Vango Spirit 200 + (Plus) pole problems?

[fhills]

This issue came up in the motley thread that is "tent pics".

I'm interested in more specific feedback.

I bought one fairly recently - very pleased with ease of putting it up/down and general design, but a problem.

Apart from a bit of test use in my sheltered garden, it's only been erected on camp for a total of 5 or 6 days, a total of 3 pitchings, - always well sheltered in ideal conditions.

But a pole has just broken (the "orange-coded" one) for what I can see as no good reason - I am pretty sure I ensured that the pole sections were always properly slotted together and this impression is supported by the nature of the metal shape which sheared off.

I called Vango - they gave me the standard line about poles not being covered by any guarantee (!!) but faced with my outrage at a breakage after such light use they have said that they will send me a spare bit of pole (not a full new one) to fix it.

So far so good but I'm concerned that this may not be a "freak" and that I may have future breakages when I'm not so close to home.

I'm no engineer but I do also wonder about the wisdom of the "gothic arch" pattern to the poles which means that they are not a perfect curve.

Anyone else got this tent/got any feedback/advice?

PS - I don't usually use the extra inside tensioning cord but I asked about this when I got the tent - Vango told me that they were optional/only for use in windy conditions. And it's never been windy.

[rogerzilla]

Fibreglass poles always break in the end.  Camping stores sell spares, and on a long trip some people take spare pole sections.

[fhills]

Thanks for the reply Rogerzilla, but the poles aren't fibreglass - they are shock corded metal sections.

[rogerzilla]

Ah - I thought it was a metal sleeve that had split (all fibreglass poles have metal sleeves).

I would ask them if you can also buy a spare, for piece of mind.  These sort of tents are pretty lightly built to keep the weight down and therefore they don't last long (not many people would take a Cabanon cycle-camping!).

FWIW, my £25 Millets 2-man tent, which weighs slightly less, also has "gothic arch poles".  It's probably not up to mountaineering, although it has withstood some pretty bad wind and rain without leaking or falling flat.

[gordon taylor]

I recently bought another Vango Spirit 200 plus.
My original was pitched at least 100 times.... possibly 150 times over a six year period. I broke a pole once - whilst pitching the tent. I blame the chatty American who was distracting me at the time.  I fixed that in  a minute or two, using the short repair sleeve that comes with the tent, and used the repaired pole + sleeve for another few weeks of daily touring until I got home again. Vango sent me some spare poles (free) and I replaced the broken section only.

BTW, I've only ever used the guy ropes once - I consider them to be an unnecessary faff unless you're half-way up the Matterhorn. I just untied then and left them at home. I also cut off those inner nylon straps that form braces to the inner apexes (sp?) I've found the tent to be extraordinarily stable; I only ever regretted not having the guy ropes once - on an Irish campsite - and there were two caravans blown over that night.

My conclusion, FWIW: I love the tent. It's just a superb bit of kit for cycle touring.

I always thread the poles carefully and undo the three pole tensioner straps completely before I pop the pole into both sockets. This omission caused my single breakage (see above!)

I'd just keep packing the little repair sleeve and relax. There isn't a problem with the poles, IMHO.

[Rainmaker]

I have had problems with the alloy poles supplied by Vango, I suggested to them they had started to use a "lighter"pole but they denied this.     My tent is the Tempest 200 and I have recently come to the conclusion that the breakages were mainly my own fault.    As well as the internal tensioning system, on my tent there is a tensioning strap one one side of the tent to "adjust" the flysheet.   If you do not slacken both these tensioning devices when packing away the tent, when you attempt to put the poles back into the anchoring points you can put too much stress on the poles.   I would suggest that if you have difficulty in fitting the poles you check that all the tensioning devices are slack.

[Polar Bear]

Hillebergs come with a spare pole section - potentially jolly useful.   Mine sits in the pole bag for 'just in case'.

[fhills]

Thanks for the generally encouraging replies folks - glad you replied Gordy as I'd seen from your other posts that you had one.

I'm intrigued as to why you bought another one - is it for someone else?

