Author Topic: New member and differences between 100km and 200km  (Read 12694 times)

New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« on: 26 January, 2016, 06:45:03 pm »
Hi, I have been reading this forum for a while and wanted to join up and get involved.

I'm a 34 year old with very little time due to children and commuting from the shires into London.

I last did my one and only Audax the 100 organised by Hampshire police road club in March 2014 around Hampshire, I can't recall what it was called, then that year let my membership lapse due to work and other things.

I'm returning this year and want to do a 200km maybe a few! What is the main difference? Other than doing it, what is the best way to step up the distance? In small blocks or just resolve to get out and do a 200?

Thanks for your replies.

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #1 on: 26 January, 2016, 06:47:32 pm »
I forgot to mention I can manage 100km and have done recently although I do find it very challenging.

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #2 on: 26 January, 2016, 07:50:30 pm »
If you can get to the point where 100km isn't particularly challenging, then 200km should be achievable but knackering.

It's mostly about ergonomics and pacing yourself.  And getting out there and riding.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #3 on: 26 January, 2016, 08:56:35 pm »
Feeding is different, getting the right energy at the right time.
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #4 on: 27 January, 2016, 07:52:18 am »
Double the distance, aim to complete with an average speed 10% less.

Your average kCals/km will be the same. Reduce speed by 10% and your kCals/min will drop by a larger difference due to the vehicles CURVED power vs speed curve.

When you move from 200 to 400km, operate the same rule. 400 speed can be 90% of 200 speed.

Example.
100 speed is 13.5 mph, 200 speed is 12.1, 400 speed is 10.9, 800 speed is 9.84, 1600 speed is 8.8 mph.

Seeings as events 1300 to 1800 have a min speed of 12 kmh ( 7.45 mph ) your safe.

When your avearge speed for a 100 minus 10% is lower than 14.3 kmh ( 8.9 mph ), you're not ready.
111% of 8.9 mph is 9.86 mph.

Big Tip. Don't go rushing off from the start of your 200 at the same pace as you rode the 100, or at the pace of more experienced riders. Stay at the target pace.
You'll be fine,,  :thumbsup:

T42

  • Apprentice geezer
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #5 on: 27 January, 2016, 09:43:31 am »
It takes a lot of willpower not to join the pack for the first euphoric rush.  I've often intended to start 5 minutes after time just to let them get away, but on 200/300k rides it's so much fun I can rarely resist it.
I've dusted off all those old bottles and set them up straight

LMT

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #6 on: 27 January, 2016, 11:03:51 am »
Double the distance, aim to complete with an average speed 10% less.

Your average kCals/km will be the same. Reduce speed by 10% and your kCals/min will drop by a larger difference due to the vehicles CURVED power vs speed curve.

When you move from 200 to 400km, operate the same rule. 400 speed can be 90% of 200 speed.

Example.
100 speed is 13.5 mph, 200 speed is 12.1, 400 speed is 10.9, 800 speed is 9.84, 1600 speed is 8.8 mph.

Seeings as events 1300 to 1800 have a min speed of 12 kmh ( 7.45 mph ) your safe.

When your avearge speed for a 100 minus 10% is lower than 14.3 kmh ( 8.9 mph ), you're not ready.
111% of 8.9 mph is 9.86 mph.

Big Tip. Don't go rushing off from the start of your 200 at the same pace as you rode the 100, or at the pace of more experienced riders. Stay at the target pace.
You'll be fine,,  :thumbsup:

 ??? The OP is asking about doing a 200....

OP, just do it, pace yourself and remember to eat and drink often. You may want to go out and a do an imperial ton beforehand just to make sure that you are comfortable on the bike doing a longish distance, by comfortable I mean sorting out any little niggles to do with bike fit.

offcumden

  • Oh, no!
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #7 on: 27 January, 2016, 11:29:33 am »
The difference for me, these days anyway, is that I will generally ride 100km between meals (eg after breakfast and before lunch), so a cafe stop just means a drink, and maybe a scone or a banana from my back pocket. If I become tired, hungry or dehydrated I'll be able to eat, drink and rest at home afterwards.  Doubling the distance requires something more like a proper meal stop, and adjusting my pace to cope with the extra hours on the bike.

So, if you're used to half-day rides, remember that you'll be out all day on a 200km (esp. if it involves travelling to/from), so pace yourself accordingly.

