Buying at an LBS/off the internet dilemma

[Rhys W]

I need to make a major purchase due to unforeseen circumstances. I've found the make/model that ticks all the boxes for me and there's a shop a few miles away (not my usual shop, but I like going there when I can) that has been selling this make for years - it's the owner's personal favourite in fact. I phoned up to inquire if they had one my size, although I didn't expect such a small shop to carry a lot of stock. No, but they could probably get one in. I think I made it clear that if they could get it I'd be round at the earliest opportunity to buy it. I asked him to give me call back once he knew if he could get it.

A week goes by... nothing. After 10 days I call back, thinking he might have lost my number or something. Apparently he'd spoken to the distributors the day before and was waiting to hear back from them. I emphasised again that I'd practically made my decision that this was what I was after and that I preferred buying it from the shop rather than going online. Another 10 days goes past and I hear nothing - it's been three weeks now and I haven't been called back. If the distributor doesn't have one, then at least he should call back and let me know what the situation is.

Now it's getting a bit urgent, so plan B is put in motion. I email 4 online shops that show they carry this model and size, and surprisingly, all 4 email back within 24 hours! As I suspected, 3 of them don't actually have it in stock and would have to order it, but one has one in stock - with free shipping.

Now, I'd really like to buy it from the shop, but not returning calls and not giving me a yes or no answer in 3 weeks is really trying my patience. What would you do?

[Polar Bear]

I tend to visit my lbs rather than phone them.   They're a great bunch.

[Canardly]

Its a major purchase and having a local LBS is always a good thing. Give him one more shot thinks.

[epa611]

Go buy online.  Sounds as if he has no idea about customer service and does not deserve your business!

[Basil]

One more chance with a personal visit.

[Kim]

That sounds suspiciously like you're trying to buy a recumbent, in which case such things are normal and you'll just have to persevere...

[Rhys W]

I should clarify - when I say local it would be a 40+ mile round trip for me, but it is very much "local" in terms of the cycling scene in this part of the world. But I agree, calling in would have been better.

I'm quite loyal and supportive of local shops when it comes to things like this (and not just for bike shops), I'm sure many people would have taken their money elsewhere if they hadn't heard back within a week.

[Euan Uzami]

What would you do if you were the shop, and someone had shown interest, and you were keen to make a living and satisfy the customer?

What woiuld you do if you were the shop, and someone had shown interest but you weren't that bothered about them?

Which one of those does the shop seem to be doing?

There's your answer.


Aside.

The number one annoyance when I go into a bike shop
"er... no, sorry we haven't got one of those in stock. But we can get it!"

well I can get it, Ironside!
Anybody can get it..., the whole point of coming into a bike shop is to walk away with it in my hands today.

It's a bit of a shame but it's a self fulfilling prophecy. People buy off the internet, so bike shops lose trade and can't afford to keep masses of stock.  So they haven't got what people want, so they buy off the internet. Full circle.


I have absolutely no qualms about not giving my local bike shop any trade. The last two times I've been in there, once was to get a repair quote for crash damage for a bike with carbon forks, and he wouldn't write them off as he was more scared about getting found out by the insurance company for "false accounting" than me injuring myself again due to  unforseen damage causing the  forks to fail. 

The most recent time was to get some sealant for tubeless tyres, he said
"oh, is it for that bike? those aren't tubeless at the moment, you'll need a conversion kit if you want to run them without tubes."
"No, they're already tubeless - they haven't got tubes in."
"Those tyres have got tubes in."
"How much do you want to bet that those tyres have NOT got tubes in?!!"
"Oh, ok - sorry. Yes, here you go then, this is the sealant you need."

If i hadn't known, he would have had me convinced. He was adamant and the shame is, a lot of people who don't know any better will be getting told completely wrong things with an air of authority. 

[Rhys W]

The number one annoyance when I go into a bike shop
"er... no, sorry we haven't got one of those in stock. But we can get it!"

I don't mind this, as long as it's in a reasonable timeframe. Even if it costs slightly more, there can be many reasons why the shop would be the better option - especially for a complete bike.

It's the not bothering to call me back in three weeks that annoys me. If I had a bike shop I'd be doing everything possible to ensure that money was being spent in my shop and not elsewhere.

[contango]

The number one annoyance when I go into a bike shop
"er... no, sorry we haven't got one of those in stock. But we can get it!"

I don't mind this, as long as it's in a reasonable timeframe. Even if it costs slightly more, there can be many reasons why the shop would be the better option - especially for a complete bike.

It's the not bothering to call me back in three weeks that annoys me. If I had a bike shop I'd be doing everything possible to ensure that money was being spent in my shop and not elsewhere.

