Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => The Knowledge => GPS => Topic started by: StevieB on 22 November, 2016, 04:28:18 am
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Just noticed LEZYNE have introduced five(!) new GPS devices:
http://www.lezyne.com/products-gps.php (http://www.lezyne.com/products-gps.php)
Does anyone have an opinion? I like Lezyne pumps and hand-tools, but GPS is a step up technically...
The units are in the £80 ~ £140 which seems OK for units without maps.
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DC rainmaker gives it a :thumbsup:
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2016/09/hands-lezyne-computer.html
I also am excited by this feature:
"But it’s one specific mobile phone feature that I thought was particularly cool: The ability to instantly send turn by turn directions from your phone to the unit. "
Particularly useful for cycle touring. We used to do this in, what 2004, with a psion and an old etrex! Few devices since then have supported this workflow very well
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HK has a Lezyne GPS computer (just for data logging) and it is prone to getting water in the micro-USB socket (bad positioning, not changed), even with the bung in place. One has gone on the fritz and been replaced under warranty within a couple of months of purchase. I think the designers must test their prototypes in California.
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Just checked the info, hardly worth using if you don't use a smartphone. Since a smartphone has issues with battery life when using it for audaxing, any device designed to work together with a smartphone is of limited value.
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I've got one of the older Leyzne GPS computers as well, my biggest bugbear with it is that you can't seem to charge it on the go, so of little use on rides over 10 hours or so. Will be interested to see if the new ones can.
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The Lezyne Super GPS looks interesting. It claims 24 hours battery life, much better than any of the Garmin Edge models. And compatible with Ant+ sensors.
Yes, it needs to be connected to a phone to get any navigation features, or smart notifications etc. But still useful as a trip computer and recording a track, without a phone. Or maybe alongside another GPS device, as a backup.
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... except in heavy rain.
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And Wiggle now have the Lezyne Mini GPS for £40. http://www.wiggle.co.uk/lezyne-mini-gps-cycle-computer/
I'd be tempted to give it a go, but the lack of Ant+ support is annoying.
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Hmm, using it in the rain? Interesting idea. Why would anyone need to do that? Yes pretty sure that wouldn't have occurred to them. Seems a curious use case to me.
Next you'll want it to work when scuba diving or something
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After my 3 year old Edge 500's battery failed to make it through a 200k I've resolved to move away from Garmin and will definitely be buying a Lezyne Super next. I’ll have to see what the weatherproofing is like, but even if it is suboptimal that strikes me as an easy fix.
I’m much more interested in the Ant+ compatibility and a nice black and white screen, rather than a less visible colour one that seems to be there solely to bump up the price.
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If you want battery life, use a Garmin Etrex.
The batteries are basic AA, will last over 24h, and when they run out you just put a fresh pair in, or, if you don't want to stop specially, swap at the next control/natural stop after 2 bars. You've also got the advantage of the Garmin ecosystem - i.e. lots of other people to give advice, a choice of several versions of OpenStreetmap (rather than just what the maker chooses to give you), points of interest etc.
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Appreciate all the responses…
I sympathise with ‘BikinOn’ – contemplated buying a backup to my “old” EDGE 500 as in years gone by it would regularly crash and I lost several DIYs. Then thought ‘Hang on – you’re buying a second Garmin unit because the first is not reliable?’
Lately the edit switch and then buzzer no longer work suggesting the pcb has got wet too many times - the plastic surround gave way, where it forms the buttons.
So while the cheaper £40 Lezyne unit should be fine for recording rides, now I need a unit which will provide proper navigation.
And if the Lezyne Super needs a continuous connection to my smartphone, and the smartphone needs to be connected to a power supply, then the chain of dependencies is only getting longer! Might as well use my phone?
Perhaps it is different with maps (no maps on the 500), but I rely on the turn-by-turn instructions (plus the beep when I’ve gone off-course!), and more-so the beep and screen light after dark when approaching a turn. I regret the weeks of my life lost to entering them, but no way will I trust Google, Garmin or whoever to generate them from an autorouted course.
Does the Lezyne phone-combination work with self-generated (.tcx) tracks…?
