Is a mac book worth it

[Mr Larrington]

Am I the only person in teh WURRRLD who didn't have a problem with the care and feeding of an iPod under Windows then?

[Jaded]

When the iPod come out it could not be used with Windoze. It also was FireWire only.

[Kim]

Am I the only person in teh WURRRLD who didn't have a problem with the care and feeding of an iPod under Windows then?

I can't vouch for any of the people who never asked me to help sort their iTunes problems out.

[TheLurker]

Who's convinced that Macs can only be used for certain types of computing?

Ooooh Me! Me!  You can only use them for posey hipster stuff; like umm like... posting witticisms and deeply important philosophical stuff on the most up to date* social site whilst drinking artisanal coffee from tiny wee cups in a chic metropolitan coffee bar. 

*I.e. not YACF.  YACF is the preserve of horny handed sons (and daughters) of toil; their hands engrained with the grease and skog of a thousand bicycle fettling sessions and who dunk their biscuits in brick coloured tea laced with at least 3 tablespoons of sugar as they haunt workshops in damp railway arches in the quest for the lost ping-fuckit and the last but one version, or mebbe the version before that, of the DLL they need to get their bloody M$ Windows computer to work.

Anyone taking this post seriously is advised to find a comfy seat in front of the TV and get themselves on the outside of a several of mince pies or other festive grub 

[Bledlow]

Am I the only person in teh WURRRLD who didn't have a problem with the care and feeding of an iPod under Windows then?

Dunno. But I'm already pissed off with having to run an emulator for an obsolete version of Windows in order to use things I occasionally want to, or give people much more money than I think it's worth to use newer alternatives, & I have no desire to add yet more complications.

[Mr Larrington]

Miss von Brandenburg says similar things about the Mega-Global Fruit Corporation of Cupertino, USAnia   The outfit who publish Vectorworks do catch up with FruitCo's OS updates eventually, but it would seem that "backwards compatibility" is a phrase missing from their lexicon.

[SoreTween]

5 pages in and no one has mentioned the main reason I keep contemplating a macbook - the screen is the right shape.  You cannot buy a real laptop other than with 16:9 screen, 16:9 is perfect for watching movies and sub optimal for everything else including editing movies.  To get a 16:10 or 4:3 you need a macbook or Surface both of which are eyewaterinly expensive, have a piss poor array of I/O, cannot be upgraded and cannot be home repaired.

I was a microsoft fanboi until Office 2010.  I hated the fruity walled garden but have grudging respect for the way they work post Snowden.  I still just about come down on the side of microsoft these days but only because I know how to GPO - nothing from the user side attracts me any more.

[Afasoas]

I'm still not sure the bike analogy works. It's not like Cannondale have convinced anyone that you can only use a Cannondale for certain types of cycling and I've no idea what their profit margins are like, but I'd be surprised to see them as healthy as Apples.

Who's convinced that Macs can only be used for certain types of computing?

It's a strong notion amongst photographers I've conversed with.

[LEE]

Cheaper in the long run too... http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/apple-ibm-macs/

IBM is rediscovering what it preached in the '80s and '90s, that a proprietary system, that doesn't break, is cheaper in the long-run.

I used to work on the IBM AS/400, as proprietary a collection of hardware you're ever likely to find.  It looked expensive when compared to a rack of Windows PC servers and 3rd party software but it was more reliable than TANDEM servers (whose only reason for existence was their claimed reliability).  Yes, it limits available software, but the software that is available is generally better tested.

It's much like Apple vs Android.  I have many Android Apps at my disposal but my son, who's job relies on high-quality apps for his technical job, uses Apple Apps that really do seem better quality... at a price of course.

I need to think long and hard about the switch to Apple.  I may be travelling for a year or more and I need a Laptop that will cause me the fewest issues.

[Afasoas]

Essentially, IBM are eating their own dog food:

https://www.apple.com/pr/library/2014/07/15Apple-and-IBM-Forge-Global-Partnership-to-Transform-Enterprise-Mobility.html

[caerau]

invented the iPod

Nah, there were lots of portable players around before that.  The one I remember was the Diamond Rio, but I see there were several before that too.

The ipod was shiny and better marketed though.

    FFS, I wasn't saying they invented the mp3 player.  If I had I'd have said mp3 player, not ipod.


They didn't get to world domination through their computers, they got there through the ipod and the downstream consequences of that success.  THAT was my point.  *sigh*

[Jaded]

Haters gonna hate.

[DaveJ]

They didn't get to world domination through their computers, they got there through the ipod and the downstream consequences of that success.  THAT was my point.  *sigh*

Well yes, absolutely, I wasn't disagreeing

The iPod wasn't a new invention, they just did it better.  The one thing that Apple have done "recently" that was innovative was the iPhone.   That kickstarted the whole smartphone business.  The iPad was more like the iPod, lots of earlier examples of hand held computers, but again Apple just did it better.

Going back a bit of course, the Apple II was the machine that started the whole microcomputer business, because VisiCalc.

[ian]

Well, Apple certainly did pioneer in the graphic arts and publishing (or rather the software companies did for the platform). The first utile DTP and graphics applications ran on Macs. I remember using an early version of Illustrator on Windows (the first). It distinguished itself by not actually working. It made sense to capitalise on that market and the fact that Windows was for the types of people who liked spreadsheets (ironic, I suppose, considering Visicalc.) QuarkXpress, Pagemaker, Framemaker all ran on Macs.

