Winter rubber...

[Andrew Br]

I thought the whole point in the foamy stuff layer of the M+ - apart from being thicker than the average piece of flint/glass -
 was that foreign bodies that didn't fully penetrate work their way out of it over time? 

I have vivid memories of putting several tubes (both patched and new) into an M+ on a ride before I finally found the tiny piece of glass that had caused the original puncture. It had, presumably, worked its way through the foam layer over a series of rides.
I think I took off and replaced that damn tyre 5 times and we had to keep replacing/repairing tubes. Every time we (I) inflated it, it went down again. Why I was doing the work is open to debate. It wasn't even my GF's bike......
On the positive side, removing and replacing M+ doesn't hold any fears now although I have to use levers.
The good thing* about this was that the puncture occurred just before the pub so I could fix it out of the rain and I could wash my hands properly afterwards. My lunch was a bit cold though......
This happened on a particularly wet and gravelly ride; TPT from MCR to Liverpool and back the next day.

If you're reading this Brucey, the bike that had functioning brakes when we got back was the only one with discs.......

* If indeed it is a thing.

ETA: It was this ride (scroll down):- https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=10.msg484401;topicseen#msg484401

[CarlF]

Interesting side note, I had a puncture on my Schwalbe winter studded tyres last winter. One of the studs came through the tyre and into the inner tube.

That's an exciting failure mode I haven't heard of before.  Anyone else had it?

No, but when I took the Marathon Winters off in the spring it was looking like I might have that to look forward to this winter (could clearly see where the studs were wearing spots in the casing). I was thinking about lining them with something to stave off the possibility for a while. Anyone got any ideas what might be worth trying as a lining ?

[Kim]

Interesting side note, I had a puncture on my Schwalbe winter studded tyres last winter. One of the studs came through the tyre and into the inner tube.

That's an exciting failure mode I haven't heard of before.  Anyone else had it?

No, but when I took the Marathon Winters off in the spring it was looking like I might have that to look forward to this winter (could clearly see where the studs were wearing spots in the casing). I was thinking about lining them with something to stave off the possibility for a while. Anyone got any ideas what might be worth trying as a lining ?

There was a thread somewhere where forumites experimented with DIY studded tyres using self-tapping screws (when the real thing were a lot more expensive and difficult to source) and a few layers of duct tape as a lining.

Found it!  https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=28222.0

[GraemeMcC]

I used to run Marathon Plus on the Brompton, but the effort of getting them on or off the wheel was so great that when the eventual puncture does happen (about 1 every few thousand km). You basically do single combat with a tyre to get them on and off. I've now switched to normal Marathons. It's still single combat with a loop of rubber when ever you have to take the thing off, and put it back on again, but it's against a much easier opponent.
Getting a bead jack makes things a lot easier, still works up a sweat, but easier than it would be without.

Aah, this is where the good old toe-strap becomes an invaluable addition to the saddlebag toolkit. As demonstrated by Spa Cycles video (if it still exists?) Who needs 3 hands now to get the M+ back on?

[rogerzilla]

The 26" and wider 700c ones are easy to fit.  700 x 25 is the real problem size.

[Greenbank]

No, but when I took the Marathon Winters off in the spring it was looking like I might have that to look forward to this winter (could clearly see where the studs were wearing spots in the casing). I was thinking about lining them with something to stave off the possibility for a while. Anyone got any ideas what might be worth trying as a lining ?

A 25mm Conti Hamsterskin?

[CarlF]

Interesting side note, I had a puncture on my Schwalbe winter studded tyres last winter. One of the studs came through the tyre and into the inner tube.

That's an exciting failure mode I haven't heard of before.  Anyone else had it?

No, but when I took the Marathon Winters off in the spring it was looking like I might have that to look forward to this winter (could clearly see where the studs were wearing spots in the casing). I was thinking about lining them with something to stave off the possibility for a while. Anyone got any ideas what might be worth trying as a lining ?

There was a thread somewhere where forumites experimented with DIY studded tyres using self-tapping screws (when the real thing were a lot more expensive and difficult to source) and a few layers of duct tape as a lining.

Found it!  https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=28222.0

Well that thread's been well and truly Photobucketed 

Duct tape was my first thought too.

[quixoticgeek]

Interesting side note, I had a puncture on my Schwalbe winter studded tyres last winter. One of the studs came through the tyre and into the inner tube.

That's an exciting failure mode I haven't heard of before.  Anyone else had it?

It's a rare one. Schwalbe (via SJS) replaced it under warranty.

I'll see what happens this winter. I've got a 600k winter tour planned and will decide the night before based on weather forecast if I am doing it on the studs or the marathons. The increased resistance of the studded wheels does not appeal... Will keep me warm tho...

