Author Topic: Which DynoHub ?  (Read 24809 times)

The Mechanic

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #25 on: 26 February, 2009, 08:35:01 am »
I have a Shimano DH-3N80.  I have only done about 200 miles on it so far but so far so good.  Don't notice any drag and it is supposed to be lighter than a Son.  I got mine from Germany.  I think it was about 55 quid including postage.  That was before the pound crashed mind.  I have mine build into an ambrosio evolution rim by Big Al at Wheelcraft near Glasgow.  Top wheel builder.

Sigurd Mudtracker

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #26 on: 27 February, 2009, 08:10:18 pm »
What happens if you put a 27" dynohub into a 20" wheel?  This seemed like the best option for my Kettwiesel, meaning hopefully I would get decent light output going uphill.  But would it explode horribly as I charge down the other side?

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #27 on: 27 February, 2009, 08:12:02 pm »
It would cause excess drag and would probably lead to early failure of whatever voltage-limiting circuitry the lamp has.
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

Sigurd Mudtracker

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #28 on: 27 February, 2009, 08:14:39 pm »
It would cause excess drag and would probably lead to early failure of whatever voltage-limiting circuitry the lamp has.

Well, I can at least justify the cost of a SON to SWMBO, then!

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #29 on: 27 February, 2009, 08:41:31 pm »
What happens if you put a 27" dynohub into a 20" wheel?

Mrs LWaB and I visited the webmaster of the Birdyfreunde (Birdy folding bike group) in Germany in 2004.  He used a standard SON to drive three headlights in series, with automatic switching.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #30 on: 27 February, 2009, 10:28:20 pm »
In case anyone doesn't know, there's now a version of the SON for tadpole trikes (HP Scorpion, Anthrotech, ICE and Greenspeed listed)

Schmidt Maschinenbau Produkte SON XS-M

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #31 on: 02 March, 2009, 02:13:23 am »
the normal life for my Shimano front cones is only about 5 000 miles

How do you regularly kill them that quickly?  I've done heaps more than that on Shimano hubs, although I regrease and adjust before use.  Most off-the-shelf loose bearing hubs are overly tight and under-greased IMHO.

I wish I knew the answer to that.

I didn't touch the first hub before annual maintenance - clean/inspect/regrease/adjust. Cones lasted just over 4 000 miles before pitting was visible. Rear cones lasted 10 400 miles.

The figure of 5 000 miles is a rough average over 33 000 miles for the front hubs on 2 bikes.

Oscar's dad

  • aka Septimus Fitzwilliam Beauregard Partridge
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #32 on: 12 January, 2012, 05:13:13 am »
I'm thinking of getting a dynohub (plus a wheel for it to go in  ;D ).  I'd rather go for a Shimano and keep costs down.  What's the latest thinking on Shimano V SON?

And is the Cyo still reckoned to be the best front light?

Chris N

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #33 on: 12 January, 2012, 08:48:31 am »
Compare the Shimano DH-3N80 (top of Shimano's range) against the Schmidt SON 28 (what they call the standard model).

Electrically, they're the same.

The Shimano (Ultegra-level hub) IIRC has a little more resistance than the Schmidt when the light is on, and a little less when the light is off.  The Schmidt is 60g lighter.

It's not possible to service the Schmidt yourself, but you can send it back to Germany to get it done.  The Shimano hub is officially non-serviceable.  You can it yourself though it's not easy.

The Shimano is (much) less than half the price of the Schmidt.

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #34 on: 12 January, 2012, 10:14:51 am »
I have both the units Chris N refers to on different bikes, and I can't honestly tell the difference between them when riding.

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #35 on: 12 January, 2012, 10:22:14 am »
I still prefer the Shimano, having run both the SON 28 and the DH-3N80 for an extended period.  The SON-XS is pretty cool on the Brompton though.
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

Oscar's dad

  • aka Septimus Fitzwilliam Beauregard Partridge
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #36 on: 12 January, 2012, 10:25:28 am »
Great info, many thanks.

"Come on Oscar's dad, step away from the credit card!!!"

urban_biker

  • " . . .we all ended up here and like lads in the back of a Nova we sort of egged each other on...."
  • Known in the real world as Dave
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #37 on: 12 January, 2012, 10:29:05 am »
I chose a Shimano DN-3H80 and built my first wheel (Open Pro rims) around it. It works very well.

