Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => The Knowledge => Topic started by: TPMB12 on 22 January, 2017, 04:04:39 pm
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Thinking of tyres. I got a PlanetX London Road bike which is one of those gravel/adventure/cyclocross bikes that are being touted as one bike for all. It came with 700x37 own brand tyres which I switched for 700x35 marathon plus tyres which seem fatter tyres and only just fit under mudguards. I'm thinking of running 2 different types of tyre at different times.
The marathons were bought before my first tour as a reliable tyre for puncture resistance. I just feel it's slow tyres. So I'm wondering about getting thinner, faster tyres for commuting and general leisure rides out. Perhaps a 700x28 / 32 in. Faster, lighter tyre too.
Would running such a tyre be noticeable? If it is i might consider getting a few tyres for different use. Marathons for tours, fast for road commute and some cyclocross tyres for any easy off road ride i might do. Any tyre recommendations? Is this what you would consider doing for such a bike (my only bike).
Another question i have relates to a gravel bike i saw online. It is a mason boker. A really nice bike that takes similar 700x38 tyres mine can but it's also capable of taking 650b tyres, 650x50 tyres. Would this be possible with other bikes like my London road? Would need a new wheelset obviously but would it work? What would the benefit be?
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gatorskins in 28 or 32mm are one of the most suitable tyres for commuting (imo) - they last a while, have puncture protection and feel pretty nice to ride. poor grip in wet is not an issue at commuting speeds.
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Durano/Plus/DD also in 32mm.
Have a look in Reviews someone has already covered several thousand kilometers on Schwalbe Spicers.
Spicers, particularly, are inexpensive. If you have any difficulty finding them give me a shout.
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Faster tyres would be noticeable, yes. Vittoria Rubino Pro and Panaracer Pasela are another couple to think about. If changing tyres for each kind of ride turns out to be too much bother then you could at least change according to the season. Less puncture protection is needed overall in the summer months because the roads are drier for more of the time.
Re 650B tyres on 700C bike: I suppose disc brakes make it possible but I don't know of an advantage besides any greater choice of tyre widths. The advantage of very fat tyres is obvious enough. Trail (effecting stability and steering) changes with tyre outer diameter, so you don't want a big difference of that if you like the way the bike rides now. 650B and 700C refers to the *inner* diameter, mind. Widthwise: you could measure for yourself to check the space in the frame and forks.
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Re 650 tyres. Most are some form of gravel/knobbly pattern i.e. not fast.
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Marathon Supreme are much lighter than Marathon Plus, and still pretty puncture resistant.
There does seem to be an increasing number of road style tyres for 650B (aka ETRTO 584 or 27.5"). eg Marathon Supreme in 42-584 or 50-584. Or Schwalbe Super Moto X in 70-584 could be fun, though rather heavy.
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The question about 650 wheels is really because of a bike i saw online from mason, the boker IIRC. It's available in several versions based around groupset and wheel size. They do SRAM rival/force in a 1x11 with 650 wheels or ultegra/105 in compact chainrings and 700 wheels. The 650 is a 50mm tyre but the 700 only 40mm at most. I'm curious about being able to switch wheels as well as tyres. So road road commuting 700x32. For off road 650x50 nobblies. For a tour with mixed terrain perhaps 700x35 marathons for example. Just an idea that might make a bike perform better across a variety of terrains. Perhaps no benefit.
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Hey up.
Big fan of the marathon supremes (mentioned earlier by fuaran)
I've been running 35's and my wife 32's.
Several thousand km on mine. Fairly quick on the flat, super comfy and despite the spec, I find reasonable grip off road in the 35mm. No punctures thus far, which is pretty amazing. I managed to squeeze them under mud guards with a wee bit of clearance.
We used them on this trip here:-
http://fireflyadventureteam.com/stories/11-adventure-report/88-munich-to-venice.html
Make sure you get the "new" style supremes though, they changed up the spec last year.
I'm after some swalbe G one myself in 30mm as a faster alternative to the supremes for TCR, but having a few dramas tracking down a supply. Maybe try some of them if you can find a set.
For 650b, there is Yan Hines Compass. Not tried myself, and probably pricey with the exchange rate but he is a tyre connoisseur.
My wife is having a new build bike right now and will have a set of 650's. Small frame size and wants to minimise toe overlap.
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Kojaks? 330g, rated 35s but really 32s. A good balance of puncture resistance, low weight and good durability.
