Author Topic: MTD for VAT (Read 9044 times)

Pickled Onion · « **Reply #25 on:** 07 December, 2018, 10:18:23 pm »

It's quite clearly the former.

SoreTween · « **Reply #26 on:** 17 April, 2019, 01:02:40 pm »

I've avoided Making Tax Difficult and I have mixed feelings about that. I've just submitted my final VAT return for the company that has been my working life for the last 15 years, it is no longer registered for VAT. As of January 2nd I'm an employee of somebody else's company

I asked, when the position was first offered, if I could take it on a contract basis (i.e. through my company instead of direct hire) and did not press the point when the answer was no. Now I'm in the job I've found there are contract employees in similar positions so I could have. But the combination of

The virtual abolition of tax free dividend income
Making Tax Difficult
IR35¹

mean that I'm really not bothered that I didn't.

I'm in the lucky position with my 2nd company that it has never reached the mandatory VAT threshold so I can go on filling out 7 boxes once a quarter.

¹ I don't think I'm liable under IR35, the online tool honestly filled out says not. But since the HMRC don't seem to have clue one² how to apply their own rules I simply fear them. If they came after me I would not have the resources, financial nor time, to put up a substantial fight. I genuinely think the HMRC will increasing go after the small people rather than celebs. Sure the individual payouts will be smaller but crucifying the small guys (irrespective of whether they should be liable) will be far easier money.

² For example:
Ian Wells
Susan Winchester
Lorraine Kelly
Kaye Adams

Frank9755 · « **Reply #27 on:** 08 May, 2019, 10:32:12 pm »

I've been able to avoid it for another quarter. I should have started it in April but an error at their end meant I have a six month period from Jan to June so won't start until July. I hope that things are clearer then.
Good luck to everyone now in it.

Woofage · « **Reply #28 on:** 09 May, 2019, 02:41:29 pm »

Bumped into our accountant in Waitrose the other day (god, how middle class that sounds). His firm had done VAT submissions from Excel using a piece of free bridging s/w. When I have the details I'll post them here.

SoreTween · « **Reply #29 on:** 19 October, 2020, 05:42:24 pm »

HMRC fuckers.

Got another letter today as I'm not registered for Making Tax ~~Digital~~ Difficult. I must do one of two things, the letter implores, either register or declare that I don't need to (I don't).
The URL to register:

Code: [Select]

www.gov.uk

The URL to declare I don't need to register:

Code: [Select]

www.tax.service.gov.uk/submissions/new-form/declare-your-business-is-not-required-register-making-tax-digital-vatFollowed by pages and pages of filling out shit they already know to such an extent I had to double check I wasn't in the middle of being phished.

Oh and the lovely nugget at the bottom of the letter: Businesses will be required to sign up for Making Tax Difficult regardless of turnover from April 2022.

Shits

Quisling · « **Reply #30 on:** 20 October, 2020, 09:37:58 am »

I've managed to dodge this by being a bit workshy and hence below the threshold for MTD. Nonetheless, having discussed it with my accountant they've said they'll happily continue to take my spreadsheet records and stick them into suitable software and upload for me for a small quarterly fee to save me buying the software myself, and all the attendant upgrades etc. Mind you, my records are pretty simple.

Jaded · « **Reply #31 on:** 20 October, 2020, 10:22:40 am »

Thanks for the heads up. I did worry that the bastards would do this. Oh well, that will change the quarterly VAT process a bit. And increase costs...

Davef · « **Reply #32 on:** 20 October, 2020, 10:20:37 pm »

Quote from: Quisling on 20 October, 2020, 09:37:58 am

I've managed to dodge this by being a bit workshy and hence below the threshold for MTD. Nonetheless, having discussed it with my accountant they've said they'll happily continue to take my spreadsheet records and stick them into suitable software and upload for me for a small quarterly fee to save me buying the software myself, and all the attendant upgrades etc. Mind you, my records are pretty simple.

Is the small quarterly fee more than the price of the software.

Frank9755 · « **Reply #33 on:** 23 October, 2020, 07:57:16 am »

I have been doing this for the last three returns and it is a bit more hassle but not too bad.

I use Avalara MTD Filer, which is a free software designed to take my excel outputs and put them into the format that HMRC requires. It's basically an extra stage. It does take more time, but it is less than an hour, every three months, so it is bearable.

Davef · « **Reply #34 on:** 23 October, 2020, 08:12:50 am »

I have got it down to 1 minute and 16 seconds.

Frank9755 · « **Reply #35 on:** 23 October, 2020, 09:17:30 am »

Quote from: Davef on 23 October, 2020, 08:12:50 am

I have got it down to 1 minute and 16 seconds.

Is that using MTD Filer, or software?

I guess that is probably realistic for MTD Filer. I just did it last week and it took almost an hour as I had to set it up on a new computer. But most of the time is reminding myself how it works, rather than actually doing it. If I include that time, ten minutes is a reasonable worst case of what it should take.

Davef · « **Reply #36 on:** 23 October, 2020, 02:56:37 pm »

Quote from: Frank9755 on 23 October, 2020, 09:17:30 am

Quote from: Davef on 23 October, 2020, 08:12:50 am
I have got it down to 1 minute and 16 seconds.

Is that using MTD Filer, or software?

I guess that is probably realistic for MTD Filer. I just did it last week and it took almost an hour as I had to set it up on a new computer. But most of the time is reminding myself how it works, rather than actually doing it. If I include that time, ten minutes is a reasonable worst case of what it should take.

1 min 16 was the duration of the tutorial video. In actual fact it is but a few seconds to do in reality. I start the mtd software, press the excel option and then drag and drop the excel spreadsheet on to the drop zone and press ok. Paid for, not free mtd software though.