But... I am very cautious about durability, given that the normal life for my Shimano front cones is only about 5 000 miles, and the Shimano dynohubs are supposed not to be user-maintainable. Dunno if that means there are no spare cones available, but if not it's the end of the hub.In contrast my first set of Open Pros lasted over 20 000 miles, and they're sold as short-lived roadies' kit.

I wouldn't worry too much. I've done quite a few thousand miles on my DN-3H72 hub and its been fine. More reliable than my rear Deore XT hub which has needed some maintenance over that time.
Owner of a languishing Langster

corshamjim

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #38 on: 12 January, 2012, 12:27:44 pm »
It would cause excess drag and would probably lead to early failure of whatever voltage-limiting circuitry the lamp has.

Well, I can at least justify the cost of a SON to SWMBO, then!

There are other options for 20" wheels, for example Dahon Biologic Joule and Shimano Capreo.  I think most are 74mm OLD though.  I've not tried any of them personally.

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #39 on: 12 January, 2012, 02:12:29 pm »
Compare the Shimano DH-3N80 (top of Shimano's range) against the Schmidt SON 28 (what they call the standard model).

Electrically, they're the same.

The Shimano (Ultegra-level hub) IIRC has a little more resistance than the Schmidt when the light is on, and a little less when the light is off.  The Schmidt is 60g lighter.

It's not possible to service the Schmidt yourself, but you can send it back to Germany to get it done.  The Shimano hub is officially non-serviceable.  You can it yourself though it's not easy.

The Shimano is (much) less than half the price of the Schmidt.
Just call the drag the the same, on the basis that 20% (or whatever) of hardly anything isn't enough to worry about. It's only worth thinking about on the cheap Shimano hubs (N20, N30)

There are several versions of both the Schmidt and Shimano hubs, and pretty much all the independent comparisons of drag etc refer to the older versions of one or the other hub.
It's the same with weight comparisons - which version?

The Schmidt warranty is 5 years; Shimano will depend on where you bought the hub, but is unlikely to be more than 2.

Other Shimano hubs (eg XT) occasionally have inadequate bearing grease when sold. If this happens with a dynohub, it will be a warranty claim when the hub fails rather than half an hour putting some grease in.
DIY service is possible, but there's a farly high chance of breaking the wiring and rendering the hub useless, even if you've done it OK before.

The Schmidt is better sealed, so you are more likely to get away with something like riding through a flood or crashing in a ford (dynohubs are easily forgotten about during the daytime).

With some bikes there may be no option but Schmidt - there are quite a lot more options.

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #40 on: 12 January, 2012, 02:32:19 pm »
I'd go with the DH-3N80 unless you have a good reason not to.  I'm very happy with it (and I have a SON Delux on another bike where there wasn't an alternative).  The only practical differences are the type of connector (I prefer the Shimano), expected lifetime and price.

I think the Cyo is still by far the best bang for the buck lighting-wise.

Andrij

  • Андрій
  • Ερασιτεχνικός μισάνθρωπος
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #41 on: 12 January, 2012, 06:28:18 pm »
I'm thinking of getting a dynohub (plus a wheel for it to go in  ;D ).  I'd rather go for a Shimano and keep costs down.  What's the latest thinking on Shimano V SON?

And is the Cyo still reckoned to be the best front light?

Which bike will get this new wheel?  I ask as I have a low* mileage dyno-hub front wheel, rim brake, from my commuter/all-rounder which is now surplus to requirements.  The dynohub is an older Shimano model.  I can confirm hub and rim details when I get home.

* Just checked and not quite as low as I thought - the whole combo has done 4,600km.
;D  Andrij.  I pronounce you Complete and Utter GIT   :thumbsup:

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #42 on: 12 January, 2012, 06:51:28 pm »
I'm contemplating replacing the existing XT hub on my Thorn with some flavour of dyno-hub.  This would be primarily for recharging batteries & gadgets when on tour. Given that my average speed with a camping load is sub 10 mph are either the Schmidt or Shimano better for this application ?
Not fast & rarely furious

tweeting occasional in(s)anities as andrewxclark

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #43 on: 12 January, 2012, 07:03:54 pm »
I'm contemplating replacing the existing XT hub on my Thorn with some flavour of dyno-hub.  This would be primarily for recharging batteries & gadgets when on tour. Given that my average speed with a camping load is sub 10 mph are either the Schmidt or Shimano better for this application ?

Any specific thoughts you may have about which recharger to go for?