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The Compass tyres are superb, albeit expensive. Hvaing said that so are a lot of other tyres.
I like tubeless - sealant works wonders.
Good cheap tyres are still Vittoria Voyager Hyper folding from Planet X at low prices - http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/TYVIVOHY/vittoria-voyager-hyper-folding-tyre (http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/TYVIVOHY/vittoria-voyager-hyper-folding-tyre) - fast, comfy available in a range of sizes. I'm currently running a pair of 32s tubeless on Kinlin rims and they've come up about 35mm wide (rims are 19mm internal. If you try this, do not exceed 60psi as you don't want the tyre blowing off the rim.
Mike
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I've just ordered some Marathon Supremes 32c from Spa for £28 each. Thought that was a good price but wish I'd seen those Vittorias from PX sooner - they look like a bargain at £19.99. Might get some to keep in reserve anyway.
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Having heard so much about the hypers I have decided to buy a pair to find out why all the h...
Mike, how did you find converting them to tubeless and is that a tubeless ready rim?
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Having heard so much about the hypers I have decided to buy a pair to find out why all the h...
Mike, how did you find converting them to tubeless and is that a tubeless ready rim?
Mine are on Kinlin XR-22T rims, which are tubeless (ready). I'd already taped up the rims with a couple of layers of tape (Effeto Mariposa) and the tyres went on and inflated easily with a track pump. They're not as tight a proper tubeless tyre. I had one very loud dismount when I inflated the rear to 80psi when everything was still wet with water and washing up liquid. I remounted it a bit later, put 60psi in and left it to dry. The added 50ml of sealant to both tyres, pumped them back up and rode up and down the road. I then left them a couple of days to let the beads seal a bit and they've been fine ever since.
On the Kinlin rims they are about 35mm wide (32c tyre) and I tend to put just under 60psi in the rear and just under 55 in the front. I weigh 13st at the moment. The bike isn't as fast as a more road focused bike on Schwalbe Ones, but it rides really nicely, is comfy and never feels like it's dragging.
Obviously, anyone tries this at their own risk! I don't push it through corners.
Mike
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I found the best tyres for grip and puncture resistance are Durano Plus, but they have a really wooden ride. Gatorskins are slippery as hell. If you are hell bent on fast but want puncture protection then consider going tubeless with Schwalbe One Pro.
On my winter rig Ive got Hutchinson Sector 32 tubeless. Been fine all winter. The rear skids when braking hard which isnt great but at least you can lower the pressure right down on them.
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I found the best tyres for grip and puncture resistance are Durano Plus, but they have a really wooden ride. Gatorskins are slippery as hell. If you are hell bent on fast but want puncture protection then consider going tubeless with Schwalbe One Pro.
On my winter rig Ive got Hutchinson Sector 32 tubeless. Been fine all winter. The rear skids when braking hard which isnt great but at least you can lower the pressure right down on them.
Agree, Schwalbe One tubeless are fast and tubeless is good for puncture repair. The Hypers are bigger and cheap, but still quite a fast tyre - despite being a touring tyre they placed pretty well up in the rolling resistance tests.
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What are the Hypers like for grip? They don't look very grippy.
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Slippery in the wet when new but get somewhat better when worn in.
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Are supremes better, grip-wise?
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Haven't tried Supremes, I like Paselas.
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Are supremes better, grip-wise?
My new Supremes arrived from Spa this morning. Worth noting that they're the old model, which probably explains the low price. The new version is supposed to be an improvement, according to Brucey OTP, but I've always been happy with them in the past. They'll do for now.
Having said that, I'm not the kind of rider who really tests the limits of road tyre grip....
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Are supremes better, grip-wise?
My new Supremes arrived from Spa this morning. Worth noting that they're the old model, which probably explains the low price. The new version is supposed to be an improvement, according to Brucey OTP, but I've always been happy with them in the past. They'll do for now.
Having said that, I'm not the kind of rider who really tests the limits of road tyre grip....
Thats a shame City. I can't say enough good about the supremes we you used on the M2V trip. Snag some down the road if you can.
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To be fair, they're still showing the pic of the old model on the Spa website, so it's hardly false advertising!
Wiggle are also showing the old model, but CRC appear to have the new ones in stock for £30.99 each.
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What are the Hypers like for grip? They don't look very grippy.
I've had 35mm Hypers on my tourer for several months and on the lanes over the autumn and winter I've not noticed any loss of grip compared to the Paselas they replaced.
