Yet Another Cycling Forum

Off Topic => The Pub => The Sporting Life => Topic started by: Beardy on 06 February, 2021, 05:05:04 pm

Title: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 06 February, 2021, 05:05:04 pm
I’m watching the Calcutta Cup on the anabaric distascope while at home. Although I don’t attend the stadia I do on occasion visit my local hostelry to boost the experience with a bit of atmosphere. This is obviously not an option, but the lack of a crowd at Twickers makes for a flat experience even for a home viewing.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 06 February, 2021, 06:34:53 pm
Yay. \○/
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 06 February, 2021, 06:36:29 pm
Well, Scotland were very good, outplayed England, and thoroughly deserved!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 06 February, 2021, 07:24:22 pm
I watched 9 minutes of highlights which I suspect were unrepresentative as the impression they gave was overwhelmingly in Scotland's favour. I would have expected a lot more points than 11 from what they showed. However, they were quite badly edited, often cutting off commentators in mid-sentence. That's
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: bairn again on 06 February, 2021, 07:43:58 pm
Great to win at the home of one of world rugby giants.

A cool head would say that Scotland could improve and should have been out of sight long before the finish but yay.   

England werent allowed to play and ended up playing against the clock as well, which Scotland needed. 

Id just left high school the last time Scotland won at Twickenham.  It may be an evening for that 21yo Springbank.

Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 06 February, 2021, 08:35:10 pm
Pleased with the Scotland win, but England were poor.
Scotland displayed their usual inability to convert possession and field position into points, but got away with it.

.  It may be an evening for that 21yo Springbank.

Can I call round?  ;D
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 06 February, 2021, 08:40:59 pm
I thought it was a terrific contest but a bloody awful advertisement for Rugger.  I'm not sure it would have inspired too many youngsters.

Well done Scotland.  I think England defended resolutely because they were under the cosh almost all the time.  But neither team showed much flair in admittedly poor conditions.

But well done Scotland - one for the memory banks!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 06 February, 2021, 10:09:01 pm
Spare a thought for plucky little Italy  :'(
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 06 February, 2021, 10:31:31 pm
I watched 9 minutes of highlights which I suspect were unrepresentative as the impression they gave was overwhelmingly in Scotland's favour. I would have expected a lot more points than 11 from what they showed. However, they were quite badly edited, often cutting off commentators in mid-sentence. That's

They were representative.

Of the game, and of the comme
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 07 February, 2021, 12:51:20 am
I thought Scotlandland deserved the win, but Englandtown deserved the small points difference. I thought the English pack were good in defence, but when one team hold the ball for as long as the wee jocks did, the outcome is pretty much inevitable.

I didn’t see either of the other matches but it’s pretty clear that both teams I did see play have plenty of room to improve.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 07 February, 2021, 01:15:36 am
You didn’t miss Wales-Ireland coz it ent happened yet ;D
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 07 February, 2021, 11:08:03 pm
It has now... ;)

I can't help thinking that there was a fair bit of good fortune for the winning side in that game.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 07 February, 2021, 11:33:47 pm
I didn't see it all, but until that mis kick at the end, I felt Ireland were gong to score, and so win.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: fd3 on 13 February, 2021, 11:56:10 am
a bloody awful advertisement for Rugger.
Sounds like business as usual for the six nations for the past ... 10? ... years.

Seems to me that union has been pushing more towards long distance goal kicking, mauls, big men grunting about until a penalty is given ... I swear there was more free flowing running play back in the day.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 13 February, 2021, 12:45:41 pm
I'm sure you're right.  The Wales game was slightly better - but only slightly!  And I dread England being awarded a penalty, never mind all the points they give away by being thick.  I once went into the kitchen when Farrell placed the ball and when I came back, having made a cup of tea, mowed the lawn and done the Times crossword, he was still eyeing it up.....
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 13 February, 2021, 02:20:03 pm
Wow!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 13 February, 2021, 05:15:37 pm
Come on Scotland!

Two slight bits of luck well taken.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 13 February, 2021, 06:44:13 pm
Gosh. Good game.
I always find Scotland-Wales a hard watch. My heart says blue. My other heart says red.
Although my team always wins, my team always looses.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 13 February, 2021, 06:49:29 pm
Are Wales going to win the 6 Nations based on red cards?
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: bairn again on 13 February, 2021, 06:55:32 pm
A pulsating game.  To my untrained eye Scotland played a bit like England did v. Scotland last week ie they dominated possession but were hugely ill disciplined. 