Frere

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #44 on: 12 January, 2012, 07:11:06 pm »
I'm keeping an eye on the other thread for that. The Tout Terrain looks the neatest & most elegant, no trailing wires and the unit is internal so it can't be damaged or stolen.  Downside is that it can't be swapped between bikes and installing it sounds a bit of a faff (might have to remove existing star nut to get the cables down the headtube.
Not fast & rarely furious

tweeting occasional in(s)anities as andrewxclark

Oscar's dad

  • aka Septimus Fitzwilliam Beauregard Partridge
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #45 on: 12 January, 2012, 09:16:38 pm »
I'm thinking of getting a dynohub (plus a wheel for it to go in  ;D ).  I'd rather go for a Shimano and keep costs down.  What's the latest thinking on Shimano V SON?

And is the Cyo still reckoned to be the best front light?

Which bike will get this new wheel?  I ask as I have a low* mileage dyno-hub front wheel, rim brake, from my commuter/all-rounder which is now surplus to requirements.  The dynohub is an older Shimano model.  I can confirm hub and rim details when I get home.

* Just checked and not quite as low as I thought - the whole combo has done 4,600km.

My Ribble blue running 23mm tyres.

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #46 on: 12 January, 2012, 09:33:53 pm »
I'm contemplating replacing the existing XT hub on my Thorn with some flavour of dyno-hub.  This would be primarily for recharging batteries & gadgets when on tour. Given that my average speed with a camping load is sub 10 mph are either the Schmidt or Shimano better for this application ?

One of the hubs designed for 700c wheels: ie. not a SON Delux or equivalent.

I find that things get a bit disappointing charging wise below 10mph.  Might be worth comparing the cost of a decent sized solar panel to that of dynamo + charger.

Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #47 on: 12 January, 2012, 09:43:50 pm »
I tried a solar panel for 2 weeks during my Belgium tour in September. It did work, but AA's that my charger gave me a green light on ran down very fast, and it took several days to charge up my Veho Pebble.  Granted I was just leaving it in a horizontal position on the rack which is probably not the best practice.
Not fast & rarely furious

tweeting occasional in(s)anities as andrewxclark

Andrij

  • Андрій
  • Ερασιτεχνικός μισάνθρωπος
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #48 on: 12 January, 2012, 11:02:16 pm »
I'm thinking of getting a dynohub (plus a wheel for it to go in  ;D ).  I'd rather go for a Shimano and keep costs down.  What's the latest thinking on Shimano V SON?

And is the Cyo still reckoned to be the best front light?

Which bike will get this new wheel?  I ask as I have a low* mileage dyno-hub front wheel, rim brake, from my commuter/all-rounder which is now surplus to requirements.  The dynohub is an older Shimano model.  I can confirm hub and rim details when I get home.

* Just checked and not quite as low as I thought - the whole combo has done 4,600km.

My Ribble blue running 23mm tyres.

What I have may be too sturdy for you:
* Rim: DRC ST19 - 622x17.5, black, rim brake
* Spokes: Sapim of some sort x 36
* Hub: Shimano HB-C050-D

If anyone is interested, make me an offer before I get around to listing it on the For Sale board.  I can post, but prefer a handover in the Greater London area.
;D  Andrij.  I pronounce you Complete and Utter GIT   :thumbsup:

Oscar's dad

  • aka Septimus Fitzwilliam Beauregard Partridge
Re: Which DynoHub ?
« Reply #49 on: 12 January, 2012, 11:33:23 pm »
I'm thinking of getting a dynohub (plus a wheel for it to go in  ;D ).  I'd rather go for a Shimano and keep costs down.  What's the latest thinking on Shimano V SON?

And is the Cyo still reckoned to be the best front light?

Which bike will get this new wheel?  I ask as I have a low* mileage dyno-hub front wheel, rim brake, from my commuter/all-rounder which is now surplus to requirements.  The dynohub is an older Shimano model.  I can confirm hub and rim details when I get home.

* Just checked and not quite as low as I thought - the whole combo has done 4,600km.

My Ribble blue running 23mm tyres.

What I have may be too sturdy for you:
* Rim: DRC ST19 - 622x17.5, black, rim break
* Spokes: Sapim of some sort x 36
* Hub: Shimano HB-C050-D

If anyone is interested, make me an offer before I get around to listing it on the For Sale board.  I can post, but prefer a handover in the Greater London area.

What sort of bike did you use it on Andrij?  And what size 700 tyres?