I found Duranos very harsh when I tried them on a bike that had previously had Gatorskins.
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What are the Hypers like for grip? They don't look very grippy.
I've had 35mm Hypers on my tourer for several months and on the lanes over the autumn and winter I've not noticed any loss of grip compared to the Paselas they replaced.
While I'm a big fan of Paselas, once they are worn they don't grip well. I particularly notice this when riding uphill on wet bitumen (rear wheel just spinning if I stood up). Last friday I was having to sit down up anything steep and pedal gently. Sometimes that was due to ice, but it was also due to wet smooth bitumen.
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What are the Hypers like for grip? They don't look very grippy.
I've had 35mm Hypers on my tourer for several months and on the lanes over the autumn and winter I've not noticed any loss of grip compared to the Paselas they replaced.
While I'm a big fan of Paselas, once they are worn they don't grip well. I particularly notice this when riding uphill on wet bitumen (rear wheel just spinning if I stood up). Last friday I was having to sit down up anything steep and pedal gently. Sometimes that was due to ice, but it was also due to wet smooth bitumen.
I suspect that if you want to increase grip much above Pasela level you have to accept a faster wearing compound. And on a commuting bike that is a bit of a luxury. GP4 seasons or something like that.
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gp4seasons in 32mm for £15 per tyre please, and with a proper kevlar belt
Yes, they grip well, I used to ride those confidently on all conditions. But not very puncture-resistant to glass (the belt is too narrow).
The Michelin Krylions were similar
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finally tracked down some swalbe G one speed 30mm. (75 bucks a tire :o )
pick them up in NYC this weekend and will report back.
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https://www.velovitality.co.uk/collections/wheels-tyres-and-tubes
For those experimenting with larger volume tyres, there are some crackers on there. I'm running 44mm Snoqualmie Pass Extralights. The are crazy thin and light. I've only done a 200km on them, but I can confirm that the roll so nice at 50psi. In that we were in the first bunch to the first control, I don't think they are slow. ICBA to geek out on the Jan Heine experiment data, but certainly they feel ace in slippery conditions, secure on descents, and float over crappy surfaces. I'm putting 35mm Bon Jon Extralights on Stans Grails set up tubeless for my incoming Bish Bash Bosh "gravel" bike
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https://www.velovitality.co.uk/collections/wheels-tyres-and-tubes
For those experimenting with larger volume tyres, there are some crackers on there. I'm running 44mm Snoqualmie Pass Extralights. The are crazy thin and light. I've only done a 200km on them, but I can confirm that the roll so nice at 50psi. In that we were in the first bunch to the first control, I don't think they are slow. ICBA to geek out on the Jan Heine experiment data, but certainly they feel ace in slippery conditions, secure on descents, and float over crappy surfaces. I'm putting 35mm Bon Jon Extralights on Stans Grails set up tubeless for my incoming Bish Bash Bosh "gravel" bike
I love the look of the Rivendell Jack Brown tyres - that checkerboard pattern is bonkers. Also tempted to try the Compass Stampede Pass - they look like an ideal audax tyre. Not tubeless-ready though.
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I've got some Bon Jons set us tubeless and they're smooth and seem to roll well. I've also got some stampede pass waiting for spring, when I'll try them tubeless. It seems a lot of people use them tubeless already, but again keep pressures low. If you read the compass history, the tubeless ready tyres evolved first with a different shape bead module and only later upgraded the head material. Hence early tyres had a 60psi limit, which is plenty for a. If tyre of course.
Mike
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Compass website says tubes are required for the Stampede Pass, but if people are using them tubeless successfully I won't argue with them over it.
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There's a review out there somewhere where Jan Heine responds to claims that his tyres weep when Stans is used to say that they are designed for use with Orange Seal. I'm letting my LBS build my bike, but supplied the Orange Seal. The mechanic groaned - he doesn't rate it. I'll let you know how I get on.
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My Bon Jons have been fine with caffelatex. Took a couple of rides to settle as the extra leger sidewalks really are thin, but nothing to write home about.
Mike
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Another bike is a 26" mtb that is used mostly on the road and easy towpaths/ tracks. I'm looking for better tyres than cityjets. I don't know what tyre width is on the bike now but reckon over 2". My partner just swapped knobbly tyres for slicks the same width, well the lbs did without suggesting thinner tyres might be better.
