notebook for every major project, and then abandon the notebook within a couple of pages.  I have a drawer full of nearly new notebooks.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Butterfly on 27 November, 2020, 11:33:17 am
The hospital have asked to assess how often these things have occurred over the last 6 months, I'm putting down often or very often to pretty much everything.

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/QByHSN_gyeckUta4b6XvYnT5pPiiCOdp4TvpUpdF8L1zZ-pBjkE6O9uI-CqP7fFixxMFmcfKJDatT0P7ZagySDTVKHtpylq_w4i68M8pey9KbZbpUq0l7J7M9YvC8cwDr57rK4bqpM4=w2400)

May I ask if this is NHS? I've heard it's tough to get a diagnosis on the NHS.

I've read loads over the last year or so that's made me think I've got ADHD tendencies but can't quite face trying to get help from my GP. I could also answer often or very often to a lot of that though I think I've masked a lot of it most of my life. When I started primary school the teacher made my parents take me for a hearing test because I tuned out things I didn't find interesting so very effectively to the point I couldn't hear the teacher calling my name. The specialist was angry at my mum because 'this child's hearing is perfect' and nothing more was done except to tell me to stop daydreaming.


That sounds familiar. I answered always or often to most of those. I suspect the reason I don't have a diagnosis is that I work in a job where I can do several things at once - dishwasher, washing machine, supervising homework and cooking tea for example. I read the top third, then the bottom third upwards, then most of the middle - something I do a lot, but would be a bit of a problem in a workplace requiring much written stuff. Not finishing projects isn't an issue as a nanny.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: DuncanM on 27 November, 2020, 11:35:01 am
That's interesting - I sit here surrounded by notebooks (and the garage/loft is full of unfinished projects and I never completed my PhD, and the only way I could study was with music on)!
I guess it's time to put some music on and actually do some work! :)
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: ScumOfTheRoad on 27 November, 2020, 11:38:46 am
GeraldC, that is interesting about PhD writeups. I did finish mine, but it took years and I handed it in on the very last day it would be accepted (a time limit was applied).
I work best when I have a deadline, and in fact artificially create deadlines.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Notsototalnewbie on 27 November, 2020, 11:59:50 am
That's good to hear your GP is sympathetic, Gerald. I guess as with so many things it depends on the individual.

I do the notebook thing too. In fact some of them are now getting used because the husband can't raid the office stationery cupboard any more for his work projects and keeps asking me for another.

Both my careers to date have been deadline focused and if the deadline isn't close I really have to force myself to do the work.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: geraldc on 27 November, 2020, 12:15:09 pm
ADHD people tend to be front end perfectionists, we won't start anything unless everything is perfect, aka chronic procrastinators, we'll always find an excuse not to do something. Just call your gp and make an appointment. There's very little downside, round here it's all gone to phone consultations again, so at worst you'll have to chat with someone on the phone for a bit. If that doesn't work, go private, but at least try your gp.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: SteveC on 27 November, 2020, 12:52:38 pm
However the one trait that really rang the alarm bells for me, was when it asked in a book do you feel the need to buy a new notebook for every major project, and then abandon the notebook within a couple of pages.  I have a drawer full of nearly new notebooks.
One thing I've made myself do in lockdown is use up all those notebooks I've been collecting. Well, almost. I did end up buying a couple of shorthand/reporters pads as well. Though, to be fair, the driver was an attempt to fire up before the revamp of the home office space. (http://"https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=117439.msg2560261#msg2560261")
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: barakta on 27 November, 2020, 01:36:49 pm
AD(H)D is also massively under recognised in women as it's seen as a "naughty boy" condition, or that it's hyperactive even when 'inattentiveness' is a significant component.

I have found it fascinating listening to ADHDers talking about the lived experience of having it rather than just the diagnostic criteria. And indeed the impacts on partners, families, relationships and so on.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Sergeant Pluck on 27 November, 2020, 02:13:50 pm
ADHD people tend to be front end perfectionists, we won't start anything unless everything is perfect, aka chronic procrastinators, we'll always find an excuse not to do something.

