Etrex 20 missing recorded track

[vorsprung]

I did the "Valley of the Rocks" 200km event yesterday and for no real reason I was going to put the recorded track onto Strava

But when I came to look for it, it wasn't there.  There was a file for today (day after) and a tiny file dated with yesterday, which under examination appeared to have stuff from really early in the morning only on it

I am familiar with how the file system is laid out and I looked in "Current" and "Archive" but didn't find what I was looking for

The disk on the Garmin is not full it's only 30%

My unit is set up with Frankie's recommendations to auto archive daily and I don't remember seeing doing this before

In this case it really doesn't matter but I hope it doesn't do this (rare - one off in years of use) when I'm on a DIY GPS that uses the recorded track as proof of passage!

[Ian H]

It's not part of today's track, is it?

Or did you just dream you rode the event?

[vorsprung]

It's not part of today's track, is it?

Or did you just dream you rode the event?

1) No, the file is too small

2) That sounds more likely

[Phil W]

You've probably already done this but sometimes a GPX track has a few duff dates in the first few track points and that can cause it to be saved under the wrong date. So take a look at some of the other files to see if their last updated date is yesterday.  I've had this happen but can remember if it was my older edge unit or the etrex. I suspect the former but worth a check.

[frankly frankie]

There is an option to not record a track, but it's most unlikely that you would have switched this on by accident.

I do find the 30 (in my case) quite flakey and prone to lose Tracks that have been loaded into it - one time they're there in the track list, then they're gone, reboot and sometimes they come back.  It's a heap of junk really. 

[vorsprung]

There is an option to not record a track, but it's most unlikely that you would have switched this on by accident.

I do find the 30 (in my case) quite flakey and prone to lose Tracks that have been loaded into it - one time they're there in the track list, then they're gone, reboot and sometimes they come back.  It's a heap of junk really. 

Yes, I've seen disappearing tracks after uploading them.  A disappearing recorded track isn't one I've seen before.  I might have another look for it tonight and see if it has appeared again "by magic"

[Samuel D]

It's a heap of junk really.

Is there anything usefully better in your opinion?

[frankly frankie]

Not among current models (though the newer 30x display is much improved over the 30, but that's a rather minor thing) - but I don't have much practical experience of the Edges. I'd like to keep an open mind about them but what I have observed 2nd-hand as it were, from riding with several Edge users over several years, isn't very encouraging.

[vorsprung]

i found a ".tmp" file from the 2nd of April, fixed the broken xml and loaded it into gpxeditor

This gave me the first 20km of the day, until I got to the start of the event at Honiton.  I remember pressing buttons on the garmin to try and load the track to navigate by
as I left Honiton and going backwards and forwards with mispresses as the bike bounced.  Maybe this was enough to make it flip it's wig

[vorsprung]

This times missing track is from day 1 of the unpronouncable Black Sheep 600 in Wales at the weekend

The route does Tekwesbury, Monmouth, Llandovery, Tregaron, Barmouth, Betsy Coed - about 400km

The gpx for that day conked out at approx Llandovery, maybe a little before

I would guess that part of the problem might be that I managed to exceed 10,000 points.  I started at just after 5am, archiving is automatic at mid night.  Looking at older
tracks rides of this length are quite near the limit

The "truncated" file for the first day contains exactly 3000 points

Update: I notice there is an auto archive setting "when full" perhaps a better choice for the next time I'm riding for 19 hours straight

[Phil W]

I had my etrex 20 lock up on a Welsh 400. Luckily  it didn't actually lose the tracks.  I too have mine set to archive at midnight. Interestingly the track was split into two days by the time I looked at it back home. Joining the two tracks together revealed 9,800 trackpoints. So very much looks like the 10,000 trackpoint limit being hit. I was navigating it as a single 400km and suspect this caused it not to archive the current track as normal after midnight.  The unit was off then on after midnight as I was stopped at the west end cafe Llandovery between midnight is hand 1am.

I've never hit the problem when I split a similar long track into shorter 200km legs before. I've changed track recording to less as I don't need a trackpoint roughly every 7 seconds. I'm also being more thorough at ensuring I've split a long track into shorter sequenced ones before a ride, as well as filtering out the bloat / reducing the number of trkpoints.

[Ian H]

I have just uploaded Jamie's two tracks for tonight's Avalon 400.  I reduced them to 1000 points each which gives two files each under 50kb.  I've also added a waypoint for each control with proximity warnings.

I'm also being more thorough at ensuring I've split a long track into shorter sequenced ones before a ride, as well as filtering out the bloat / reducing the number of trkpoints.

Are you saying that the track you loaded influences the recording, or just that they both use the same space?

[vorsprung]

Another missing track.  I rode to the pub and back about 60km, took under 3h

Tried to put the track into Strava this morning and there was nothing there

The trip counter showed a 60km-ish trip though, so I didn't imagine it!