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #8 on: 27 January, 2016, 12:03:35 pm »
Really great replies thank you all. I did a metric century on Monday at 13.5mph so exactly as Ningishzidda mentioned which is spooky. I ate a couple of brioche, banana and some chocolate milk so not loads with some cereal before hand.

I think I will do an imperial century to build up and am entering the Kennet valley 100 as well.

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #9 on: 27 January, 2016, 01:01:38 pm »
Double the distance, aim to complete with an average speed 10% less.

Your average kCals/km will be the same. Reduce speed by 10% and your kCals/min will drop by a larger difference due to the vehicles CURVED power vs speed curve.

When you move from 200 to 400km, operate the same rule. 400 speed can be 90% of 200 speed.

Example.
100 speed is 13.5 mph, 200 speed is 12.1, 400 speed is 10.9, 800 speed is 9.84, 1600 speed is 8.8 mph.

Seeings as events 1300 to 1800 have a min speed of 12 kmh ( 7.45 mph ) your safe.

When your avearge speed for a 100 minus 10% is lower than 14.3 kmh ( 8.9 mph ), you're not ready.
111% of 8.9 mph is 9.86 mph.

Big Tip. Don't go rushing off from the start of your 200 at the same pace as you rode the 100, or at the pace of more experienced riders. Stay at the target pace.
You'll be fine,,  :thumbsup:

 ??? The OP is asking about doing a 200....

OP, just do it, pace yourself and remember to eat and drink often. You may want to go out and a do an imperial ton beforehand just to make sure that you are comfortable on the bike doing a longish distance, by comfortable I mean sorting out any little niggles to do with bike fit.

I told him. Drop his speed by 10% and do that from the start.

"It doesn't matter how beautiful your theory is, it doesn't matter how smart you are.
If it doesn't agree with experiment, it's wrong."

"Design of experiments (DOE) is a systematic method to determine the relationship between factors affecting a process and the output of that process. In other words, it is used to find cause-and-effect relationships. This information is needed to manage process inputs in order to optimize the output."

 ;) :facepalm:

An experienced cyclist will say "We've a long way to cover today, so we'll take it easy and not get too knackered."

Martin 14

  • People too weak to follow their own dreams, will a
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #10 on: 31 January, 2016, 11:36:00 am »
Double the distance, aim to complete with an average speed 10% less.

Your average kCals/km will be the same. Reduce speed by 10% and your kCals/min will drop by a larger difference due to the vehicles CURVED power vs speed curve.

When you move from 200 to 400km, operate the same rule. 400 speed can be 90% of 200 speed.

Example.
100 speed is 13.5 mph, 200 speed is 12.1, 400 speed is 10.9, 800 speed is 9.84, 1600 speed is 8.8 mph.

Seeings as events 1300 to 1800 have a min speed of 12 kmh ( 7.45 mph ) your safe.

When your avearge speed for a 100 minus 10% is lower than 14.3 kmh ( 8.9 mph ), you're not ready.
111% of 8.9 mph is 9.86 mph.

Big Tip. Don't go rushing off from the start of your 200 at the same pace as you rode the 100, or at the pace of more experienced riders. Stay at the target pace.
You'll be fine,,  :thumbsup:

I like this, so will put this to the test starting from scratch :)
People too weak to follow their own dreams, will always find a way to discourage yours

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #11 on: 01 February, 2016, 10:53:12 pm »
The year I stepped up to 200 I did a couple of 150s  first. I haven't  done a 200 for a few years and want to  this year so plan the same again i.e. a couple of 150s beforehand.  Possibly helps with confidence more than anything.

Tim Hall

  • Victoria is my queen
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #12 on: 01 February, 2016, 11:03:06 pm »
Really great replies thank you all. I did a metric century on Monday at 13.5mph so exactly as Ningishzidda mentioned which is spooky. I ate a couple of brioche, banana and some chocolate milk so not loads with some cereal before hand.

I think I will do an imperial century to build up and am entering the Kennet valley 100 as well.
The Kennet Valley 100 is a lovely day ride, good choice.
There are two ways you can get exercise out of a bicycle: you can
"overhaul" it, or you can ride it.  (Jerome K Jerome)

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #13 on: 02 February, 2016, 10:46:02 pm »
Yes, excellent event. Hoping to ride it again this year.