New pen or I can’t start. Cue hours looking at Cult Pens. For tasks that are to be done mostly on the computer.

Geraldc, I would be extremely interested to read anything you are willing to share on any strategies that may be suggested to you.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: geraldc on 27 November, 2020, 02:24:29 pm
The big thing, is not replying to messages as you don't feel it at the moment, and then by the time you remember to reply, it's been such a long time, that it's frankly embarrassing that so much time has passed, so you just leave it. I had a colleague look at my draft emails folder once, he went white as a sheet.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Notsototalnewbie on 27 November, 2020, 02:51:54 pm
ADHD people tend to be front end perfectionists, we won't start anything unless everything is perfect, aka chronic procrastinators, we'll always find an excuse not to do something. Just call your gp and make an appointment. There's very little downside, round here it's all gone to phone consultations again, so at worst you'll have to chat with someone on the phone for a bit. If that doesn't work, go private, but at least try your gp.

Yeah I know you're right. I feel frivolous taking their time for something like this when I already take their time for other stuff. Which I know isn't how it should work but it's how I feel.

I found an email yesterday that I should have replied to weeks ago but it had something in it I didn't like so it ceased to exist for a while  ::-)

I would also be interested in what you learn.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Jurek on 27 November, 2020, 03:06:17 pm
I'm finding this to be a very interesting thread.
I work with people who leave everything until the last moment.
Which I totally, utterly  fail to understand.
Whereas I plan, plan, plan everything to within an inch of its life.
It is the only way I can maintain control.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Gattopardo on 27 November, 2020, 03:10:04 pm
Control freak.  ;D

Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Jurek on 27 November, 2020, 03:10:33 pm
Control freak.  ;D
Totally.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: citoyen on 27 November, 2020, 03:48:28 pm
I work with people who leave everything until the last moment.

Nothing sharpens the mind like an impending deadline.

I think John Finnemore must have had me in mind when he wrote this:
https://youtu.be/eb0TRa_F7GA

(First comment: "Anyone listening to this song when they're supposed to be doing work?" Er...  ;D )
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Jurek on 27 November, 2020, 04:06:22 pm
I work with people who leave everything until the last moment.

Nothing sharpens the mind like an impending deadline.

I think John Finnemore must have had me in mind when he wrote this:
https://youtu.be/eb0TRa_F7GA

(First comment: "Anyone listening to this song when they're supposed to be doing work?" Er...  ;D )
Good comment  :thumbsup:.
I tend to work on a 'What if / All points covered' basis, and sure, occasionally it goes tits up but, for the most part, my client thinks that I can walk on water.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: geraldc on 27 November, 2020, 04:56:23 pm
Yeah I know you're right. I feel frivolous taking their time for something like this when I already take their time for other stuff. Which I know isn't how it should work but it's how I feel.

From first suspicions of ADHD, it's taken me 5 years to see my gp and seek formal help. I saw him just before lockdown, and the hospital sent a letter confirming my referral after a week, and then nothing for months. My other half was so stressed by me being me during lockdown, I had to chase the gp and hospital a few weeks ago. You don't realise it, but it affects every part of your life, not just work life. I'm used to my inconsistency, for others it's a nightmare. It's actually nice to be able to talk to other people who might have it. My mates from school and uni are high achievers/borderline aspergers, and I haven't found anyone else with ADHD in my peer group (we think my granddad had it, but that's due to him blowing the family fortunes due to impulse control issues) but talking about issues like the need for background noise podcast/music, notebooks, and failing to correspond in a timely manner is quite comforting, as now I know it's not just me.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: ian on 27 November, 2020, 07:32:49 pm
I have to be honest, but I find the need to pathologize everything a bit odd. Every parent I know will explain in great detail how their little ones are dyslexic, hyperactive, or allergic to x-y-and-z and even if they aren't actually diagnosed, they'll be in an active campaign to get that diagnosis that makes world war 2 look like a playground disagreement. Where did normal go? Is this just a middle-class thing to squeeze their kids into some kind of special?

