Yet Another Cycling Forum

General Category => Freewheeling => The Dark Side => Topic started by: Von Broad on 18 June, 2023, 06:04:46 pm

Title: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 18 June, 2023, 06:04:46 pm
Ok, dragging myself back out of the gutter,I've managed to qualify for PBP, but still haven't pulled the trigger quite yet. Indecision is hangin around....

But, if I do end up going, I've made a decision to retire my home build SWB...be nice to ride something else.

So...[and I'm under no illusion that this is not going to be easy, so I don't need to be reminded!!], but having always really liked tadpole trikes, but never ridden one, I'm borrowing a mates 15yr old [but with only about 2k miles on the clock] Trice Q to attempt the Flatlands 600 next weekend, as a potential trial for PBP. I'm fortunate that I don't need to get round in time, but I'll be making a concerted effort too.

The mesh seat was not comfortable at all, and the boom is fully extended, so I've spent the weekend making brackets and fitting one of my old homemade fibreglass seats. It feels much better, but boy, on account of taking it round a large car park today, I can see why they added suspension to these things! [this Trice Q is the pre-suspension, triple 406 wheel version] It's going to be a bone shaker alright!

I've taken the chain tubes off and made a chain retention bracket for the drive idler. The tyres are Kenda Quests. Not the best, but surprisingly I can see no evidence of sidewall deterioration at all, so I'll take my chances. I do have some [old] marathon racers here, so I'll take a couple as spares.

I've only a few days to finish all the fettling, but I was wondering how folk attach GPS devices to these things?
I'm used to having the navigation unit virtually under my nose on my SWB bikes, and they can be very difficult to see in strong sunlight.
I'll be using a bare bones track on an Etrex Legend HCX. I've seen nav units attached to the main frame, but that looks a fair distance away from what I'm used too. I'll sort something out.

Can't help thinking of dear Mr Larrington [and, I think, Silverback OTP] who found themselves in a pickle on account of the retaining bolt of the handlebars breaking causing detachment from the main frame. [If memory is working as it should?]. 

Relatively old as it is - these bikes are just so brilliant. I've always fancied having a go on one, so here we are.

And as for the ICE VTX......well...!
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: fd3 on 18 June, 2023, 06:52:20 pm
For GPS/Garmin, you either have a bar-end on the handle which you can mount it to, or you mount to the "stem" (potentially using an extender).
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 18 June, 2023, 07:10:58 pm
For GPS/Garmin, you either have a bar-end on the handle which you can mount it to, or you mount to the "stem" (potentially using an extender).

Yeah thanks, this thing has got bar-end shifters, so some quick bodgy fabrication will be required before the weekend. I have loads of plastic pipe and zip ties!
I always have a route sheet [of course I do!], but it's quite important to have your Garmin easily accessible and convenient for 'messing about with'. At least it is in my experience!
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on 18 June, 2023, 07:11:15 pm
Audax recumbents need fast tyres. Marathon Racers are not that. Small-wheel unsuspended trikes need fat tyres, minimum 40mm width, and low-ish pressures. If you do take the Trice to PBP, splash the cash for good tyres.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 18 June, 2023, 07:13:11 pm
Audax recumbents need fast tyres. Marathon Racers are not that. Trikes need fat tyres, minimum 40mm width, and low-ish pressures. If you do take the Trice to PBP, splash the cash for good tyres.
That's good advice. What would you suggest LWB?

I'll have a read of this [probably can't get half these tyres now!]
and do some research
https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=113399.0
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: fd3 on 18 June, 2023, 08:40:43 pm
Topeak Bar extenders?
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Kim on 18 June, 2023, 09:41:14 pm
On my Streetmachine, I have the GPS mounted using a stem (which has some sort of extra accessory bar sticking out in what-would-normally-be-the-front of the handlebar clamp) clamped to the derailleur post so it points backward towards the rider.  It's just about readable, though I tend to use turn-by-turn navigation for extra visibility.

I reproduced this on barakta's ICE using an 'accessory bar' thing from SJS (had to spread the clamp a bit to make it fit) pointing upwards.  It's not great for reading the screen, but she doesn't use it for navigation (mostly just the e-bike console), and worked fairly well for battery lights back in the day.