I too like to build up to 200s by riding the odd 150. I can ride 100km easily. These days, 200km is a challenge. I try to have ridden 100s or ideally 150s on two or three preceding weekends, especially now that week-day mileage is a problem because I work in London. Can't ride every week (family and other commitments), but three in six would be good. I'm not sure it's just about fitness, but about confidence from completed rides as well.

I've packed in several 200s. I've also finished the odd one wishing I could carry to do a 300 :thumbsup:

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #14 on: 03 February, 2016, 07:51:57 pm »
Really great replies thank you all. I did a metric century on Monday at 13.5mph so exactly as Ningishzidda mentioned which is spooky. I ate a couple of brioche, banana and some chocolate milk so not loads with some cereal before hand.

I think I will do an imperial century to build up and am entering the Kennet valley 100 as well.

This is promising, just remember on a 200 that you will probably need a better meal at about half way.

For some that will mean beans on toast at each of the first two controls (50, 100km) and something sweeter at 150km. Personally having grown up touring with a pub lunch I tend to a snack at 50km e.g. bacon roll and then something more substantial at 100km (jacket potato + tuna or a pasta dish) then whatever I fancy at 150km.

What you need to eat and if that should be small and frequently or large and further spread is individual and the knowledge comes with experience and to an extent training. The important thing is not to get too hungry before you eat else you don't have sufficient energy to digest the food and ride at the same time.

contango

  • NB have not grown beard since photo was taken
  • The Fat And The Furious
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #15 on: 03 February, 2016, 08:57:30 pm »
Hi, I have been reading this forum for a while and wanted to join up and get involved.

I'm a 34 year old with very little time due to children and commuting from the shires into London.

I last did my one and only Audax the 100 organised by Hampshire police road club in March 2014 around Hampshire, I can't recall what it was called, then that year let my membership lapse due to work and other things.

I'm returning this year and want to do a 200km maybe a few! What is the main difference? Other than doing it, what is the best way to step up the distance? In small blocks or just resolve to get out and do a 200?

Thanks for your replies.

I rode a 150 between my first 100 and my first 200. An obvious halfway stage is either a 150 or an imperial 100 (more or less 160km).

One thing I've done when figuring if I'm ready to do something new is to take a best guess how I'd handle extra distance at the end of an existing ride. What I did in 2014 (the last year I did audaxing due to leaving the country) was to gauge myself based on a couple of my own rides, then shorter audaxes. I'd been off the bike for a while for weather issues, and really wanted to get a 300 under my belt. So I rode about 80km at my own pace, then figured if I could still ride further albeit at a slower pace. The next step was a local 120 (plus 30km each way, which I cycled) and after riding 180km I concluded I could ride another 120km in the time I'd have left on a 300.

Ultimately the only way to find out for sure is to enter and see how you get on. If you're in Hampshire you could try the Elstead series (that offers a 100, 150 and 200) or the Hungerford Hurrah/Hungerford Hooray (140/200). I've done the Elstead 150 and 200 and the Hungerford Hooray and enjoyed them both.
Always carry a small flask of whisky in case of snakebite. And, furthermore, always carry a small snake.

simonp

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #16 on: 03 February, 2016, 09:01:50 pm »
When I was new to riding 200s, I found it got hard, legs feeling heavier, around 150km. I think by then I'm probably, even when eating a lot, running low on glycogen.

Getting better at burning fat while riding will help. Avoiding excessive sugary food in your daily diet may help with this, and also training fasted (e.g. first thing in the morning before breakfast).

LEE

  • "Shut Up Jens" - Legs.
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #17 on: 03 February, 2016, 09:53:39 pm »
If you can get to the point where 100km isn't particularly challenging, then 200km should be achievable but knackering.


It's that same logic that found me at the start of PBP1200 thinking .. "This all started with a bloody 100k !!"
Some people say I'm self-obsessed but that's enough about them.

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #18 on: 03 February, 2016, 10:04:50 pm »

When I was new to riding 200s, I found it got hard, legs feeling heavier, around 150km. I think by then I'm probably, even when eating a lot, running low on glycogen.

Getting better at burning fat while riding will help. Avoiding excessive sugary food in your daily diet may help with this, and also training fasted (e.g. first thing in the morning before breakfast).

