Tubeless for Dummies

[Phil W]

Use the German online sites like Rose bikes or bike24. You can select English.

[bikey-mikey]

A small tale to encourage the lurkers...

Last weekend as I was about to turn right onto the excellent mid canal cycle path into Lincoln, on the Bomber County 200 ride, I had to short cut across some roadside crap, to avoid a car coming way too fast, and in that crap was some glass....

The sector 28 front went psst psst psst and when it's obvious like that I stop and put a finger on the hole to give it the best chance to seal...  It was a really nasty cut, but seal it did, though at quite a reduced pressure.

I had a spare folding clincher and a couple of tubes in my bag, BUT I have never actually used it, since the tubeless has always got me round... So I carried on with the reduced pressure tubeless.

So I completed the last 50 km or so, and drove off to a travelodge in preparation for Sunday's Ironbridge 200.

Overnight I had added quite a bit more pressure so it was nearly how I always have it, but once I started riding Sunday morning it went psst psst psst again, in the first two or three kms, so I finger sealed it again, and am pleased to confirm that I completed the entire ride successfully...

 I've replaced the tyre now, cos I'm not a fan of sticky internal patches, which never seem to stay in place, but I'm happy to prove the efficacy of tubeless again....

[vorsprung]

Use the German online sites like Rose bikes or bike24. You can select English.

http://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/schwalbe-pro-one-evo-osc-tl-easy-25-622-folding-497909      have used this shop.  Good
https://www.rosebikes.co.uk/article/schwalbe-pro-one-evo-road-tyre-hs-462-folding-tyre/aid:870785    have used.  Expensive
http://www.starbike.com/en/schwalbe-pro-one/      have used.  Good.  V good for spokes and wheel building
https://www.bike24.com/1.php?content=8;product=62612;menu=1000,4,22,35     have used often.  Good
https://www.bike-components.de/en/Schwalbe/Pro-One-Evolution-MicroSkin-OneStar-Faltreifen-Modell-2016-p45634/      have not used

Be sure to check you are ordering 25mm tubeless, and this years model of tyre - which is slightly better

[Hot Flatus]

Use the German online sites like Rose bikes or bike24. You can select English.

http://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/schwalbe-pro-one-evo-osc-tl-easy-25-622-folding-497909      have used this shop.  Good
https://www.rosebikes.co.uk/article/schwalbe-pro-one-evo-road-tyre-hs-462-folding-tyre/aid:870785    have used.  Expensive
http://www.starbike.com/en/schwalbe-pro-one/      have used.  Good.  V good for spokes and wheel building
https://www.bike24.com/1.php?content=8;product=62612;menu=1000,4,22,35     have used often.  Good
https://www.bike-components.de/en/Schwalbe/Pro-One-Evolution-MicroSkin-OneStar-Faltreifen-Modell-2016-p45634/      have not used

Be sure to check you are ordering 25mm tubeless, and this years model of tyre - which is slightly better

"PRO" is tubeless, and this year's.

Anything else isn't.

[jiberjaber]

I am hoping to embark on the tubeless adventure when my new wheels arrive next week.

The only snag appears to be sourcing some tyres.  I am having real trouble finding some Schwalbe Pro One 25mm tyres.

Any suggestions welcome (I would like to go with the Schwalbe as I like the clincher version).

How come your not going 28c Ted?

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

[Andrew Br]

I've now done about 250 miles on the Schwalbe S-One on the rear of my Dirty Disco. So far, it's all good.
The tyre went on the rim fairly easily with the long plastic tyre lever (Topeak).
Washing-up liquid and CO₂ were needed to seat the beads.
I started off running the tyre at 85psi, the maximum recommended and equivalent to what I'd run the previous 28mm GP4 Season at.
Over the course of a few rides, I've dropped it to 70 psi and I think that I'll go lower, perhaps to 60psi in due course. I weigh 70-71kg and I usually have a 1-2kg saddle bag.
On rough surfaces the ride has been fantastic and it's getting better as I drop the pressure. I've even taken the tyre off-road  .
So far, I can't feel that the drag has increased as the pressure has been reduced.