That winning try had a lot in common with one by Tony Stanger in 1990 the last time I was at Murrayfield.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Steph on 13 February, 2021, 07:36:03 pm
I am just relieved.

Mind you, both matches today had some corking tries, by all the teams.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 13 February, 2021, 07:44:06 pm
Lewis Rees-Zammit seems to be something rather special.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 13 February, 2021, 07:59:19 pm
I had to go for my evening meal 10 minutes into the second half of the Scotland/Wales match  >:( It looks like it got a bit tense towards the end.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 13 February, 2021, 08:31:29 pm
Lewis Rees-Zammit seems to be something rather special.

Lewis Rees(ed) Lightning.   :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: TimC on 13 February, 2021, 08:44:57 pm
I really enjoyed the Scotland-Wales match. Can't say I've enjoyed one as much in some time! The England - Italy match was also fun, but not in the same way. I enjoyed Italy occasionally sticking it to the man, but they - as ever - were never really in the match.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 13 February, 2021, 11:06:14 pm
Lewis Rees-Zammit seems to be something rather special.

Indeed.

He'll be a target now, though.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 14 February, 2021, 12:19:00 am
At least Plucky Little Italy managed a couple of tries this time :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: markcjagar on 14 February, 2021, 02:54:52 pm
Despite the big win over Italy I thought England, whilst better than last week, were still rather lacklustre. The tries were fun though and you can see hints of improvement from Italy.

Scotland should've easily beaten Wales but their discipline let them down and Wales are known for grinding out close wins. The bit after 80 minutes was nerve wracking, 2 wins would've been an amazing start for Scotland.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 14 February, 2021, 03:29:49 pm
(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/a94fd23a54ca8be4473e846071e47c8a9c4d676e/0_267_3896_2338/master/3896.jpg?width=1920&quality=85&auto=format&fit=max&s=b93d749f59e0a914e4d9477136de26ea)

That's a cracking photo! (From the Graun)
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 14 February, 2021, 03:50:25 pm
Ireland - France.
I've just heard the (English) referee shout, "Alors. Use it".
 ;D
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 27 February, 2021, 06:17:29 pm
When you run at Wales, their weaknesses are exposed.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 27 February, 2021, 06:37:58 pm
As an Englishman I can only say that I’m ashamed. The England pack are the stronger team on the field, why then are they not in a commanding lead? Poor disciple. They play a stunning series of phases and then someone does something totally stupid and right under the referees nose to boot. Idiots.

There’s no point talking about ‘those’ two tries as their total lack of discipline makes that issue moot.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 27 February, 2021, 06:41:31 pm
It’s actually quite funny.

I’m glad I'm on my third beer.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 27 February, 2021, 06:46:49 pm
I hope for the Referees sake that the bonus point doesn’t affect the tournament outcome, but I think it’s unlikely.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 27 February, 2021, 07:33:47 pm
Well,I really missed the atmosphere of the pub.  Old men with veins standing out on their foreheads as they bellow out Hen Wlad Fy Nhadau.  Groups of young women up on the tables,  older ladies group hugging. Free sausage and chips at half-time.   Just magic.
This year I watched it on my own in my study   :(
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 27 February, 2021, 08:00:59 pm
I'm waiting for the highlights. I was totally unaware that it was on.

Wales have never scored 40 points against England before.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: CommuteTooFar on 27 February, 2021, 09:25:17 pm
I am watching the whole match  now.


As for first try.  Farrell asks the referee for time to tell is team they have given away too many penalties.  Every other captain in world rugby runs to the left runs to right, "Lads stop giving away penalties, the ref has noticed."  Farrell instead calls a group hug. The ref did not agree to that. Blows his whistle to tell Biggar to continue and a controversial try is well executed.

 
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 27 February, 2021, 09:36:37 pm
That makes sense - but wasn't it Farrell who gave away the penalty in question?

I'm trying to make sense of the second try. The ball went from Rees-Zammit's right hand, to left hand, to thigh, to heel, and then went backwards, despite his first touch knocking it forward.