I like to support local businesses as long as they support me in return. If their "unique selling point" is nothing more than being local I'm really not interested. If they look after me then I'll buy more stuff from them.

My LBS is almost always more expensive than online box shifters but they've helped me out several times over the years I've been cycling so a good chunk of the time I'll buy things from them even if it takes a little longer and costs a little more. When I broke my back wheel the owner lent me a wheel to keep me on the road, lent me a truing stand and a couple of wheels with worn out rims so I could practise stripping and building wheels, and then gave me a discount when I ordered my own truing stand. That sort of thing has a value to me, so I'll pay a little more to preserve it.

On the other hand when I went to my local IT service shop to get a laptop drive cloned they wanted £45 + VAT to do it, but then said it would be another £45 + VAT for the operating system. When I asked why there were two charges to just clone a drive because it didn't matter what was on it they just said that was their charging structure, and it would take 7-10 days to do. So I bought a USB doodad for £20 and did it myself, and haven't set foot in that shop since then.

In your case it sounds like the LBS doesn't really care about doing business with you. I'd say if they're this tardy about keeping you informed when you're trying to give them money they're not going to be any better if you have a warranty issue, so I'd conclude they don't want your business. Personally I'd be tempted to email them and let them know that you bought your expensive bike elsewhere because they seemed to find it too much trouble to tell you what was going on, even if only to make it very clear to them that treating customers badly costs them business.

[Karla]

Buy online.  There's supporting your lbs, then there's supporting bad customer service.  Like you I prefer to support the former, but it sounds like this has gone way into the latter so you shouldn't have any qualms about taking your money elsewhere.

[Kim]

The number one annoyance when I go into a bike shop
"er... no, sorry we haven't got one of those in stock. But we can get it!"

I don't mind this, as long as it's in a reasonable timeframe. Even if it costs slightly more, there can be many reasons why the shop would be the better option - especially for a complete bike.

Indeed.

Complete bikes and clothing (and to a lesser extent luggage) - that's where physical shops have the edge, the stuff that you *really* want to fondle before buying.

If they haven't got the bike I'm interested in, they'll probably be able to get one in a reasonable timeframe, or another physical shop might have it.  It's the sort of thing you'll allow them some flexibility over, but there's a point where they clearly can't be arsed.

Clothing, well, I've yet to see a bike shop with more than a token selection of non-road shoes or women's-specific clothing, so critical things like shorts, saddles and shoes will continue to be a case of online-shopping-roulette.  More generic items (gloves and the like) do tend to be stocked, and I'm happy to buy something I like from the shop I find it in.


Otherwise, it's a guy with a spanner and a back room full of readily available spare parts, both of which I try to avoid needing on principle (YMMV).  Knowledge, at least for the sort of thing I tend to ride, is something you get on the internet (or in far away places like London, Edinburgh or Little Thetford).

[Glover Fan]

All LBS in my experience since the "cycling popularity explosion" have become a lot less bothered about my custom as I know what I want and they don't seem to be able to sell me what I don't need as opposed to somebody with no knowledge about cycling, so they can reach their greatest margins.

So I just buy online now.

I just don't do the "buy parts for bike online and ask LBS to fit them". Against the rules.

[Cudzoziemiec]

I just don't do the "buy parts for bike online and ask LBS to fit them". Against the rules.

As a general principle, I think that's sound. However, there are one or two LBSs I know which don't sell new bikes and not much in the way of new parts - they're basically workshops with a few items of first need, like tubes - and if I was in the position of not being able to fit parts I'd bought online, I'd certainly go there.

More generally, LBSs vary as does any other genre of shops. My L-most seems to try reasonably to keep customers happy, but I went off it when I went in there wanting a 700x35 tube. "Sorry, we're out of tubes. We're getting a delivery on Thursday." This was Monday. There are some things it's reasonable to wait for and some things it's not. Though on that occasion I simply went to another shop, not online.

[Polar Bear]

If you don't support your lbs, just like village shops, post offices and pubs, it will close.   Yes, you can get what you might want elsewhere but when it comes to a particular job requiring expensive tools and expertise, you're floored.

My lbs, Thorntons in Rugby, is great for consumables lubes and jobs such as facing a bb shell so I'll keep trying them first thanks.     

[contango]

I just don't do the "buy parts for bike online and ask LBS to fit them". Against the rules.

I don't have a problem with having my LBS fit parts I bought elsewhere. As a rule if I buy parts elsewhere it means online, in which case I'd look to fit them myself or there's not much point buying them online at all. But if I can't fit them myself I'd ask the LBS to fit them for me, I'd just expect to pay their normal workshop rates. Fitting a part they didn't supply really isn't any different to servicing a bike they didn't sell.