On Velocity Aleron rins, the tyre measures 32mm at 70 psi  .

Pressure loss has been about the same as the front GP4 Season and that's with less than the recommended amount of sealant. I'm waiting for my LBS to get some more sealant for me.

Limited experience but I'm very pleased so far.
It looks like I'll be binning the front tyre soon due to cuts in the tread (8500+ miles so mustn't grumble) and I know already what I'm going to get.

[tedshred]

How come your not going 28c Ted?

I am now.  Gave up trying to find 25mm tyres . Everyone seems to be out of stock.  I then remembered that I had 28s on when I fitted the mudguards so they ought to fit ok.  They should also give a nicer ride which will be important on my fixed odyssey.

One thing I did see somewhere in my investigations was mention of a 75kg weight limit.  Not sure if this is right but it might explain some of Tippers' misadventures 

Looking forward to trying it all out in time for Green & Yellow Fields.  Fitting on to DT Swiss R460. If it means not having to get my spanner out every time I have a visitation I will be mighty pleased 

[vorsprung]

The Hutchinson Intensive 25mm have now done 2100km or so (actually a bit more, some rides were not logged) and I've had yet another puncture that the sealant couldn't cope with.  Let's call it a "big hole".  "big" is 2mm+ but it's relative

 I tried to fix it "in the field" with the Weldite external patch kit.  This amazing kit comes with a tube of rubber glue, a knife, two special tools and some strips of rubber coated string.  The basic idea is that the string is poked into the hole with the tools.  First attempt didn't work at all, inflation blew out the string.  Second attempt worked to some extent and I rode for another 30 minutes before the patching string ripped itself out.  Third attempt was made more difficult to cope with as by now I am out of CO2 carts.  Eventually managed to get the tyre reseated by pumping very very fast.  Dunno how good the third repair is but I am home now.  The ride was cut short

There seem to be a load of nicks in the tyres now.  I wonder if they will do one of these "big holes" every 50 miles or so now?  If so I will have to part company with the Hutchinson Intensive option.  They are supposed to be "heavy" "winter" tyres.  Maybe that doesn't include durability.   They aren't fast tyres, the grip is good but they are narrow even on wide rims. 

Trouble is,  I'm not sure that the Schwalbe tyres will work ok on my non standard H Son Plus rims.  So it might be back to clichers

[Frank9755]

Had to fix a broken spoke at the weekend. 

Was dreading it but in the end it wasn't that hard, and it helped me to learn more about how the tubeless setup works, as my tyres were put on by the guy who built my wheels.

I tried to get the new spoke in to the old nipple without taking the tyre off, but inevitably it didn't work and the nipple got lost inside the rim, so the tyre and yellow tape had to come off. 

I'd been meaning to take the tyre off anyway as I wanted to check the sealant, not having done so in that tyre since before PBP.  I was pleasantly surprised to see that there was still plenty in there.  I was also pleasantly surprised to seet that there was little evidence of punctures having been fixed by the sealant (ie no rubber string-balls sticking to the inside of the tyre) so it looked like I'd not had too much need of the sealant recently and that the sealant lasts a lot longer if you don't get many punctures.

I then peeled the tape off, carefully, as I was going to try to re-use it.  There were two layers on the wheel so I had to unwrap about 1.25 layers to get to the spoke hole.  Fixed the spoke, and managed to re-fit the old tape.  I suspect that the advice is not to do this, but it was easier and it seemed to stick ok.  I expect that when the tyre is pumped up, the pressure will help to hold it in place. 

I put the tyre back on, pumped it back up  with the track pump.  As ever, this worked smoothly with no need to faff around with soapy water sprays or similar, just three or four swift pumps and the tyre snapped back on to the rim. 

I'm finding tubeless works really well for me.  I've just had another set of new wheels delivered (Kinlin XR-31 rims) and I have another set in the garage which I've recently discovered are tubeless ready (Velocity A23), so I've ordered the bits to set them up as well.  I have a box of tubes in the garage which I am beginning to think I may never have to use! 