I have skittish attention and always did, it wasn't great for education, but hey ho, but I've come to terms with it. This is how my brain works. I muddle words far worse than some people I know who'll never miss and opportunity to tell me about their dyslexia. I'm shy enough that I must be on some kind of spectrum, I'm just to timorous to sign up. I must have something wrong with me. Or probably, I'm just what I am, and I work with that. We are all, in fact, our own little snowflake.

Before someone rants, I'm not saying these things don't exist, or that there are no benefits in setting a diagnosis boundary where these things really are a problem, but sometimes it seems we try too hard to demonstrate that we've got something wrong.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Mike J on 27 November, 2020, 07:43:50 pm
My attention has definitely got worse, the worst example is in work meetings, due to sitting at a desk instead of in a meeting room with other participants.  I stop paying attention quite a lot.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: geraldc on 27 November, 2020, 07:49:04 pm
If you ask me what needs to be done. I can tell you perfectly. If you tell me to execute the plan, it could go horribly wrong. I know what to do, but for some reason my gears seem stuck in neutral.
My brain has problems deciding on basic stuff, eg, should I spend 15 mins firing off a report that is overdue to a key client, or should I help a colleague on some minor but "interesting" problem, that could potentially take hours, and if solved wouldn't get me any credit anyway. Unless I put in effort focusing, I end up doing stuff that makes no sense. But while I'm doing this pointless task I kind of feel fulfilled/useful.

There are strange things, I like stuff in piles all over the place. It would look messy to 99% of people, but my brain sees it as my pile of stuff, therefore not a mess. If I make a mess, it's almost as if I literally can't see it.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Kim on 27 November, 2020, 07:51:42 pm
I have to be honest, but I find the need to pathologize everything a bit odd.

It's what you have to do when accessing services (eg. education) from people who subscribe to (or have to work within a funding framework based on) the medical model of disability.

Yes, it would be brilliant if teaching was accessible to everyone by default, but that's a bit too social model, as it would mean doing things differently and possibly *gasp* spending money.

I blame Thatcher.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: rob on 27 November, 2020, 08:02:12 pm
I recall from school, and it wasn’t too far from where Ian grew up, that we had thick kids and bright kids and that was it.  There was no spectrum to be on, you were just good at school or bad at it.  In truth I suspect the system was just massively failing a tonne of kids.  I was lucky in that I was good at exams and it saw me through.

As a parent we were taken to one side and told at an early age that our child would not make it through the school system in tact.  We were incredibly fortunate to have the budget and time to get a full diagnosis and to get the school to put a plan in place.  I documented elsewhere how were really unsure about medicating him but we did and it made a huge difference.  He’s now flying along at his senior school.  He will still get distracted 4 times between his bedroom and the front door.

It has to be said that there is no longer a stigma here.  Some employers are now actively looking for employees that are on the spectrum, particularly in coding and analysis roles.  The consultant we dealt with said she had to deal with people who were begging for a positive diagnosis in order to get their dream job.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Lightning Phil on 27 November, 2020, 08:04:50 pm
My attention has definitely got worse, the worst example is in work meetings, due to sitting at a desk instead of in a meeting room with other participants.  I stop paying attention quite a lot.

To be honest that’s nothing new. If you ever worked from home in the last twenty years and dialled into a conference call. About 99% of the time you didn’t really need to be there. They’d be in jokes if a group was in a meeting room that you wouldn’t quite pick up. You’d put yourself on mute whilst you did something more productive whilst kind of listening for anything relevant. Most meetings are badly run even before people are remote. It’s hard to concentrate when meetings aren’t focused and you’ve got a ton of stuff to do.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: FifeingEejit on 27 November, 2020, 08:27:25 pm
Sorry what?
I was to busy playing with my hair.


