Neck/trapezius pain on road bike - options?

[LittleWheelsandBig]

But most of them climb like shit and are really funny-looking 

[DuncanM]

This might be ready by the end of 2017 (maybe!  ):
https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=94895.0
It's gonna be a lot slower than a decent road bike though...
Cheers
Duncan

[McWheels]

But most of them climb like shit and are really funny-looking 

Oh go on then my dear old thing, I'll have a nibble... 

http://cruzbike.com/blog/2016/09/16/race-report-jason-perezs-2016-california-triple-crown-victory/
And the World TT Champs at Borrego Springs where Jason cleared 510 miles in 24 hrs. And RAAM 2013. And...

[LittleWheelsandBig]

And your point is?

How far is the 24hr record for upright bikes? How many times has the solo RAAM record for upright bikes been beaten by recumbents? It seems that upright bikes can be quite good for riding long distances in reasonable comfort.

Just for clarity, I had drinks with a 2010 HPV World Champion last Saturday, I've owned recumbents and I expect to own more of them in the future.

[McWheels]

One chooses the bike best suited to one's needs. If the OP wants to avoid neck pain, there are options outwith the standard envelope worth considering.

As for why are recumbents not dominating worldwide? I think 2 key reasons. 1 that there has been 80-odd years of dedicated industrial mass-market reseach and development into one style, therefore it has been polished, rolled in glitter, hard baked and polished again. There are many really well designed, comfortable, and targeted uprights. And 2 that there are no full-time professional recumbent teams, since you can't make money an enterprise racing them in the way Team Sky, Movistar etc can.

And despite all this a recumbent has the hour record again like in 1934 (Mattias Konig) and the industry hasn't collapsed. Perhaps we bike-ists enjoy being contrary?

[TheLurker]

As for why are recumbents not dominating worldwide?

It seems to me (I'm an expert me -  I rode a recumbent once - in 1993*) that one very good reason is that upwrongs are much easier to use wearing civvies than recumbents, especially for those who prefer to wear skirts and kilts. In addition for most of that time upwrongs have been mechanically simpler and easier to maintain.

*Seriously.  Around St. Paul's Sq in Brizzle.  It was a home-brew LWB with under saddle steering.  Absolute hoot.  Loved it, but... it was an LWB and getting on for one half times to twice the length of my BSO and therefore impossible to store where I then lived.  So add awkward to store as another reason perhaps?

P.S.
Dunc - have you still got your mountain bike?  That any more comfortable? Any road up - GWS.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Andy Wilkinson is an amateur bike racer who has done 541 miles in a 24hr TT on an upright bike.
http://www.merseysidermagazine.com/site/sport/andy-wilkinson-cycling-phenomenon/

[mrcharly-YHT]

As for why are recumbents not dominating worldwide more common?

Two reasons:
1) They cost too much
2) They are harder to noodle through traffic

[DuncanM]

Dunc - have you still got your mountain bike?  That any more comfortable? Any road up - GWS.

Hi Lurk

Yes, the MTB is more comfy, but it's so sloooow! Especially if it's windy.
The fix is faster than the MTB, but still slower than the road bike, and ultimately I want to ride more, so a comfortable road bike is what I'm after.

I'm gonna have a chat with the guys at Take3Tri about getting a Retul fit on their jig- if they can give me a good position and I can fit it to the Peugeot then I'll stay on that, and if not then I'll get something else...
Are you still commuting on your Ribble?
Cheers
Duncan

[TheLurker]

Dunc - have you still got your mountain bike?  That any more comfortable? Any road up - GWS.

Hi Lurk
Yes, the MTB is more comfy, but it's so sloooow! Especially if it's windy.

You are a gentleman of a certain age you should be taking it more slowly. I certainly am.

I'm gonna have a chat with the guys at Take3Tri about getting a Retul fit on their jig- if they can give me a good position and I can fit it to the Peugeot then I'll stay on that, and if not then I'll get something else...

Sounds like a good idea.  Alternatively you could do something terribly out of character and get something _modern_.  Preferably something that doesn't require a hammer to change gear

Are you still commuting on your Ribble?

Yeah; it, well bits of it, will be 10 years old come Feb.  My, my doesn't time fly?

[Hot Flatus]

Ive not read the thread so apologies if this has been said already.

Core strength & bike fit.

Yes, I know it is de rigeur, but if you havent got much of it then  youll be using something else to hold you up whilst riding.

If you want to know if your bike fit is correct try riding as normal and then without moving your body at all or tensing anything up....lift your hands off the bars.

If you cant do it without changing position or tensioning legs etc then your position isnt right and/or you might have a weak core.

[velosam]

I suffered from this as well.

Had a bike fit and there were 2 issues
1. Saddle too low which got raised
2. Contrary to everything I had been told and read, the saddle got moved forward.

HTH

[DuncanM]

I definitely can't lift my hands off the bars and carry on riding in a normal position on the drops or hoods. I just about can on the tops, but it's not comfy. I need to develop my core strength - will do lots of planks! Will keep this thread updated with how that and the fit goes...
Cheers
Duncan

[LittleWheelsandBig]

I have only been able to do so comfortably while pedalling. When coasting, I can't do so. This is quite normal in my experience.