The alternative would be either something clamped to the handlebars below the grip; maybe a stem cap bracket on a kingpost; or perhaps on the main tube between your legs (which probably isn't great for reading the screen without sitting forward?).

Basically a case of muck about to find the least-worst option that fits around your controls.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on 18 June, 2023, 09:47:06 pm
Start with Schwalbe Big Apple 50-406 for English road surfaces. They might be overkill for French roads.

Continental Contact Urban 42-406 or 50-406 are reputedly a good combination of speed, durability and puncture resistance but I have not tried them.

Greenspeed Scorcher 40-406 are very quick but not particularly puncture resistant.

https://shop.ginkgo-veloteile.de/en/Wheel-Accessories/Tires-Tubes/Tires-406-mm/ might be useful to you.

Upright trikes are about 10-12% slower than upright bikes. Heavier + additional wind resistance. I don’t see why recumbent versions would be much different.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 18 June, 2023, 10:40:16 pm
The alternative would be either something clamped to the handlebars below the grip; maybe a stem cap bracket on a kingpost; or perhaps on the main tube between your legs (which probably isn't great for reading the screen without sitting forward?).

Basically a case of muck about to find the least-worst option that fits around your controls.

Yes, these would appear to be the two options.

It's a tight fit, but below the handlebar grip is probably where I'll go if I end up riding it further.

The main tube between the legs is going to be too low, but something extended from the main tube sticking up between the legs would work. But as you know, lifting yourself out of the bike is one of the ergonomic [not the right word] features on the these bikes. It would be a bit odd sticking something too high between your legs so as to make removing yourself some kind of gymnastic manoeuvre! Pardon my language, but there's probably a sweet spot there somewhere, as regards height so that when you lift yourself up [and down again], nothing gets too tangled up! It's probably the easiest thing to rig up in the time I have.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Tigerbiten on 19 June, 2023, 04:26:20 am
Play around with your tyre pressure to try and find if there's a sweet spot between soft and slow vs hard and harsh.
I find it's around 60 psi on my trike.
The other thing is I run different tyres front/back on my tadpole trike.
Front punctures are easy to fix as you don't need to remove a wheel. So I run a nice light tyre on my  front wheel. The risk of a puncture is upped slightly due to tyre weight but it also absorbs more of the road buzz at the right pressure.
While rear punctures are just a PITA to fix. So I run something heavier that has slightly more puncture resistance than the light front tyres. It will not absorb as much road buzz as a lighter tyres but the improved puncture resistance more than makes up for this.

Luck .........
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: ElyDave on 21 June, 2023, 07:23:38 pm

And as for the ICE VTX......well...!

I've had those thoughts as well, as a (very) fast tourer, but don't have £5k tucked away down the side of the sofa

I'm also very unclear on their rack potential
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 21 June, 2023, 09:07:44 pm

And as for the ICE VTX......well...!

I've had those thoughts as well, as a (very) fast tourer, but don't have £5k tucked away down the side of the sofa

ICE just sold an ex-demo VTX on Ebay for £1470. How old exactly, I'm not sure. It's been around for a while now, hasn't it?
I saw it late...too late really to give it any consideration. Bit silly buying something you've not ridden at all. Or is it? :-)

edit: I've rigged up a foldable Garmin holder that's attached to the main tube - it folds up between your legs to put the Garmin about 400mm from your face and then folds down when you want to get off the bike. It is rather cool, if I say so myself, but there is a big question around durability [as in even getting to the first control in one piece!]
It's made of 40mm and 32mm push fit waste pipe - which is basically saying it's made of cheese. Soft cheese at that!
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Blodwyn Pig on 21 June, 2023, 09:25:15 pm

And as for the ICE VTX......well...!

I've had those thoughts as well, as a (very) fast tourer, but don't have £5k tucked away down the side of the sofa


edit: I've rigged up a foldable Garmin holder that's attached to the main tube - it folds up between your legs to put the Garmin about 400mm from your face and then folds down when you want to get off the bike. It is rather cool, if I say so myself, but there is a big question around durability [as in even getting to the first control in one piece!]
It's made of 40mm and 32mm push fit waste pipe - which is basically saying it's made of cheese. Soft cheese at that!


Any photos :)
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 21 June, 2023, 09:29:22 pm

And as for the ICE VTX......well...!

