YACF as club in AUK membership

[AndyH]

and my local CTC events tend to start at least 10 miles away.

Oh, that's a shame.

(Is it even possible to ride 20 miles in a day?!?)

Hmm, for people new to this game adding 20 miles on might seem like quite a lot.  Particularly if they have a life and have other things to do.  I know that generally doesn't apply round here.

Ooh that hurt 

It's not really a question of adding on the miles to get to the CTC rides. If it was that much of a problem I could put the bike on the car (I am not serious!). The CTC rides are not really what I want to do, apart from their (excellent) Audax events.

My point was more that I don't have a club within what I consider to be a reasonable distance that I want to join.

Having said that I do plan to join the CTC Wessex DA next year, on the basis that organisations like the CTC and AUK deserve to be supported. (wasn't there another thread on why bother to join AUK recently that covered this ?)

Andy

[clarion]

Who's Marcus?

[Greenbank]

Who's Marcus?

marcus

[clarion]

Thanks.  Obvious really, but it seems he's far too busy riding bikes to post anywhere other than in A&C.  Good luck to him, I say!

[marcus]

Who's Marcus?

It's me! 

I don't tend to post much on yacf except on Audax stuff - and even then rather infrequently.

[Nuncio]

Who's Marcus?

If "By his deeds shall a man be known", then he's a Maniac.

[Weirdy Biker]

I'm Spartacus!

[mattc]

Ooh that hurt 

It's not really a question of adding on the miles to get to the CTC rides. If it was that much of a problem I could put the bike on the car (I am not serious!). The CTC rides are not really what I want to do, apart from their (excellent) Audax events.

My point was more that I don't have a club within what I consider to be a reasonable distance that I want to join.

Having said that I do plan to join the CTC Wessex DA next year, on the basis that organisations like the CTC and AUK deserve to be supported.

Sorry

Thing is, I got into Audax after regular 13 mile rides to join CTC rides. It's a pretty obvious step towards 200km rides.

Bon route!

[Ivo]

.......You can just put AUK as a club, I believe; AUK won the club competition on the 2006 HBKH ........

This is because (ISTBC) no matter who you list as your club, on foreign soil every AUK member is classified as AUK.
In a similar way that sports people may have a club they represent, but in international level it's the country that's considered.

No. For audax purposes you're still regsitered under your club. I've a number of riders at my brevets (run in the Netherlands) who do list YACF as their club. One of them on my rides alone netted 13 points.

[Martin]

I've just had an email from a rider looking for some last minute ECE points; seemed rather disgruntled that his club has lost to a (quote) "non-club" in the AUK CPC again

Sour grapes or does he have a point? (FWIW I've seen more YACF than any other club in the AUK events I've ridden this year)

discuss...

[mikewigley]

I've just had an email from a rider looking for some last minute ECE points; seemed rather disgruntled that his club has lost to a (quote) "non-club" in the AUK CPC again

It all depends on what you define as a club.  Bear in mind that the AUK Membership team is unlikely to check if it is a bona-fide club however you define it, nor that you are even a paid-up member of said club.

I added a new club to our list of clubs today.  At least it had a website and at least one member (an ex-YACF member!) so that was good enough for me.

[Martin]

I've just had an email from a rider looking for some last minute ECE points; seemed rather disgruntled that his club has lost to a (quote) "non-club" in the AUK CPC again

It all depends on what you define as a club.  

in this case YACF;

FWIW I stopped playing politics with AUK clubs back in 2007 after having shown that a forum could indeed galvanise enough people to go out there and ride their bikes and win an award in the process which I thought was a great achievement; (although others may remember that a short lived bit of acrimony also resulted)

I've since gone back to my real club as the only points collecting member and have sat near the bottom of the table ever since

[SandyV]

I suspect for many YACF IS their "real" club (or indeed only club)

[mattc]

I've just had an email from a rider looking for some last minute ECE points; seemed rather disgruntled that his club has lost to a (quote) "non-club" in the AUK CPC again

Just for clarity:
I thought YACF had no hope of a points award due to the top-6 rule (which some would say has been er ... finessed in the past anyway)?
Have I missed something? Is this rider troubled by not coming 2nd?

[urban_biker]

I suspect for many YACF IS their "real" club (or indeed only club)

Certainly for me. I would probably still be riding audax without YACF but I doubt I would be sat here planning to do PBP next year. YACF is my only club and all my cycling buddies are in yacf. OK it may not be a "proper" cycling club in the historical sense and it may not have a history. But times they are a changing.

[LEE]

It's a club.

