Mudguards.

[Andy W]

Why do some cyclists not use mudguards when cycling long distances, ie, audax,  epic Lejog adventures. Both my tourer and lightweight audax style bikes have mudguards, and no they don't rattle. Mark Beaumont the famous adventurer and round the world record breaker appears nor to use them. Am I missing something? If one were focusing on speed either racing or local chain gang rides I'd understand.  It doesn't bother me,  I'm just puzzled.

[Kim]

I think a lot of it is fashion, most likely secondary fashion (ie. where your choice is limited to what's fashionable due to poor availability of alternatives).  An awful lot of otherwise decent bikes don't have the tyre clearance or mounting points for proper mudguards.  Improper mudguards^[1] are a work of Stan, and a muddy back might not be a deal breaker?

I think people tend to over-rate their aero/weight penalty.

And depending on the bike, they can be vulnerable to getting bashed, which puts you into all that rattling and alignment stuff that isn't usually a problem on a bike with sturdy luggage racks to secure/protect them.


_{[1] I'll make an exception for the MTB ones that serve only to keep the sheep shit out of your mouth and the grit out of your arse crack, as long as they're attached to a primarily off-road bike.}

[zigzag]

my take is that a bikepacking seat pack protects from most of road spray, mudguards require some time and patience to set up properly, more faff if traveling with a bike if it needs to be dismantled. on the off-road sections they can clog up with mud. i've been using ass-saver mudguard for those type of scenarios.

i generally ride with mudguards, they also protect from sealant spray if running tubeless tyres.

[quixoticgeek]

Why do some cyclists not use mudguards when cycling long distances, ie, audax,  epic Lejog adventures. Both my tourer and lightweight audax style bikes have mudguards, and no they don't rattle. Mark Beaumont the famous adventurer and round the world record breaker appears nor to use them. Am I missing something? If one were focusing on speed either racing or local chain gang rides I'd understand.  It doesn't bother me,  I'm just puzzled.

It is well documented on this forum that i really fucking hate mudguards. I could say it's because the ruin the aesthetic of the bike. But that wouldn't actually be enough for me to not use them. For me the problem i have with them is the noise. They squeak, and rattle, and bang, and rub, and clog, and buzz, and when you're riding for hours on end, it's enough to drive you absolutely nuts. Here in .NL especially, i find the noise they make in cross winds incredibly annoying.

A bike should be as near silent as it's possible to be. It's bad enough that at the wrong angle of cross wind my front disk rotor hums. I'm hoping the next one won't.

That's not the reason you were expecting is it ?

J

[Kim]

I should note that the only time I've had mudguard trouble on the Streetmachine (that wasn't caused by a train) was after about 4 hours of riding on Dutch cyclepaths.  I had to stop and apply nylocks.

[quixoticgeek]

I should note that the only time I've had mudguard trouble on the Streetmachine (that wasn't caused by a train) was after about 4 hours of riding on Dutch cyclepaths.  I had to stop and apply nylocks.

Cos you of course carry spare Nylocs...

I rely on my tailfin to protect my arse. And rely on over shoes to protect my feet. The over full frame bag protects my face. I just accept if it rains I'll need to lube my chain.

J

[FifeingEejit]

They snap when stressed resulting in me having to carry bits in back pocket
They're often poorly designed (currana I'm looking at you) such that ay someone else has carries one of my guards round a 100km audax which was awfully jice of them though for how I've treated them since my original plan to dump it in the bin would have done.
They're a royal pain in the arse when you need to take a wheel off to put bike in a vehicle
They're a royal pain in the arse to get them tolerably quiet
They use different tools from what every multi tool produced since bikes went hex key based has on them
Their benefit to faff ratio is poor when it's dry, and middling when it's wet, only gaining the upper hand when it's fucking wet, but they're such a faff once they're in you can't be arsed removing them
They make it harder to monitor rear tyre wear and sometimes contribute to it which guarantees you'll have a blow out in some shithole like Leven.

And the Rest I have to say has already been said


Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk

[drossall]

The original question mentioned Audaxes. I do prefer to ride behind people with mudguards in the wet. And there's the issue of cafes not letting us come back next time because of muddy seats from riders who have sprayed themselves up the back.

I've never had much issue with mudguards. The occasional breakage and so on, but on the whole I'm very happy with them. I've just got out my Audax bike for tomorrow's event. That has guards, even though there's really no chance of needing them.

[quixoticgeek]

The original question mentioned Audaxes. I do prefer to ride behind people with mudguards in the wet. And there's the issue of cafes not letting us come back next time because of muddy seats from riders who have sprayed themselves up the back.