I've had those thoughts as well, as a (very) fast tourer, but don't have £5k tucked away down the side of the sofa


edit: I've rigged up a foldable Garmin holder that's attached to the main tube - it folds up between your legs to put the Garmin about 400mm from your face and then folds down when you want to get off the bike. It is rather cool, if I say so myself, but there is a big question around durability [as in even getting to the first control in one piece!]
It's made of 40mm and 32mm push fit waste pipe - which is basically saying it's made of cheese. Soft cheese at that!


Any photos :)
See what I can do.....[have to sort a drop box account of something...hang on]

Not sure if this will work..
photos (https://www.dropbox.com/photos?_tk=web_left_nav_bar&role=personal&di=left_nav)
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: ElyDave on 21 June, 2023, 10:06:40 pm

And as for the ICE VTX......well...!

I've had those thoughts as well, as a (very) fast tourer, but don't have £5k tucked away down the side of the sofa

ICE just sold an ex-demo VTX on Ebay for £1470. How old exactly, I'm not sure. It's been around for a while now, hasn't it?
I saw it late...too late really to give it any consideration. Bit silly buying something you've not ridden at all. Or is it? :-)

edit: I've rigged up a foldable Garmin holder that's attached to the main tube - it folds up between your legs to put the Garmin about 400mm from your face and then folds down when you want to get off the bike. It is rather cool, if I say so myself, but there is a big question around durability [as in even getting to the first control in one piece!]
It's made of 40mm and 32mm push fit waste pipe - which is basically saying it's made of cheese. Soft cheese at that!

I did something like that on my M5 to hold a rear light - attached to the headrest, actually seemed to work OK.

My main problem this evening, putting away the Airnimal after using it for commuting duties, dyno light working great.  Thought I'd spin up the rear wheel on the S40 for fun - nothing.  Dunwich dynamo weekend after next, nephew's engagement next weekend, have I got time for electrical fault tracing?  I've barely got time to scratch my arse!

May be Plan B - ride the Faran, instead.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Mr Larrington on 22 June, 2023, 12:51:29 am

And as for the ICE VTX......well...!

I've had those thoughts as well, as a (very) fast tourer, but don't have £5k tucked away down the side of the sofa


edit: I've rigged up a foldable Garmin holder that's attached to the main tube - it folds up between your legs to put the Garmin about 400mm from your face and then folds down when you want to get off the bike. It is rather cool, if I say so myself, but there is a big question around durability [as in even getting to the first control in one piece!]
It's made of 40mm and 32mm push fit waste pipe - which is basically saying it's made of cheese. Soft cheese at that!


Any photos :)
See what I can do.....[have to sort a drop box account of something...hang on]

Not sure if this will work..
photos (https://www.dropbox.com/photos?_tk=web_left_nav_bar&role=personal&di=left_nav)

Not on my fondleslab it doesn’t chiz.  's like Bandcamp; insisting I need to update my browser even when it’s on the most recent version available.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 22 June, 2023, 07:03:47 am
Not on my fondleslab it doesn’t chiz.  's like Bandcamp; insisting I need to update my browser even when it’s on the most recent version available.
Seems hardly worth it for a bit of plastic pipe, but this might work (https://photos.app.goo.gl/BqeGV1rZW3FULBCS9)

[edit: can't help thinking of you Dave and your audax endeavours since I borrowed this Trice.....did you get your XL sorted in the end? [sheered handlebar bolt?]]
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: MattH on 22 June, 2023, 07:27:33 am
On my XL I mount the GPS on the right hand handlebar, on the bar sticking out under the grip (equivalent to where you have the bell on the left), with the little bar swung to be pointing outwards. Normal Garmin mount when outdoors, RAM mount and X-Grip for my phone when on the turbo indoors. The position isn't as good as your plastic pipe one, but it is pretty stable.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: JonBuoy on 22 June, 2023, 07:34:12 am
Not on my fondleslab it doesn’t chiz.  's like Bandcamp; insisting I need to update my browser even when it’s on the most recent version available.
Seems hardly worth it for a bit of plastic pipe, but this might work (https://photos.app.goo.gl/BqeGV1rZW3FULBCS9)

[edit: can't help thinking of you Dave and your audax endeavours since I borrowed this Trice.....did you get your XL sorted in the end? [sheered handlebar bolt?]]

