Grammar that makes you cringe

[T42]

There's a TV series on UK TV at the moment called "Britain's Most Historic Towns"

At least the series is not called "Britain's Historickest Towns"

FTFY

[hellymedic]

Not really grammar but I really don't like it when technical terms are a mixture of Latin and Greek.

David gave a talk on the Society for Popular Astronomy's live lockdown show this evening  He was in a shed so we couldn't communicate directly. He points out the dark patch on Mars, known as the Mare Erythraeum and knows mare = sea (Latin) but is stuck on erythraeum (Greek, Latinised).

I posted in the 'Chat'...

[Giraffe]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erythraean_Sea

[T42]

Not really grammar but I really don't like it when technical terms are a mixture of Latin and Greek.

I remember John Wyndham remarking on that in a 1960 novel, Trouble with Lichen.

I got annoyed yesterday with a YT chappie who explained terms such as hypokalaemia in detail then talked about "a bacteria".

[quixoticgeek]

Not really grammar but I really don't like it when technical terms are a mixture of Latin and Greek.

David gave a talk on the Society for Popular Astronomy's live lockdown show this evening  He was in a shed so we couldn't communicate directly. He points out the dark patch on Mars, known as the Mare Erythraeum and knows mare = sea (Latin) but is stuck on erythraeum (Greek, Latinised).

I posted in the 'Chat'...

I'm reminded of the old classic

"Polyamory is wrong! you Shouldn't mix latin and greek like this..."

J

[mattc]

According to my dictionary historic means “famous or important in history”. Nothing wrong with some towns being historicer, meaning famouser or importanter than others.

This is why I am troubled by the word used in front of "sex crimes". 

[Paul]

There's a TV series on UK TV at the moment called "Britain's Most Historic Towns"

At least the series is not called "Britain's Historicest Towns"

Now “Britain’s Most Hysteric Towns”, I’d watch that.

(ETA: I do actually watch Britain’s Most Historic Towns, almost as much for the content as for the presenter)

[hellymedic]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erythraean_Sea

Given that an erythrocyte is a red blood cell and we docs use the term a fair bit, I didn't need to look anything up...

[citoyen]

According to my dictionary historic means “famous or important in history”. Nothing wrong with some towns being historicer, meaning famouser or importanter than others.

This is why I am troubled by the word used in front of "sex crimes". 

I gave a slightly more expansive definition:

'Historic' means more than just 'happened in the past' - because after all, not every past event is deemed worthy of being recorded in the history books. There's an element of fame (or infamy) and importance implied.

Besides, 'famous' and 'important' don't necessarily always have positive connotations.

[citoyen]

'Unbeknownst'

How has this ugly, unwieldy archaicism endured? It conveys no meaning that is not contained within the perfectly functional everyday word 'unknown' in half as many syllables. I can't think of an instance I have ever encountered where 'unbeknownst' could not be replaced with 'unknown'.

[Cudzoziemiec]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erythraean_Sea

Given that an erythrocyte is a red blood cell and we docs use the term a fair bit, I didn't need to look anything up...

I like the idea of the name being Latinized-Greekified Tamil though!

[ian]

'Unbeknownst'

How has this ugly, unwieldy archaicism endured? It conveys no meaning that is not contained within the perfectly functional everyday word 'unknown' in half as many syllables. I can't think of an instance I have ever encountered where 'unbeknownst' could not be replaced with 'unknown'.

I quite like the word. If you look at it for a bit, what a collection of letters they are. Each of them swaggering like an expanded version of alphabetty Reservoir Dogs.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Good point there. You've got a rare 4-letter consonant cluster backed up by two 3-ers.

[offcumden]

Not sure that this belongs here, but it does seem eminently cringeworthy, so just to get it off my chest...

Recently I saw an email where one francophone was seeking to assure a colleague, also a francophone, of his readiness to tackle a job - "Je suis dans les starting-blocks ...".  Surely, to French ears, that must sound, well, foreign? I doubt the Académie Française would approve.

I suppose we might say (not quite synonymously) 'on the qui vive' . . .

