[HAMR] More thoughts on the current record attempt(s)

[jochta]

I have looked at Strava (I am not a premium member) and the tracking and the average says 20.9 km/h which is 13mph - where do these faster speeds come from. The evidence I can see does not support these speeds.

The tracking under-reads distance (because it is guessing the route between the infrequent live tracking points) and only measures elapsed time.

As an example, here's the 16th Jan on the tracker: http://www.soretween.altervista.org/TeethGrinder/tg381.jpg (286km at 20.9kph)

286km/20.9kph = 13h 41m

This fits with the tracker's first and last live tracking points of 9:39:05 to 23:21:05 (13h 42m).

And here's the GPX file that was uploaded to Strava: https://www.strava.com/activities/472063940 (322.2km with moving time of 12:27:50, elapsed time of 13:49:02).

322.2 / 13h49m02 = 23.32kph (based on elapsed time)
322.2 / 12h27m50 = 25.85kph (based on moving time)

No idea how Strava is managing to pull 28.4kph out of those figures.

Yes those figures you have are correct. I picked the wrong one. 28.4 km/h is the 75% Quartile Speed.

[L CC]

What is the reasoning for a long distance UK cyclist staying away from this site?  Was he one of those affiliated to "he who must not be named" from ACF?

Hoppo isn't an audaxer, he's a TTer who specialises in longer distance events.
I've met him two or three times and nothing he's said or done has altered my initial opinion of him.


[sweeping generalisation]TTers tend not to be the cozy lefty middle class smug who largely haunt this place[/sweeping generalisation]
[disclaimer]Lurking on the TT forum was almost enough to dissuade me from racing[/disclaimer]

[Frank9755]

He's not even really a TTer - seen as almost as much of an outsider there as here.

Your sweeping generalisation is an interesting observation!

[Hattyfatner]

Morning All,

Could someone provide a brief summary of the status of the various record attempts as I've rather lost the plot on this and don't have time to trawl back Many thanks

[Ham]

Kurt has been an' gon' an' dun it
Steve is still doin' it. Maybe accordin' to sum
Kajsa is doin' something different
Bruce don' giv a stuff an is doin it too
Miles gave up

there you go

[Hattyfatner]

Kurt has been an' gon' an' dun it
Steve is still doin' it. Maybe accordin' to sum
Kajsa is doin' something different
Bruce don' giv a stuff an is doin it too
Miles gave up

there you go

Ok, is Steve on his second or third restart?

[Ian H]

His first restart.

[Hattyfatner]

His first restart.

When was the attempt restarted?

[rafletcher]

164 days ago 

[Freya]

& it was Kristin who shot J.R.

Sorry that should probably have had a spoiler alert.

[Hattyfatner]

164 days ago 

Say no more

Sort of lost track with all the negativity 

[geraldc]

Alas poor iron ox, how quickly you're forgotten

Kurt has been an' gon' an' dun it
Steve is still doin' it. Maybe accordin' to sum
Kajsa is doin' something different
Bruce don' giv a stuff an is doin it too
Miles gave up

there you go

[Exit Stage Left]

I think people misunderstand Hoppo. He arrived on the TT scene at a time when the long-distance royalty were easing out of sight. Wilko had won everything, and had been coached early in his career by Keith Boardman, Chris's dad. Gethin Butler was the grandson of a 24 hour winner, and son of a noted ex-pro and race promoter.
Hoppo came onto the scene as a brash self-promoter, in a world where everyone defers to performance, and expects their heroes to be modest. He made a lot of being the first UK finisher of RAAM, and has never been afraid to put himself forward in order to finance RAAM rides.
It's the promotional aspect that Steve has benefited from, Idai has been instrumental in that as well. I would have been perfectly happy with a lower profile approach, more akin to the level of publicity that the 24 gets, there's been a bit of an expectation/reality mismatch for me.

[rob]

Well, we know with a reasonable degree of certainty that the antagonism from team Steve to yacf is derived from the antipathy of Hoppo, the team leader ...

Why?

I don't get it.   Maybe it is a self fulfilling prophesy, there do seem to be some negative remarks about Hoppo now - but that is only because of a lack of communication.

What is the reasoning for a long distance UK cyclist staying away from this site?  Was he one of those affiliated to "he who must not be named" from ACF?

I doubt it is that.  I had assumed that it stemmed from his encounter with the unique charm of MattC when they had a disagreement over lights on the 24hour TT a few years ago.  But I think he doesn't like forums in general as he also made a bit of a fool of himself on the TT forum (by complaining about results for a 12-hour not being out immediately) and now avoids that too.