Although writing that did just help me find the Stig tub that contains my SD card which lives in the pile of stuff infront of my keyboard (recently cleaned, see WFH Rejig thread) that I was looking for 30 minutes ago to put the SD card out of the Dead Sansa Clip.

I maintain that a bike is the ultimate fidget spinner.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Mike J on 27 November, 2020, 08:32:07 pm
My attention has definitely got worse, the worst example is in work meetings, due to sitting at a desk instead of in a meeting room with other participants.  I stop paying attention quite a lot.

To be honest that’s nothing new. If you ever worked from home in the last twenty years and dialled into a conference call. About 99% of the time you didn’t really need to be there. They’d be in jokes if a group was in a meeting room that you wouldn’t quite pick up. You’d put yourself on mute whilst you did something more productive whilst kind of listening for anything relevant. Most meetings are badly run even before people are remote. It’s hard to concentrate when meetings aren’t focused and you’ve got a ton of stuff to do.

Despite having had a laptop for 5 years plus, have never had the "approval" to wfh before now  ::-)
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: ian on 27 November, 2020, 08:37:07 pm
I struggled at school, in part because I came from no great tradition of thinking and academic achievement, my parents left school at the first opportunity (in my father's case, a couple of years before it was legally advisable), but my brain doesn't work with a conventional lesson structure. I'm not going to pay attention for an hour. I work on a scale of minutes. I just assumed I was stupid and no one disagreed with my self-diagnosis. I also couldn't see anything because I needed jam-jar glasses but wasn't going to ask for them because it was better to be stupid than look stupid. So much of my childhood was blurry and dim in every which way.

I remember being grabbed by a teacher on the eve of comprehensive school. "You can't see, can you?" Sure, said I, used to bluffing it. "What's written on the board?" Normally, I'd have copied from someone else, but it was just me and I was so obviously caught. Anyway, that meant they dragged my parents to school (who also hadn't noticed) and earned me precisely the NHS specs of a telescopic prescription that anyone teetering on their teenage years feared more than anything else.

But anyway, I owe another teacher once at comprehensive school who took an interest in my apparent stupidity and knocked some sense of potential achievement into me. That and the fact I was always curious about stuff and spent my weekly paper round money on something called the Joy of Knowledge, a weekly encyclopaedia, each issue of which I consumed, and a library card that was perpetually maxed out. Anyway, I got a degree, a PhD, several years knocking out some top-notch molecular genetics. My younger sister got a couple of GCSEs and her daughter has all the intellectual curiosity of a rock and, currently, a career in the unemployment industry (not entirely her fault, she was doing some kind of childcare course that didn't survive its intersection with the current pandemic).

I'm not sure where we draw the line between people having individual needs and people having some form of pathology. Drawing the line sometimes seems wrong. I'm eternally thankful for the attentions of a few people and I understand how much of my life was luck (and honestly this is what royally fucks me off about the entitled, privately educated people, who never have to contemplate that so much of everything is circumstance).
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: L CC on 28 November, 2020, 08:45:15 am
I have to be honest, but I find the need to pathologize everything a bit odd.

It's what you have to do when accessing services (eg. education) from people who subscribe to (or have to work within a funding framework based on) the medical model of disability.

Yes, it would be brilliant if teaching was accessible to everyone by default, but that's a bit too social model, as it would mean doing things differently and possibly *gasp* spending money.

I blame Thatcher.
It's spending the same money, except spending it on medicalising personality traits instead of on educating people.

I find it loathsome and think it's probably unhelpful, long term, as it removes some personal responsibility in overcoming ones own limitations.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: TheLurker on 28 November, 2020, 08:53:20 am
Quote from: Mike J
My attention has definitely got worse, the worst example is in work meetings, ...  I stop paying attention quite a lot.
You obviously had far more interesting meetings then we ever did.  These days I can use the time for getting on with *real* work while a management drone (ha ha) drones on about some powerpoint slide that he (it's always a he) has wasted $deity alone knows how many hours on, rather than day-dreaming about machetes, axes and wreaking violent death on the individual wasting *my* life with his (did I mention it's always a him?) pointless, pointless and utterly irrelevant to my job *drivel*.