[Somnolent]

Trouble is,  I'm not sure that the Schwalbe tyres will work ok on my non standard H Son Plus rims.  So it might be back to clichers

Non-standard?
My H + Son Archetypes seem to be fine with the Schwalbe One tubeless, both last year's and the new "TL easy" version, although bizarrely the latter was less easy to get seated on the rim.

[bikey-mikey]

The Hutchinson Intensive 25mm have now done 2100km or so (actually a bit more, some rides were not logged) and I've had yet another puncture that the sealant couldn't cope with.  Let's call it a "big hole".  "big" is 2mm+ but it's relative

 I tried to fix it "in the field" with the Weldite external patch kit.  This amazing kit comes with a tube of rubber glue, a knife, two special tools and some strips of rubber coated string.  The basic idea is that the string is poked into the hole with the tools.  First attempt didn't work at all, inflation blew out the string.  Second attempt worked to some extent and I rode for another 30 minutes before the patching string ripped itself out.  Third attempt was made more difficult to cope with as by now I am out of CO2 carts.  Eventually managed to get the tyre reseated by pumping very very fast.  Dunno how good the third repair is but I am home now.  The ride was cut short

There seem to be a load of nicks in the tyres now.  I wonder if they will do one of these "big holes" every 50 miles or so now?  If so I will have to part company with the Hutchinson Intensive option.  They are supposed to be "heavy" "winter" tyres.  Maybe that doesn't include durability.   They aren't fast tyres, the grip is good but they are narrow even on wide rims. 

Trouble is,  I'm not sure that the Schwalbe tyres will work ok on my non standard H Son Plus rims.  So it might be back to clichers

Sector 28s my boy !!

[vorsprung]

..f so I will have to part company with the Hutchinson Intensive option.  They are supposed to be "heavy" "winter" tyres.  Maybe that doesn't include durability.   They aren't fast tyres, the grip is good but they are narrow even on wide rims. 

Trouble is,  I'm not sure that the Schwalbe tyres will work ok on my non standard H Son Plus rims.  So it might be back to clichers

Sector 28s my boy !!

Unfortunately the Ridley won't do bigger than 25mm with guards.   Which is a shame, I like 28mm

[vorsprung]

Trouble is,  I'm not sure that the Schwalbe tyres will work ok on my non standard H Son Plus rims.  So it might be back to clichers

Non-standard?
My H + Son Archetypes seem to be fine with the Schwalbe One tubeless, both last year's and the new "TL easy" version, although bizarrely the latter was less easy to get seated on the rim.

ok well that's good news.  I might join the queue of people trying to get hold of some 25mm Schwalbe Ones

[Phil W]

..f so I will have to part company with the Hutchinson Intensive option.  They are supposed to be "heavy" "winter" tyres.  Maybe that doesn't include durability.   They aren't fast tyres, the grip is good but they are narrow even on wide rims. 

Trouble is,  I'm not sure that the Schwalbe tyres will work ok on my non standard H Son Plus rims.  So it might be back to clichers

Sector 28s my boy !!

Unfortunately the Ridley won't do bigger than 25mm with guards.   Which is a shame, I like 28mm

Just me and you then Mikey. My Sector 28s are proving a very reliable and nice riding tyre.

[Si S]

..f so I will have to part company with the Hutchinson Intensive option.  They are supposed to be "heavy" "winter" tyres.  Maybe that doesn't include durability.   They aren't fast tyres, the grip is good but they are narrow even on wide rims. 

Trouble is,  I'm not sure that the Schwalbe tyres will work ok on my non standard H Son Plus rims.  So it might be back to clichers

Sector 28s my boy !!

Unfortunately the Ridley won't do bigger than 25mm with guards.   Which is a shame, I like 28mm

Just me and you then Mikey. My Sector 28s are proving a very reliable and nice riding tyre.

