Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => The Knowledge => Topic started by: welshwheels on 10 September, 2012, 08:56:49 pm
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As the nights are drawing in and the commute is getting ever darker the time has come to bight the bullet and purchase a good light for a change instead of cheapo lights that I seem to think will do the job and obviously are not up to the job for commuting and the odd ride off up to 2hrs in the dark on unlit roads /paths and country lanes any thing you could suggest will be appreciated :thumbsup: *
*I have plenty of led's to make sure I am seen I really need a light to see
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A B&M Cyo and a Shimano hub dynamo. Of course, you need to build it into a wheel, which will push you over £100, but if your front rim is a bit worn it may be worth it.
Otherwise, a Hope Vision One does the job for much less.
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B&M Cyo and an Axa bottle dynamo would come in within budget.
They're not as elegant as hub dynamos, but they do actually work. Would be a reasonable interim solution pending a future wheel replacement.
Otherwise, B&M Ixon IQ (good beam shape, dodgy battery contacts), Hope Vision One (circular beam and plunges you into darkness without warning when the battery's low) or the Philips Saferide (excellent lighting, bracket falls to bits) would be the ones to consider.
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fenix torch
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I've never had a dynamo light, though I have plenty of experience of how good they can be riding with others. If you don't want to bother with a battery pack either, you'll get 2 hours out of Fenix lights on highest settings and loads more on lower settings. They are easy to stick in your pocket. I have PD3 and an LD20. The former runs on lithium cells (I have a charger) and the latter on any AA cells (I use rechargeables). Have a look at this website:-
http://www.fenixtorch.co.uk/batteries/main.html
Edit: cross post with mrcharly!
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And a nod to Alpkit headtorches, while we're on the torchy side of things. Probably not for the commute, but a useful addition for longer rides on dark lanes and paths.
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Otherwise, B&M Ixon IQ (good beam shape, dodgy battery contacts), Hope Vision One (circular beam and plunges you into darkness without warning when the battery's low) or the Philips Saferide (excellent lighting, bracket falls to bits) would be the ones to consider.
I think the problems with the Philips Saferide bracket are specific to the dynamo version. The battery version has a rather different bracket, I've not heard of any problems with it.
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A B&M Cyo and a Shimano hub dynamo. Of course, you need to build it into a wheel, which will push you over £100, but if your front rim is a bit worn it may be worth it.
Otherwise, a Hope Vision One does the job for much less.
Check out B&M's new Dynamo light.....The Luxos (http://www.bumm.de/produkte/dynamo-scheinwerfer/lumotec-iq2-luxos.html)
Could be very nice.
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A B&M Cyo and a Shimano hub dynamo. Of course, you need to build it into a wheel, which will push you over £100, but if your front rim is a bit worn it may be worth it.
Otherwise, a Hope Vision One does the job for much less.
Check out B&M's new Dynamo light.....The Luxos (http://www.bumm.de/produkte/dynamo-scheinwerfer/lumotec-iq2-luxos.html)
Indeedy....some English blurb PDf goodness here:-
http://www.bumm.de/fileadmin/user_upload/Katalog/Katalog_2012_GB.pdf
Could be very nice.
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well give it another couple of weeks and I'll be doing most of my riding in the dark around the Brecon Beacons and the Black mountain, I will be using my Hope 1, damn good light for the money, lights up the mountain roads really well, always carry some spare batteries just in case, but not needed them yet :)
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Hope announced a new version of the V1 at Eurobike, 30% more lumen output. No details on the website yet.
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A B&M Cyo and a Shimano hub dynamo. Of course, you need to build it into a wheel, which will push you over £100, but if your front rim is a bit worn it may be worth it.
Otherwise, a Hope Vision One does the job for much less.
Check out B&M's new Dynamo light.....The Luxos (http://www.bumm.de/produkte/dynamo-scheinwerfer/lumotec-iq2-luxos.html)
Could be very nice.
Looks amazing. Starbikes has the 179U and 179E on pre-order for 179 and 199 euro respectively. 179E seems that have a built in battery that charges off the dynamo and allows you to turn on an optional 140lux beam from the handlebar switch. That's more than double the light output of the standard cyo. Both also provide a USB charger.
I know what's going on my xmas list.
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Yep, the luxos looks amazing. The panoramic beam looks fantastic from the beam pattern photos
Lot of lolly, but if it does the job of an e-werk as well, then it starts to look like a really good option.
Way Off topic for the OP - sorry!
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The switch on the bars with usb port looks real neat. *If* it will power a gps/charge external batteries then it would be a game changer. Think of it as an e-werk with a neater cabling solution and a free light...
x-post with marcusjb.Cannibalising the e-werk market must be a headache for B&M, but that's progress. It's the old conundrum; should I eat my children or should I let somebody else do it?