I would love to get up and out in the morning but never seem to get the chance.

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #19 on: 03 February, 2016, 10:07:40 pm »

Hi, I have been reading this forum for a while and wanted to join up and get involved.

I'm a 34 year old with very little time due to children and commuting from the shires into London.

I last did my one and only Audax the 100 organised by Hampshire police road club in March 2014 around Hampshire, I can't recall what it was called, then that year let my membership lapse due to work and other things.

I'm returning this year and want to do a 200km maybe a few! What is the main difference? Other than doing it, what is the best way to step up the distance? In small blocks or just resolve to get out and do a 200?

Thanks for your replies.

I rode a 150 between my first 100 and my first 200. An obvious halfway stage is either a 150 or an imperial 100 (more or less 160km).

One thing I've done when figuring if I'm ready to do something new is to take a best guess how I'd handle extra distance at the end of an existing ride. What I did in 2014 (the last year I did audaxing due to leaving the country) was to gauge myself based on a couple of my own rides, then shorter audaxes. I'd been off the bike for a while for weather issues, and really wanted to get a 300 under my belt. So I rode about 80km at my own pace, then figured if I could still ride further albeit at a slower pace. The next step was a local 120 (plus 30km each way, which I cycled) and after riding 180km I concluded I could ride another 120km in the time I'd have left on a 300.

Ultimately the only way to find out for sure is to enter and see how you get on. If you're in Hampshire you could try the Elstead series (that offers a 100, 150 and 200) or the Hungerford Hurrah/Hungerford Hooray (140/200). I've done the Elstead 150 and 200 and the Hungerford Hooray and enjoyed them both.

I remember seeing the Elstead series and I wanted to enter one of those in the past, look forward to do it in the summer if back on.

I think my first 200 will be the grand national park2park Romsey


Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #20 on: 03 February, 2016, 10:09:57 pm »

If you can get to the point where 100km isn't particularly challenging, then 200km should be achievable but knackering.


It's that same logic that found me at the start of PBP1200 thinking .. "This all started with a bloody 100k !!"

Brave man, how did you enjoy the PBP? (If that's the right question).

I thought the PBP article in the Arivee magazine was excellent.

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #21 on: 03 February, 2016, 10:26:53 pm »
It takes a lot of willpower not to join the pack for the first euphoric rush.  I've often intended to start 5 minutes after time just to let them get away, but on 200/300k rides it's so much fun I can rarely resist it.

I really don't see the point of this advice.

IMO and IME, if you do find yourself in the "first euphoric rush" that will probably be highly beneficial later on, in terms of getting round in time and in comfort.
If you don't - well OK there are other ways to skin the cat.
when you're dead you're done, so let the good times roll

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #22 on: 03 February, 2016, 10:35:52 pm »
It takes a lot of willpower not to join the pack for the first euphoric rush.  I've often intended to start 5 minutes after time just to let them get away, but on 200/300k rides it's so much fun I can rarely resist it.

I really don't see the point of this advice.

IMO and IME, if you do find yourself in the "first euphoric rush" that will probably be highly beneficial later on, in terms of getting round in time and in comfort.
If you don't - well OK there are other ways to skin the cat.

i found myself in this situation during pbp. after my crash in the early kilometres i've got the adrenalin rush to catch the front group. looking at my power and heart rate figures i knew i was being stupid and irrational, but it was so much fun that i dug deep and caught them anyway, despite knowing i'd pay for this later. so what..

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #23 on: 03 February, 2016, 10:36:34 pm »
IMO and IME, if you do find yourself in the "first euphoric rush" that will probably be highly beneficial later on, in terms of getting round in time and in comfort.

My experience is the exact opposite.  Riding at that sort of pace isn't compatible with me getting all the way round in comfort.

In practice, I always seem to be in the loo at the start, so it's less of a problem than it might be.

Re: New member and differences between 100km and 200km
« Reply #24 on: 03 February, 2016, 11:56:12 pm »
The one piece of advice I would offer is this. Several people have already said that food will be very important during the ride, with at least one reasonable size meal. IMO it is very important to stick to food you know, and know that you get on with. In other words, do not experiment with food on the ride.

Oh, one other thing. It is amazing how much difference a handful of jelly babies can make when you are feeling low. I usually take a packet with me.