She hasn't had a single puncture in over a year since greeting them. Before that she rode a stretch of road that was really bad for punctures so got a lot. Sane stretch, nothing! The trouble is they're too fat and she feels they're very slow tyres. Matches the rider though we need every bit of help so any faster tyre options?
We need good puncture resistance, decent grip and a better rolling resistance/faster ride.
I have marathon plus tyres and no punctures. Would this be a good option for this mtb? Supremes? What widths? 1.75" or 1.5" possible/advisable? Don't know rim width but it came with typical mtb tyres/wheels not fat or semi fat. Whatever the common rim size for 7 or 8 year old MTBs will be what this is.
Any recommendations?
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Marathon plus are not fast tyres.
It's difficult to suggest 'faster' tyres without knowing what your partner is currently using.
Plus, rider perception of 'fast' is not always correct. One of the riding magazines verified this by sending out testers on bikes with various tyres but not letting the riders have cycle computers. The riders reported their perceptions of the tyres as 'fast' etc. Sometimes the perceived 'slow' tyres were delivering faster times.
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....Any recommendations?
yes; you can think about 26x1.125" or 26x1.25" tyres (and they might be fractionally faster than 1.5" ones on smooth surfaces) but most MTBs have unyieldingly stiff frames and (if rigid) forks too. This means that narrower tyres are often slower (or at least no faster) than slightly wider ones of similar construction, yet are a good deal less comfortable.
You say you want
...good puncture resistance, decent grip and a better rolling resistance/faster ride....
well, don't we all.... you need to prioritise these things; if there were one tyre that embodies them all, we'd all be using that.... ;). Also you need to say where ride comfort and price come in that list. Maybe you take ride comfort for granted at present; trust me, you most likely won't do this again once you have tried 26 x 1.125" tyres pumped up hard on a typical MTB.
FWIW Schwalbe Kojaks are a decent tyre.
cheers
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There's a review out there somewhere where Jan Heine responds to claims that his tyres weep when Stans is used to say that they are designed for use with Orange Seal. I'm letting my LBS build my bike, but supplied the Orange Seal. The mechanic groaned - he doesn't rate it. I'll let you know how I get on.
So using Orange Seal -- still weep so bad that my LBS think they are rubbish. We'll see if the bon jons settle down, but they look at foamy mess at 60psi on the first go.
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There's a review out there somewhere where Jan Heine responds to claims that his tyres weep when Stans is used to say that they are designed for use with Orange Seal. I'm letting my LBS build my bike, but supplied the Orange Seal. The mechanic groaned - he doesn't rate it. I'll let you know how I get on.
So using Orange Seal -- still weep so bad that my LBS think they are rubbish. We'll see if the bon jons settle down, but they look at foamy mess at 60psi on the first go.
I'd be surpised if you need 60psi in Bon Jons. Put 20psi in, spin them and the up 10 psi at a time. I ride mine at 45 to 50 rear and 40 to 45 front. That's plenty at 13 stone.
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There's a review out there somewhere where Jan Heine responds to claims that his tyres weep when Stans is used to say that they are designed for use with Orange Seal. I'm letting my LBS build my bike, but supplied the Orange Seal. The mechanic groaned - he doesn't rate it. I'll let you know how I get on.
So using Orange Seal -- still weep so bad that my LBS think they are rubbish. We'll see if the bon jons settle down, but they look at foamy mess at 60psi on the first go.
The LBS called yesterday to show the finished bike - they are just setting it up according to the bike fit. the mechanic came out and said "I was wrong - the bon jons are amazing - they've stayed up from the first time I put air in them"
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Another bike is a 26" mtb that is used mostly on the road and easy towpaths/ tracks.
We need good puncture resistance, decent grip and a better rolling resistance/faster ride.
Any recommendations?
I've been using Continental Travel Contact 26" x 1.75" for commuting / extensive touring for many years and absolutely love them. Not a single puncture in over 20,000 miles and that includes riding fully loaded over some of the worst off-road terrain you can take a bike on.
The smooth band in the centre means they are relatively fast rolling on tarmac, but you can lower the pressure when on loose stuff so the treads on the shoulders kick in. The thick centre band means they last for many thousands of miles before needing replacing. Can't really see what else you want in a tyre where weight isn't critical.
I have 6 stashed in case they go out of production!
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Another bike is a 26" mtb that is used mostly on the road and easy towpaths/ tracks. I'm looking for better tyres than cityjets. I don't know what tyre width is on the bike now but reckon over 2". My partner just swapped knobbly tyres for slicks the same width, well the lbs did without suggesting thinner tyres might be better.