It needs a urinal arrangement plumbing into it so that you can pee on the move to save time ;)
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Blodwyn Pig on 22 June, 2023, 07:40:26 am
Have you actually tried it yet, might wobble to much to read it. Possibly some version of  the last photo, less tall, and braced against the derailleur post.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 22 June, 2023, 07:58:31 am
It needs a urinal arrangement plumbing into it so that you can pee on the move to save time ;)

Someone on this forum once called me a 'pikey'  ;)
Don't give me ideas!

Have you actually tried it yet, might wobble to much to read it.
Quite, was my thinking too.
There will be lots of vibration, but I'll be vibrating too, so should be synchronized!
And no, I haven't tried it yet, quick bodge, I'll try it on the day  :)

With the same pipe, I've also made a 'stand' [cough] to jack up the back wheel 100mm or so [with front brakes on] to facilitate dealing with visitations.
Haven't tried that either :-)
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: fd3 on 22 June, 2023, 09:40:46 am
My main problem this evening, putting away the Airnimal after using it for commuting duties, dyno light working great.  Thought I'd spin up the rear wheel on the S40 for fun - nothing.  Dunwich dynamo weekend after next, nephew's engagement next weekend, have I got time for electrical fault tracing?  I've barely got time to scratch my arse!
Well, as a first look would it make sense to plug the Airnimal lights into the dynohub on the S40 and see whether that works?  This would then tell you whether the hub is the issue (assuming you don't rock the multimeter electrickery thang).
If it does work then it's a wiring issue and you just need to trace that - most likely the run to the front light as (ass_U_ME_ing usual dyno wiring) the rear runs off the front - but you could check that in less than a minute by unplugging the back.
Again, I am ass_U_ME_ing that you have to run extra long dyno cable to connect the front light to the rear dynamo, so the likelihood is that you need to swap that out - but removing the front light and then plugging it directly into the rear hub is a 5 min job.

I reckon you could get it done in 10 mins, it's the "sourcing new rear dynamo cable + ends + soldering" which would be the faff - were it needed.
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: ElyDave on 22 June, 2023, 10:46:17 pm
see my post in teh knolidge, I reckon it's something to do with the USB Werk, which I fully intend to remove as an example of a never fully functioning waste of money
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 26 June, 2023, 05:46:09 pm
short update....

I managed [with no sleep and 4 mins to spare at the finish] to get round the Flatlands 600 on the Trice over the weekend.
SWB recumbents are not news to me, but trikes are so it was still quite an adventure riding a recumbent trike for the first time.
I really enjoyed trying something different [and professionally built lol]

Hardly news to all you seasoned trike riders, but a couple of observations....

Firstly, I was initally concerned about how I was going to keep all three tyres and tubes from yielding big holes and tears due to fights with pot holes, but Judith Swallow [HK otp] gave me some very useful and welcomes advice before we set off - 'steer with the boom, keep your rear wheel out of trouble and don't worry quite so much what the front wheels are doing'. This proved to be invaluable right from the outset in having some kind of guidance to work with. I spent the whole weekend quite fascinated how the front wheels, due to a lack of direct heavy weight pressing down on them were able to bounce out of mischief when it came their way.
[Does anybody know what the model number is for these Sturmey Archer single-sided brake hubs? I can't see anything visible on the casing. I think I'll need to service the hubs, the bearings have got some play.             

Balance and stability.  This has gradually become a bit of a big deal for me over the years. I can only think it down to exhaustion and fatigue, but after about 300km on the longer a general sense of balance, especially when climbing and moving off from a stationary position can become a bit problematic - as in literally falling off. This is not good and it gets very stressful. It reached a nadir last year on the FF600 with me ending up in a hedge with the bike on top of me. So what a joy it was to have this removed from the ride. A lot of brevets can occasionally cross busy A roads so being comfortable with a general sense of control over your bike is so important. 

3. The bodgy waste pipe GPS unit holder, worked a treat, and although veering slightly over to one side by the time Sunday came around, I was surprisd how little vibration there was troubling the unit over the weekend, there was some but not half of what i had anticipated. I follow a basic   track, so clear vision is everything. It was never a problem to read the line of navigation. Was there some vibration? Yes, of course, but it was never a problem. Reading the screen in bright sunlight presents many more restricting factors for me. Given a bit more thought, I would say there is definite mileage in a design like this.