J

[Kim]

I'll see what happens this winter. I've got a 600k winter tour planned and will decide the night before based on weather forecast if I am doing it on the studs or the marathons. The increased resistance of the studded wheels does not appeal...

Chapeau!  I did 100k on studs once, and have no desire to repeat the experience.

[quixoticgeek]

I'll see what happens this winter. I've got a 600k winter tour planned and will decide the night before based on weather forecast if I am doing it on the studs or the marathons. The increased resistance of the studded wheels does not appeal...

Chapeau!  I did 100k on studs once, and have no desire to repeat the experience.

I did just over 50 in one go last winter. Got frostnip as well. I cursed them quite a bit on the non icy bits, but being able to cycle across the lake, priceless... The trick to usable ride seems to be to pump them up as high as they can go whilst still comfy (the Brompton ones are rated to 8bar! 7 is considerably more comfortable than 8.).

I'm hoping this years winter madness will be slightly easier on 622x42 than last years 349x30's. A long with improvements to my footwear to prevent frost injuries.

We'll see how things go, global warming may mean I can do it on normal Marathons...

J

[BrianI]

Don't rule out Marathon Plus for peace of mind.  They are heavy but they roll just fine.

Is Marathon plus worth it over the normal Marathon?

J

Yes.  Totally unique product.

Can you still buy "normal" Marathons, without the "greenguard" layer?

[halhorner]

+1 for Conti GP 4 seasons - I use these for audax all year round and really like them.

The bikes in purgatory run Marathon Plus.

[Pickled Onion]

I find M+ are quite easy to get on to Brompton wheels. Yes, they're very stiff, but if you seat the opposite side well into the wheel they don't require much effort. They ride like treacle if not pumped up to the maximum, when they are harsh but acceptable.

I bought them after puncturing both tyres at the same time, for a *second* time in a fortnight. I don't generally ride in the gutter but in London it can be tricky to avoid glass spotted at the last moment without getting run over by a taxi. They very *almost* never puncture. Certainly no normal punctures in many tens of thousands of km. I managed to puncture one once—by riding over a broken half-bottle standing on its base. The piece of glass I pulled out of the tyre was the size of a thumbnail, but it was still rideable; I'm sure any other tyre would have been shredded

[quixoticgeek]

Can you still buy "normal" Marathons, without the "greenguard" layer?

Not AFAIK. Hence my thinking "normal marathons" are the ones with green guard, as opposed to marathon plus with the funky blue layer.

Was there once a marathon without green guard?

J

[Kim]

I remember hearing something about the recipe for normal Marathons changing a couple of years ago, but I've no idea how true that is.

I thought 'greenguard' was just marketing puff.

[BrianI]

I remember hearing something about the recipe for normal Marathons changing a couple of years ago, but I've no idea how true that is.

I thought 'greenguard' was just marketing puff.

The old Marathon (HS368) had a kevlar belt under the tread, while the new Marathon Greenguard (HS420) has the 3mm rubber layer under the tread, like a thinner version of the rubber puncture resistant layer in Marathon  Pluses.

[mrcharly-YHT]

If you wanted a 'normal' marathon, you would buy a Marathon Almotion now wouldn't you? They seem to be the fast but still sturdy tyre. Lighter than a greenguard.

[BrianI]

If you wanted a 'normal' marathon, you would buy a Marathon Almotion now wouldn't you? They seem to be the fast but still sturdy tyre. Lighter than a greenguard.

Unless I'm looking at the wrong thing on the schwalbe website, only available as 700x38c as the minimum width...

[Kim]

https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=55534.0 refers.

It went from Marathon HS 308 to Marathon HS 368 and now to Marathon HS 420.

[andrew_s]

I cursed them quite a bit on the non icy bits, but being able to cycle across the lake, priceless... The trick to usable ride seems to be to pump them up as high as they can go whilst still comfy

If the tyres are pumped hard, the studs are less reliable than they might otherwise be, as there won't be that many studs actually in contact with the ice.
I came off on ice twice a few years ago because of too hard tyres, before I twigged and let some air out.

[quixoticgeek]

If the tyres are pumped hard, the studs are less reliable than they might otherwise be, as there won't be that many studs actually in contact with the ice.
I came off on ice twice a few years ago because of too hard tyres, before I twigged and let some air out.

Aye, but if you have less icy bits between icy bits, it's useful to be able to pump them up nice and hard so that they roll a lot easier.

J

[mrcharly-YHT]

If you wanted a 'normal' marathon, you would buy a Marathon Almotion now wouldn't you? They seem to be the fast but still sturdy tyre. Lighter than a greenguard.

Unless I'm looking at the wrong thing on the schwalbe website, only available as 700x38c as the minimum width...

I think you are correct. It is being marketed as a touring tyre.
So the old marathon is gone.