Hence I’m leaning towards Garmin – as ‘andrew_s’ almost said “Better the devil you know!” Battery life is an issue, but I don’t see the Etrex as being very cycle-friendly.
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I don’t see the Etrex as being very cycle-friendly.
I think the world is divided on that one.
Whilst (most) Etrex models lack (some of) the features that (some) cyclists "want" (Cadence/power etc) if your needs are limited to a) navigation + b) track recording in a robust & waterproof package (as is the case for most auks) then I'd argue that Etrex is exactly what you want ! Barometric elevation is an option on the pricier models for those interested in AAA.
I'm not sure about the newer models but the HCx generation could even record two copies of the track, one to on-board memory, the other to the SD card.
Anectdata: I've had (very occasional) crashes, uncommanded switch-offs, battery failures, SD card failures, but I've NEVER lost a DIY.
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Just checked the info, hardly worth using if you don't use a smartphone. Since a smartphone has issues with battery life when using it for audaxing, any device designed to work together with a smartphone is of limited value.
If you want battery life, use a Garmin Etrex.
The batteries are basic AA, will last over 24h, and when they run out you just put a fresh pair in, or, if you don't want to stop specially, swap at the next control/natural stop after 2 bars. You've also got the advantage of the Garmin ecosystem - i.e. lots of other people to give advice, a choice of several versions of OpenStreetmap (rather than just what the maker chooses to give you), points of interest etc.
I don’t see the Etrex as being very cycle-friendly.
I think the world is divided on that one.
Whilst (most) Etrex models lack (some of) the features that (some) cyclists "want" (Cadence/power etc) if your needs are limited to a) navigation + b) track recording in a robust & waterproof package (as is the case for most auks) then I'd argue that Etrex is exactly what you want ! Barometric elevation is an option on the pricier models for those interested in AAA.
I'm not sure about the newer models but the HCx generation could even record two copies of the track, one to on-board memory, the other to the SD card.
Anectdata: I've had (very occasional) crashes, uncommanded switch-offs, battery failures, SD card failures, but I've NEVER lost a DIY.
How odd! This isn't on the audax board, and the OP made no mention of audax, and audax is a tiny corner of cycling, but three people have all started talking about audax!
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I don’t see the Etrex as being very cycle-friendly.
I think the world is divided on that one.
Indeed. I don't see the Edge as being very cycle-friendly. Stupid distance-related bugs, having to tell it to start recording, inconvenient batteries. Hardly what you need on a bike... :P
I'm not sure about the newer models but the HCx generation could even record two copies of the track, one to on-board memory, the other to the SD card.
Unfortunately not, but in the handful of times my eTrex 30 has crashed (due to openstreetmap map bugs or the SD card working loose) or run out of power, it's never lost the recorded track. The main risk is accidentally deleting the data by mis-clicking in the reset menu with cold/gloved fingers.
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According to Wiggle support "Unfortunately the Lezyne devices we offer do not support TCX or GPX files" - so they are out for me!
Apologies if I did not make my needs clear in the beginning, or if I am in the wrong place.... but, yes, I am primarily interested in audax (& recognise others may be focused on training, performance, touring, strava, social media, etc.)
I respect that Etrax is popular among audaxers, and struggle to explain my prejudice against it as I no longer care enough about cadence/HR to monitor them. Mmmmm
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The eTrex 30 can do Ant+ HR. And cadence, allegedly, but it won't play with my discrete cadence sensor (I think it wants the cadence data from a combined speed/cadence unit).
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I've got an unused Garmin speed/cadence sensor that I was about to put up for sale. Interested?
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I've got an unused Garmin speed/cadence sensor that I was about to put up for sale. Interested?
No thanks: I have the recumbent-friendly discrete sensors to use with an Ant+ computer (Bontrager Node) on the Baron, which works fine. I'm not particularly interested in logging cadence. But it's a gotcha with the eTrex that seemed worth drawing attention to.
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Perhaps it is different with maps (no maps on the 500), but I rely on the turn-by-turn instructions (plus the beep when I’ve gone off-course!), and more-so the beep and screen light after dark when approaching a turn. I regret the weeks of my life lost to entering them, but no way will I trust Google, Garmin or whoever to generate them from an autorouted course.