And the downside, and it's a big downside as regards riding brevets - and that's how they climb - slowly and steadily with lots of close incremental gearing. They are what they are. I knew that anyway. Mind you, some rides are better than others for recumbents. Give me long gradual climbs and swooping long descents any day of the week as opposed to short sharp ups and downs. But I'm no fast cyclist anyway regardless of what I ride, so what does it really matter? Certainly at the moment stability and balance are much more important.

And I don't need to talk about descending.

As for PBP - the final curtain for payment in the UK is Saturday. I'm still procrastinating, but I might give the Trice a go on PBP. If that happens - I'm building a [luggage] tailbox, for sure.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: GavinC on 26 June, 2023, 06:14:08 pm

[Does anybody know what the model number is for these Sturmey Archer single-sided brake hubs? I can't see anything visible on the casing. I think I'll need to service the hubs, the bearings have got some play.             

The single sided hubs are Sturmey X-SD (https://www.sturmey-archer.com/en/products/detail/x-sd) though I would imagine they share most of their internals with the regular X-FD brake hubs.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 26 June, 2023, 06:19:29 pm

[Does anybody know what the model number is for these Sturmey Archer single-sided brake hubs? I can't see anything visible on the casing. I think I'll need to service the hubs, the bearings have got some play.             

The single sided hubs are Sturmey X-SD (https://www.sturmey-archer.com/en/products/detail/x-sd) though I would imagine they share most of their internals with the regular X-FD brake hubs.

Ah thanks, I did have a look on the site earlier, but wasn't quite sure [and so, so tired!]

edit: what about bearing quality? Do you have a preferences of manufacturer??
[believe it or not, I've never had a hub with sealed bearings before!]
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: fd3 on 27 June, 2023, 10:43:24 am
short update....
Some really good points in there.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: PhilO on 27 June, 2023, 11:08:39 am

edit: what about bearing quality? Do you have a preferences of manufacturer??
[believe it or not, I've never had a hub with sealed bearings before!]

I don't have any experience with re-bearing-ing SA hubs, but I did spend a few years working as an engineer for NSK... 

If I was doing it, I'd probably use -2RS rather than the specified ZZ bearings (rubber sealed rather than shielded). There's a theoretical increase in drag from the seals but it's tiny and the bearings should last indefinitely. I would definitely buy named branded product, but beyond that there's no particular advantage of one manufacturer over another.

The most important thing is to be careful fitting them; don't drop them, don't knock them in with a mallet - press them,  only press on the ring that's being fitted (ie outer ring when fitting to a housing, inner ring when fitting to a shaft). At least 90% of warranty returns we saw had failed due to such 'fitting abuse'...
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 27 June, 2023, 06:16:51 pm

edit: what about bearing quality? Do you have a preferences of manufacturer??
[believe it or not, I've never had a hub with sealed bearings before!]

I don't have any experience with re-bearing-ing SA hubs, but I did spend a few years working as an engineer for NSK... 

If I was doing it, I'd probably use -2RS rather than the specified ZZ bearings (rubber sealed rather than shielded). There's a theoretical increase in drag from the seals but it's tiny and the bearings should last indefinitely. I would definitely buy named branded product, but beyond that there's no particular advantage of one manufacturer over another.

The most important thing is to be careful fitting them; don't drop them, don't knock them in with a mallet - press them,  only press on the ring that's being fitted (ie outer ring when fitting to a housing, inner ring when fitting to a shaft). At least 90% of warranty returns we saw had failed due to such 'fitting abuse'...

That's helpful, thanks PhilO
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Wobbly John on 27 June, 2023, 09:56:54 pm

[Does anybody know what the model number is for these Sturmey Archer single-sided brake hubs? I can't see anything visible on the casing. I think I'll need to service the hubs, the bearings have got some play.             

The single sided hubs are Sturmey X-SD (https://www.sturmey-archer.com/en/products/detail/x-sd) though I would imagine they share most of their internals with the regular X-FD brake hubs.
The single sided hubs have larger od bearings, presumably to cope with a 12mm axle instead of 10mm.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: mr ben on 29 June, 2023, 11:26:46 am

And as for the ICE VTX......well...!