@@

Guy ropes - yes there do seem to be a lot but I feel safer putting them up.

Gordy - by internal straps I assume you mean the cords that descend in a kind of triangle from the apex of the porch?

Threading the poles - any special tips? I tend to put the poles together completely, then push them through, gathering up the sleeve material when there is any resistance and then easing them through. I note Vango's advice to not pull the poles through at all or they may separate. I'd appreciate any special tips on this bit of the procedure as I gather that it's key.


By the way, I always pack the poles inside the tent, rolling it around them - I assume that this is best - protecting the poles from any concentrated stress as the whole thing is then lashed to the top of the rack. The tent pegs I keep separately in a pannier.

I was pretty sure that I'd always pre-slackened the tensioning straps but I'll be extra careful to check that I've done this completely in future.

By the way - does anyone know the reason for the "buckles" on the two straps at the front and the two at the back? Unless I'm being really thick (always possible) they don't seem to do anything on mine so can't be used to tighten anything after banging the pegs in. I usually find that I first peg the back out, then put it forward to peg the front out, then have to return to the back and then extract the back pegs and move them backwards in order to remove the slack. A very minor irritation, but it seems odd.

I should stress that if I resolve this issue/have no more problems, I'll be very pleased with the thing - the size is incredible in relation to the packed size and getting it in the bag is no problem at all.

[Viking]

I suggest you speak to Vango.  Depending on the age of the tent, they might send you a new pole FOC.

[gordon taylor]

Thanks for the generally encouraging replies folks - glad you replied Gordy as I'd seen from your other posts that you had one.

I'm intrigued as to why you bought another one - is it for someone else?

@@

Guy ropes - yes there do seem to be a lot but I feel safer putting them up.

Gordy - by internal straps I assume you mean the cords that descend in a kind of triangle from the apex of the porch?

Threading the poles - any special tips? I tend to put the poles together completely, then push them through, gathering up the sleeve material when there is any resistance and then easing them through. I note Vango's advice to not pull the poles through at all or they may separate. I'd appreciate any special tips on this bit of the procedure as I gather that it's key.


By the way, I always pack the poles inside the tent, rolling it around them - I assume that this is best - protecting the poles from any concentrated stress as the whole thing is then lashed to the top of the rack. The tent pegs I keep separately in a pannier.

I was pretty sure that I'd always pre-slackened the tensioning straps but I'll be extra careful to check that I've done this completely in future.

By the way - does anyone know the reason for the "buckles" on the two straps at the front and the two at the back? Unless I'm being really thick (always possible) they don't seem to do anything on mine so can't be used to tighten anything after banging the pegs in. I usually find that I first peg the back out, then put it forward to peg the front out, then have to return to the back and then extract the back pegs and move them backwards in order to remove the slack. A very minor irritation, but it seems odd.

I should stress that if I resolve this issue/have no more problems, I'll be very pleased with the thing - the size is incredible in relation to the packed size and getting it in the bag is no problem at all.

Hi. I bought another one as the old one had worn out, really - pinpricks in the groundsheet, a couple of tears in the flysheet etc etc. I've given it to a young friend who is still using it. In fact, we're hoping she met her prospective husband in it during the summer!!! 

I use exactly the method you describe for threading the poles.

Those buckles at the front and back... I re-threaded my straps through those buckles. They had been wrongly assembled, IMHO. If you do it right, you can use those straps to tighten the flysheet without removing the pegs. They worked like that on my old tent and now they do the same on the new one! I'll take a photo later, if you like.

[fhills]

Thanks for the reply Gordy.

Interesting about the buckles - I thought I must be going mad.

I'll take a closer look at them, but yes photos or guidance on rethreading them would be handy. Is any unpicking/restritching needed?

I think you might be local/ish to me (Pm's in any exchange on this point) , so if I still can't get my head round it, maybe I could sneak a look at your handywork?

Two new pole sections arrived from Vango so all looking good - I just need to finesse with a Dremel some cack-handed hacksawing to length.

thanks again

[andrew_s]

Hillebergs come with a spare pole section - potentially jolly useful.   Mine sits in the pole bag for 'just in case'.