He was on there again the other day as his 12hr distance was wrong on his long distance BAR certificate.   Tim Carpenter has stood down from looking after that competition, though, so I'm not sure who he can complain to now.

[clarion]

I think people misunderstand Hoppo. He arrived on the TT scene at a time when the long-distance royalty were easing out of sight. Wilko had won everything, and had been coached early in his career by Keith Boardman, Chris's dad. Gethin Butler was the grandson of a 24 hour winner, and son of a noted ex-pro and race promoter.
Hoppo came onto the scene as a brash self-promoter, in a world where everyone defers to performance, and expects their heroes to be modest. He made a lot of being the first UK finisher of RAAM, and has never been afraid to put himself forward in order to finance RAAM rides.
It's the promotional aspect that Steve has benefited from, Idai has been instrumental in that as well. I would have been perfectly happy with a lower profile approach, more akin to the level of publicity that the 24 gets, there's been a bit of an expectation/reality mismatch for me.

Lower profile?!   I would have thought that a bit more promotion/information/transparency/PR would have been a lot better, and reduced the level of rumblings.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

I suspect ESL meant lower profile with regards to mainstream media and higher profile with regards to supporters.

[Frank9755]

I think people misunderstand Hoppo. He arrived on the TT scene at a time when the long-distance royalty were easing out of sight. Wilko had won everything, and had been coached early in his career by Keith Boardman, Chris's dad. Gethin Butler was the grandson of a 24 hour winner, and son of a noted ex-pro and race promoter.
Hoppo came onto the scene as a brash self-promoter, in a world where everyone defers to performance, and expects their heroes to be modest. He made a lot of being the first UK finisher of RAAM, and has never been afraid to put himself forward in order to finance RAAM rides.

People misunderstand Hoppo by thinking he's a top level long distance time triallist! He isn't, not in the same league as the people you mention. 
On the odd time he's entered, he has come in, perhaps, the top 20 at the nationals, not been threatening the podium.
That's still a decent achievement and he's a gutsy rider (and I was really impressed by his ride in a 100 a week after a 12 hour last year when he went under 4 hours while I was struggling badly attempting the same), but he's not in, or close to, the top class.

[LMT]

I think people misunderstand Hoppo. He arrived on the TT scene at a time when the long-distance royalty were easing out of sight. Wilko had won everything, and had been coached early in his career by Keith Boardman, Chris's dad. Gethin Butler was the grandson of a 24 hour winner, and son of a noted ex-pro and race promoter.
Hoppo came onto the scene as a brash self-promoter, in a world where everyone defers to performance, and expects their heroes to be modest. He made a lot of being the first UK finisher of RAAM, and has never been afraid to put himself forward in order to finance RAAM rides.

People misunderstand Hoppo by thinking he's a top level long distance time triallist! He isn't, not in the same league as the people you mention. 
On the odd time he's entered, he has come in, perhaps, the top 20 at the nationals, not been threatening the podium.
That's still a decent achievement and he's a gutsy rider (and I was really impressed by his ride in a 100 a week after a 12 hour last year when he went under 4 hours while I was struggling badly attempting the same), but he's not in, or close to, the top class.

Hmm, depends on what is relative?

In terms of distance for sure, there are people that have covered more than him on a bike given a set time limit. But the man is tenacious, that there can be no doubt, after all he has done RAAM which does deserve respect imo.

[Exit Stage Left]

I suspect ESL meant lower profile with regards to mainstream media and higher profile with regards to supporters.

I replied to an early enquiry about doing some filming of Steve thus, edited to remove identity obviously. Steve started to get mainstream interest, so I just filmed him when our paths crossed, as I'm about 200 miles from the action.

What are you wanting from any filming? Is it to provide publicity, or to give some feedback to the donors?

I'm concerned mainly with recording events from the standpoint of someone actively involved in them. So my focus accepts that people can ride 200 miles a day, for a number of days. What's interesting is how that effort can be sustained, both physically and emotionally.

That interest also extends to the way support is provided. The support on YACF  seems to be independent of any publicity considerations. Is it possible for this record to be achieved within a sealed world, like the Andy Wilkinson record? With only those who really care about it being interested.
We got a lot of satisfaction in being there to film that record. I don't feel the need to show Wilko's 'journey' to that record, because we know what's involved, and it's for an audience that understands.
If you want to produce a recruitment video for Audax, or to satisfy sponsors, then the focus changes. And it's more up to you to give me a brief.