These days, things like Creative Suite run equally on either platform, so I don't think to be honest it matters for graphics and publishing. Music and sound, more so, there's a lot of faff on Windows to avoid latency issues. Animation, unless you have the budget to pimp up a Mac Pro, can benefit for the hardware heft available for fewer ££££. But that's top end renders, not the sort of crap I churn out.

It don't matter. This 27 inch retina iMac is gorgeous and I don't care, I love it. Platonically, of course, anything else would make a mess on that pristine screen.

[Kim]

The iPod wasn't a new invention, they just did it better.  The one thing that Apple have done "recently" that was innovative was the iPhone.   That kickstarted the whole smartphone business.  The iPad was more like the iPod, lots of earlier examples of hand held computers, but again Apple just did it better.

For values of better that equate to making and marketing a desirable product for the masses.  The iPod appealed to people who didn't know what MP3 was; it was a shiny Walkman-like object that would hold their entire music collection, and it rapidly became cool amongst the cool kids, which undoubtedly helped.  It's probably true that Sony or whoever would have got us to the same point sooner or later - but Apple got it right first.

The iPhone sold the idea of pocket computing to people who'd never used a Blackberry, Palm or Psion.  It succeeded where the Newton failed, largely because the internet had matured to the point where normal people could see the point in a computer in their pocket, but also because it inherited a large helping of cool from the iPod, and was also a well-designed product.  The discovery that normal people would pay to use large amounts of mobile data then set things up for everything that came later.

[Hot Flatus]

The Ipod was lovely, as were Iphones....but so they should be at the price they were charging. Nice stuff is nice, and it usually costs more than the stuff that is not as nice. Comparing a MacBook to a cheaper Dell Inspiron seems a bit pointless tbh. There is no doubting that Apple got quite a lot right, and amongst that was normalising spending vast chunks of cash on ephemeral electronic devices by Apple fans.  Samsung et al have profited from that in recent years.

[Afasoas]

The Ipod was lovely, as were Iphones....but so they should be at the price they were charging. Nice stuff is nice, and it usually costs more than the stuff that is not as nice. Comparing a MacBook to a cheaper Dell Inspiron seems a bit pointless tbh. There is no doubting that Apple got quite a lot right, and amongst that was normalising spending vast chunks of cash of ephemeral electronic devices by Apple fans.  Samsung et al have profited from that in recent years.

The Inspiron laptops are aimed at the cheaper end of the spectrum, intended solely for consumer use. So no that wouldn't be fair.
The XPS on the other hand has been aimed squarely at the MacBook. I wouldn't plump for one personally, but they do the lightweight/small/sexy packaging thing well. Enough to impress our sales staff anyway.
I would personally go for a Latitude or Precision laptop as the former is built for every day usability (better ergonomics) rather than maximum portability/sexyness and the latter is intended to be a mobile workstation. Indeed, it has 3 million more pixels than a retina display, so that must make it better

[Pickled Onion]

I don't think bike analogy works - unless you can name a manufacturer/brand that uses components that are welded into the frame, or provides ancillaries that can only be bought with and used on bikes of their own manufacture.

Brompton

So: "Is a Brompton worth it?"

Clearly Bromptons are overpriced if you consider the sum of the parts. There are plenty of cheaper folders that will do the job of getting you somewhere, and for many people they will be perfectly adequate. They have standard components that you can easily fix or change at home.

With a Brompton you are mostly tied to Brompton components (some of which can't easily be replaced by the owner), and specific luggage, etc. You are paying a premium for the fold, the size, the lack of flex, etc. Things which may not be important to everyone, but are important enough to a lot of people who are happy to pay extra for them. Or perhaps all the Brompton owners here have been suckered by the branding, and form a Brompton fanboi clique?

[fuaran]

Well Brompton are also keen on illegal price fixing...

[Kim]

I'd say that was a good analogy.  Brompton make good (if overpriced) products, but their worldwide success is as much about marketing their particular flavour of shinyness as the functionality being optimised for a particular niche.

The same could be said for Brooks, whose platform remains tragically incompatible with my, erm, software.

[Jaded]

Yeah.

I except a thread soon

"Is a Brompton Worth it."

Followed by

"Is a Pinarello worth it"
"Is a (insert name of expensive bike brand here) worth it."

What is it about computers that brings out sad people, telling you that you could have got something cheaper?

[Kim]

Yeah.

I except a thread soon

"Is a Brompton Worth it."

Several of those in the Folders board already.  It's a perfectly reasonable question, like the OP's.

[Hot Flatus]

Maybe the Pinarello analogy is apposite.

Its made of the same raw materials as all the other bikes of its type. The groupset is made in the same factory as that found on a Boardman. It probably rides much the same, but of course its higher price tag and brand caché may alter the perception of its owner. After all, why else did they pay the premium?

It has, of course, got a name that trades on past glory and a better paint job. And yes, Pinarello owners possibly want you to know that they ride a Pinarello

 

[nicknack]

What is it about computers that brings out sad people, telling you that you could have got something cheaper?

It's not just computers.
Anyway, it's possibly that some folk don't like people flaunting their wealth.
I probably need a whole pile of smileys here.

[Maverick]

What is it about computers that brings out sad people, telling you that you could have got something cheaper?

It's not just computers.
Anyway, it's possibly that some folk don't like people flaunting their wealth.
I probably need a whole pile of smileys here.

Have a look at some of the guitar boards