Arrivée est arrivé!

[arabella]

Copied back here after being buried elsewhere, and edited :

I was disappointed by having to see a topless picture on p49**.  Why is male toplessness more acceptable than female toplessness (or vice versa)? It's on the same continuum that ends up saying women should show only their hands (and possibly their eyes qv yashmak vs burkha) but it's OK for men to show face/head etc (and in the same vein bring back 1930s bathing suits). 
Either that or as a country we should acquire a more european attitude towards nudity, otherwise we're being, imo, inconsistent. 
** yes I do realise a top was most likely worn for the actual riding


Otherwise I've enjoyed what I've read so far.  It almost made me want to go to america, and do some more hilly rides.

[mmmmartin]

having to see a topless picture ........

male toplessness ..........

female toplessness .............

a more european attitude towards nudity..............

Not seen Arrivee yet as I am away from home for a week. Was looking forward to reading it, as always, but am now in a tumescent frenzy at the more-than-usually-exciting prospect of seeing the mag. And actually touching it......

Sorry, as you were.

[roger]

Chapeau to Ivo - a great photo.

"Hats off to Dom for starting this debate..."  The wind in ones hair does appeal in some cases.

Roger.

[Delph Cyclist]

Apparently the Italian law was 2015 and for l'Eroica the medical certificate must be dated after 02 October.

But for Eroica, a medical certificate that is at least 30 years old would be acceptable surely?

[Cudzoziemiec]

Copied back here after being buried elsewhere, and edited :

I was disappointed by having to see a topless picture on p49**.  Why is male toplessness more acceptable than female toplessness (or vice versa)? It's on the same continuum that ends up saying women should show only their hands (and possibly their eyes qv yashmak vs burkha) but it's OK for men to show face/head etc (and in the same vein bring back 1930s bathing suits). 
Either that or as a country we should acquire a more european attitude towards nudity, otherwise we're being, imo, inconsistent. 
** yes I do realise a top was most likely worn for the actual riding


Otherwise I've enjoyed what I've read so far.  It almost made me want to go to america, and do some more hilly rides.

Perhaps it's an audax initiation rite: you have to be willing to appear in public in vaguely embarrassing clothes or lack of clothes. The bloke on p49 managed to combine both in one photo.

[whosatthewheel]

Apparently the Italian law was 2015 and for l'Eroica the medical certificate must be dated after 02 October.

But for Eroica, a medical certificate that is at least 30 years old would be acceptable surely?

Only if rolled up in a leather strap for toe clip pedals

[D.A.L.E.]

That photo of the smashed helmet 'that saved her from serious injury' can get tae fuck as well.

I very much doubt I'll be submitting anything to Arrivée in the forseeable.

[hellymedic]

To be fair, this is the selection of ONE editor and several editors rotate between editions of Arrivée.
The other thousands in AUK might delight and benefit from your contribution...

[LiamFitz]

I do wonder if there was an exact moment when YACF shifted from being a friendly place where people who rode bikes talked about riding bikes to being a noticeboard for ranting and name calling. 

Why can't people on here just be nice?  In the last year comments seem to have got increasingly aggressive, combative and snide.  And when people disagree, do they really have to be so harsh?

Whilst it's natural that a community won't always see eye to eye, it would be good if we could up the levels of respect shown to each other.

Liam

[Divingrob]

I blame Bowie dying. Since then its all gone crap in the world. Nobody cares and they dont mind telling you. (there are of course the odd exceptions)

I do wonder if there was an exact moment when YACF shifted from being a friendly place where people who rode bikes talked about riding bikes to being a noticeboard for ranting and name calling. 

Why can't people on here just be nice?  In the last year comments seem to have got increasingly aggressive, combative and snide.  And when people disagree, do they really have to be so harsh?

Whilst it's natural that a community won't always see eye to eye, it would be good if we could up the levels of respect shown to each other.

Liam

[Ivan]

I do wonder if there was an exact moment when YACF shifted from being a friendly place where people who rode bikes talked about riding bikes to being a noticeboard for ranting and name calling. 

The retirement of Hummers as moderator?

[mmmmartin]

a friendly place where people who rode bikes talked about riding bikes

This is odd, because on an actual event with actual riders on actual bikes on actual roads, I've always, without exception, found everyone to be really friendly.

[hellymedic]

I do wonder if there was an exact moment when YACF shifted from being a friendly place where people who rode bikes talked about riding bikes to being a noticeboard for ranting and name calling. 

Why can't people on here just be nice?  In the last year comments seem to have got increasingly aggressive, combative and snide.  And when people disagree, do they really have to be so harsh?

Whilst it's natural that a community won't always see eye to eye, it would be good if we could up the levels of respect shown to each other.

Liam

There have been parts of yacf that have resorted to name-calling and abuse from fairly early since inception. These are mainly actively managed.

[LiamFitz]

a friendly place where people who rode bikes talked about riding bikes

This is odd, because on an actual event with actual riders on actual bikes on actual roads, I've always, without exception, found everyone to be really friendly.