I've had those thoughts as well, as a (very) fast tourer, but don't have £5k tucked away down the side of the sofa

I'm also very unclear on their rack potential

I had a go on one at the York Rally.  Where's the thigh-rubbing emoji?  I've only tried a bent trike once before and this was something else (as indeed were the Sprint and Adventure I also had a go one).  Alas my sofa is also barren.  I asked about luggage generally and the person from ICE said something about them all having touring in mind, but sorry that's a bit vague!

short update....

I managed [with no sleep and 4 mins to spare at the finish] to get round the Flatlands 600 on the Trice over the weekend.
SWB recumbents are not news to me, but trikes are so it was still quite an adventure riding a recumbent trike for the first time.
I really enjoyed trying something different [and professionally built lol]
...
As for PBP - the final curtain for payment in the UK is Saturday. I'm still procrastinating, but I might give the Trice a go on PBP. If that happens - I'm building a [luggage] tailbox, for sure.

Very interested to hear if/how you get on.  How does this compare with your non-trike 600 km experiences?
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 29 June, 2023, 08:57:54 pm
Very interested to hear if/how you get on.  How does this compare with your non-trike 600 km experiences?

Will....I'm 64 now, and not having had any cycling experience between the age of 18 and 40 [fags, booze and other things], I would describe myself as a leisure cyclist. I've never been part of a road club, never done any time-trialling and don't have the history of cycling in my legs during those important years of youth etc Many may laugh, but the pace of Audax is quite fast for me. You really do have to keep moving to get round. And if your pace is on the less-speedy side then the whole process can get very stressful as the clock ticks. I'm just not a fast cyclist, regardless of what I'm riding.  And by fast, I mean, quick enough to get ahead of the audax game and accrue enough time to sleep on the longer events. This is what the longer events are all about - being quick enough to get some kip to make life a bit easier for yourself the following day. On PBP 2007, I think I managed to get 4hrs sleep [out of a total of 90hrs!] All three PBP's have been masterclasses in sleep-deprivation. And I suspect this coming one is going to be no different [providing I manage to get there and get round at all]. So we need to look at ourselves first before we go putting too much expectation on the bike.

Having said that, with that kind of tiredness, I am prone to coming off the bike - especially my two-wheel recumbents deep into a longer ride, so the stability of the trike was really a revelation. Climbing 'felt' a tad slower on the trike, but also less stressful in a way due to not having to worry about stayting upright. Gears and more gears.

Bikes get talked about a lot. It's as much about the engine that sits on the bike as well as the bike itself.
Met a guy this year, called Rab -[I don't think he posts here], but he rides a Pelso Brevet - a dual 26" high racer, and he looked pretty useful as a person who rides recumbents on audax. Moves over the ground nicely. Much quicker than me, that's for sure.

Would I have been that much quicker on a VTX than the TriceQ last weekend? Possibly, but somehow I doubt the difference would have been that much at the end of the day.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: PaulM on 30 June, 2023, 11:39:34 am
Regarding tyres, on an unsuspended Q I'd suggest something having around 40mm width. Although I haven't tried them, the reports are so good I'd suggest the 42-406 Conti Contact Urban. Although there is a 32mm version I believe it comes up narrower, closer to 28mm.

http://www.wrhpv.com/smalltyreshop/index.htm#!/Contact-Urban-Tyres-42-406/p/492574883/category=0 (http://www.wrhpv.com/smalltyreshop/index.htm#!/Contact-Urban-Tyres-42-406/p/492574883/category=0)

I think the latest Marathon Racers are pretty decent and good value. I'm using folding Maxxis DTH which have 120 tpi and are comfortable. I did a comparison test with Racers and they were 2% quicker over a week's commuting BUT I  ran the DTHs at 60 psi and the Racers at 45 psi, which is one reason I  think the new Racers are quite decent.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 01 July, 2023, 12:40:54 am
Regarding tyres, on an unsuspended Q I'd suggest something having around 40mm width. Although I haven't tried them, the reports are so good I'd suggest the 42-406 Conti Contact Urban. Although there is a 32mm version I believe it comes up narrower, closer to 28mm.

http://www.wrhpv.com/smalltyreshop/index.htm#!/Contact-Urban-Tyres-42-406/p/492574883/category=0 (http://www.wrhpv.com/smalltyreshop/index.htm#!/Contact-Urban-Tyres-42-406/p/492574883/category=0)

I think the latest Marathon Racers are pretty decent and good value. I'm using folding Maxxis DTH which have 120 tpi and are comfortable. I did a comparison test with Racers and they were 2% quicker over a week's commuting BUT I  ran the DTHs at 60 psi and the Racers at 45 psi, which is one reason I  think the new Racers are quite decent.