Me too, don't think about them really, which is really what I want out of a tyre, although I've only done 2000km on them so far. Probably need to think about checking the sealant, but if it isn't broke.... 

[Sea of vapours]

And me. 12,000km and no issues with Sector 28s as yet.

[Si S]

So how often should I check the sealant?

Bearing in my mind, I HATE fettling, bikes are for riding not pissing around taking apart and then wondering why it won't go back together without  a hammer someone who knows what they're doing.

[Sea of vapours]

So how often should I check the sealant?

You can hear it sloshing about if you shake the wheel from side to side a bit (from having been static). You - well, I at least - can't hear it if you rotate the wheel, but a rapid side to side will produce liquid sounds unless it's very low indeed. I vaguely tested this when replacing a tyre (due to wear) and I could reliably hear as little as 20ml, but the 'from static' bit is important so that the sealant is concentrated in one place. Easy and quick to do.

[Phil W]

So how often should I check the sealant?

Bearing in my mind, I HATE fettling, bikes are for riding not pissing around taking apart and then wondering why it won't go back together without  a hammer someone who knows what they're doing.

I usually check mine about once every 4 months or so. So late Autumn, coming out of Winter, and early Summer

[Si S]

Thanks for that, I could hear sloshing last night, its been three months so I think I'll leave it until the end of May, bikes going to be busy in May, and then maybe fit those milkit valves.

[vorsprung]

Ok update and a useful tip

My rear tyre also had a malfunction.  I think the couple of problems I've had recently are a combination of 1) hitting a largish sharp and 2) the sealant needed topping up

I've patched the not-very-big-but-did-not-want-to-seal hole in the rear and it is fine again

Meanwhile the external patch on the front tyre I've scraped it flat as possible with a sharp knife and a rasp

So the bike is looking ok to ride again.  I have also restocked co2 inflators

now for the

TIP of the WEEK

If you want to remove the valve cores to add more sealant, a size 11 spoke key works great.  I've previously used point nosed pliers
Before you say "but I don't have an size 11 spoke key!  My spokes are 14 gauge!"  If you have a cheap tool kit with a round spoke key tool then you probably do
the thing I mean is this



they are standard with the Aldi/Lidli /In motion products tool kits in the little plastic suitcase

[vorsprung]

and another thing

I have a new bike that will work best with 30 to 33mm tyres.  I'd like fast/race ones.  The only option in tubeless in the size slightly bigger than 28mm with a fast compound is the Schwalbe S-One, which is 30mm

Sadly not available anywhere at the moment.  I have "alerts" set up on a couple of german sites

[GrahamG]

Rather than start a new thread..... Tyre deformity - anyone had this with tubeless??

I've got a Hutchinson Intensive on the back of the fixed after successfully doing a conversion with a rim strip, only this winter's (pitifully low) mileage on of ~500, and there's a slight deformity on one part of the tyre with a bulge about 15mm square but no visible damage whatsoever and the tiny bump it creates isn't noticeable whilst riding. Would you soldier on with this in the proper cheapskate manner or do you think this is something that really wants changing?  It's by the valve where the rim strip is really fat so could potentially interfere with the bead, I'm wondering if this has caused it.

[tiermat]

and another thing

I have a new bike that will work best with 30 to 33mm tyres.  I'd like fast/race ones.  The only option in tubeless in the size slightly bigger than 28mm with a fast compound is the Schwalbe S-One, which is 30mm

Sadly not available anywhere at the moment.  I have "alerts" set up on a couple of german sites

If it is road you are after you might struggle, but I know that the G-Ones are available in 33mm (if and when you can get hold of them!)

[frankly frankie]

TIP of the WEEK

If you want to remove the valve cores to add more sealant, a size 11 spoke key works great.  I've previously used point nosed pliers
Before you say "but I don't have an size 11 spoke key!  My spokes are 14 gauge!"  If you have a cheap tool kit with a round spoke key tool then you probably do
the thing I mean is this

Seems a little OTT when this fails to register on my kitchen scale.      Came free with a Conti inner tube as I recall.