[vorsprung]

just because it is a LBS doesn't give it magic powers

if you want them to get something in and they can't, then they can't.

so buy it online

I've used two LBS in recent years.  One of them turned out to be a total waste of time.  The other have been more and more impressive.  Use shops that can do the stuff you need to be done

[The French Tandem]

If you don't support your lbs, just like village shops, post offices and pubs, it will close.   

This sounds like a sort of blackmail to my ears: "Buy from us or we will close". If your local shops have no better argument, then let them close.

Our former LBS went bankrupt about 3 years ago, We now buy everything online, and are very happy with that!

[AAO]

I try to always use my LBS and I have a great relationship with them, built over several years. Sometimes the difference in price for an item offered online is just too big - for example a Groupset - and the shop just cannot compete. In these situations, because I am a good customer and let's face it money is money, they don't pull faces and will happily fit the item for me.
On complete bikes my LBS can usually compete pretty well and I always buy from them. Result - I have people who can help me out if I have a problem, chat to and be friendly with, and they stay in business.
Shop - Clive Powell, Rhayader, Powys.

[Kim]

Shop - Clive Powell, Rhayader, Powys.

Who were open on a Sunday afternoon when I needed a gear cable in the middle of a recent tour.   

[Polar Bear]

If you don't support your lbs, just like village shops, post offices and pubs, it will close.   

This sounds like a sort of blackmail to my ears: "Buy from us or we will close". If your local shops have no better argument, then let them close.

Our former LBS went bankrupt about 3 years ago, We now buy everything online, and are very happy with that!

Of course it's not blackmail, it's fact.  This is what happens to local businesses.   

[Tom M]

I am now a fairly longstanding customer of my LBS, and they have provided me with a lot of good service over the years. It can be difficult for them to compete on price all the time though, even with the discount they give me. I am on a pretty tight budget nowadays with having a family, and it's not necessarily how their prices compare to online, but what they actually stock. Being a fairly high-end shop they tend to keep more of the expensive brands, particularly in things like clothing. I prefer the cheaper end of the market myself, and can't really justify spending £50-70 on a pair of shorts or a jersey, so buy that kind of stuff online or Aldi etc.

They are handy for little bits, and it does pay to have that kind of relationship. Having had work bike (frame from them) crash damaged a few years back, they provided a 'healthy' quote  for a replacement which let me get a few extra things from them as well. They also did me a fictional bike on the cycle to work scheme that let me have the cash to spend on on some parts I was after. Even a few weeks ago I had a wheel in to be trued (one of my weaknesses...) I mentioned that I was on the bike that day and would have to leave it at work till I could take it back home. Owner does a few mins banging in the workshop and produces a DIY sprint carrier out of a piece of aluminium so I could get the wheel back.

Not saying they are perfect all the time, and have had times when it's taken longer to get/do things than I would like, but on the whole it's a positive experience.

As for the OP, as no kind of existing relationship is there with the shop, I don't think I would be so patient and forgiving with their lack of communication and enthusiasm. I'm not sure what sort of margin they make on bikes now? My thoughts would be it is more on parts/accessories, which might go some way to explain things. Could also be something like them having some problems with the distributor or something themselves? If they were owing them money or something, then they might be trying to hold off ordering that brand?

[Ningishzidda]

Local bike shop to cyclist...
"Use it or lose it."

Cyclist to Local bike shop...
"Be competitive or die."

[clifftaylor]

As I mentioned elsewhere - I recently used my LBS to buy a 105 front mech:

Go to LBS (10 mins bus, plus 15 minute walk), buy front mech.

Go home (reverse journey), discover that what was in the box wasn't what the label said (box had been opened previously)

Go back to shop, ask for correct item, nothing available, "it'll be here next week"

Go home again.

Return to LBS a week later. "It's not in yet the distributor is out of stock"

Go home.

A week later, LBS phone to say that the item in question is now in.

Go to LBS (journey as above), collect item.

Go home, feeling annoyed that I have paid about half the cost of the item on bus fares.

Wiggle have had the item in stock all through this saga...

[jsabine]

To ask the obvious (and irritatingly unhelpful) questions:

Don't you open previously opened boxes to check their contents as a matter of course? Hell, I often open sealed items to make sure there's nothing obvious in going to have to ask questions about.
Couldn't the middle two visits have been replaced by phone calls?
Couldn't some - or all - of the visits have been by bike rather than bus and shanks's pony?

(But yes, it sounds frustrating. And it all adds up to why I rarely look in an LBS for planned purchases. I'll pop in on spec and buy on a whim, or if I need an emergency tube or chain, but a new mech to swap in a fortnight tends to get bought online. That's all modulated by my most local LBS being Halfords, mind.)