LWB suggested the Contact Urbans too, and likewise, hasn't tried them.
Interesting you mention the latest Marathan Racers, as opposed to previous versions that maybe weren't so good?
Funnily enough, the Kenda Quests that have come with my mates Q, [must be 15yrs old, most of that time not being used], and show no sign of sidewall deterioration at all!! And they held up just fine on the ride last weekend.
Anyway, plenty to go on...and spend money on....and like all these things, see for oneself.
Thanks
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: PaulM on 01 July, 2023, 11:54:24 am

LWB suggested the Contact Urbans too, and likewise, hasn't tried them.
Interesting you mention the latest Marathan Racers, as opposed to previous versions that maybe weren't so good?
Funnily enough, the Kenda Quests that have come with my mates Q, [must be 15yrs old, most of that time not being used], and show no sign of sidewall deterioration at all!! And they held up just fine on the ride last weekend.
Anyway, plenty to go on...and spend money on....and like all these things, see for oneself.
Thanks
Schwalbe certainly increased the tread depth of the Racers, and they are forever tinkering with compounds so who knows. What's strange is how similar the Durano, the Kojak and the Racer are in their construction but you hear different things about them. In my hands the Kojak tread seems a lot stiffer than the Durano and Racer tread and yet they are all a double layer of nylon RaceGuard. The Racers are quite a tall tyre and the sidewalls seem flexible with 67 threads per inch. Again the Durano and Kojak have similar 67 tpi sidewalls but I'd take the Racers any day. Maybe the extra height and width makes a better rolling tyre.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: mr ben on 03 July, 2023, 04:11:09 pm

Bikes get talked about a lot. It's as much about the engine that sits on the bike as well as the bike itself.


I am a similarly full value audaxer; a 400 km that starts in the morning is ok, I can stay awake for 24 hours.  Longer than that and I really struggle with the tiny amount of sleep I have time for.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 13 August, 2023, 08:00:37 pm
but I might give the Trice a go on PBP. If that happens - I'm building a [luggage] tailbox, for sure.

Ok, so I don't always follow things through, but I have forced myself to keep my word this time.....being on the wagon helps.

Finished the tailbox today....PBP next Sunday!!!

For those interested in real basic kitchen table carbon fibre layup then I've taken some photos of the build sequence. There is no explanation text, but it's kind of obvious how I've knocked this up. I think.

I have some carbon cloth, and three batches of laminating resin with a view to building a bike. It hasn't happened [I got close].
The resin is about 10 yrs old....so I wondered about it's integrity, but I 'think' it's ok. I made the wheel arch first as a separate item, then the first bit of the main shell then bonded the two together, and built it up from there.

I followed no plan, no dimensions and had idea what I was doing. Make it up as you go along kind of thing. I have a shed at the back of a Butchers Shop, and there is loads of cardboard knocking around from meat deliveries, so I figured I may as well make use of it. That, and about 4 cans of expanding foam.

Tailbox (https://photos.app.goo.gl/tA4zXzn6P8vv4PTu6)


It's real basic stuff. The main draw back with this very basic wet layup is the lack of proper compression of the laminate and getting all the epoxy out. Carbon fibre done like this can get heavy with too much epoxy floating around. But I don't have access to vacuum bagging right now, so it is what it is.

But, running it round the car park today, I think it will work. I'll take another look after the 1200km of PBP!!

It struck me a few days ago, that changing a visitation in the rear could prove to be somewhat of a pita on a trike, so I made a simple wheel stand (https://photos.app.goo.gl/h6Gu8Wbgj2VJecR56) out of some 40mm waste pipe wrapped in carbon [photos a bit milky...need to clean phone].
I don't think I'm going to regret making this.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Kim on 13 August, 2023, 08:16:16 pm
Needs a BHPC race number on it, really...    :demon: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 13 August, 2023, 08:29:48 pm
Needs a BHPC race number on it, really...    :demon: :thumbsup:

That......is not such a bad idea.

