Is the (discontinued) Campag Athena groupset any good?

[Oxford_Guy]

BTW I received the Triple Comp Chainset today, as well as the front and rear derailleurs I've ordered - they all look absolutely gorgeous, especially the chainset, it's like a piece of engineering art, even little details like the chain ring and crank bolts. Very happy so far.

[Oxford_Guy]

BTW does anyone know what the capacity of the Veloce 10-medium derailleur is? Should it have enough capacity for running a 30/40/50 triple and a 13-29 or 12-30 cassette? I had assumed so, but didn't check...

[jsabine]

BTW does anyone know what the capacity of the Veloce 10-medium derailleur is? Should it have enough capacity for running a 30/40/50 triple and a 13-29 or 12-30 cassette? I had assumed so, but didn't check...

My Record mech - 75mm-ish between jockey wheel centres, as near as I can measure through the wheel (ie without actually moving the bike or getting my hands dirty) - is perfectly fine with 30/40/50 and a 13-29 cassette.

[Oxford_Guy]

BTW does anyone know what the capacity of the Veloce 10-medium derailleur is? Should it have enough capacity for running a 30/40/50 triple and a 13-29 or 12-30 cassette? I had assumed so, but didn't check...

My Record mech - 75mm-ish between jockey wheel centres, as near as I can measure through the wheel (ie without actually moving the bike or getting my hands dirty) - is perfectly fine with 30/40/50 and a 13-29 cassette.

Okay, using my vernier callipers I measure 73mm between the jockey wheels on my Veloce mech, so I guess that should be okay.

Do you find 50/13 high enough? I'm not a racer, nor that strong, but do want to use the bike for sportives. 50/12 (as on the more expensive 12-30 cassette) is probably higher than I would find useful, though. 30/29 should be low enough for my intended usage.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

At his peak, Merckx raced with a 53t x 13t top gear. Are you as strong as he was?

[Oxford_Guy]

At his peak, Merckx raced with a 53t x 13t top gear. Are you as strong as he was?

Have a guess?

Seriously, though, 53/13 is about 107.5 gear inches, 50/13 about 101.5, so there is some difference.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

There is a big power difference needed to bridge that gap.

[Samuel D]

There is a big power difference needed to bridge that gap.

Then that’s in favour of Oxford_Guy going for a higher gear. However, the difference is still under 20%. I bet Merckx had more than 20% more power than any of us.

There are very few descending cases where super-tall gears help outside of racing (where it’s worth spending enormous effort to prevent even a small gap opening up, so as to save more effort on the following flat) by keen racers (who have large power outputs). I don’t know why so many cyclists, plenty of them good, doubt this. Your power output compared to the immense drag of 60-plus km/h is so pitiful that you’re better off doing what you can to reduce that drag than pedal. Therefore tucking hard and coasting is faster in most cases.

Besides, unless you’re racing and have to stay with the group for later benefits, the speed you do on descents is practically irrelevant to your average speed and journey time. You’re better off optimising your gearing for the hours you spend on the flat than descents that are always over in seconds or minutes, and that’s before you consider the additional point that you’re better off resting your legs to work better later than pedalling at FTP for gain that can at best be infinitesimal.

[Brucey]

re mech capacity; it seems obvious that a longer cage ought to equate to a larger capacity, and it usually does. However what is less obvious is that some of the total capacity come from the chain wrap around the pulleys.  When comparing mechs a possible change in pulley size should be borne in mind; bigger pulleys also make for a bigger total capacity.

BTW bigger pulleys are also more efficient and run smoother; in fact the only downsides are that

a) you need to spend more money on decent bearings to keep them in line and
b) all else being equal, they will be a little bit heavier.

The fact that for decades we have been riding round with  tiny pulleys (and in fact shimano tried to foist even smaller ones onto us, eg versions of the 'crane' model had 9T pulleys!) says lots about the (misplaced) priorities of both manufacturers and riders.

cheers

[LittleWheelsandBig]

There is a big power difference needed to bridge that gap.

Then that’s in favour of Oxford_Guy going for a higher gear. However, the difference is still under 20%. I bet Merckx had more than 20% more power than any of us.

You misunderstand me. Being able to usefully turn the bigger gear requires a lot more power than the smaller gear, due to wind resistance. If you don't have that horsepower, you can't use the bigger gear for anything other than just rolling the legs over on a descent, which makes no real difference.

[jsabine]

Do you find 50/13 high enough? I'm not a racer, nor that strong, but do want to use the bike for sportives.

I rarely use the big ring at all - and when I do, I'm limited by my legs, not my gearing.

[Oxford_Guy]

Do you find 50/13 high enough? I'm not a racer, nor that strong, but do want to use the bike for sportives.

I rarely use the big ring at all - and when I do, I'm limited by my legs, not my gearing.

Well 50/13 is only just over 100 grear inches, the highest gear on my Cheviot used to be 42/11, which is also just over 100 gear inches, and I would quite often spin out on that even on not hugely steep hills - I now have 46/11, which is over 110 gear inches (as would 50/12 be), which is probably too high, as I've only used it for short periods on very steep descents - but I might combine the 46T with a 13-34 custom cassette (it's a tourer). Around 104/5" would probably be ideal, be not sure it's worth chasing that at the expense of more useful gears lower down, so sounds like 50/13 (with the Veloce 13-29 cassette) is probably going to be fine for a non-racer like me.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Slightly fatter tyres boost gear inches.

[Oxford_Guy]

Slightly fatter tyres boost gear inches.

Indeed, and vice-versa obviously. My preference would be to run 25m tyres on this bike, though.

[Samuel D]

Well 50/13 is only just over 100 grear inches, the highest gear on my Cheviot used to be 42/11, which is also just over 100 gear inches, and I would quite often spin out on that even on not hugely steep hills […]

Who’s forcing you to pedal? Stop and tuck! Your journey will take the same time.

Even when I’m riding with fast groups – seriously fit guys including racers – they can’t get away from me with my top gear of 100", and I weigh barely 65 kg. Coasting is incredibly fast if you tuck hard.