[Cudzoziemiec]

Possibly sounds less foreign to them.

Locution verbale dérivée de l'anglais. Employés en athlétisme, les startings blocks désignent un appareil où les pieds des sprinteurs sont disposés, de façon à pouvoir réagir immédiatement après le top départ. Par extension, cette expression signifie qu'une personne se tient à l'affût pour réagir le plus vite possible après un signal.

http://www.linternaute.fr/expression/langue-francaise/14434/etre-dans-les-starting-blocks/
Many examples here: https://www.linguee.com/french-english/translation/dans+les+starting+blocks.html

[offcumden]

Thanks, Cudzo.  It does look as if its use is quite common in French, although I'd never seen it written down before. Shouldn't surprise me really, although you'd think maybe there'd be scope to create a word using the resources of their own language? 

On the other hand:  peloton, domestique, savoir faire (and many others) are quite handy in English, and I've made good use of schadenfreude recently when looking across the pond . . . 

[Pingu]

'Unbeknownst'

How has this ugly, unwieldy archaicism endured? It conveys no meaning that is not contained within the perfectly functional everyday word 'unknown' in half as many syllables. I can't think of an instance I have ever encountered where 'unbeknownst' could not be replaced with 'unknown'.

There are unbeknownst instances to you - how would you know 

[Zipperhead]

And better make sure you have a good dump - if it's captured then the probing will be less messy.

[rafletcher]

Heard from an American colleague this morning, the verb  "taxonomize", not related to anything biological. Classify would have worked.

[ian]

That's what taxonomologists do.

[hatler]

And surely the results of their work will be taxonomologisations.

[drossall]

"Taxonomy" carries an implication of the structure being composed of meaningful words. Classification systems can be )alpha-numerical or otherwise devoid of inherent meanings. I started working on taxonomies and classification systems as a young information scientist, but find them still important now in Web sites.

However, I'm not convinced that "taxonomise" is itself a meaningful word. I'm not sure how you could convert something into a taxonomy if it were not one in the first place. Unless of course the speaker were confusing the items that were being classified with the taxonomy structure itself, and suggesting that the former were being "taxonomised". But that's rather the same point as about "hospitalisation" which, logically, does not mean "being taken to hospital", but "being converted into a hospital."

[ian]

Sometimes, I like to sit back and ontologificate things.

[T42]

"Taxonomy" carries an implication of the structure being composed of meaningful words. Classification systems can be )alpha-numerical or otherwise devoid of inherent meanings. I started working on taxonomies and classification systems as a young information scientist, but find them still important now in Web sites.

However, I'm not convinced that "taxonomise" is itself a meaningful word. I'm not sure how you could convert something into a taxonomy if it were not one in the first place. Unless of course the speaker were confusing the items that were being classified with the taxonomy structure itself, and suggesting that the former were being "taxonomised". But that's rather the same point as about "hospitalisation" which, logically, does not mean "being taken to hospital", but "being converted into a hospital."

In a wee while hospitalize will also mean go to hospital, as the passive is gradually ironed out of the language. "Where's Fred?" "Oh, he hospitalized with the Rona".  A bit after that he'll be crematorializing.  Of course, he might avoid all that by vaccinating.

[Mr Larrington]

"Taxonomy" carries an implication of the structure being composed of meaningful words. Classification systems can be )alpha-numerical or otherwise devoid of inherent meanings. I started working on taxonomies and classification systems as a young information scientist, but find them still important now in Web sites.

However, I'm not convinced that "taxonomise" is itself a meaningful word. I'm not sure how you could convert something into a taxonomy if it were not one in the first place. Unless of course the speaker were confusing the items that were being classified with the taxonomy structure itself, and suggesting that the former were being "taxonomised". But that's rather the same point as about "hospitalisation" which, logically, does not mean "being taken to hospital", but "being converted into a hospital."

In a wee while hospitalize will also mean go to hospital, as the passive is gradually ironed out of the language. "Where's Fred?" "Oh, he hospitalized with the Rona".  A bit after that he'll be crematorializing.  Of course, he might avoid all that by vaccinating vaccinationalizing.

FTFY