Quote
Law 12 DEFINITION: KNOCK-ON

A knock-on occurs when a player loses possession of the ball and it goes forward, or when a player hits the ball forward with the hand or arm, or when the ball hits the hand or arm and goes forward, and the ball touches the ground or another player before the original player can catch it.

https://rugby365.com/laws-referees/law-discussions/law-discussion-knock-on/

From that, I can't help but think that the referee was wrong.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 27 February, 2021, 09:52:15 pm
It could be argued that those first two tries knock England off their game and thus upset the outcome of the game, but England have never been the most disciplined team, and at the moment in my opinion they’re particularly bad so it’s debatable whether or not the game outcome was affected.

I think the bigger issue is if Wales win the tournament by one point or on goal difference, though whether anyone will actually care other than the second team and the England supporters.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: CommuteTooFar on 27 February, 2021, 10:01:43 pm
many time a player has mishandled and turned it into a drop kick.  I am not certain every referee has allowed or penalised it. Fundamentally rhys-zammit fumble was a drop kick.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 27 February, 2021, 10:44:33 pm
Kudos to Farrell for declining to rise to the bait and slag off the ref.  Shame he forgot to instruct his Gentleman to lay out his kicking trousers this morning.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: fd3 on 27 February, 2021, 11:41:43 pm
Freude can apparently be enhanced by shadenfreude; who knew?
The first controversy was rude, but the second is laws as written.  It does make me  ;D to hear all the ENGLISH pundits going on about these controversies, whereas, had they won in these circumstances, they would be singing a very different tune about the laws as written and how you can't argue with the ref, play the game in front of you, etc. Martin Johnson, especially, should know better.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: toontra on 28 February, 2021, 10:26:40 am
As for first try.  Farrell asks the referee for time to tell is team they have given away too many penalties.  Every other captain in world rugby runs to the left runs to right, "Lads stop giving away penalties, the ref has noticed."  Farrell instead calls a group hug. The ref did not agree to that. Blows his whistle to tell Biggar to continue and a controversial try is well executed.

Spot on.  The ref's comment wasn't intended as a time out for England to have a breather and regroup.  I thought the ref had a good game, calling out England's cynical fouling all over the park.

Mind you I'm Scottish  ;)
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 28 February, 2021, 01:43:24 pm
It seems that the BBC reporter who interviewed Farrell after the match has come in for some appalling online abuse - just for doing her job.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/feb/27/bbcs-sonja-mclaughlan-reveals-online-abuse-over-owen-farrell-interview
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 28 February, 2021, 04:53:55 pm
The general consensus from the pundits I’ve read seems to be the ref was a bit shit and has form of similar, but there’s no point going on about it as the England pack got the result they played for in any event.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 28 February, 2021, 07:24:37 pm
She was clearly trying to get Farrell to criticise the ref even when he'd already made it plain he wasn’t going to.  Which in no way excuses the actions of the Neanderthals.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 12 March, 2021, 11:52:02 am
Six Nations: CVC deal will bring in 'new era' for rugby, says tournament boss Ben Morel (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/56359501).

Why, yes, Ben!  Yes, it will!

Quote
[…] moving the Championship off free-to-air TV in order to maximise revenue is not a foregone conclusion.

These are not sports people, Benny, these are money people.  The only thing they’re interested in is the bottom line.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: John Stonebridge on 12 March, 2021, 11:00:58 pm
The decision by NatWest to withdraw sponsorship from the six nations was fuelled by a desire to avoid at all costs being the sponsor holding the ball at the point that the coverage moved from from free-to-air. 

It was all dressed up in corpororate bollocks speak in 2017 but the six nations in a free-to-air format was an utter steal for even at the £10m - £15m pa that NatWest was paying towards the end. 

No doubt some fuckers like Red Bull will be waiting in the wings to “partner” with CVC and Sky or whoever
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 13 March, 2021, 06:37:58 pm
Well that was an exciting match.

Never in doubt, of course.  :o
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 13 March, 2021, 06:57:57 pm
Yes, it's all quite nicely poised - England still in with a chance of finishing 5th!

(I suspect we won't see much movement on the suggestion that Italy are removed from the competition because they protect the others from falling into what used to be Scotland's fiefdom.)
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 13 March, 2021, 07:57:17 pm
i wonder when the last time a hooker, or any other front row forward, scored 2 tries in an international?
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Nuncio on 13 March, 2021, 08:09:29 pm
Don't know, but Jamie George did it 4 months ago before he ruined it and scored a 3rd. (v Georgia)
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 13 March, 2021, 11:13:11 pm
Yes, it's all quite nicely poised - England still in with a chance of finishing 5th!