[frankly frankie]

It all depends on what you define as a club. 

It might also depend on what AUK committee defines as a club.  I mean, at the end of the day they could sit around their table and look at the list and decide, for some reason or another, that one of them doesn't qualify ... 

In which case, on the (despicable) 6-rider rule, it would currently be far too close to call, between VC 167 and Willesden.  (Cue flurry in the transfer market.)

[mattc]

<scary image>

It's a club.

It's clearly a cult.

[Greenbank]

It's clearly a cult.

In the early days Mrs G referred to it as "the weight loss cult" when I went from 94kg to 78kg. It's now been shortened to "the cult" as in "Is anyone you know doing that 400? Simon or Scott from the cult?"

[Philip Whiteman]

It all depends on what you define as a club.  

It might also depend on what AUK committee defines as a club.  I mean, at the end of the day they could sit around their table and look at the list and decide, for some reason or another, that one of them doesn't qualify ...  

In which case, on the (despicable) 6-rider rule, it would currently be far too close to call, between VC 167 and Willesden.  (Cue flurry in the transfer market.)

Technically speaking there is no legal definition for a 'club' (there are countless types of clubs) but it is generally accepted to be an organisation of individuals that meet socially and adhere to that organisation's rules.  Of course the next question is how do you define a rule?  As an example, anyone can join Velo d'Ardbeg providing they adhere to the rule of becoming a member - the purchase of an Ardbeg cycle jersey. So whether YACF is a club may be a mute point.  I guess that we adhere to a set of guiding principles in terms of behaviour in using the forum, etc.

Unlike the CTC, CTT or BC, AUK does not have affiliate organisations paying a subscription fee.  If that were the case then YACF could face a few problems defining it.  There are a number of virtual clubs registered to BC like YACF but members of those clubs usually paying an affiliate fee and agree to a set of organisational rules.

Unlike BC/CTT, AUK does not have to worry about cyclists representing clubs. BC/CTT  need to be clear on what constitutes a 'club' in order to effect the claim membership system (you can only race for one club as a '1st claim' member).  

In effect, if AUK were to sit around a table to debate who and what constitutes a club, then I would suggest that they have too much time on their hands and suffer a degree of anul retentiveness.  As AUK does not appear to undertake such a fruitless activity such an accusation would be unwarranted.

[Jaded]

Surely the aim of AUK is to get people to ride Audax.

YACF (and ACF) have probably contributed more to that aim than any other organisation.

People no longer live social lives constrained by geography.

[border-rider]

And it's worth noting that membership of the big "geographical" clubs is not any longer a matter of geography - people from all over the place seem to ride under the colours of some of them

[LittleWheelsandBig]

And it's worth noting that membership of the big "geographical" clubs is not any longer a matter of geography - people from all over the place seem to ride under the colours of some of them

But it is such a pretty green...

[mattc]

Surely the aim of AUK is to get people to ride Audax.

YACF (and ACF) have probably contributed more to that aim than any other organisation.

Apart from AUK, the people that surface the roads, the bike manufacturers, ACP, local clubs/DAs that put on the events ...     

Clearly [Y]ACF has given Audax a huge boost. But remember most people on here were already members of other clubs (or in some way benefitted from those clubs e.g. I got into long rides thru various CTC groups). So there is a symbiosis here.

[Manotea]

And it's worth noting that membership of the big "geographical" clubs is not any longer a matter of geography - people from all over the place seem to ride under the colours of some of them

But it is such a pretty green...

Well, the current jersey is, I'm not so sure about the old 'slime green'!

The 'modern' Willesden club is about 80 year old so there has been time for members to move house once or twice. Willesden also has a presence at three locations : the club house in Wembley, the track at Hillingdon (by no means a 'Willesden' resource but used/supported by Willesden coaches and riders), whilst clubruns start from Denham, so we are a bit spread out. Beyond that there are some overseas members who wear the green jersey when they are over here. But all in, its a real club with a real centre. With far fewer 'members' than YACF, aside from all of its other activities Willesden typically sponsors about ten Audaxes a year with a complete SR series next year for PBP.

In contrast YACF operates as a simple loose grouping with occaisional club outings. At the risk of sounding all bitter and twisted, on two of the three YACF 'clubruns' I've taken part in, I was dropped and abandoned. That's never happened to me That doesn't happen on a Willesden clubrun.

Anyways, what is the way forward for YACF? Is there a need for a way forward? Dunno, but given the numbers of riders registering YACF as their club to AUK, it would be nice to see some YACF sponsored events in the calendar.