The Grumble Thread - No energy for a full on rant.

[Polar Bear]

And vested interests of course.

[mcshroom]

It's the reason I haven't had any fitted. Also my meters are on the outside of the house and easy to get to, so I don't find going out and reading them once a month much of an imposition really.

I'm in the process of moving to a new supplier, who don't do smart meters yet, but reckon the SMET2 ones they are rolling out later this year won't be supplier specific, which could be interesting.

[robgul]

I have a smart meter installed a couple of years ago, which is now useless as I have just moved suppliers.

That's why I stopped the man doing the work when he was here screwdriver in hand - the "tying you in" thing is outrageous to say nothing of wasteful for the industry (although we haven't changed supplier in the 17 years that we've been here as the deals, so far, that we are on have been favourable)

We have a small gadget linked to the electricity that shows consumption and read both electric and gas meters at the end of each month to report to the supplier and get accurate pay-as-you-go bills.

Rob

Rob

[Polar Bear]

We've been reading our meters on a Sunday evening regularly now for years.   Not sure what a smart meter would give us that we really need.

[ian]

Supplier-specific meters? They forgot to mention that. I'd assumed – not unreasonably – that I could switch suppliers without changing meters. That seems extraordinarily dumb.

My parents have one, it was interesting for the purposes of curiosity how much is being used and the cost, I have no concept of what my prolonged languishing in the bathtub cost. I suspect I'd get bored quickly, our bills aren't immodest. That and I'm sick of estimated fucking bills. I even got an estimated water bill last time. The meter down a tube with the lid that requires a special thinggummy to open and eyes that can see in the dark to read.

[Beardy]

This whole Smart Meter thingy is all a bit odd to me. I've only got electric and gas appliances that I want, and I only turn them on when I need to use them. It's difficult to me to understand just how much I'd change my behaviour if I know that my computers were costing me 5 groats an hour to use, because I'd still need to do whatever, and it's lots cheaper and more convenient that driving to the library to look it up in a book. Someone sent a chap round about 2 years ago to replace the old whiry meter with a new fangled electric meter (complete with blinky light) which isn't smart at all. He did install  the new meter in spite of my dodgy wiring (my fault, I put too many fittings on a lighting circuit. I'll get around to that when I can face the mess of digging the wire out of the wall) mainly because he was a 'repurposed' meter reader who'd had a whole days training in meter replacement and I easily bamboozled him into the dodgy test equipment argument.

[Ham]

I seem to recall that the current generation (G2) of meters are now more universal than G1, what I have.

On the positive side, the info from the meter was very informative, including splitting the costs between types of usage (eg, fridge/freezer, washing machine, always on etc) which I shall miss. I was with Ovo, who were excellent for customer service on all occasions I had to deal with them and - compensating for their not-the-cheapest-prices, they paid substantial interest on credit balances, which I had managed to work up to a mahoosive level. As they finally cottoned on to this and have been using it up, I couldn't ignore that the Bulb (all renewable) deal represented c.15% saving, including paying the penalty for ending the Ovo fixed (for one more year) deal early.

[Kim]

Supplier-specific meters? They forgot to mention that. I'd assumed – not unreasonably – that I could switch suppliers without changing meters. That seems extraordinarily dumb.

You can.  It's just that the new supplier won't be able to read the old supplier's smart meters automagically, and will probably want to install their own.

At some point government regulation is due to solve this problem, but for some ridiculous reason this didn't get sorted out before people started upgrading the meters.

[Kim]

This whole Smart Meter thingy is all a bit odd to me. I've only got electric and gas appliances that I want, and I only turn them on when I need to use them. It's difficult to me to understand just how much I'd change my behaviour if I know that my computers were costing me 5 groats an hour to use, because I'd still need to do whatever, and it's lots cheaper and more convenient that driving to the library to look it up in a book.

I think the reasoning is:

- Sending people to read meters is expensive.  Better to let the meters read themselves.
- Many people are far more wasteful than you describe.  Some may be unaware of it.
- People may be conscientious but simply unaware that a certain appliance (eg. an old fridge) is a massive energy-hog and could be worthwhile avoiding using or replacing.
- Smart metering allows billing to reflect demand, at a much finer granularity that the existing off-peak tariffs.  Sure, you still need that computer on now, or that cooking appliance at dinner time, but you might only need to get that wash load done or that car charged by tomorrow morning.  You (or a smart appliance working out the details on your behalf) might be persuaded to do it at 9pm or 3am rather than 6pm if the electricity is substantially cheaper.  This is good for the grid, as it allows demand to be manipulated to maximise use of cheap, clean electricity sources.
- Moar data moar betterer.

[spesh]

This whole Smart Meter thingy is all a bit odd to me. I've only got electric and gas appliances that I want, and I only turn them on when I need to use them. It's difficult to me to understand just how much I'd change my behaviour if I know that my computers were costing me 5 groats an hour to use, because I'd still need to do whatever, and it's lots cheaper and more convenient that driving to the library to look it up in a book.

I think the reasoning is:

- Sending people to read meters is expensive.  Better to let the meters read themselves.
- Many people are far more wasteful than you describe.  Some may be unaware of it.
- People may be conscientious but simply unaware that a certain appliance (eg. an old fridge) is a massive energy-hog and could be worthwhile avoiding using or replacing.
- Smart metering allows billing to reflect demand, at a much finer granularity that the existing off-peak tariffs.  Sure, you still need that computer on now, or that cooking appliance at dinner time, but you might only need to get that wash load done or that car charged by tomorrow morning.  You (or a smart appliance working out the details on your behalf) might be persuaded to do it at 9pm or 3am rather than 6pm if the electricity is substantially cheaper.  This is good for the grid, as it allows demand to be manipulated to maximise use of cheap, clean electricity sources.
- Moar data moar betterer.