Will investigate further tonight

[frankly frankie]

Using default recording settings, a 600km will probably exceed 10,000 points (though not by much - a 400km should be OK) - but I wouldn't expect that to be a problem if you also have auto-archiving set to archive daily, because the ride extends through two calendar days.  Of course if you have deviated from the default recording settings all bets are off.  On older Etrexes it was also necessary to set the recording method to 'Wrap when full' (the alternative being to just stop when full) but I don't see an equivalent option on the E30 - what mine appears to do is just start a new Active Log Current track every day, deleting the old one (but I haven't used it in a midnight situation - so all I ever see is that yesterday's ride is archived and today I'm starting a new ride).

Maybe a 'safe' procedure using the E20/30 on a 600 would be to turn it off and on again as soon as is convenient after midnight (say at the next control) to encourage it to do whatever archiving/cycling of tracklogs is necessary.

NB that the older Etrexes, although they have capacity for 10,000 points, came out of the blister pack factory set to 3000 points (as I recall) - it is necessary to raise this limit which is a setting oddly found under Map Setup.  I can't imagine why they were set up this way as the 10,000 points Active Log appears to be a fully reserved memory space.

[Pingu]

On my settings (I don't know what they as I'm not at home just now), at midnight the eTrex 30 archives the Current track and starts a new Current track.

[Oaky]

On my settings (I don't know what they as I'm not at home just now), at midnight the eTrex 30 archives the Current track and starts a new Current track.

Same here.  My settings are pretty much factory defaults with changes as per Frankie's eTrex configuration article(s).

[vorsprung]

On my settings (I don't know what they as I'm not at home just now), at midnight the eTrex 30 archives the Current track and starts a new Current track.

Right, the problems I've had before (not the recent going to the pub incident) were when there was a 5am start and I managed to use up more than 10,000 points before midnight

So as I was riding along, at midnight, the eTrex attempted to save the bigger than 10,000 points chunk and lost most of it.  It then started a new session from where ever I was at midnight.

When I came to look at it the track was

 

• start at 5am from Tewkesbury to some random point on the way to Llandovery
• then an appaernt gap from there until midnight somewhere on the way to Betsy
• the device is switched off at the stop in Betsy, recording is paused
• next day I switch on and carry on to the finish back at Tewkesbury, which works fine

[Ian H]

I recorded the Buzzard 600 earlier this year – first time I have bothered to record an event of that length. 

Etrex 20 set to-
record method: auto
recording interval: less often
Auto archive: when full

I ended up with two tracks to join together, but no missing sections.  Managed on one set of batteries as well.

[Oaky]

My settings:-
record method: auto
recording interval: more often
auto archive: daily

on an eTrex 20, certainly managed to record a 600 including the ride to the start, starting at 0430 sat, and finishing at ~2200 Sun.  Two tracks generated, no missing points.  I'm running an eTrex 30 now with the same settings.  I'll find out in about 10 days' time whether that works the same way.

[frankly frankie]

"more often" is probably pushing it if you're starting at 04:30 and expecting to ride and record through till midnight (when it gets archived).  My E30 on 'more often' uses about 1000 points to record about 35km (it can vary a lot obviously, depending on terrain) so you might expect to run out of points after 350km-ish.  The default normal setting would probably be good for 500km and not many randonneurs would ride 500km between 4:30 and midnight, so that should be fairly safe. 
'more often' is a good setting for shorter rides, certainly.

[Oaky]

"more often" is probably pushing it if you're starting at 04:30 and expecting to ride and record through till midnight (when it gets archived).  My E30 on 'more often' uses about 1000 points to record about 35km (it can vary a lot obviously, depending on terrain) so you might expect to run out of points after 350km-ish.  The default normal setting would probably be good for 500km and not many randonneurs would ride 500km between 4:30 and midnight, so that should be fairly safe. 
'more often' is a good setting for shorter rides, certainly.

Thanks for this!

I just checked a  historical track from the eTrex 20 set to "more often" and between midnight and just after 10p.m. it did ~8400 points corresponding to almost exactly 200 miles (so - consistent with yours at approx 38km per 1000 points).  Looks like I was just about riding slowly enough / in suitable terrain to squeak in below the 10,000 limit.  Checking a more recent track, though, I got more like 30km per 1000 points, which would have pushed me over.

I think I'll back off my setting to "normal" ahead of the next 600.

[frankly frankie]

Riding slower generates more points, in general.  In another tracklog I checked while preparing the previous message, 1000 points only went 20km - but I was riding uphill (with luggage) for all that distance.  And it was a very wiggly road.  My 35km example was riding fairly fast in gently undulating terrain on a main-ish road.

[Pingu]

So who's going for the 10000 point distance record?

[vorsprung]

had a good rumage on the disk and there are no .tmp files

so the eTrex 20 seems to have totally failed for no apparent reason

[Ian H]

had a good rumage on the disk and there are no .tmp files

so the eTrex 20 seems to have totally failed for no apparent reason

A bit like Mrs B's, though her's was in torrential rain, and incorporating a falling off.