Could a mod split the Luxos posts off as a new thread? One to watch...
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(yes - mods should split into a Luxos thread as it is very interesting, but not relevant to the OP).
I also believe B&M have announced a cheaper E-Werk with USB charging only - makes a lot of sense as that's what 90% of people will use it for (I never use mine for any other voltage outputs - I could charge my Ixon IQ from it, but never do - I have a Cyo!). It will apparently have a small cache battery in it as well (like the Luxos appears to) to ensure a solid USB output.
I think we're really getting into 'proper' solutions now, rather than cobbled together bits and pieces. Using an E-Werk to charge up a third party battery pack which I then have to turn on to recharge GPS/iPhone etc. is not elegant.
I may consider the Luxos and move the Cyo onto the commute bike with a Shimano dynohub at some point in the future. Leave me with an unused E-Werk, but that's life.
The switch on the handlebars to change lighting modes looks interesting - I can't quite work out all the modes, there's the panoramic mode, non-panoramic mode - I wonder is there a 'dipped' mode to avoid dazzling on-coming traffic.
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After a bit more reading it appears that the highest power Luxos 179E which produces 120lux is only available for e-bikes which are fast electric bikes classed as mopeds with their own battery. It uses the built in power system to boost the dynamo.
I suspect however that it might be possible to mount an additional battery pack, charged off the luxos that also provides for the occasional power boost for the luxos. Would need to look at one to be sure.
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The B&M Ixon IQ Speed looks good, though even from Bike24 it'd break the £100 barrier, though not by very much. 50 Lux for ten hours -
http://www.bumm.de/produkte/akku-scheinwerfer/ixon-iq-speed.html (http://www.bumm.de/produkte/akku-scheinwerfer/ixon-iq-speed.html)
http://www.bike24.com/1.php?content=8;navigation=1;product=6844;page=9;menu=1000,5,66;mid=0;pgc=0;orderby=3 (http://www.bike24.com/1.php?content=8;navigation=1;product=6844;page=9;menu=1000,5,66;mid=0;pgc=0;orderby=3)
It's StVZO approved (as is the Philips Saferide, so most of that light should go on the road rather than up in the air.
Or if you don't mind scattering light around willy-nilly as long as the road is well lit up, there are many Chinese lights from £20 upwards which are brighter than any of the above, but not necessarily as reliable. Several people here, & who I know off the forum, have £20-30 models which in low setting are as bright as anyone could possibly want on road, & last several hours, or last maybe 3 hours in "blind everyone coming the other way" maximum. There's a thread about them. The less cheap but probably more reliable (they certainly look better made) Magicshine lights are available from UK sellers, delivery in a couple of days, & still more lumens than you can eat for <£100.
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The B&M Ixon IQ Speed looks good, though even from Bike24 it'd break the £100 barrier, though not by very much. 50 Lux for ten hours -
Actually, I think that one gets my vote, if we're talking battery lights. The major problems with the Ixon IQ (namely, dodgy battery contacts and a battery compartment catch that's prone to failure) are avoided, and you get a little extra light output to boot.
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This explains why Cyos are on special offer
I don't really need a usb charger or a flood light mode or the other stuff that the light does but if it makes Cyos cheaper, great
I wonder if something as complex as the top of the range "Luxos" light will actually be reliable enough to use on long, wet audax rides? My Cyo, IQ Fly and Seculite Plus have been pretty good though.
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After a bit more reading it appears that the highest power Luxos 179E which produces 120lux is only available for e-bikes which are fast electric bikes classed as mopeds with their own battery. It uses the built in power system to boost the dynamo.
I suspect however that it might be possible to mount an additional battery pack, charged off the luxos that also provides for the occasional power boost for the luxos. Would need to look at one to be sure.
The 179u version has all the functionality though, See here (http://www.bumm.de/fileadmin/user_upload/Katalog/Katalog_2012_GB.pdf), and 90Lux flood would be a useful upgrade. I found the Cyo 60Lux a tadge narrow on winding descents.
Edit: Waterproofing is a worry though, my Cyo60 died soon after meeting Welsh rain.
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I don't think it's likely to be much worse than a Cyo, as the main thing that's going to affect reliability is water ingress. With the odd exception (especially when not protected from front wheel spray by a mudguard) they seem to have a pretty good track record for that. Of course, the connector for the remote switch/USB port might be an issue in seriously apocalyptic rain, but there would always be the option of unplugging it.
