Author Topic: 'Hot foot' SPD issues... (Read 8902 times)

andyoxon · « **on:** 11 August, 2013, 09:12:42 pm »

I've searched and can't find the recent threads on this... feel free to post links.

Today towards end of a 70km ride, I had to stop and take my left shoe off for a few minutes - it was so bad. For this ride I'd moved the cleat to the heel most position, if anything this seems to be worse. I've already put some 1-2mm plastic sheet and dunlop basic insole in the Lidl shoes.

Are there any good value SPD shoes that have decent padding/block of the cleat? Anything else to try?

LittleWheelsandBig · « **Reply #1 on:** 11 August, 2013, 09:19:59 pm »

Get stiff-soled SPD shoes. LIDL don't cut it.

Canardly · « **Reply #2 on:** 11 August, 2013, 09:26:21 pm »

Change pedal to one offering more support?

L CC · « **Reply #3 on:** 11 August, 2013, 09:30:34 pm »

See your doctor about steroid injections for Mortons Neuroma.

valkyrie · « **Reply #4 on:** 11 August, 2013, 09:37:36 pm »

I suffer from hot foot quite frequently on longer rides, here's what I've found -

1. SPDs on fairly cheap Shimano shoes were the worst source of hot foot, despite being nice and roomy. Can get hot foot in under 200km
2. SPD-SLs on SIDIs were much better, but still got hot foot in hot weather after 400km or so.
3. Look Keos on the same SIDIs seem a bit better again, so hot foot not normally an issue under 600km unless the weather is very hot.

A few weeks ago I had to pack on a DIY 1300 in France because it was too hot. It was a proper heatwave - high 30s, tarmac melting etc and it was pretty much impossible to make any real progress between midday and about 7pm. I got hot foot in less than 200km on that ride, but managed to make it go away by slackening my shoes right off. I didn't think the shoes were tight to begin with but letting my feet move more in the shoes really helped.

I'd recommend trying different pedals/cleats and/or stiffer shoes. If you want to stick with SPDs then mountainbike racing shoes have basically the same rigid sole construction as road race shoes, but they are very expensive.

Exit Stage Left · « **Reply #5 on:** 11 August, 2013, 09:44:26 pm »

I've gone down every route possible, and have Sidi Mega Wide shoes in a size 50, 49 is my size, on Look Delta cleats. I've also got SPDs and some Northwave MTB shoes on one bike. I have some pedals on that with cleats one side, and rat traps on the other, so I can go shopping on it. When I get hot foot on that I unclip and pedal on my toes or instep on the rat traps until the hot foot goes away and I clip in again.

andyoxon · « **Reply #6 on:** 11 August, 2013, 10:14:45 pm »

Thanks all. Today I didn't get numbness as such, just ache that got worse. So are non-expensive recessed SPD cleats more prone to press on the foot, than non recessed road shoes? I do find recessed very convenient, but have go to get something better. Not so keen on the idea of SL shoes. Any good examples of stiff soled shoes?

frankly frankie · « **Reply #7 on:** 11 August, 2013, 10:26:18 pm »

Yes they are very convenient, but generally not as stiff as road shoes - and stiffness is the key.
But regardless, I simply don't know how people ride on typical vestigial SPD pedals without a bit of foot support.

You need this sort of thing

[Shimano M424 image from Wiggle]

Yes they look awful and uncool but they do the job very well. I hate how they look but I've used them these last 12 years or so.
If you use MTB-type shoes with treaded soles and recessed cleats you may well need to hack some sole rubber away to make these safe - that's what I do - otherwise you can easily find your feet totally locked in, be warned.

If you use road shoes, then get decent ones with carbon-reinfoced soles - totally rigid, very nice. LIDL - er no.
But you still have the issue of an unsupported shoe, there can be a outward swivel of the foot (reverse pronation??) which is simply solved by using pedals like the above monstrosity.

andyoxon · « **Reply #8 on:** 11 August, 2013, 10:37:39 pm »

Thanks, will take a look. I've seen these:

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/shimano/xc50-spd-mtb-shoes-ec039082

Recessed - inasmuch as they have outer treads rather than the cleat sunk into the sole. Class fibre reinforced - my guess is carbon is more expensive (?) Mind you £80 seems a fair bit for shoes.

