Author Topic: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?  (Read 4384 times)

Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« on: 04 February, 2009, 12:08:38 am »
Recently I've had the chance to compare a Vista C with my old faithful Summit, and I'm not convinced that a mapping GPS is a great advantage. I have started to need reading glasses in the last year or two, and I don't wear them (obviously) on a bike.

The Summit has a nice large black arrow showing which way I should be going, and clear text. The Vista C was a bit small, with hard-to-read messages about heading SW (which way is that?) and a pointer I could hardly see.

My eyes are not bad - it's just hard to read really small text while trying not to land in a hedge.

Thoughts? Am I missing an obvious feature? Or should I save the Vista C and its maps for walking, when there's time to get the glasses out?

simonp

Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #1 on: 04 February, 2009, 12:12:26 am »
There is an arrow screen on the Etrex Vista, plus you can make the text bigger by having fewer things displayed (e.g. if you have speed + trip distance + distance to turn + waypoint name all displayed, they will be in a smaller font than if you just have 1 or 2 of those, so that they fit).

Chris S

Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #2 on: 04 February, 2009, 07:40:05 am »
I need +1.5 reading glasses, but don't have a problem with seeing the map on my Vista Cx.

TBH the bouncing around of the handlebars does more to wreck any focus than any age related short-sightedness, and yet I can still see enough for it to be useful. I can't read the waypoint text as it's too small, but it's displayed on the banner at the top in big friendly middle-ager text.

Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #3 on: 04 February, 2009, 07:46:26 am »
Thanks for the useful suggestions. I did know about the arrow screen, but I was taking the view that there's little point in a mapping GPS unless I'm using the mapping screen. Obviously you can switch, but in mid-Audax I probably wouldn't.

The trick of turning off some text elements is a handy one. I'll look into that (too many options, too little time!)

I've also noticed that you can make the map rotate to direction of travel instead of to orient north. That may help.

I'll give it another try, but that big black arrow that swings violently just before each turn still has a lot to be said for it :thumbsup:

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #4 on: 04 February, 2009, 10:06:54 am »
Bring on the voice prompts ;- )
(An entire audax bunch approaching a L turn, all with voice prompts on ...)

I agree entirely about the uselessness of the message prompts, and I turn these off.
And top of my wish-list for the Etrex C series would be a contrastier screen, and/or with anti-reflective glass - would that be so hard, Garmin?

My eyes are pretty shot - I use +2 specs and still read at arm's length.  For me, these Etrex C models are OK, but borderline.  I use the map page with 2 data fields like this:
NB this shot is larger than life-size:

The map itself seems fine to me - OK the detail is a blur but its still heaps better than 'no map'.   The data fields are OK for me at this size - I have to limit the waypoint names to 6 chars because above that it switches to a smaller font. (The waypoint name is 'Next' above)
Note that if you have the map in 'track up' mode then the purple route line to the next junction always points in the same direction as your pointer would.
Because I don't use the popup instructions I use the waypoint names instead and embed instructions into those (as above - the next instruction is a 'L' turn).  This does take a bit of prep time and I could understand anyone  who wasn't prepared to spend this time. 
The Garmin-generated instructions in 'Follow road' mode are actually a bit more blindie-friendly - as here:


Quote
Obviously you can switch, but in mid-Audax I probably wouldn't.
Its quite simple to set these models up so that one button just toggles between your two favourite screens, whatever they may be.  A 'how-to' for that is here:
http://www.aukadia.net/gps/lwg_4.htm
when you're dead you're done, so let the good times roll

andygates

  • Peroxide Viking
Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #5 on: 04 February, 2009, 10:14:43 am »
Having a map is good for when you get lost, even if you don't use it otherwise. 

Turn "declutter" on for cleaner displays.
It takes blood and guts to be this cool but I'm still just a cliché.
OpenStreetMap UK & IRL Streetmap & Topo: ravenfamily.org/andyg/maps updates weekly.

Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #6 on: 05 February, 2009, 12:01:42 am »
I don't think the Vista C has a declutter. I've just been through the options with the helpful guidance above. I can cut down to three data fields but not two on most displays.

Thanks all. Roll on the next Audax ;D

Wowbagger

  • Former Sylph
    • Stuff mostly about weather
Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #7 on: 05 February, 2009, 12:19:28 am »
I wear bifocals when cycling and I've had no problem. My close-up vision is quite poor.

On Saturday's Willy Warmer, I merely had the track loaded onto the machine, as supplied by Manotea, and the little arrow followed the track. I found this was quite sufficient for route finding. The route sheet was in my pocket and pulled out at critical moments if I was in any doubt, which was rare.

At one point, when I was riding in a group with Andrij, Geraldc and Mercury, we passed a left turn we should have  taken. It was well after dark by this time. Andrij had the route sheet on his bars and between us he and I were doing the navigating. Within about 10 yards of passing this junction, I announced that I thought we should have turned there, quite simply because the little arrow suddenly diverted off the track.

I don't get any announcements, but I just keep an eye on the screen before a junction and afterwards.
Quote from: Dez
It doesn’t matter where you start. Just start.

Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #8 on: 05 February, 2009, 01:08:20 pm »
These experiences are interesting - would be useful to know to which model each relates. I was trying a Vista C - are the HC or HCx models significantly better, for example?