(I suspect we won't see much movement on the suggestion that Italy are removed from the competition because they protect the others from falling into what used to be Scotland's fiefdom.)

Back at the start of the current campaign one of the colemantators noted that even were Plucky Little Italy to be removed, they’d likely be replaced by AN Other team – most probably Georgia – who would be even worse.  On the other hand Argentina made representations to join in with Europe rather than the rest of the Southern Hemisphere because nearly all their top players plied their trade exclusively in Europe.  Natch they were roundly rebuffed.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 13 March, 2021, 11:38:56 pm
Really dubious winning try, almost as bad as that time wilkinson stood fully on the line v Scotland and the try was still given. 

Onfield ref had a decent view and didnt give it.

Still, that was Englands cup final today so they probably thought they had earned the sympathy vote.

It was definitely a try.

The second angle showed it, ball definitely grounded as he slid forward.

I couldn't understand why it took so long to award it.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: fd3 on 14 March, 2021, 01:00:31 am
Eh merde.

As to replacing Italy, cobblers!  What they need to do is ignore Mr L and expand to 7 nations with the Argentines playing out of Barcelona (or some-such).  Or they could go back to four nations, refuse to play France on the grounds that they are from EUROPE and then the Southern Hemisphere could try and stifle the growth of the PIs and we could have a WC of England, France, 3-Nations where England and France could take turns coming last.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 14 March, 2021, 08:42:23 am
They could limit the number of kicks allowed up the field in open play.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 14 March, 2021, 12:24:43 pm
And how long Farrell is allowed for a kick at goal.  Actually, just limit Farrell, full stop!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 14 March, 2021, 12:27:08 pm
Can't understand why he is Captain.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: TimC on 14 March, 2021, 12:40:18 pm
This is YACF, so of course it's de rigeur to ply the hate on anything English!

That was a very entertaining match between two teams who weren't playing at their best. The winning try was not 'dubious', but it warranted being checked. The right decision was reached.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 14 March, 2021, 12:44:49 pm
I don't hate anybody but I do like open rugby.  Actually, that's not quite true: shall we say I strongly dislike England's lilywhite strip.  Italy has the best strip.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 14 March, 2021, 01:05:45 pm
And how long Farrell is allowed for a kick at goal.  Actually, just limit Farrell, full stop!

Sixty seconds of playing time for a penalty once the team has indicated they’re going to kick for goal; ninety seconds for a conversion once the try has been scored.  Farrell is probably one of the game’s most notable procrastinators but at least he had his kicking trousers on yesterday, unlike in the Wales game.

PS: It wasn’t my suggestion to remove Plucky Little Italy, merely something that $COLEMANTATOR mentioned during their opening game.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: T42 on 14 March, 2021, 01:10:00 pm
Didn't watch or listen, just heard the score and said [rude word].
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Steph on 14 March, 2021, 01:33:05 pm
I shall just sit and smile at the memory of Rees-Zammit running the length of the pitch, and the wonderful Big George looking a little more like his wonderful unstoppable self.

Also smiling at how really cosmopolitan the Welsh squad is nowadays, even when disregarding South Seas imports. Malta and Iran are not countries usually associated with the Great Game. Well, not this Great Game, that is.

Re the comment about getting rid of flankers, line-outs, etc: if I wanted to watch 26 people, all the same size and shape, doing the same thing over and over again, I would follow League. I will stick with the game that allows pretty little boys with perms, like de Klerk, to play alongside the Kens and Maros of this world, and win.

While typing that, I remember one particularly small boy called Jones being picked on by a much bigger boy, Farr-jones. The thought of telling Robert Jones that he is a pretty boy is not tempting. Hint, Nick: Robert's nose should have given you a warning.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9Z2m6DgwQ4&t=1s
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 14 March, 2021, 01:35:53 pm
And how long Farrell is allowed for a kick at goal.  Actually, just limit Farrell, full stop!

Sixty seconds of playing time for a penalty once the team has indicated they’re going to kick for goal; ninety seconds for a conversion once the try has been scored.  Farrell is probably one of the game’s most notable procrastinators but at least he had his kicking trousers on yesterday, unlike in the Wales game.