Yep - when you meet people in person they are invariably excellent.

[Greenbank]

I think that's the point. Many/most yacfers have met in person.

As yacf membership grows there will be more people who haven't met up with at least some others.

(Some long standing people are just objectionable though, no matter how many times they meet up.)

[whosatthewheel]

I don't understand why people feel so strongly about helmets... one way or the other... wear it if you want to, don't wear it if you don't want to. There is no law (yet) and Audax UK sticks to what is the law, on everything, not just helmets... brakes, aero bars and such... what ever is road legal, it is game for AUK

[Jaded]

Maybe take some time to find out why people feel strongly.

[whosatthewheel]

Maybe take some time to find out why people feel strongly.

Because they feel that one day AUK will decide that helemts are now compulsory... To be honest, an association with 6,000 members which promotes organised events with 50-100 participants (with one exception) is almost invisible and has zero mediatic power... so if one day helmets will become compulsory by law, it will not be because of AUK pushing for it.

On the other hand, if helmets will become law, then there is nothing AUK can do to stop that happening... so you can all chill out, do as you think it's best, follow the law whatever that is and stop getting agitated about some otherwordly realities that might or might never happen and more importantly you can't do anything about.

Equally, I don't see the point of someone waving his hands to persuade AUK to pursue a helmet only coverage... the law is clear and the law does not impose helmets... end of the aggro

[Whitedown Man]

I don't understand why people feel so strongly about helmets... one way or the other... wear it if you want to, don't wear it if you don't want to. There is no law (yet) and Audax UK sticks to what is the law, on everything, not just helmets... brakes, aero bars and such... what ever is road legal, it is game for AUK

Not on everything. Some Orgs still insist on deciding on riders’ behalves whether or not to ride with mudguards.

[hellymedic]

I don't understand why people feel so strongly about helmets... one way or the other... wear it if you want to, don't wear it if you don't want to. There is no law (yet) and Audax UK sticks to what is the law, on everything, not just helmets... brakes, aero bars and such... what ever is road legal, it is game for AUK

Not on everything. Some Orgs still insist on deciding on riders’ behalves whether or not to ride with mudguards.

<yawn>

In the spirit of excellence, they wish to minimise spreading muddy water onto other folk and their homes, floors and furniture.

Which seems fair to me.

[mattc]

I don't understand why people feel so strongly about helmets... one way or the other... wear it if you want to, don't wear it if you don't want to. There is no law (yet) and Audax UK sticks to what is the law, on everything, not just helmets... brakes, aero bars and such... what ever is road legal, it is game for AUK

Not on everything. Some Orgs still insist on deciding on riders’ behalves whether or not to ride with mudguards.

I'm going to guess that you think such rules are a bad thing ... but I would suggest Mudguard Rules are in a different category to road laws; it's more a fussiness/manners/hygiene thing. Like asking visitors to take their shoes off at the front door. Or keeping the noise down late at night to keep the neighbours happy.

[In Time Trialling land, the equivalent is probably "No warming up on rollers". Sounds utterly bizarre, but the rule is usually deployed with good reason )

[Martin]

Please note Double Dutch is on Easter Saturday 31st March not Good Friday as printed in this issue.

[Veloman]

I very much doubt I'll be submitting anything to Arrivée in the forseeable.

I think that's a shame as I have enjoyed reading your articles.  Please don't let one article giving a particular opinion put you off submitting something as your work is appreciated and AUK need that type of support.

[Veloman]

.... Why can't people on here just be nice?  In the last year comments seem to have got increasingly aggressive, combative and snide.  And when people disagree, do they really have to be so harsh? .....

I think that is the nature of internet forums where keyboard warriors thrive and bravado, coupled to point scoring, is often supported by a smiley emoji from others.  I also agree overall with what you have posted, but not sure about the time scale.  Perhaps behaviour is worse when the weather discourages cycling and as we are approaching the 'cabin fever' period ...............!

[Whitedown Man]

I don't understand why people feel so strongly about helmets... one way or the other... wear it if you want to, don't wear it if you don't want to. There is no law (yet) and Audax UK sticks to what is the law, on everything, not just helmets... brakes, aero bars and such... what ever is road legal, it is game for AUK

Not on everything. Some Orgs still insist on deciding on riders’ behalves whether or not to ride with mudguards.

I'm going to guess that you think such rules are a bad thing ... but I would suggest Mudguard Rules are in a different category to road laws; it's more a fussiness/manners/hygiene thing. Like asking visitors to take their shoes off at the front door. Or keeping the noise down late at night to keep the neighbours happy.

[In Time Trialling land, the equivalent is probably "No warming up on rollers". Sounds utterly bizarre, but the rule is usually deployed with good reason )

But why do only a minority of events require mudguards? It’s not difficult to find two events in the same part of the country at the same time of the year, one with mandatory mudguards, one without. Are all of the Orgs who don’t insist on mudguards unfussy / unmannerly / unhygienic? Or is there something else at play?