On my Lidl shoes, the plate that the cleats mount on is very rigid - so I guess it's either the section 'inside' the shoe, or the whole assembly being pressed in by pressure on pedal.

vorsprung · « **Reply #9 on:** 12 August, 2013, 08:20:48 am »

I agree with the comments about a lack of stiffness^{^*} causing hot foot
The only times I've had this problem was when using my old Shimano M030 touring shoes, which are quite bendy for a SPD shoe. I guess this is because they are intended for walking in
Good socks help with foot comfort generally too, as do Sorbothane insoles

_*stop sniggering!!!

frankly frankie · « **Reply #10 on:** 12 August, 2013, 08:41:39 am »

Quote from: andyoxon on 11 August, 2013, 10:37:39 pm

I've seen these:

I've been eyeing those myself. I agree £80 is as much as I would want to pay for a pair of shoes, and I've had good results with Shimano shoes in the past (broader than the average). I think I've seen them (or very similar) a bit cheaper in Decathlon.

PaulF · « **Reply #11 on:** 12 August, 2013, 08:56:12 am »

I've got a pair of xc50's and I'm very pleased with them using 'normal' spd's.

Having said that, like all shoes, it's worth trying them on to find out whether you have a 'Shimano shaped foot'

andyoxon · « **Reply #12 on:** 12 August, 2013, 09:08:13 am »

Thanks for comments all. XC50s sound promising.

Anatomy of the cleat mount in my shoes... The shoe is actually very rigid - can hardly bend shoe with hands. It looks like the main issue (for me) is padding above the cleat. Not impressed with the thin sponge 'plaster'. The grey insole came with shoe, the other are my additions. My foot is quite tight in the shoe and perhaps this doesn't help. Note 'impression' of cleat well on grey insole.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-GlDwt4u1ln8/UgiWA8RAfFI/AAAAAAAAExQ/5U52Kxi22Jg/s512/P1180004.JPG[/img]

bumper · « **Reply #13 on:** 12 August, 2013, 09:11:15 am »

I use carbon soled spd-sl shoes but still suffer with hot foot on the left. The things which have almost cured my foot pain are moving the cleats backwards and starting off with fairly slack buckles on the shoes. Another thing which has definitely helped is not relying on my left foot for resting on and unweighting myself over bumps, I try to use my right leg too. It may sound weird but most of us favour a leg when riding. Every few miles taking the time to pull up on the pedal stroke with the sore foot helps to keep it at bay.

andyoxon · « **Reply #14 on:** 12 August, 2013, 09:32:35 am »

Re. carbon soled shoes... is the carbon a base plate simply to make the sole super rigid, and then the cleat has variable types of material padding on top to protect the foot. Or, is it the case that the cleat mount is encased in carbon on the foot side, so that pressure from the metal cleat mount is well distributed and doesn't hurt foot (generally). Perhaps the construction varies?

rafletcher · « **Reply #15 on:** 12 August, 2013, 09:37:41 am »

CF soled shoes are just that. The sole is a cf reinforced composite. Generally it's a "flat" sole with raised tread to "recess" the cleat for walking. Inside the shoe is an insole. Oh, and they're VERY expensive.

http://www.wheelies.co.uk/p38663/Specialized-S-Works-MTB-Shoe.aspx

mattc · « **Reply #16 on:** 12 August, 2013, 09:43:01 am »

hotfoot returns loads of hits (YACF search is a bit feeble, so doesn't find much for "hot foot")
I've already typed loads about this (several threads), can't be arsed again:

https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=74587.msg1539112#msg1539112

andyoxon · « **Reply #17 on:** 12 August, 2013, 09:45:27 am »