PS: It wasn’t my suggestion to remove Plucky Little Italy, merely something that $COLEMANTATOR mentioned during their opening game.

Yes, I think it was Sam Warburton, ex-Wales captain, who made the suggestion.  Or maybe he was endorsing a commentator, I'm not quite sure.

Didn't know about the allowable time - they need to get that shifted!  I think what makes it worse in Farrell's case is the number of rituals he goes through, possibly advised by highly-paid sports psychologist, who no doubt turns up to work in a tracksuit. 
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Steph on 14 March, 2021, 01:43:28 pm
Warbs is an eminently fair and honourable player, and talks a lot of sense. a lot of kickballers could take lessons.

I was reminded of him by one of the Italians yellow-carded yesterday, who fully accepted his penalty and made a point of apologising to the Welsh player involved.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 14 March, 2021, 02:09:00 pm
Definitely agree.  Still think he said the Italy thing, though.

A propos Robert Jones, Steph, you might like this, then follow the link to David Bishop, whom one should always treat with respect, too!

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/robert-jones-wales-rugby-scrum-18147737 (https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/robert-jones-wales-rugby-scrum-18147737)
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 14 March, 2021, 03:28:47 pm
Missing Richie Gray in the lineout.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 14 March, 2021, 03:37:46 pm
Going back to the kicking thing.  Finn Russell has just converted Scotland's first try.  Fifteen seconds from placing the ball to running back to the re-start.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 14 March, 2021, 04:10:51 pm
Plenty of thud and blunder in the current came...
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Steph on 14 March, 2021, 05:08:20 pm
A wild game, and further proof that Scottish sports teams are always handicapped by being made up entirely of Scots.
Serious point on this: the Scots sports teams are always handicapped by their obsession with beating one team, that being England.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 14 March, 2021, 05:11:29 pm
A wild game, and further proof that Scottish sports teams are always handicapped by being made up entirely of Scots.

You mean like Duhan van der Merwe  ;D
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Steph on 14 March, 2021, 05:11:53 pm
Definitely agree.  Still think he said the Italy thing, though.

A propos Robert Jones, Steph, you might like this, then follow the link to David Bishop, whom one should always treat with respect, too!

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/robert-jones-wales-rugby-scrum-18147737 (https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/robert-jones-wales-rugby-scrum-18147737)

I read that article while looking for the video. Dai Bish was a great player, but he was also a twat, and a nasty one, in my memory. Welsh rugby always had a parallel handicap to the old English one. In Wales, it was the East-West regional divide; in England, it was the "right sort of chap" divide, as in public school/southern England focus.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Nuncio on 14 March, 2021, 05:38:43 pm
Dai Bish was a great player, but he was also a twat, and a nasty one, in my memory.

As was Rob Jones' elder brother Anthony (twat, that is, not great player), also mentioned in that article. I hadn't realised that he'd died.  I was at university with him. He, and most of the rugger lot, were best avoided (though, from memory, Paul Thorburn seemed OK).

I marvel every time I cycle through it, that the tiny village of Trebanos produced England bowler Greg Thomas, Rob Jones and Bleddyn Bowen within 2 or three years, then a litle gap before Arwel Thomas, and another one before Justin Tipuric. 
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: John Stonebridge on 14 March, 2021, 06:12:52 pm
A wild game, and further proof that Scottish sports teams are always handicapped by being made up entirely of Scots.

You mean like Duhan van der Merwe  ;D
very much  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 14 March, 2021, 09:58:45 pm
Didn't know about the allowable time - they need to get that shifted!  I think what makes it worse in Farrell's case is the number of rituals he goes through, possibly advised by highly-paid sports psychologist, who no doubt turns up to work in a tracksuit.

I've only just finished watching the Scotland-Ireland game.  Sexton seems to take almost as long as Farrell.

The match as a whole reminded mr of Dr Hutch's comment when a guest in V2's broom cupboard during the TdF a few years ago: “What we like to see is bike racing done badly!”
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 20 March, 2021, 04:19:00 pm
Oh dear.  And it was such a promising start by Plucky Little Italy too :'(
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 20 March, 2021, 05:23:32 pm
That was a stonking try.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 20 March, 2021, 06:39:45 pm
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 20 March, 2021, 06:40:00 pm
wot a shoking sho by england most deplorable a lot of rabits

You'd think they’d have learned to give away so many penalties by now :facepalm:
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 20 March, 2021, 07:23:07 pm
Was this match broadcast on the Beeb?