I've never had much issue with mudguards. The occasional breakage and so on, but on the whole I'm very happy with them. I've just got out my Audax bike for tomorrow's event. That has guards, even though there's really no chance of needing them.

I solve this problem by being slow. There's noone behind you when you're always last...

J

[Kim]

I should note that the only time I've had mudguard trouble on the Streetmachine (that wasn't caused by a train) was after about 4 hours of riding on Dutch cyclepaths.  I had to stop and apply nylocks.

Cos you of course carry spare Nylocs...

To be fair, only two (M5 and M6, which covers all the things that use nuts on that bike).  But I was riding a loaded Streetmachine through .nl, I could have been carrying half the Park Tools catalogue and not noticed the extra weight.

To date there have been four occasions when I've needed a spare nut:

1) Rack bolt stripped the braze-on threads on my second ever cycle-camping trip, which involved a lot of what would these days be described as 'gravel' riding, with cheap (read: heavy) kit.  I nicked a nut and bolt from a less critical bit of the rack and bodged it till I got to Bristol, from whence there were trains.

2) Basil had some sort of saddlebag problem on some exploratory ride in the Lichfield direction, and I helpfully pointed out that he could steal one from somewhere else on the bike.

(This was the point where someone on the forum had a cleat bolt incident, and I added a stratgic selection of nuts, bolts and washers to my touring kit.)

3) One of Roger's comedy friends on a FNRttS suffered a catastrophic failure of the brake lever pivot.  Having previously awed him with my level of preparedness in bringing a spanner or something, he was practically floored by me digging out a M5 nut, bolt and washer that did the job perfectly. He's probably still riding around with it.

4) The afore-mentioned .nl trip, where one of the rear mudguard bolts shook loose (I think shortly after leaving the ferry, judging by the noise it was making - I'd assumed it was just some weird suspension resonance thing like you sometimes get on gravel at speed).

I think I donated a cleat bolt to cycleman at one point.  And I've certainly used the spare chain link that also lives in that kit^[1].  And, weirdly, the pair of cable end ferrules that I put in there as a one-off because reasons and forgot to remove actually came in useful for a friend's kid's bike on which the fraying front gear cable was stabbing them in the leg.  The disc brake pads and spare springamathing remain unused, as do the spare chainring bolts (though only just - I caught it just in time).  I've also got an assortment of glasses screws in the little sewing kit I carry when touring, which should save an hour or two next time I ride across Wales^[2] with Wowbagger.

Anyway, it's that weight/bulk to how much of a problem it might solve ratio thing.  Nuts and bolts and quick links and the like score very highly on account of extreme smallth.



_{[1] My own mechanicals are overwhelmingly chain-related.
[2] If Wales is involved, I add an extra spare gear cable, but that's getting rather off topic.}

[Pingu]

Why do some cyclists not use mudguards when cycling long distances, ie, audax,  epic Lejog adventures. Both my tourer and lightweight audax style bikes have mudguards, and no they don't rattle. Mark Beaumont the famous adventurer and round the world record breaker appears nor to use them. Am I missing something? If one were focusing on speed either racing or local chain gang rides I'd understand.  It doesn't bother me,  I'm just puzzled.

If it doesn't bother you then why are you asking?

[De Sisti]

I do prefer to ride behind people with mudguards in the wet.

Only if they've got a decent mudflap attached to them!

[Andy W]

Ah yes the rear mud flap. Mine is virtually touching the road surface, looks like I’m earthing my bike 👍

[iandusud]

Ah yes the rear mud flap. Mine is virtually touching the road surface, looks like I’m earthing my bike 👍

A man after my own heart  . I make my mudflaps from large black plastic plant pots that the plants my wife gets from the garden centre come in. They are light, thin and sufficiently rigid. You can mould them to shape using a hot air gun. I wouldn't be without them on my daily riders and touring bikes. I do have a stripped down carbon bike bike for dry sunny days and like the aesthetic of it. There is something about minimalism that I like. I stripped down fixed wheel bike is a beautiful thing. But a huge amount of my cycling is about getting from a to b being able to carry a lot of luggage. So once a bike is fitted with racks and lights a pair of well fitted mudguards has no negative effect on the aesthetics. On the other hand maintenance is greatly reduced on a bike fitted with decent guards and flaps. The transmission in particular but also headset and brakes. I think I would end up spending a lot of my weekends in the winter on maintenance on my daily riders if they didn't have guards.