Quote from: rafletcher on 12 August, 2013, 09:37:41 am

CF soled shoes are just that. The sole is a cf reinforced composite. Generally it's a "flat" sole with raised tread to "recess" the cleat for walking. Inside the shoe is an insole. Oh, and they're VERY expensive.

http://www.wheelies.co.uk/p38663/Specialized-S-Works-MTB-Shoe.aspx

Thanks. Just to be clear though - in these s-works/top end/similar shoes if one pulled the insole out, the cleat mount would not be visible, simply the carbon sole or perhaps some additional material on top of the carbon soles i.e. the cleat mount is not exposed to the inside of the shoe.

rafletcher · « **Reply #18 on:** 12 August, 2013, 09:54:45 am »

ISWYM - and I have no idea! Someone will know though I'm sure.

mattc · « **Reply #19 on:** 12 August, 2013, 10:03:57 am »

I've edited this a bit:

Quote from: andyoxon on 12 August, 2013, 09:08:13 am

It looks like the main issue (for me) is padding above the cleat. Not impressed with the thin sponge 'plaster'. The grey insole came with shoe, the other are my additions. My foot is quite tight in the shoe and perhaps this doesn't help. Note 'impression' of cleat well on grey insole.

Well ... these pics seem to show that your foot isn't even touching the cleat (or it's backing plate). Perhaps it's my eyesight, or piccie quality, but:
The impression on your insole is from the "sticking plaster" cover, not the cleat. The latter would make a much smaller indentation, and should show the 4 screw holes.

mrcharly-YHT · « **Reply #20 on:** 12 August, 2013, 10:11:21 am »

That 'hollow' plus tight shoes will cause problems.

You don't need tight shoes if using SPDs. Get roomy shoes with a velcro strap (which doesn't stretch). Don't lace them up tight.

There should be a sticky-backed bit of aluminium to go over that 'hole'. You could fill it with silicone sealant (which is removable if you need to replace the plate).

andyoxon · « **Reply #21 on:** 12 August, 2013, 10:24:35 am »

That's right, the flat cleat mount plate is in the recessed 'chamber', or hollow, and it seems that the rectangular edge of this hollow must be digging into my foot, the shielding/padding is not sufficient. I may have some aluminium around, will have a look.

Perhaps If I centralise the cleat in the 'hollow' and find some plate to go over, this may be some sort of fix.

Greenbank · « **Reply #22 on:** 12 August, 2013, 10:28:39 am »

Quote from: Greenbank on 07 August, 2013, 12:48:43 pm

All SPD, all the same pedals, and same bike:-

I've got two pairs of shoes that will give me hotfoot after 60km-80km of riding. (Some Adidas SPD shoes and some cheaper Spesh MTB Sport shoes I use for commuting).

I've got one pair of shoes that hasn't given me hotfoot after 250km of riding. Never ridden longer in these shoes (really old Shimano SPD shoes with cloth uppers but a really stiff sole.)

I've got one pair of shoes that hasn't given me hotfoot at all during 1200km and 1400km rides. (Spesh MTB Pro with carbon soles.)

A larger pedal platform may delay the onset of hotfoot a bit, maybe even long enough to complete the specific event. But you can't get a larger pedal platform that the sole of the shoe, so as stiff a sole as you can remain comfy in seems the best option.

edscoble · « **Reply #23 on:** 12 August, 2013, 11:50:36 am »

Why have no one mention the likelihood of the insoles being the curpit? some people feet are different, I got a custom insoles because I have a very high arch that put more pressure on the back of my feet and the balls of my feet (almost none in the middle).

the hot spot occur for me depending on how well the shoes fit regardless of the price, having more support on the middle of my feet (the arch), i have noticable less pressure on the balls of my feet now.

stiff shoes help, but only does so much.

andyoxon · « **Reply #24 on:** 12 August, 2013, 01:21:21 pm »

For me it's the ball of the foot - back from where my toes 'join'. Even without the added insole, when I could wiggle my toes and move my foot more, I was getting ache and also at times numbness.