[Frank9755]

I think people misunderstand Hoppo. He arrived on the TT scene at a time when the long-distance royalty were easing out of sight. Wilko had won everything, and had been coached early in his career by Keith Boardman, Chris's dad. Gethin Butler was the grandson of a 24 hour winner, and son of a noted ex-pro and race promoter.
Hoppo came onto the scene as a brash self-promoter, in a world where everyone defers to performance, and expects their heroes to be modest. He made a lot of being the first UK finisher of RAAM, and has never been afraid to put himself forward in order to finance RAAM rides.

People misunderstand Hoppo by thinking he's a top level long distance time triallist! He isn't, not in the same league as the people you mention. 
On the odd time he's entered, he has come in, perhaps, the top 20 at the nationals, not been threatening the podium.
That's still a decent achievement and he's a gutsy rider (and I was really impressed by his ride in a 100 a week after a 12 hour last year when he went under 4 hours while I was struggling badly attempting the same), but he's not in, or close to, the top class.

Hmm, depends on what is relative?

In terms of distance for sure, there are people that have covered more than him on a bike given a set time limit. But the man is tenacious, that there can be no doubt, after all he has done RAAM which does deserve respect imo.

Sure, he's achieved other things outside time trialling. He's also done PBP.
But even in things like RAAM, he was (as are most of us) a participant, not a potential winner. 

[rafletcher]

But the man is tenacious, that there can be no doubt, after all he has done RAAM which does deserve respect imo.

A fact you're unlikely to forget if you need to email him....    hopporaam2005@googlemail.co.uk   

[TimC]

I think people misunderstand Hoppo. He arrived on the TT scene at a time when the long-distance royalty were easing out of sight. Wilko had won everything, and had been coached early in his career by Keith Boardman, Chris's dad. Gethin Butler was the grandson of a 24 hour winner, and son of a noted ex-pro and race promoter.
Hoppo came onto the scene as a brash self-promoter, in a world where everyone defers to performance, and expects their heroes to be modest. He made a lot of being the first UK finisher of RAAM, and has never been afraid to put himself forward in order to finance RAAM rides.
It's the promotional aspect that Steve has benefited from, Idai has been instrumental in that as well. I would have been perfectly happy with a lower profile approach, more akin to the level of publicity that the 24 gets, there's been a bit of an expectation/reality mismatch for me.

Lower profile?!   I would have thought that a bit more promotion/information/transparency/PR would have been a lot better, and reduced the level of rumblings.

Hoppo may be a great rider, but that's really irrelevant in the context of being, if this is indeed what he is, Steve's 'team manager'. There's no requirement for a band's manager to be able to sing or play, or a bank's manager to be able to count (ooh, ouch!), or an airline's manager to be able to fly. I'm not sure what responsibilities he has taken on on Steve's behalf, but it sure doesn't include riding a bike! So discussions of his cycling ability are a total red herring.

His revelation of Bruce's issues with UCMA seem a bit unnecessary, and are also irrelevant to Steve's effort, so it would probably better for him to have resisted comment until UCMA made their own public announcement. It's a distraction - as we are proving.

As for Steve's averages, Saturday's Strava record shows a distance of 322.2km, ridden over a moving time of 12:27:50, and an elapsed time of 13:49:02. That's a moving speed of 25.85kmh (16.05mph) and an overall average (the one that counts) of 23.32kmh (14.48mph). Not as fast as I'd first though, but I think it's an improvement on what he's been recently achieving.

[Frank9755]

Hoppo may be a great rider

I know it's not the point you are making, but he's not!  He's a reasonably good rider.

[La Tortue]

Seems the year record challenge has gone to hell in a handbasket.  Steve's gutsy attempt is now rewarded with parts of his fan base trashing his methods, crew, and overall chances.  Facts are he is still in the game and positioned to make one heck of a comeback.  Meanwhile, the Kiwi figures he  can just tell us how many miles he rode 365 days from January 1 and that is good enough.   Turmoil and bickering has dwarfed the Challenge itself.  Gone is the time one can track a riders progress  or perhaps catch a video update on the daily rigors of the ride.   Apparently, Kurt has set the bar for more than just the number of miles to ride.

[zigzag]

the only time i raced in the same tt (10mi) with hoppo was on the 1st of jan 2015 when Steve was starting out his 1ytt. his time was about 1min better, but we were on very different bikes; hoppo's time was around the middle of the finishers list, mine at the bottom third iirc. i agree with Frank9755 comparing him to an average/competitive club rider specialising in (and doing a lot of) long distance events.