Part of me hopes that this will be Eddie Jones' swansong, because he's such an annoying little tick. OTOH, England always seem to "underperform" under his guidance, so the other part wants him to stay.

I haven't found any highlights yet.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: SteveC on 20 March, 2021, 07:42:29 pm
It was on ITV (which confused MrsC).
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 20 March, 2021, 07:58:11 pm
Bloody hell - some of those Welshmen can't sing...
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 20 March, 2021, 10:02:18 pm
There'll be even less singing in the Valleys now.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Steph on 20 March, 2021, 10:03:06 pm
ARSEBOLLOCKS!!!!!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 20 March, 2021, 10:06:19 pm
Didn't Wales get a bonus point tonight because they lost by only 2 points?
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: TimC on 20 March, 2021, 10:13:31 pm
I think that was the most entertaining match I've seen in many years!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: hatler on 20 March, 2021, 11:08:05 pm
It was gripping stuff. Amazing game.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Pingu on 20 March, 2021, 11:30:38 pm
So, are the statisticians having hard-ons about the possible outcomes?
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 21 March, 2021, 12:36:49 am
Oh yes.  France have to beat Scotland and score four tries to make them equal on points with Wales and then it all goes down to mathemagical nerdery which ICBA to look up.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: T42 on 21 March, 2021, 09:08:44 am
Feeling rather pleased this morning. :D
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 21 March, 2021, 07:34:28 pm
Thinking back to yesterday's match, Wales's last spell of possession culminated in the Rees-Zammit grounding of the ball that just touched the white line. After that, it was all France.

Wales were about 2cm from winning the Grand Slam.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 21 March, 2021, 11:17:18 pm
Oh yes.  France have to beat Scotland and score four tries to make them equal on points with Wales and then it all goes down to mathemagical nerdery which ICBA to look up.

Frankly, my bear, I don't think you'll need to be A:  France should be up to the task.  Is there a date for this, yet?
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 21 March, 2021, 11:20:04 pm
Oh yes.  France have to beat Scotland and score four tries to make them equal on points with Wales and then it all goes down to mathemagical nerdery which ICBA to look up.

Frankly, my bear, I don't think you'll need to be A:  France should be up to the task.  Is there a date for this, yet?

This coming Friday.  20:00 GMT according to Mr Google.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 21 March, 2021, 11:26:28 pm
I think France need to win with four try bonus point plus a 17 or more point lead.
If I were a France fan, I'd be nervous.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 22 March, 2021, 12:08:48 am
If I've understood the rules correctly, France have to:

1. Win.
2. Score 4 tries for a bonus point
3. Beat Scotland by at least 21 points as Wales' current points difference (61) is 20 better than France's (41).
4. In the event of points and points difference being equal, then the number of tries scored comes into play. Wales have scored 20 to Frances 15.

If points, points difference and the number of tries are equal, then the championship is shared.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 22 March, 2021, 11:05:51 am
Ah, a slightly different complexion appears, then!  I should think France might score five tries all right but a 21 point gap might be a little harder to close.  Is there nothing about how many Sourh Africans you've got or left-handed players, or something?

@ Mr Larrington - thanks for the time and date.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Nuncio on 22 March, 2021, 11:43:29 am
Thinking back to yesterday's match, Wales's last spell of possession culminated in the Rees-Zammit grounding of the ball that just touched the white line. After that, it was all France.

Wales were about 2cm from winning the Grand Slam.

But even that was questionable - both the decision on grounding (looked to be the right decision to me, probably), and the decision to award a penalty for the preceding maul being brought down rather than a penalty try (looked to be the wrong decision, probably). And wasn't there a later French 'try' where a single replay shown later appeared to show the ball being touched down on the line, but where the ref didn't even go to Barnesey [sic], or, at least, didn't ask for a second look?
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: John Stonebridge on 22 March, 2021, 03:11:45 pm
If the thumpings dished out to plucky Italy and England are put to one side, the scores in the five games so far between Sco/Ire/Wal/Fra have seen a margin of victory that has never been above 5. 

So France will be going some to get all that they require, not that they aren't capable of it what with their Gallic flair.