[perpetual dan]

I like my mudguards. There's an occasional noise to let me know grit isn't being flung any further, but otherwise not enough to upset me. If I wanted a silent bike I'd change my tyres and my freewheel first

Aside from a "one bike for all rides" [heresy, burn him!] situation, I'd be even more puzzled at the faffing involved in routinely taking them off / putting them on again for particular distances or weather forecasts.

[hatler]

My experience is fit guards, ride, and errr .... that's it.

No noise, no rattles, squeaks, hums, clogging, anything.

Road bike, daily commute (as was) into Central London, FNRttCs when they happen and weekend dips into Surrey's Hills.

Funnily enough on my ride this morning I considered that in the absence of the daily commute, and only choosing to ride when it's dry, I could remove them, and came to the conclusion that there's no point. More faff (getting them off), and for what ?

[Paul H]

My bikes are 50/50 with and without guards.  Pros and cons, there's nothing religious about it, it isn't often I get it completely wrong and spend hours in the rain without, I find that quite unpleasant, but a bit of a shower isn't a big deal, and there's other ways to mitigate the unpleasantness.  There is a big difference in how much cleaner bikes with guards remain, then again cleaning isn't a big deal either. I've only broken them in a crash, mine don't rattle or cause any other problems. The group thing is simple enough, you don't have to ride behind anyone, if it's a club they can make rules and the choice becomes whether to ride with them or not. Mudflaps seem to have become more fashionable in the last few years, even on some road bikes.  I don't know why "fashionable" is used to deride things, without it we'd still all be riding 1950's roadsters. I regret getting rid of my 1990's frame bags as they were considered dorky, they were as practical then as they would be now.

[hubner]

Why do some cyclists not use mudguards when cycling long distances, ie, audax,  epic Lejog adventures. Both my tourer and lightweight audax style bikes have mudguards, and no they don't rattle. Mark Beaumont the famous adventurer and round the world record breaker appears nor to use them. Am I missing something? If one were focusing on speed either racing or local chain gang rides I'd understand.  It doesn't bother me,  I'm just puzzled.

I would say they are in fact aiming at speed. Mudguards do slow you down despite what some people say.

Yes waterproofs and bags can keep you dry but mudguards also keep your bike and your clothes cleaner. Without mudguards, fithy gritty water gets throw all over your clothing and bike bits in particular the bottom bracket and the top of the seat tube. And properly fitted mudguards don't rattle or buzz or make a noise.

The biggest drawback, apart from extra weight and slowing you down, is they make it more awkward to check the rear tyre for glass etc.

Having said all that, I do have mudgardless bikes but they are only ridden on dry roads. But for general use/utility bikes, they look incomplete without mudguards, imo.

[De Sisti]

Mudguards do slow you down despite what some people say.

Is this opinion, or fact (to be backed up by evidence)?

[rogerzilla]

I regard them as a necessary evil.  They are noisy, fragile, the narrower ones shake themselves to death in frequent use, and they both increase rim wear and make cleaning more difficult.  It's also harder to chuck the bike in a car because it doesn't get much smaller with the wheels off.

They do stop your bum crack being force-fed gritty water, though.

[hubner]

Mudguards do slow you down despite what some people say.

Is this opinion, or fact (to be backed up by evidence)?

Humble experience.

The only people saying mudguards don't slow you down or even they make you go faster are people selling mudguards or bikes with mudguards.

Fact: they weigh at least half a kg.
Fact: mudflaps present a wide surface to the wind.

[Lightning Phil]

Fact: mudflaps present a wide surface to the wind.

Fact, the rider presents 100 x more surface area.

[hubner]

I regard them as a necessary evil.  They are noisy, fragile, the narrower ones shake themselves to death in frequent use, and they both increase rim wear and make cleaning more difficult.  It's also harder to chuck the bike in a car because it doesn't get much smaller with the wheels off.

They do stop your bum crack being force-fed gritty water, though.

My narrow SKSs have lasted decades. One rear did break but only because I rested my saddlebag on it.

As for increase rim wear, surely wet is wet, more water on the rim could actually decrease wear by washing away all the grit and muck.

[hubner]

Fact: mudflaps present a wide surface to the wind.

Fact, the rider presents 100 x more surface area.

The mudflap is extra surface area regardless of the size of the rider.

[Paul H]

Is this opinion, or fact (to be backed up by evidence)?

Does it matter? 
I'd be surprised if the wind turbulence didn't slow you down and equally surprised if anyone could notice the difference. As with much cycling stuff, if you think it makes you faster, climb better, look more like your idol... then it does, why spoil it with facts? In some cases it'll be self fulfilling, if you think a bike's faster, you ride it harder and it becomes faster.