Tell you what, you've just reminded me of something Kim, as a token of support [I think I stopped my membership a while ago] I have a BHPC long-sleeved shirt from err...2006?....that I have never worn - anywhere. Why? Well, to be honest, I really never liked the logo.....no offense to anybody, but thought it was bloody awful tbh. But, all being well, I will take it to Paris and wear it at the start.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: fd3 on 14 August, 2023, 12:24:54 pm
I like the stand idea!
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Kim on 14 August, 2023, 12:33:46 pm
Not so much for visitations (where you can just tip the trike onto its side), but for fettling anything involving chains and gears, it's incredibly useful to have something to prop the rear wheel off the ground, as you'd need to be a 6ft orangutan to be able to turn the cranks at the same time as lifting the rear end.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: PaulM on 14 August, 2023, 02:17:08 pm
The Contact Urbans look smart  :). Have you noticed any improvements over the Kwests?

EDIT: I'd be interested to know the measured width of the 42mm Contact Urbans when mounted on the rims. I'm  toying with the idea of buying a couple for two of my 'bents.
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Wobbly John on 14 August, 2023, 03:11:55 pm
I’m planning to make a tailbox for the Windcheetah at some point. I have some Thermahex sheet offcuts that seem to be the way to go for a one-off. https://www.panelsystems.co.uk/product/thermhex-polypropylene-honeycomb-core
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 14 August, 2023, 07:46:36 pm
Not so much for visitations (where you can just tip the trike onto its side), but for fettling anything involving chains and gears, it's incredibly useful to have something to prop the rear wheel off the ground
Indeed. Originally made for the fairies, but I have to admit to realizing how useful it is to having the back end propped up to adjust gears. [both hand brakes on of course].
I've noticed some scuff marks on both front hubs, presumably from my mate tipping it on it's side, so that has to be guarded against really, it just needs something to protect the hub from getting unnecessarily scratched if tipping it up on the road, which is easily done of course, just need to remember.

The Contact Urbans look smart  :). Have you noticed any improvements over the Kwests?

EDIT: I'd be interested to know the measured width of the 42mm Contact Urbans when mounted on the rims. I'm  toying with the idea of buying a couple for two of my 'bents.

The width of the mounted Contact Urbans is exactly 42mm.
When I first put them on, they didn't sit on the rims at all well - really lob-sided. I thought, 'oh no, this is not good at all', but it turned out I wasn't providing enough air for them to 'pop' onto the rim properly. Reminded me a bit of how a car tyre inflates. They look well meaty.
It's difficult to know how they compare to the Kwests just riding round a car park, but they certainly didn't feel any slower that's for sure. I'll find out next week I guess! They're rated at 87psi....which is a very specific pressure!

I’m planning to make a tailbox for the Windcheetah at some point. I have some Thermahex sheet offcuts that seem to be the way to go for a one-off. https://www.panelsystems.co.uk/product/thermhex-polypropylene-honeycomb-core

I'm sure you've messed around with composites WB. It's all about preparation and care taken to get as good a mold as possible, and also to avoid any sharp corners that are very difficult to work the fabric round. Convex and curvature are your friends.
It makes you appreciate folk that are skilled at working with composites [people like Geoff Bird and Simon Sanderson from BHPC] because although simple in one sense, it's a real art to produce results with a good finish - that also have the necessary strength integrity as well. A tailbox is a good place to start though.
Like with so many things experience is everything. I think when you get good at it, people seem to prefer pre-preg over wet layups. Maybe.
Just need one of your dynamo windmills now :-)
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: JonBuoy on 14 August, 2023, 08:57:56 pm
I'll find out next week I guess! They're rated at 87psi....which is a very specific pressure!

That'll be 5.99844bar  ;)
Title: Re: Trice Q try out....
Post by: Von Broad on 15 August, 2023, 10:06:09 am
I'll find out next week I guess! They're rated at 87psi....which is a very specific pressure!

That'll be 5.99844bar  ;)

Right, I'll have to be mindful of that - it says 6bar on the tyre!  :)