FWIW the money man Mr P Power is currently giving Scotland a 16 point start.     
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: T42 on 22 March, 2021, 03:56:01 pm
The danger there is that Gallic flair get itself dealt a full house of red cards.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 26 March, 2021, 08:01:44 pm
I've just realised that the Flower of Scotland begins similarly to the Hebrew Slaves' Chorus from *Joe Green's opera Nabucco.

*aka Giuseppe Verdi...
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Beardy on 26 March, 2021, 08:07:36 pm
We can discount Scotlandland fielding the B team to allow the French a real go given the losers to such shenanigans would be Wales and not the ald foes.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 26 March, 2021, 08:16:43 pm
Why did France take the 3? They need tries.  4 of them.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 26 March, 2021, 08:17:56 pm
Also.
Yay. \0/
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 26 March, 2021, 08:26:23 pm
France have been sailing close to the wind a few times in defence.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 26 March, 2021, 08:45:45 pm
Oooh, handbags!  Norty Scotland!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 26 March, 2021, 08:52:58 pm
It's interesting that the pundits are question France's decision to kick a couple of penalties. Points are points. Years ago, if ever a team chose to run when there was a chance to kick a penalty, that was the questionable decision.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 26 March, 2021, 08:54:51 pm
They need tries.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 26 March, 2021, 08:57:27 pm
In a normal game I would agree. Take the points.  However France must take the bonus point to draw level with Wales.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 26 March, 2021, 09:36:44 pm
Something tells me this championship will go to the wire...
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 26 March, 2021, 09:48:16 pm
Not any more.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Basil on 26 March, 2021, 09:50:05 pm
Gosh. Haven't Wales played well tonight?   :smug:
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 26 March, 2021, 09:59:52 pm
That was tense!

Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 26 March, 2021, 10:00:04 pm
What a wonderful game!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 26 March, 2021, 10:00:53 pm
Bah!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: John Stonebridge on 26 March, 2021, 10:10:21 pm
Oh yes.  France have to beat Scotland and score four tries to make them equal on points with Wales and then it all goes down to mathemagical nerdery which ICBA to look up.

Frankly, my bear, I don't think you'll need to be A:  France should be up to the task.  Is there a date for this, yet?

I was otherwise engaged tonight, how did the game go?
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 26 March, 2021, 10:14:07 pm
Scotland did very well.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 26 March, 2021, 10:14:17 pm
Scotland won 27-23 with a last-gasp try.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 26 March, 2021, 10:49:14 pm
It was a bit like old times really, in the 1970s 5-nations sense: Wales & France were top, and England got the wooden spoon...  :P
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: CommuteTooFar on 26 March, 2021, 10:52:10 pm
Its a pity Scotland did not get one more try. They needed a bonus point and France not to get one.  They would then be 2nd in the championship.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: TimC on 27 March, 2021, 12:12:56 am
It's interesting that the pundits are question France's decision to kick a couple of penalties. Points are points. Years ago, if ever a team chose to run when there was a chance to kick a penalty, that was the questionable decision.
Scotland forfeited 9 guaranteed points by not kicking penalties when they could have done. France forfeited the game by not taking the ball to touch at 82 minutes. Decisions you later live to regret...

But what a game!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: toontra on 27 March, 2021, 09:07:00 am
France forfeited the game by not taking the ball to touch at 82 minutes.

I couldn't believe what I was seeing, and it was barely mentioned (if at all) in the live TV commentary.  I had to wait and listen to the post-match analysis to get confirmation of what had actually happened.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 27 March, 2021, 09:32:00 am
Yes, that was extraordinary. What did they stand to gain by playing on? Denying Scotland a losing bonus piint?
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: T42 on 27 March, 2021, 09:55:52 am
Bugger.

What did Wales do that so displeased M. Larrington?
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 27 March, 2021, 11:27:33 am
Bugger.

What did Wales do that so displeased M. Larrington?

Have Professor Larrington as a supporter*, mostly.  Opportunities for sibling oneupmanship must be pursued wherever possible.

* our late mother spent her early childhood in Stradey Park Avenue, Llanelli
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Steph on 27 March, 2021, 11:34:33 am
Also.
Yay. \0/

And furthermore

YAY

and in conclusionYAY!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: fd3 on 27 March, 2021, 11:43:35 am
France forfeited the game by not taking the ball to touch at 82 minutes.