"Smart" meters, the Internet of Shit and advanced persistent threats in the cyber-domain, courtesy of hostile foreign powers...

I mean, what's the worst that could happen? 

[Kim]

"Smart" meters, the Internet of Shit and advanced persistent threats in the cyber-domain, courtesy of hostile foreign powers...

I mean, what's the worst that could happen? 

I think it's been amply demonstrated that hostile foreign powers are unnecessary when we have utility company competence and marginally inventive script kiddies trying to take out a rival minecraft server.

[Beardy]

Speaking of the internet of smart things, my Evohome package arrived this morning but I had to wait until lunch time to open it and play is restricted because I'm actually working today. But the bit I've done so far is good apart from their server refusing to send me emails to activate my account. Rather ironically this vindicates my choice of Evohome because the remote access via their server is an add on to the fully contained functionality of the kit in the home. No, I'm not going to be able to turn it on from Mars or use my phone to control it until THEY get their finger out, but that's the icing on the cake as it were. <wonders if someone has already hacked the controller interface so I don't need to use their servers>

[TheLurker]

This whole Smart Meter thingy is all a bit odd to me.

As I understand it it's not about the consumer's convenience.  It is, medium to long term, about power companies being able to exert more control over usage, either by demand sensitive pricing or straight-forward turning the taps down* and also to allow remote disconnection for reluctant payers. 

I have also heard that these so called "Smart" meters can't do the sums to cope with feed-in from domestic PV systems, but that may be an "alternative fact".

Excuse me while I get my coat.  It's the one with the tin-foil lining.


*No, I don't know how that would/will work either, short of the sort of things ISPs (used to and may still) do.  Gone over your monthly leccy/gas allowance? Oh dearie me.  Well that'll be five squillion pounds per extra unit/btu** used and plus an admin fee of 12.50 for sending you an automated e-mail telling you that you're about to be ripped off.

**Alternative measurement systems are available. For more details send an SAE and postal order for 3/- to ....

[Biggsy]

A grumble and a warning:

The old Royal Fail Online Postage (non-business) service is closing on 23 March - replaced with Click & Drop (which has fewer options but is easier for one-offs).  You'll lose any balance in your account if you don't withdraw or spend it by the closing date.  The cheek is that you can't withdraw your last £10 and you can't spend it on Click & Drop.  You can't even spend it in the Shop on old-fashioned stamps and First Class Mum mugs.  Hmm, must put some shit on eBay to have something to post.

www.royalmail.com/prepay/account

[hellymedic]

A grumble and a warning:

The old Royal Fail Online Postage (non-business) service is closing on 23 March - replaced with Click & Drop (which has fewer options but is easier for one-offs).  You'll lose any balance in your account if you don't withdraw or spend it by the closing date.  The cheek is that you can't withdraw your last £10 and you can't spend it on Click & Drop.  You can't even spend it in the Shop on old-fashioned stamps and First Class Mum mugs.  Hmm, must put some shit on eBay to have something to post.

www.royalmail.com/prepay/account

They did eventually refund my last £1.56 but took ten days to transfer it into my current account, after I'd bought postage with some of the last £10.

[Feanor]

I've just lost my trusty old Leatherman multi-tool.

It was in the bottom of my day-bag I take out on the mountain when skiing, for any emergency fettling that may be required.
Unfortunately, this is also my hand-baggage bag, and it got left in there accidentally.

It is now in the Naughty Tray at the Aéroport de Genève.

[ElyDave]

Bugger, I had my Swiss army knife taken off me at Stavanger, not because of the knife, but due to the saw.

[hellymedic]

Sorry for your loss, Feanor!

FWIW I realised my Leatherman Micra had passed Security without comment or problem when I arrived in Israel a while back. It usually resides in the sidepocket of the bumbag that is seldom parted from me, but went through X-ray.

I did not attempt to repeat this feat on my return.

I do love my 'girlie' Leatherman!

[Eccentrica Gallumbits]

Fucking useless pathetic Tesco binbags, splitting and dribbling cat litter and cat turds through my flat.

[Kim]

My 'if it's good enough for Macgyver' Swiss Army Knife has been with me since I was 14.  It's gone on sabbatical a couple of times, but always seems to turn up again.  Probably helps that the last time it went through an airport was in about 1996, where the security bod laughed at me Mick Dundee style for declaring it as a knife.

[Kim]

Fucking useless pathetic Tesco binbags, splitting and dribbling cat litter and cat turds through my flat.

Are they using the same stuff that they used to make the carrier bags out of?  That was so biodegradable that exposure to cat piss would cause it to biodegrade before bin day.

[Torslanda]

Bib bags. Costco is your friend.

[Canardly]

Lidl bags with in built tie are quite strong.

[T42]

Mrs. T42 ordered a copy of her mum's birth certificate from the England & Wales records office on 18th Dec., paying £10 for fast-track handling. It still hasn't arrived.

She sent them an email this morning to complain. The boilerplate reply told her that they had no mechanism for changing orders or sending them again, so if she really wanted the certificate she could place another order. And pay for it, of course.

Cynical bastards.

[Guy]

I've been here nearly 2 anna 1/2 hours and so far I have managed to:

book 1 return flight
book 2 return orange cards
book 2 hotels
have 1 long, loud, sweary rant at the bloody recalcitrant Hogg Robinson webshite.

And now I'm going for caffeine.