Nearly taken out tonight

[MattH]

I've just got in from taking a small group of people from my work out on a training ride for L2B. I thought I'd been storing up some karma when I stopped our group to help a guy walking along pushing his road bike; turned out he'd punctured 3 miles earlier but didn't have anything to fix it with, and faced another 4 miles home. Three patches sorted out his tube, which was doing a swiss-cheese impression, and we carried on.

Later on, I was riding alongside the weakest of the riders, some way behind the group, on a wide B road (wide enough to have white lines down the centre, and for cars to pass in opposite directions without worry - equivalent to many A roads). We were two abreast, with nothing coming towards us and, initially, nothing behind (so we weren't holding anyone up for extended periods doing a slow climb, for example).

Then the sound of a fast engine came from behind, and a honking horn. We were overtaken by a Sainsburys delivery van, literally a couple of inches from my arm (if I'd flexed my elbow it would have scraped on the side), then he cut across our front within inches of my front wheel. A slight wobble on my part and I'd have been under him. It was extremely aggressive, frightening and unecessary (there was nothing behind him, and nothing approaching). Luckily this is very rare where I live, it is the first time I've had anything like this.

I've just reported it to the police, I got his number plate and apparently they should take some kind of action as there is a witness in addition to me - but I'll see what they say when they come to take a proper statement.

[Wowbagger]

I think that you should also contact Sainsbury's to let them know that you have reported one of their drivers to the police. I think quite a lot of managers are quite concerned that their employees should present a friendly and responsible face to the general public.

Having said that, I emailed National Grid Gas over a week ago because I saw one of their drivers chatting merrily on his mobile phone whilst driving far too fast, with only one hand on the wheel, through a built-up area. I have yet to receive a reply.

[dkahn400]

I think that you should also contact Sainsbury's to let them know that you have reported one of their drivers to the police. I think quite a lot of managers are quite concerned that their employees should present a friendly and responsible face to the general public.

Having said that, I emailed National Grid Gas over a week ago because i saw one of their drivers chatting merily on his mobile phone whilst driving far too fast, with only one hand on the wheel, through a built-up area. I have yet to receive a reply.

I had a very quick and good response from DHL in similar circs.

[dkahn400]

Then the sound of a fast engine came from behind, and a honking horn. We were overtaken by a Sainsburys delivery van, literally a couple of inches from my arm (if I'd flexed my elbow it would have scraped on the side), then he cut across our front within inches of my front wheel. A slight wobble on my part and I'd have been under him. It was extremely aggressive, frightening and unecessary (there was nothing behind him, and nothing approaching). Luckily this is very rare where I live, it is the first time I've had anything like this.

Sounds like the old "How dare they ride two abreast? Good job I am here to teach them the error of their ways" ploy. It's a common belief among the motorised that cycling two abreast is illegal. Sometimes they appoint themselves as special deputy for the enforcement of imaginary cycling laws.

[PaulF]

I think that you should also contact Sainsbury's to let them know that you have reported one of their drivers to the police. I think quite a lot of managers are quite concerned that their employees should present a friendly and responsible face to the general public.

Having said that, I emailed National Grid Gas over a week ago because i saw one of their drivers chatting merily on his mobile phone whilst driving far too fast, with only one hand on the wheel, through a built-up area. I have yet to receive a reply.

I had a very quick and good response from DHL in similar circs.

I had a great response from DHL in similar circumstances, phone call and follow up e-mails. In The Other Place there were some templates for letters/e-mails to send, perhaps we could create something similar here. From scratch natch

(of course someone will be along soon to show that's already been done)

[GruB]

Oh dear, first PDM yesterday and now you Mattc.  They come in threes you know?  They come in threes.

[Regulator]

I say report the driver to Sainsburys.  Point out that liveried vans being driven dangerously are not good for their image.

Last week I complained to a large stationery retailer about one of their liveried lorries being driven in Chancery Lane (full of cyclists, pedestrians and building-related obstructions) whilst the driver was on his mobile phone.  I informed them I was offering them the chance to deal with it as an alternative to reporting it to the police.  I got a call yesterday informing me that this was not teh first time that the driver had been reported and as a result of my call he had been sacked.

That's one lorry that won't be driven by a twat.  Do I feel guilty that someone's lost their job?  Not at all.

[alexb]

Similarly, I phoned a company to complain about bad driving and got a verbal apology from someone who sounded genuinely appalled.

[Wendy]

+1 on reporting.  The police is good too, but hitting him in the job is perhaps the quickest and most direct consequence.

[gordon taylor]

If you write to Sainsbury's be sure to mention the Highway Code wording "not MORE than two abreast." I agree with the comment above that the driver was probably trying to enforce his version of the "law."

[MattH]

Then the sound of a fast engine came from behind, and a honking horn. We were overtaken by a Sainsburys delivery van, literally a couple of inches from my arm (if I'd flexed my elbow it would have scraped on the side), then he cut across our front within inches of my front wheel. A slight wobble on my part and I'd have been under him. It was extremely aggressive, frightening and unecessary (there was nothing behind him, and nothing approaching). Luckily this is very rare where I live, it is the first time I've had anything like this.