Back OT.
My ability to concentrate is pretty variable at the best of times (from intensely focussed to, "hello birds, hello sky" within the space of a couple of hours) and I can't say I've noticed it having got any worse than usual.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Gattopardo on 28 November, 2020, 09:19:37 am
If you are interested I would recomend having a search for ADHD and me by Rory Bremner.  It is both a radio show and a Horizon TV documentary program.  It does give an interesting view.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Kim on 28 November, 2020, 12:24:37 pm
I have to be honest, but I find the need to pathologize everything a bit odd.

It's what you have to do when accessing services (eg. education) from people who subscribe to (or have to work within a funding framework based on) the medical model of disability.

Yes, it would be brilliant if teaching was accessible to everyone by default, but that's a bit too social model, as it would mean doing things differently and possibly *gasp* spending money.

I blame Thatcher.
It's spending the same money, except spending it on medicalising personality traits instead of on educating people.

Like so much of the rot in modern society, it's about making sure the money spent comes from someone else's budget.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Mike J on 28 November, 2020, 04:34:49 pm
Quote from: Mike J
My attention has definitely got worse, the worst example is in work meetings, ...  I stop paying attention quite a lot.
You obviously had far more interesting meetings then we ever did. 
 

It was probably more my ability to feign interest rather than the actual interestingness of the meetings.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: rob on 28 November, 2020, 05:29:40 pm
I think taking someone with a disorder that effects concentration and telling them to try harder is like telling someone with acute anxiety to pull themselves together.   Neither thing works.

I had my head in the sand with J and thought it would fixed if I just shouted at him more to focus harder.  It took a medical professional to tell me that he just can’t concentrate on a task before it fell into place.  We didn’t have to make any major changes but he was given longer to finish tasks and extra time in exams.  When he sat his entrance exam at his new school it was all on a computer and he got the second highest mark they had seen without requiring extra time.  It’s about making little adjustments here and there.

To go back to when he sat at the kitchen table sobbing as he couldn’t finish a task was heartbreaking.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: ian on 28 November, 2020, 07:37:12 pm
I have to be honest, but I find the need to pathologize everything a bit odd.

It's what you have to do when accessing services (eg. education) from people who subscribe to (or have to work within a funding framework based on) the medical model of disability.

Yes, it would be brilliant if teaching was accessible to everyone by default, but that's a bit too social model, as it would mean doing things differently and possibly *gasp* spending money.

I blame Thatcher.
It's spending the same money, except spending it on medicalising personality traits instead of on educating people.

I find it loathsome and think it's probably unhelpful, long term, as it removes some personal responsibility in overcoming ones own limitations.

This, I suppose, explains it. It seems a bit mad, telling kids they're unwell and not (in the majority of cases) just, well, different. Like most things, this seems a game the middle-classes are good at. They know how to browbeat GPs and teachers until they'll do anything just to get rid of them. Again though, it's not that I don't think there are cases like rob's, where there is a genuine need, but that's not every other kid, and to be honest, if everyone is fighting for this, it yanks the resources from the kids who genuinely need them. We seem to be stumbling towards the US model, where vast numbers of schoolchildren are being routinely medicated.

But if I were in charge of the world, I'd dump exams and all that shit immediately. This may explain why I'm not in charge of the world, of course. It's probably good that I don't have kids, I'd have to find some kind of hippy school to put them in. They'd grow up to hate me.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Gattopardo on 29 November, 2020, 12:06:15 am
What it says in the title.  Couldn't settle to anything under first lockdown, didn't really recover during the summer and it's twice as bad now. :(

Are you in France?
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: DuncanM on 29 November, 2020, 10:23:41 am
But if I were in charge of the world, I'd dump exams and all that shit immediately. This may explain why I'm not in charge of the world, of course. It's probably good that I don't have kids, I'd have to find some kind of hippy school to put them in. They'd grow up to hate me.
It will be interesting to see if Wales ever go back to actual exams, given they have approved assessments in place of the 2021 exams...
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: citoyen on 29 November, 2020, 10:35:30 am
I tend to work on a 'What if / All points covered' basis, and sure, occasionally it goes tits up but, for the most part, my client thinks that I can walk on water.