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #9 on: 05 February, 2009, 01:10:45 pm »
The C screen is less contrasty than the Cx and HCx - the difference is subtle but clear enough when you put them side by side.  The 'x' models are worth having for their data card if you need to store a big map (eg for a overseas trip) but the difference between Cx and HCx seems negligible to me.

I don't think the Vista C has a declutter.

With the map page displayed, use the 'menu' key (bottom left key) and one of the options presented should be 'Turn Declutter On' (or Off).
I've never noticed it making much difference - I think it depends what zoom levels you like to work at, and interacts with some of the thresholds settable under 'Setup Map' - but the way I have mine set up, Declutter doesn't do anything noticeable. 

In the same menu, 'Data Fields' gives the options of None, 2, 3 or 4.  For the Map page.
For other pages the options may be different, the Compass page only has options for 3 or 4.  Also the different generations of 'C' - C/Cx/HCx all have minor variations on the theme.
when you're dead you're done, so let the good times roll

Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #10 on: 05 February, 2009, 01:58:58 pm »
The 'x' models are worth having for their data card if you need to store a big map (eg for a overseas trip) but the difference between Cx and HCx seems negligible to me.
The HCx has a High sensitivity receiver, and will continue to give a position under trees and in streets lined with high buildings (or even indoors), where the Cx and C give up.

The data card in the 'x' models will also allow you to log your rides to the card. If you don't have a card you have the 10,000 points in the "active track", but as soon as you save a track the GPS auto-simplifies it and you lose all time and height information. Logging tracks to card means you don't have to download to PC before your next ride.

Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #11 on: 05 February, 2009, 02:48:30 pm »
frankly frankie - that's helpful. I was using the main setup menu, which seems to offer many of the same options, but not all - doesn't seem to have Declutter for example ???

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #12 on: 05 February, 2009, 04:54:40 pm »
Yeah, there's not much logic to any of it.
I think its actually only the Setup Map that is obtainable in two different ways - but everything else is randomly distributed between the 'menu key' which gives in-context options for each screen, and the Setup pages.
There's a (nearly complete) menu map here:
http://www.aukadia.net/gps/gpsmanual.pdf

Some screens, like this, are downright hard to find!

when you're dead you're done, so let the good times roll

Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #13 on: 05 February, 2009, 05:17:11 pm »
Some screens, like this, are downright hard to find!

Especially on a Vista C ;D

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #14 on: 06 February, 2009, 11:22:12 am »
The HCx has a High sensitivity receiver, and will continue to give a position under trees and in streets lined with high buildings (or even indoors), where the Cx and C give up.

I have all 3 models (that is, Sheila and I have, between us) and in practical cycling use, I don't see a difference, under dense tree cover.  Not much experience in urban canyons but I would expect the H models to do their stuff and give a position but you'd have to think it may not be a very good one.  Whether a poor fix is better than none depends on the situation, I suppose.

Under trees, I find their behaviour really interesting.  Taking the Cx for a walk, it will struggle even under quite light cover, deciduous trees in winter for example, and give up almost straight away. 
At cycling speeds, and mounted on the handlebars, it is quite a different animal, and forest cover has to be really dense and prolonged before you see any problems.  Its as though, it may never see more than 1 sat at a time, but at each grab it gets a different sat, and it manages to integrate the information as it goes along.  The faster you go, the better this works.
We've been along long winding forest roads in central France, and by overlaying the two tracks later, there's no significant variation to be seen, between Sheila's HCx and my Cx.  If you stop at a junction, or slow down up a steep climb (under tree cover), then yes, the HCx hangs on a bit better than the Cx does - but keep it moving at a decent pace and the older models seem to cope OK.

(Climbing makes it hard for 2 reasons - one you are travelling slower so the gaps in the canopy are less frequent - and two, you are likely to be more bent over the handlebars and screening the GPS with your body.)
when you're dead you're done, so let the good times roll

Lycra Man

  • SR 2011, 2012 & RRTY
Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #15 on: 06 February, 2009, 07:11:51 pm »
Frankly Frankie,

Very useful guide you attached, but I am puzzled on one thing.

I have an Etrex Legend Cx with a memory card, and following your guidance notes, I cannot 'see' the Memory Card.

I tried both the recent 2GB one I bought 3 months ago, and the original 32MB that came with the device.

Any ideas?

Lycra Man

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #16 on: 08 February, 2009, 09:41:56 am »
Do you mean see it as an external drive?

If you can see maps on your GPS (other than the very crude basemap - trunk roads only) - then the card is there and working.
If you can't see the maps then try reseating the card - but since you've tried 2 cards it won't be that.
A 2Gb card should work fine.

To see it as an external drive when connected to the PC, you have to:
power up the GPS
connect as normal
go into Setup, then Interface, then USB Mass storage.

In practical terms, this is only really useful for copying the daily track logs off the card.
Most other 'connect' operations use 'Garmin' mode where the GPS doesn't appear as external storage*

* Etrex and other models of similar and earlier vintage.  New models such as 605/705 and Colorado/Oregon, work a different (better) way.
when you're dead you're done, so let the good times roll

Lycra Man

  • SR 2011, 2012 & RRTY
Re: Etrex without reading glasses: mapping or not?
« Reply #17 on: 08 February, 2009, 10:38:12 pm »
FF,

Thanks. Using that method, I can 'see' the drive, but I have already removed all tracks to my PC, so will try again once I have ridden somewhere.
Regards
Lycra Man