Obviously having a battery built into the light is going to be a long-term cause of failure, but that's probably not going to die without warning (it'll lose capacity first), and I expect the basic functions will still work without it. I'm hoping it won't be too much of a headache to replace it when the time comes.
What I'm wondering is how easy it's going to be to extend the cable for the remote switch to reach the handlebars...
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Have we started using Lux instead of Lumens as the main unit for comparison now?
(I'm so out of date - it's probably megalumens by now :-[ )
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Lux and light field
Busch & Müller states the light output of headlights using the unit Lux. A Lux value provides
the illumination level in relation to its distance
from the light source – it is exactly this relation
which is a deciding factor when considering a
headlight, because it states the amount of light
on the road. The value Lumen states how much
light exits the headlight at the light source and
it cannot be told whether that light shines onto
the road or is lost as stray light. However, even
Lux is an incomplete value when talking about
the output of a headlight.
Also important is the quality of the light field
which is created on the road. Its width, depth,
homogeneity as well as its glare free light/dark
boundary directly ]affect how it is perceived by
the observing eye. All those qualities cannot be
stated using measured data. This means: Only
when one looks at the light fi eld as a whole, the
true quality of a headlight can be appraised.
From page 6 of the catalogue. (http://www.bumm.de/fileadmin/user_upload/Katalog/Katalog_2012_GB.pdf)
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I'm sure that's helpful, but I didn't ask for a definition! :P
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Well, there's no simple answer. Lumens are easily comparable, but only tell half the story. Lux are arguably more useful, but consider the difference between the 60Lux Cyo and the 40Lux Cyo R: They both use the same LED and electronics (so give out the same number of Lumens), but the optics in the 'R' spread the light more evenly in a taller beam. Depending on exactly how you've got it mounted on the bike, this can either give much better visibility (both in the nearfield as designed, and by the side effect of avoiding a hotspot in the middle of the beam that makes the periphery appear darker), or needlessly waste light on the ground directly in front of the wheel...
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OK, final try ... it seems to me that lights used to be mainly advertised with "X billion Lumens output".*
But in this thread all the references are to "... the Y Lux NightBlaze Plus" and similar. So I wondered if there's been a shift in the marketing speak, or if I've just not been paying attention!
*Random sample: my Fenix box lists runtimes (hours) vs lumens in the various modes.
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The thread has mostly discussed B&M lights and B&M specifies light output in Lux. AFAIAA that's all there is to it...
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B&M have always quoted Lux. I suspect that's what the German lighting regs use.
Other (non-German) manufacturers tend to stick to Lumens, as that's how the LEDs are specified by their manufacturers and avoids any complicated testing or mathematics to account for the effect of the optics. They're also standard for torch manufacturers, as unlike bike lights, torches aren't normally used at a fixed distance from the subject they're illuminating.
If there's been a shift towards Lux, I suspect that's indicative of B&Ms increasing market share.
(As optics are so important, my preferred units for comparison are power draw / runtime, and subjective illumination when seen in close proximity on night rides. Lumens or Lux, on their own, tell you very little. Photographs taken in controlled conditions are also good, but hard to come by.)
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Photos in standardised conditions are my favourite method of comparison, for instance these, (http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/headlights.asp) other than actually getting to use the thing at night. Even switching it on and shining it round a darkened room or garden doesn't really replicate the effective illumination when riding.
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B&M have always quoted Lux. I suspect that's what the German lighting regs use.
It is.
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anyone got any thoughts on a front light for my trice . as the light is mounted low compared to a upright cycle i wonder if any light would be better than others :-\ :)
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wow :o thanks for the info so much so that I need to seriously look at some of these dynamo outfits as I Had not really considered a dynohub before maybe I will have to amend the budget slightly ;) justified by the saving in gym membership :sick: and fuel saving alone :thumbsup: thanks again for all the replies time to look at lights and see what will suit my needs best
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anyone got any thoughts on a front light for my trice . as the light is mounted low compared to a upright cycle i wonder if any light would be better than others :-\ :)
We've got a non-R Cyo[1] on barakta's. For best distance illumination it needs to be pointed ever so slightly up from horizontal, but not to the point of blinding oncoming traffic at medium range.
It's certainly the sort of thing you want to be aiming for beam-shape wise - a wide but shallow rectangular beam. Anything too tall will waste light either on the ground behind your feet or into the sky/eyes of oncoming traffic. Circular beams are probably best avoided, though a narrow spot aimed into the distance might be beneficial in combination with something else.
[1] Same optics as on the B&M IQ Fly, Ixon IQ, Ixon IQ Speed and Schmidt Edelux.
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thanks kim :thumbsup:. i will have a look at them :)