A problem would be that if you've invested time creating routes that work to give turn-by-turn on an Edge, they very likely would not work on an Etrex anyway. (Any more than they would on a Lezyne.)
At the very least, if adopting an Etrex (which like some others here, I would recommend) you would also have to learn a new workflow, unfortunately. I don't mean by that, that you have to trust the autorouting - I fully agree with your scepticism about that - but you have to learn how to make it do your bidding.
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... routes that work to give turn-by-turn on an Edge, they very likely would not work on an Etrex ...
Thanks ff - that is the kind of detail that is difficult to come by in all the glossy blurb… It would not be a deal-breaker for me – there are always new routes to enter and even old favourites get tweaked from year to year. (Besides getting a feel for the route beforehand is not entirely wasted effort.)
I saw the Garmin range (EDGE only!) in my LBS yesterday and was disappointed at the size of the 810 – bigger that the 500, but the map mock-up just looked so tiny to be unusable! (Bear in mind my eyesight isn’t the greatest.)
Comparing screen sizes, the 810 is bigger than the Etrex 30 but with less resolution, and smaller than the Etrex 35 but with bigger resolution!
My conclusion was the 1000 Explore (I swore I’d never look at them!) might offer a reasonable display size when it comes to maps…. But it lacks the 24 hr battery life the 820 promises in its save mode (display turned off).
OK, I’m going to stop fretting about this! Maybe by the January sales it will all become clear…
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Joth's law of audax GPS discussions: no matter the make and model of topic, the debate will descend to edge vs etrex.
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That's a natural follow up to the YACF law that discussion of any piece of cycling equipment will eventually descend to its suitability for audax. :)
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I have heard audax/randonneuring described as an attempt to create the perfect cyclist, "Any route, any distance, any weather, unstoppable." That concept seems like a reasonable test for cycling equipment.
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I have heard of audax/randonneuring described as an attempt to create the perfect cyclist, "Any route, any distance, any weather, unstoppable." That concept seems like a reasonable test for cycling equipment.
That's a good point, but it's not necessarily applicable to things like wicker baskets or GPSes that need to be slaved to a smartphone, which might be perfectly good products in their own context.
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I wouldn't be too interested in buying a wicker basket that rapidly deteriorates in the rain.
Over a decade ago, I was repeatedly passed during the Elenith 300 by a bloke riding a ladies hybrid with wicker baskets front and back. It opened my eyes as to what might be good equipment choices. Something that dies after a shower of rain is wall-art; not useful, practical equipment.
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Doesn't have to be slaved to a smartphone. Only if you want the live updates and SMS notifications etc, when using the GPS.
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Something that dies after a shower of rain is wall-art; not useful, practical equipment.
Like a map :demon:
I saw the Garmin range (EDGE only!) in my LBS yesterday and was disappointed at the size of the 810 – bigger that the 500, but the map mock-up just looked so tiny to be unusable!
Really - GPS map displays and paper maps - they are such different things that they should have different names - each is better or worse than the other in some situations, but it's difficult at first for anyone who loves paper maps (and most of us do) to wean themselves onto a pokey little 2x1 screen display - never mind it is more accurate, more detailed, and covers more terrain than the paper equivalent, weighs less, is more compact, is waterproof, and in many cases is easily updateable.
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A GPS receiver isn't really supposed to be a substitute for a paper map, it's more like a substitute for a compass. It helps you work out where you are and/or shows you which way to go. Yes, with a mapping-capable model you can program routes on it directly in extremis, but you wouldn't normally use it that way. It can also act as a more advanced form of bike computer, recording where you've been and how fast you were going when you got there.
A larger-screened, faster-CPUed tablet device with appropriate mapping software compares favourably to paper maps in most respects, at least for touring (where it saves volume and helpfully doubles as an internet access device, ebook reader, etc. etc.). I wouldn't carry one on an audax, and you probably still want the Garmin to keep an eye on things as you're riding along, especially if it's pish.
Paper maps are cheap, the batteries don't run out, and they have large displays. They're susceptible to wind, water, repeated folding, and don't work in the dark or tell you where you are without additional hardware. Updates are expensive.