Sounds like the old "How dare they ride two abreast? Good job I am here to take teach them the error of their ways" ploy. It's a common belief among the motorised that cycling two abreast is illegal. Sometimes they appoint themselves as special deputy for the enforcement of imaginary cycling laws.

That was the feeling I got too, which is why I decided to report it. If it had been a bit close but felt like the driver had just made a mistake (the kind of thing where a driver will come past at a reasonable speed but maybe come back in a bit quickly) then I'd have let it lie. Obviously a mistake could leave a cyclist just as injured, but malicious drivers need to at least have it pointed out to them that their behaviour is not acceptable and may have consequences.

[Fi]

That sounds really scary.  You're right to report it, even if the police take no action, they might eventually if they get enough complaints from cyclists.

I used to ride up Chancery Lane, Reg, it's horrible as it's widish road and people seem to think they have to roar up it at great speed, only to be caught at the lights at the top.  I've had a number of "conversations" with drivers there.  The surface is dreadful too.

In the course of a telephoned complaint to one of the London bus companies last year, I said I don't suppose you'll do much about it. The lady replied, "Yes we do. I could name a number of drivers who are no longer with us because of complaints."

[juliet]

Definitely report it to Sainsburys.  I've done this several times (not for Sainsburys in particular, for several different companies!) & have had mixed results but frequently good ones. 

One of my letters c&ped from the Other Place ( http://www.anothercyclingforum.com/index.php?topic=19866.0 )

"I have a complaint about one of your drivers - in a BT
Openreach van, registration [reg number of van].

I was cycling east along Southwark Park Road (London SE16), around 1745
today (Tue 20 Nov), when your driver overtook me at high speed and far
too close - around a foot from my right shoulder.

This was just east of the junction with Dunton Road.  The road is wide
here and there is plenty of room for safe overtaking - and in any case
if there is not room to overtake safely and with appropriate space, the
driver should not have done so.

The Highway Code states that drivers should give cyclists plenty of room
when overtaking (rule 212) and at least as much space as you would give
a car (rule 163).

My experience is that the majority of professional drivers are safe and
courteous.  I am sure that you would not wish your drivers to have a
lower standard.

I would appreciate it if you would bring this to the attention of the
driver concerned, and take appropriate action to ensure improved driving
standards in future."

(got a phone call, apology, & IIRC promise to have a chat to all drivers, from that one.)

[mattc]

Sometimes they appoint themselves as special deputy for the enforcement of imaginary cycling laws.

Yes. And isn't it odd that they rarely go out of their way to enforce driving laws (imaginary or real)?

[MattH]

Thanks for the comments everybody.

I'm drafting a letter to Sainsburys, of similar tone to Juliet's (describe fairly clinically what happened, express disappointment that a professional driver could act in such a way, ask for appropriate action - not ranting).

I've just had a call from Hampshire police, checking a detail that didn't make sense (they had it as happening after 10pm; that was actually when I made the call once I got home). Apparently the van belongs to a leasing company not Sainsburys, so they are following that chain to find out who actually has it and so who the driver was.

At least they seem interested

[Gandalf]

Definitely report it to Sainsburys.  I've done this several times (not for Sainsburys in particular, for several different companies!) & have had mixed results but frequently good ones. 

One of my letters c&ped from the Other Place ( http://www.anothercyclingforum.com/index.php?topic=19866.0 )

"I have a complaint about one of your drivers - in a BT
Openreach van, registration [reg number of van].

I was cycling east along Southwark Park Road (London SE16), around 1745
today (Tue 20 Nov), when your driver overtook me at high speed and far
too close - around a foot from my right shoulder.

This was just east of the junction with Dunton Road.  The road is wide
here and there is plenty of room for safe overtaking - and in any case
if there is not room to overtake safely and with appropriate space, the
driver should not have done so.

The Highway Code states that drivers should give cyclists plenty of room
when overtaking (rule 212) and at least as much space as you would give
a car (rule 163).

My experience is that the majority of professional drivers are safe and
courteous.  I am sure that you would not wish your drivers to have a
lower standard.

I would appreciate it if you would bring this to the attention of the
driver concerned, and take appropriate action to ensure improved driving
standards in future."

(got a phone call, apology, & IIRC promise to have a chat to all drivers, from that one.)

Sadly I doubt it, I have worked for BT, more latterly Openreach for 22 years.  In all the plethora of briefings I have endured not once have a seen anything relating to driving safely and courteously, certainly no mention of cyclists.

They do send people on 'Drivewise' courses if they have too many accidents though.

[Eccentrica Gallumbits]

How many is too many? 

[Gandalf]

How many is too many? 

I'm afraid  don't know the precise figure. I'm pleased to report that this is not an area where I have first hand knowledge! 

I'll try and find out .