Planning is fine. I can do planning. But I can also relate to what people are saying here about not being able to complete tasks.

A few weeks ago, I finally got around to putting up the last few panels in the kitchen. Only four years since we did the refurb. And I still haven't finished off the skirting boards in the conservatory after replacing the flooring seven years ago.  :facepalm:

(So why the hell am I on yacf talking about it rather than just doing it?  ??? )
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: ElyDave on 29 November, 2020, 09:08:52 pm
planning isn't the problem, it's other people, they are the distraction.

It's always "Me, Me, Me!, Now, Now, Now!".

If you want it done properly, stop mithering me, look at the plan - yes it says 5 weeks because that's how long it takes. Hanging on the other end of a keyboard won'tmake it take three weeks. Oh, and you want that as well now, OK, I'll drop this, which puts it back another two days.

In terms of absolute focus, having my office separate from the rest of the house, and setting Do Not Disturb on Teams is the first step.  Then I decide what priorities I'll address and give myself enough time to get my brain into soemthing. Then I have to contend with the birds hopping around the bonsai, and last week a mouse running round for about 5 minutes, and t'internet
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Lightning Phil on 29 November, 2020, 09:11:25 pm
Shut down email and only look at it start and end of day. It isn’t so urgent it needs addressing as soon as a notification comes up.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Greenbank on 29 November, 2020, 09:30:54 pm
Shut down email and only look at it start and end of day. It isn’t so urgent it needs addressing as soon as a notification comes up.

That's great if you've got a job where you can do that but many can't, and in the context of this thread it's also verging on "Just pull yourself together" kind of advice.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: Chris S on 29 November, 2020, 10:31:06 pm
Shut down email and only look at it start and end of day. It isn’t so urgent it needs addressing as soon as a notification comes up.

That's great if you've got a job where you can do that but many can't, and in the context of this thread it's also verging on "Just pull yourself together" kind of advice.

That kind of depends on the job. If you have a job that puts you "on call" and needing to react to things, then yes - but then you are "at work".

I guess Phil is referring to genuine down-time when you actually don't need to look at your work email because you're not at work, and it's officially Somebody Else's Problemtm
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: L CC on 30 November, 2020, 08:57:29 am
Shut down email and only look at it start and end of day. It isn’t so urgent it needs addressing as soon as a notification comes up.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA

Erm, yes it is. That's exactly what my job is. Responding to emails, sharpish. My job is 95% firefighting.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: rob on 30 November, 2020, 09:15:19 am
I went away with some University mates and one quite vocal member of the group had made his way to being pretty senior in a large insurance company.   He kept giving me a hard time for checking my mails regularly over the weekend.   He was able to turn his phone off on a Friday evening and not look at it again until he went back to work.

I have spent most of the last 20 years working for American trading businesses.  They will contact you whenever and wherever you are to ask the most meaningless question.   Whilst never formally being on call I was always able to be contacted.

I have been with a Swiss company for nearly 3 months and I'm now at the point where nothing happens out of hours.   I do still check my mails into the evening and on holiday, though.   Old habits die hard.
Title: Re: Concentration gone to hell under lockdown
Post by: ian on 30 November, 2020, 09:44:55 am
Americans are terrible for the always-on culture. I was off at the end of last week which coincided with thanksgiving. I still have fucking emails from the Americans this morning (though fortunately fewer). I had to tell one of my colleagues specifically not to work on something – it'll wait. Go spend your time with your wife and kids.

I switch my mothership phone off in the evening and for any holiday. Unless you generally have a life-and-death job, nothing is really that important.