[DuncanM]

Yes, it was while pedalling. The idea behind moving the seat further back (were it possible) is that it would allow my legs to take more pressure off my hands/arms - obviously this only works when you are putting force through the pedals!
Cheers
Duncan

[DuncanM]

Retul fitting tonight. Should be interesting.
I have been perusing (whisper it) modern bikes on Evans website (my employer runs their cycle to work scheme through them). If I need to change, I might try something with discs (pref hydraulic). Don't think the budget will stretch to this newfangled plastic stuff though!  Will see what they say tonight...
Cheers
Duncan

[sg37409]

I get some neck pain on the bike, and tracked it down to having things (phone mainly) in an ortleib doc wallet on a lanyard, and the tiredness / weakness wasn't able to recover due to my posture at my desk.

[DuncanM]

Well, it was interesting.
Mark tested my flexibility with a few static stretch type movements - he gave me 7/10! We talked about what I wanted to achieve, and how different frames are set up to do different things.
Then he stuck velcro tabs on my shoes, knee, hip, shoulder and arm, and attached something that reminded me of Christmas tree lights. This meant that the Retul sensor could see me moving (and my legs going around) in real time, and we could start moving things about while getting feedback from the measuring system.
We moved the saddle a bit forward (this seemed to be a bit like a scientific KOPS - I was expecting it to go backward from what I'm used to), and up a bit until it was comfortable and the angles (foot/ankle and knee) were good. Then we moved the front end of the bike up and down and in and out. The system was able to give a back angle number, and I could feel how the different angles worked. We ended up with a good comfortable setup with an angle of 46degrees - then Mark measured the jig to give me a stack and reach measurement. We then checked out some bikes (eg Spec Roubaix fits approx in a 58) and tried it again, with a shorter reach to see if it worked a bit better. The final stack/reach numbers were 600 and 400 respectively.
Finally, I got my bike and saw just how far out it was - the saddle needed to go up about 6cm and forward about 3! The stack height is rediculously low, so with the saddle correct, riding on the hoods felt like riding a stretched out super low bike, even with a tall stem at it's maximum! So it's time to get something comfortable - will probably be "endurance" or "gravel" style bike with stack/reach numbers that suit me. Mark is going to email me a report with tour conclusions and some suitable bikes.
It was a really good experience, and a really interesting setup.  Very pleased I did it - I can now go ahead and get a comfy bike without feeling guilty about getting rid of an old bike that has sort of become part of me!
Cheers
Duncan

[mrcharly-YHT]

I'm not quite sure I understand your description.

Your saddle needed to come up and forward, that bit is clear, what isn't clear is the positioning of your bars.

I wish you luck in finding your 'right' position. I was lucky. I went to buy a bike once, sat on one and it fit me - it was a revelation, my back didn't hurt, I felt relaxed; since then I've duplicated that position on every bike, just carrying over the measurements. It is a wonderful feeling.

[LEE]

Welcome to my world.

The biggest improvement I made was to wear a Buff, even in warm weather.  My neck/shoulder pain (which eventually put paid to my PBP2015 ride) is mad much worse, and is brought on much quicker, when I have cold air flowing around/over my neck and shoulders.  Since it was incredibly cold during PBP2015 nights it caused me a lot of issues I wouldn't have expected in August.

Worth a try, they are only a couple of quid.

I'd say it delayed the onset of discomfort, and then pain, from 100km up to 200-300km.  All bets are off from 400km onwards, I just expect those rides to be a battle against neck cramps rather than a cycling challenge.  That's basically why I quit the long-distance stuff, I didn't see it as a cycling challenge any more.

[DuncanM]

Your saddle needed to come up and forward, that bit is clear, what isn't clear is the positioning of your bars.

The bars also needed to come up (lots) and back (a little) too.  But I already have a very long stem (190mm Nitto) on max height, so it's not possible to do that without some convoluted stem extender/aheadset whatsit. And that will probably mean it needs new bars, at which point, you've completely ruined the elegance of the bike, and got the worst of all worlds (strange looking, flexy, little tyre clearance, heavy, no mudguards).
I'll try keeping my neck warm, but I think it's just the position on the bike - I used to get issues even on hot summer days.
Cheers
Duncan

[mrcharly-YHT]

Have you flipped the stem already?

[marylogic]

I have had problems with neck and upper thoracic pain. The following things have helped me:

1. Altering bike set up (in  my case shortening the stem as the reach was too big)
2. Wearing a buff as above (it doesn't prevent the pain but stops severe spasm due to cold).
3. focusing on keeping shoulders relaxed and elbows bent - basically anytime I start to feel pain on the bike I make a conscious effort to relax
4. Scapular stabilising exercises
5. Stretching my upper back by lying with a rolled up towel directly under my spine.

Hope some of these may help.

What didn't help was buying a touring bike which I thought would be a more relaxed position.

[DuncanM]

Have you flipped the stem already?

It's a quill stem, so flipping it might be tricky!   And when I say it's long, I mean 190mm tall, giving a height of 110mm at the minimum insertion point! 
Cheers
Duncan

[The French Tandem]

If you need a flippable stem, then this adaptor might help:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/brand-x-quill-adaptor-alloy/rp-prod6254