I couldn't believe what I was seeing, and it was barely mentioned (if at all) in the live TV commentary.  I had to wait and listen to the post-match analysis to get confirmation of what had actually happened.
France have a track record of is sort of thing, and respec due.  IIRC in the last WC they needed 3 points to win against Tonga and had a penalty under the sticks.  They chose to run the ball.
If you look at it from a game theory POV they did the right thing.  If they win the match by 3 or lose by 4 they finish second.  The game plan was always “score at least 4 trys” so they stuck to it.  They will have learnt more and become a better team pushing on at 82 mins than just stopping for the win.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: TimC on 27 March, 2021, 11:47:36 am
Yes, but they needed two tries and 21 points clear of Scotland to win the championship. Neither was possible at that point, so the only thing left was to win the game. They chose not to. WTF???

ETA: I bet a good few of the players who lost out on the win bonus will have had words last night!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: andyoxon on 27 March, 2021, 12:09:43 pm
That's what I thought - another try was irrelevant at that point, and a long shot.  France seemed to just toss the game away, instead of booting it out.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: John Stonebridge on 27 March, 2021, 01:02:36 pm
I watched the entire game this morning. 

Summing it up as “France threw it away” (which of course they did, or didn't in the 82nd min) detracts from a magnificent Scotland performance.   

Scotlands team talk wrote itself via the “we’ve got a title to win” talk by some French players beforehand. 

Best Six Nations in a long time and amazing to have six games where the margin of victory was 5 or fewer. 

If its the swan song for the competitions terrestrial coverage, its a fitting finale. 
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Wowbagger on 27 March, 2021, 01:09:37 pm
Bugger.

What did Wales do that so displeased M. Larrington?

Have Professor Larrington as a supporter*, mostly.  Opportunities for sibling oneupmanship must be pursued wherever possible.

* our late mother spent her early childhood in Stradey Park Avenue, Llanelli

It's an interesting phenomenon.

I had a long natter to my older daughter yesterday who opted to describe herself as "English" in the recent census. She loves the Englishness of stuff: warm beer, Kentish countryside, English seasons, folk music, that sort of thing, and all very admirable. Doesn't care too much about sport, but generally prefers Wales to win when it comes to rugby.

Her younger sister is a different kettle of offal: she now lives in Melbourne and last weekend got out of bed at audax o'clock in order to watch the rugby with her Kiwi boyfriend. She did something similar yesterday, despite having buggered off into the outback for the weekend. Yesterday, just after the match finished, she sent me a photo of herself wearing her Welsh rugby top. (Curiously, in her youth she represented England at chess a few times and was, I think, the youngest player ever to do so on her first outing). I've always been an enthusiastic Wales supporter, but I've never gone so far as to obtain a Welsh rugby top. One of my treasured possessions, though, is a red-and-white scarf in 15 segments that was knitted for me by a very dear college friend who died tragically young.

Of those who care, my siblings support Wales - indeed, one of my sisters has a very Welsh partner who is much more enthusiastic about rugby than I am.

As a family, our Welsh tendencies come from my father, who was a Rhymney Valley man. I grew up watching rugby with him, and of course I always supported Wales. It was very easy to prefer Wales to England from the mid 1960s onwards. I think the first time I ever saw England win that fixture was in 1974, and that was down to a poor refereeing decision. I think I was in my mid-to-late-30s before I saw England win in Cardiff.

Conversely, I have never witnessed Wales beat the All Blacks. I was born one year too late for the last occasion that happened (1953). England have beaten them a number of times though.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 27 March, 2021, 01:20:11 pm
I’ve seen England beat the All Blacks, live.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 27 March, 2021, 02:56:56 pm
They are much harder to beat live.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Jaded on 27 March, 2021, 03:11:18 pm
Seeing things on telly isn’t true.  ;D
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Peter on 27 March, 2021, 03:43:40 pm
Alas, twitter is the new home of all truth!
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: fd3 on 27 March, 2021, 06:47:16 pm
In the 6 nations I support wales, on account of supporting France in the other code.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: Mr Larrington on 27 March, 2021, 06:56:44 pm
Might have gone better for France had it not taken them about half an hour to work out that Scotland had actually turned up with the intention of playing rugby rather than just rolling over and dying.
Title: Re: Six Nations 2021
Post by: markcjagar on 30 March, 2021, 03:27:34 pm
GWAN SCOTLAND!

Finn is a god and an idiot!

If Mish isn't confirmed at 7 for the Lions tour then the world is upside down...