Not only that, but there's a separate compartment in the pole bag for the spare section.

Hilleberg recommend against letting the elastic just snap the sections together. Apparently it can cause cracking in the pole ends.

[mrcharly-YHT]

These 'gothic arches'; are they created by having a middle angled joiner?  That's what my argos tent has, along with the nicest poles I've ever seen on any tent, including a saunders spacepacker.

[fhills]

These 'gothic arches'; are they created by having a middle angled joiner?  That's what my argos tent has, along with the nicest poles I've ever seen on any tent, including a saunders spacepacker.

Yes they are - maybe they are no problem - I'm no engineer.

New pole section cut to length and inserted so all hopefully back to new.

One thing I noted - the three poles are different lengths - no great surprise and understandable, but it would have helped if the pole sections were all the same length. They aren't which means I cannot cut down the second section that Vango sent me and have it all ready for any future problem. All I can do is pre-cut it to the longest length used and then cut it again on-site if I need anything smaller.

[Feline]

Hillebergs come with a spare pole section - potentially jolly useful.   Mine sits in the pole bag for 'just in case'.

We had the spare section when the pole broke on our Hilleberg in France. Unfortunately it broke in 2 places at once.
Fortunately we could divert to Decathlon on our ride the next day and bought any old pole for 9 euros which did us for the remaining nights and trip back.
Simon accused me of having too many clothes next to my mattress, but I don't think this is what broke our pole actually 

[Jon P]

I broke a section during last year's Dales trip, inevitably when I was pitching just before dark and starting to rain. ISTR wedging a peg in a drystone wall and bending it so it would hold it together -which it did, though I had to be content with an early lowland camp the next (last) night instead of the one I enviously found an hour into the day's walk.  You can also get alloy sleeves to fit over the broken sections, and since then I even found a metal one that fitted, lying in the road.

[fhills]

I You can also get alloy sleeves to fit over the broken sections, and since then I even found a metal one that fitted, lying in the road.

Mine came with that alloy sleeve - you're supposed to slot it into place and secure it with tape I think.

Poles are 8.5mm diameter - I have no idea how common this is/how easy it might be to find generic spares in camp shops/Decathlons etc. I suppose the length and dimensions of the "sticky-out sleeve" length that fits into the next section is important as well - if it's too short I guess it would stress the next section.

[fhills]

Update, and not a nice one I'm afraid.

Sorted the rear pole problem by cutting the new section to length with a Dremel and then smoothing (is it advisable to take a hacksaw on camp?) the end. Went on another trip of what was meant to be four nights. Erected in perfect weather conditions (this wasn't in the recent gale/rainstorm conditions but in the Indian summer that preceeded it) in a single spot on a campsite - it's never been free-camping. On the morning after the third night there was a crack from the front of the tent - pole sheared and the sharp razor then created cut through the sleeve. Only way to then get the stuck pole out was to remove the shock cord (it would be helpful if info on how to do this was in the tent instructions) and take the pole out in bits. To be clear - this is an entirely different pole to the first breakage - middle pole as yet unscathed so maybe it would make a wigwam.

Using the tent for the last night didn't seem like a good idea as it seemed to me that even using the metal repair sleeve and strong tape I had deliberately brought, the pole sleeve would get damaged further and the tent would start to tear itself apart. So abandoned the camp - farmer/camspite owner refunded my last night's money and was as mystified as me - weather calm all the time I and my tent (described as "lightweight, reliable, robust" by Vango) had been there.
.
I couldn't possibly have taken more care putting the tent up - anyone who had watched me would have thought I was manufacturing the thing - poles all pushed through as recommended (ie: not pulled) and I even carefully examined all of the pole sections for signs of wear as I put them together. Cords not overtightened at all. After all the poles were in and the tent was up I virtually caressed the pole sleeves to check that all sections inside were perfectly joined.