Jaded · « **Reply #37 on:** 23 October, 2020, 03:27:24 pm »

Quote from: Frank9755 on 23 October, 2020, 09:17:30 am

Quote from: Davef on 23 October, 2020, 08:12:50 am
I have got it down to 1 minute and 16 seconds.

Is that using MTD Filer, or software?

I guess that is probably realistic for MTD Filer. I just did it last week and it took almost an hour as I had to set it up on a new computer. But most of the time is reminding myself how it works, rather than actually doing it. If I include that time, ten minutes is a reasonable worst case of what it should take.

Hmm, it doesn't work on Apples. I guess I'll has to set up Office 365 on my Virtual Win 10 machine. I already use a MacOS virtual machine for my accounting package (because gouging) so that's only be three places I need to go to each quarter...

Davef · « **Reply #38 on:** 23 October, 2020, 03:32:42 pm »

Quote from: Jaded on 23 October, 2020, 03:27:24 pm

Quote from: Frank9755 on 23 October, 2020, 09:17:30 am
Quote from: Davef on 23 October, 2020, 08:12:50 am
I have got it down to 1 minute and 16 seconds.

Is that using MTD Filer, or software?

I guess that is probably realistic for MTD Filer. I just did it last week and it took almost an hour as I had to set it up on a new computer. But most of the time is reminding myself how it works, rather than actually doing it. If I include that time, ten minutes is a reasonable worst case of what it should take.

Hmm, it doesn't work on Apples. I guess I'll has to set up Office 365 on my Virtual Win 10 machine. I already use a MacOS virtual machine for my accounting package (because gouging) so that's only be three places I need to go to each quarter...

My one is also available as web version so works with macs. Send me a message and I will sort you out.

Frank9755 · « **Reply #39 on:** 04 May, 2021, 06:58:06 am »

Avalara MTD filer has stopped working but I have discovered Portico, which is far easier to use and does the job, apparently with HMRC's approval.

Highly recommended if you want to carry on with your excel sheets!

https://app.portico.openanswers.co.uk/#/signin

giropaul · « **Reply #40 on:** 04 May, 2021, 09:27:00 am »

Quote from: rogerzilla on 27 November, 2018, 08:33:24 pm

AIUI a lot of sole traders do no work for the last couple of months of each financial year, living off savings, just to stay below the threshold and avoid a world of pain. In a mostly-labour business like Fixing Stuff, you really don't want to be VAT-registered as you have virtually no input costs to help offset it and will simply be 20% more expensive than the next guy who manages to stay unregistered.

That’s exactly what I did. It’s going back a few years now, but if I’d gone VAT registered I would have needed to work quite a lot more just to pay the extra accountant’s fees.

SoreTween · « **Reply #41 on:** 02 May, 2023, 09:45:01 am »

The annual HMRC Administrative Burdens Advisory Board survey is up. It's biassed towards you telling them how wonderful Making Tax Difficult is but you can tell them the actual situation too. Benefits: "None". Extra admin = "finding the funds for the additional costs" etc.

SoreTween · « **Reply #42 on:** 05 May, 2024, 10:55:55 am »

FFS.
Making Tax Difficult for VAT was sold to us on the basis of people making mistakes in submitting their info on the web. This as I've said many times involved typing 7 numbers into 7 boxes on a web form. Now we are supposed to use software that submits the 7 boxes automagically. Of course, the hundreds and hundreds of book keeping entries required to generate these 7 numbers are still as error prone as before but lets just focus on the quarterly return.

16 years running company 1, 64 returns, 448 entries. Number of typos submitted - zero. There were possibly some typed but none, not a single one, got past the 'these are the figures you've entered, are you sure?' page.
8 years running company 2 pre-MTD, 32 returns, 224 entries. Number of typos submitted - zero.

Now I email my 7 numbers to my beancounter who copies them into a spreadsheet which uploads them automatically.

< 2 years running company 2 under MTD, 7 returns, 49 entries. Number of typos submitted - two. Biggies. Numbers off by more than double.

It's understandable. I have one company currently submitting returns so I'm focussed on it, I pay proper attention. My beancounter has dozens to do, possibly hundreds. I expect they pay very careful attention to their own company return, the rest is just numbers to type. What happens when you give people lots of data to transcribe? Errors.

And I have to pay for this. Under the old system submitting a return was a zero cost exercise, there are no free pieces of software available to submit. You can sign up to a web service & pay per submission, buy the software or pay your beancounter to use their purchased software.

That's progress folks. I'd write to my MP but I've already told him he's a useless fuckwit and later this year he can rest assured whoever looks best set to oust him is getting my vote.

Jaded · « **Reply #43 on:** 05 May, 2024, 11:48:35 am »

Agreed, it is blx.

I use Vital Tax £20 per year. Works in an Excel spreadsheet.

I've noticed that my bank, BoS, is offering free online accounting for small businesses. With MTD built in. My suspicion is that you sign up, and in a few years time they start a subscription service for £120 a year...

SoreTween · « **Reply #44 on:** 05 May, 2024, 03:27:34 pm »

Thanks Jaded, £20 is a hell of a lot less than it used to be. The cost to me would be more because I'd have to get back on the Microsoft gravy train, I'm all linux

But wait, what's this? Only an MTD bridge that supports LibreOffice on Linux. Yeeee ha! £7.50 a go but that's a £52.50 gain on my current arrangement, roll on next quarter.

And yeah, I'd be just as suspicious of a new free service.

Frank9755 · « **Reply #45 on:** **Yesterday** at 10:00:50 am »

The one I mentioned above, Portico, has been renamed to MyTaxDigital, but it is still free and doesn't require any specific brand of spreadsheet.
https://mytaxdigital.co.uk/