She hasn't had a single puncture in over a year since greeting them. Before that she rode a stretch of road that was really bad for punctures so got a lot. Sane stretch, nothing! The trouble is they're too fat and she feels they're very slow tyres. Matches the rider though we need every bit of help so any faster tyre options?
We need good puncture resistance, decent grip and a better rolling resistance/faster ride.
I have marathon plus tyres and no punctures. Would this be a good option for this mtb? Supremes? What widths? 1.75" or 1.5" possible/advisable? Don't know rim width but it came with typical mtb tyres/wheels not fat or semi fat. Whatever the common rim size for 7 or 8 year old MTBs will be what this is.
Any recommendations?
I'm very fond of my cityjets! I've done years of generally messing about on a single set, including some 70 mile charidee rides. 60 PSI for a 120kg lard arse and they roll OK.
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We need good puncture resistance, decent grip and a better rolling resistance/faster ride.
I'd be inclined to recommend the Marathon Almotion (https://www.schwalbe.com/gb/tour-reader/marathon-almotion.html).
Bicyclerollingresistance.com reckon they are faster than the Marathon Supreme or Voyager Hyper, they aren't a smooth tread, and Schwalbe say very good puncture resistance. The downside is that the green anti-puncture layer adds significant weight
https://www.rosebikes.com/article/schwalbe-marathon-almotion-dynamic-casing-touring-tyre-folding-tyre/aid:789509
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An update on the Swalbe G ones. in 30mm.
Yes they are super fast and grippy.
I was hoping to use them as the go-to rubber for transcontinental race in July, but they are so damn hard to seat that I dare not risk it. They took 140 psi to coax them on to the rims proper like. (Bel He'd +)
So its probably back to the marathon supremes in a 32mm for TCR#5. I'm being warned though that, as fast as I think they are, they are not really at the higher end of "rollability."
Anyone got feedback on Roubaix 32's? Something else thats bomb proof, squishy, fast, and doesn't require an hour of cursing and tears to seat on the rim?
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Durano Plus are readily available in 32mm, roll well, wear well and have the same puncture belt as Marathons.
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They roll like an iron slug compared to the tyres he is looking at. I would look vittoria voyager hyper in 32mm
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for commuting:
Vittoria Rubino Pro Control
for fast..... Specialized S-Works Turbo Cotton
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They roll like an iron slug compared to the tyres he is looking at. I would look vittoria voyager hyper in 32mm
Funieee. :D
Are the vittorias decent with puncture resistance? I have a bit of an agenda against the manufacturer (possibly totally unfounded in this case) as I frequently ran through expensive open paves racing due to multiple side wall cuts..and switched to s-works turbos with much better results.
I've had similar dim puncture experiences with contis too, but thats going back some.
Its a weird combination needed for a TCR type race. Medium fat/fast/robust. I'm also keen to have tyres that come off the rim ok as I will be using tubes and some of the tubeless ready options are ridiculously tight.
Lot of the guys are going 25's but I aint doing that with kit on board.
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The Hypers are good tyres, I commute on them. Just scrub them in very well before trying to get round wet corners.
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I'm a biggish lad (1.95m, currently ~100kg), and I've done maybe 2000km on my current set of 35mm hypers without incident; the rear's got a few cuts in the rubber but nothing major or through the carcass. As LWaB notes, they're a bit slippy in the wet at first; I'm going to scrub my next pair before I fit them. Best of all they're only about £15 for the 35s at Planet X (a bit more for the 32mm).
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They were £11.99 from px when i got them this week. I'm k looking forward to trying them out next week.
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Picked up a set of Sp. roubaix Pro 30/32 in the LBS. No rolling resistance tests for them them that I can track down, sadly.
Will give them a test for a couple of weeks.
Bike set up is for TCR so pretty heavy.
Will order up some marathon supremes as back up incase I don't get on with the roubaix flavour.
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Whipped off the g-ones and was bummed to see a big old vertical cut in the front tyre with a bubbling Barley 500 km on them :o Probably bad luck and broken heineken bottles..
Initial impression of the roubaix's is that they are nice and "Apu" (super squishy) good holding and fast rolling.
I have loaded up the bike in a simulated TCR scenario and will take a longer pull tomorrow. (bike is 52 lb with full water on board OMFG)