So apart from a test pitch before each trip, the tent has been erected 4 times for 9 nights only. Unfit for purpose is the only conclusion it seems to me - at least on the one I was sold. Retail price of this tent is currently £300.

It is now in no state to use.

I have been in touch with outdoorworlddirect (they have been particularly helpful so far so fingers crossed)and Vango - currently hopeful that this will be sorted on the basis that there was something wrong with the manufacture of the particular tent I bought. This would be kind of supported by the fact that whoever put the thing together hadn't even managed to put the rear pitching buckles on properly and no-one down the line spotted this. The buckles cannot be used as detailed in the tent's pitching instructions and are simply decorative. If Vango is seeking to claim a weight reduction for a future model they may as well take them off.

Current thoughts - nice tent but build quality maybe worse than a Coleman tent at half the price.

Will report back when I learn more, though I gather Vango take 5 weeks or so to make  a decision. Good job they don't have a space programme.

[Wowbagger]

Hopefully, Vango will do the right thing. I must say if I'd had your experiences i would be going for a full refund.

I read something online about pole problems, and the guy blamed the "Gothic Arch" shape.

The only problem I experienced with the tent was the rather lightweight nature of the elastic loops connecting the inner and the flysheet. I replaced these with elastic from Mrs. Wow's knickers sewing box.

[fhills]

Thanks for the support wow.

I'm going for a complete swap out, but on further reflection I'm wondering if I'd be happier with a straight refund - I'm confident I could get something for less money that would perform better and would be just as suitable for backpacking/cycle camping. And basic confidence that a tent is going to complete a short trip is important. I'm perfectly willing to undertake a bit of lifetime maintenance/replace the odd pole (further research from me has revealed that the dimensions are pretty common and you just need to shorten to length) but this is beyond a joke.

I'm no engineer and don't know if the gothic arch is a problem. I know other tents use them. I have noticed that the poles seem to flex less than others I've come across - this seems bad to me (again no enginner) for riding out the odd bit of wind (or with regard to my particular tent's history, caress from a butterfly wing) - I kind of have the impression that stress is just transmitted by the inner sleeve of each pole to the outer of the next section - that is where both of mine bust.

Fingers crossed that as you say Vango will do the right thing. I'm relying on the sale of goods act and their concern for their brand/reputation - the "guarantee", on closer inspection is a thing of wonder. Difficult to see what it covers you for. I'm aware that manufacturers have to protect themselves from folk taking the piss but theirs is an extreme case.

I've had no other problems at all with the tent apart from the bust poles and their attack on the tent fabric - and the curiously mismanufactured/checked pegging pole tensioners.

I see that the new model of this tent by the way has two doors, not one - a bit concerned that they are adding features when they should concentrate on sorting the basic tent and its manufacturing/checking. "Features" will be the death of us.

I have a few other thoughts on the tent's design but I'll save them for now. Will report back when I get word back from Vango - I may be some time .....

[jane]

Only just spotted this thread.  Extremely surprised at the problems you've had and agree that Vango should refund you fully.  Surprised, though, because my old Vango has weathered some really tough weather conditions including a winter blizzards 700 metres up.  And many other Scottish storms which saw other tents waterlogged and broken.  I wonder if they have changed the poles in some way, or whether there was a fault in yours.  Either way, I can understand why you would want to go for something completely different.  You really need to have confidence in your tent. 
    For short trips, the ultralight Lasers are pretty good.  If you need more space, I am not sure.  I bought a new one recently, the WildCountry Duolite Tourer.  I used it this summer and it was fine, but I had no really bad weather to test it's rather insecure (well, it looked a bit so to me) clipping system. The poles are external and clipped to the fly.  If I had the money I would go for a Hilleberg, but they are way too expensive for my pocket.  I'll be looking around over the next few months, so will probably report my findings.  And would be interested in yours if you're doing the same.

[cycleman]

my vango 200 is still ok after a couple years re poles but the goundsheet in porous  . i found out at milldenhall this years as that was the first time it has had to cope with a proper rainstorm . the footprint is waterproof and water got between it and the inner groundsheet which th water went right through  . i will wait and see how vango deal with your problem before approaching them with mine . as my tent is a few years old i am sure that they will not help  .

