New Trains and cycle carrying capacity

[Cudzoziemiec]

You didn't watch it, Kim! The sign says "Do not lock cycles to separators".

[Kim]

You didn't watch it, Kim! The sign says "Do not lock cycles to separators".

I did, but I didn't get time to read all the text.

So it does.  I wonder what that's about.  Is the separator no longer unlockable, or staff not wanting the hassle?

[Cudzoziemiec]

The separator is clearly movable by passengers, at a guess it might be that if an outer bike is locked to the separator, the inner one cannot be removed.

[Kim]

That makes sense.  The design is a bit more open than the rubbish on CrossCountry's Voyagers, where - on the rare occasions that two compatibly-handlebared bikes occupy the double space - you usually to need to remove one bike to get at the other.  But it's always going to depend on the bikes themselves, and the height/strength of the person trying to lift them.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Yes, it's an inherently compromised storage method.

[Cudzoziemiec]

One other point about these trains: atm they're using 2 sets of 5-car trains back to back to make 10 carriages per train, with 1st class in the middle. This means there is bike space at both ends – I think – but that won't be the case when the 9-car sets come into service, some time in the future (but they'll have the same number of seats, due to having only one kitchen area).

[matthew]

Yes, it's an inherently compromised storage method.

Think of it from the train companies point of view, it is an inherently optimised method as it uses the least footprint in the restricted plan area of a train thereby allowing the greatest number of seats.

We might look at it and claim that it is ablist as you have to be sufficiently string to get the bike up and other associated compromises but how many train miles are done with no bikes on board?*



* Yes I know this can be a self fulfilling metric.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Obviously, and so it also makes sense for TOCs to use bike space for luggages. As for the number of journeys without bikes on board, I reckon there's great variation from route to route and also time to time. XC from Birmingham to Bristol on a Saturday or Sunday I have never seen less than 3 bikes on board (they have 3 spaces)!

[Kim]

Yes, TOCs hate bikes.  And luggage.  Anything that's not able-bodied commuters is an inconvenience to them.

I'd be in favour of paying for cycle reservations, if it improved the general attitude to bikes.


Sure, many trains travel without any bikes on board.  But many trains travel with only a tiny proportion of seats filled.  It's the nature of peak demand.

[mattc]

Yes, TOCs hate bikes.  And luggage.  Anything that's not able-bodied commuters is an inconvenience to them.

I'd be in favour of paying for cycle reservations, if it improved the general attitude to bikes.

I'd happily pay for cycle carriage [not just the reservation]. This is what happens on every continental* train I've used.

Why do we need a different, crappier approach in the UK? Does the Min-of-T know something the Yooropeans don't about integrated transport? 


[*The Swiss charge about a million pounds, but it was a very scenic trip ]

[drossall]

Yes, TOCs hate bikes.  And luggage.  Anything that's not able-bodied commuters is an inconvenience to them.

I'm sure they'd rather the commuters didn't take up space either

[pcolbeck]

Yeah, specifically the business end of a the power car.  That's a whole unit on a HST, but just the bit behind the cab on a Pendolino or Voyager.

I think that was designed in for parcels and mail neither of which have gone by rail for years sadly  hence no need in new train design.

[SA_SA_SA_SA]

....On some high speed trains (including but not limited to HSTs), there are areas that can't be used for passengers, because they're supposed to be a crumple zone....

I think for a while passenger space wasn't allowed in a Driving van Trailer above a certain speed , but the rule was dropped.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driving_Van_Trailer