[fhills]

Have had some goodish news cycleman though porous YACF seems to have lost the long update I'd written to the thread - no time now to rewrite the whole thing so will post tomorrow or at soonest,

Mystified to say the least by your porous groundsheet but not something I've tested. Mine has only ever been erected in dry pretty much perfect weather that wouldn't challenge a festival tent. I don't use a footprint but a tarp from B&Q but as you say it's not the bottom layer that's you problem . Doesn't sound good - maybe someone else has advice.
(edited for typo)
 

[fhills]

Well some good (ish) news.

Vango came back to me via outdoorworlddirect and have said that they are going to "professionally repair" the tent pole sleeve on the flysheet so that apparently I won't be able to tell it from new. They accelerated the process because of oddities with my situation. I'm a bit puzzled as to how this is more economic for them than just swapping the bit out with another Chinese bit rolled off the production line at a rate of knots but there you go. If the repair is that good I'm happy. I had kind of started to lean towards maybe asking for a refund as I still have doubts (understandable I think in the circumstances) about the tent, but these things have a certain momentum and I have been  pushing hard. I've also asked them to sort the non-buckling pitching buckles, so more sewing for them.

www.outdoorworlddirect.co.uk have been very good with this issue and very responsive and I would definitely recomend them. And no premium rate number - see below - which I think always creates a good impression/gives you the feeling that a company is actually willing to speak to you. It helped I think that I was able to give them a complete pitching history with dates and locations. This wasn't actually much trouble for me since it had been used so little.

A few things Vango owners might be interested in.

http://www.campingspares.co.uk, Vango's sister company, seems to stress that if a pole section breaks it is vital that all the bits are put back together in the same order. While it is clearly important that any gothic arch remains in the centre, I have no idea at all why this might be. When I repaired the first pole, though ignorant of this rule, I definitely put everything back in the same order simply because of the way I did the job, but the latest broken pole was returned to them in bits (it was taken apart to get it out of the sleeve) so hopefully they will just give me an entirely new pole.

If you need to contact Vango, particularly from a field on your mobile, it might be an idea to scribble this phone number on the tent pitching instructions instead of the premium rate one (followed by inevitable press this for, that for ..) they give. Doesn't create a good impression.

The number: 0141 773 5475 .

I'll definitely be taking at least one spare pole section in future, and a hacksaw blade, and the temporary repair sleeve/splint, and maybe the repair sleeve/splint from another tent.

Jane's post:

Yes I wondered if they had changed the tent pole spec for in amongst some bad user experiences of the tent (a total failure in one instance necessitating purchase of a brand new tent mid-tour)  I've read a lot of good things about it. It's always possible I suppose in their quest for, er, continuous improvement/shaving costs. The tent pegs it came with were pretty shoddy - some disgracefully so - some had four sharp edges virtually guaranteed to shear the guy ropes. Pegs that came with a tent at half the price were real pegs similar to better ones I bought for the Vango..

I considered the WildCountry Duolite Tourer. Can't remember why I eventually went the Vango route. I've seen a fair few tents with external poles. It does look kind of odd but there may be an advantage - if the poles shear they are far less likely to damage the flysheet I would have thought. Also, I assume that it makes temporary repairs with a metal sleeve/splint and duct tape easier. Getting the poles through the flysheet sleeves on the Vango isn't very easy as it is - I'm not lookin forward to having to do it with a pole thickened by a repair splint and a whole load of duct tape.

Somewhat put out by the Vango experience and encouraged by the sale season and maybe wanting to get a bit of late camping in I have very recently taken delivery of another tent - half the list price and half the actual cost price - initial signs are good and it's about to go up on my lawn. Will maybe post more on it when I am in a better position to comment on it.

[Mrs Pingu]

On the Vango front, one of the poles in our 2002 tent snapped. I sent it to their repair arm with credit card details and they sent it back all sorted with a little note saying 'no charge' which I thought was nice given how old the tent was!