Grammar that makes you cringe

[ElyDave]

at least it's a metric tonne of storage, not one of those old fashioned ones

[Bledlow]

People writing tonne when they mean ton, as in it cost a tonne of money. It's a wonder they don't write it cost a tonne (0.984 Imperial long tons) of money.

One of my colleagues does this all the time. If I'm editing his copy, I usually change it to 'loads' or something else to avoid the issue.

I think it's a form of hypercorrection, whereby all units are pedantically expressed in metric even if used figuratively.

See also: hide your light under 36.387 litres, go the whole 8.23 metres, give them 2.54cm and they'll take 1,6km...

I recall wandering around Sri Lanka in the 1980s & noticing that railway stations had the altitude on the main name sign.

In metres, in multiples of 3.05. 

At least it wasn't in multiples of 3.048.

[citoyen]

A grammar that makes me cringe:


It was the headline that first caught my attention (which, to be fair is what headlines are supposed to do), particularly the unwieldy passive construction 'have been deemed selective' - I guess 'have you passed the 11+?' is deprecated for all sorts of reasons, but that's a fairly cackhanded way of getting around it.

Then I read on and it got worse. That third sentence is 37 words long. 

[ian]

The benefits of a comprehensive school education mean I can't compose sentences that long.

Which is a good thing for everyone.

[T42]

Then I read on and it got worse. That third sentence is 37 words long. 

Going for the Henry James award?

[Cudzoziemiec]

Bumf or even arsef.

[citoyen]

Bumf or even arsef.

It's an advert on a train for a school open day. They could say everything they needed to say in three or four succinct bullet points.

Arsef is a good word. I shall adopt it. Even though I don't know how to say it.

[Cudzoziemiec]

I'd just say it like arse with a 'f' sound at the end. I've never said it out loud though; I might let you have the honour of being the first. Though we already have the perfectly good 'arsewipe' to describe that kind of pseudo-impressive writing.

Perhaps they could have said something like 'Have you qualified for a selective school?' in the headline, avoiding the clumsy passive, the dodgy use of selective and the 'controversial' 11+ all in one go. Perhaps they could have found something concrete to say about their school as well.

[citoyen]

Perhaps they could have said something like 'Have you qualified for a selective school?' in the headline

Or they could just be honest about a policy that leaves a vast number of 10 year olds on the educational scrapheap.

[Peter]

How many 11-year-olds would know they had been "deemed selective"?   Is this a buzz-phrase in the South?  Do you want to go to a school that is going to "allow" you to smile?  Most kids do it naturally, until education intervenes.  There's so much that's infelicitous in the last sentence that it's hard to know where to start.

[citoyen]

There's so much that's infelicitous in the last sentence that it's hard to know where to start.

Everything about it appals me, but the bit about "allowing" kids to smile is particularly invidious.

In any case, it's the school that's selective; the pupils are selected. It's offensive to suggest the kids have any control over "proceedings".

[ian]

It is, admittedly, a peculiarly awful piece of text. I feel sure the school in question features an 'executive leadership team.'

[Cudzoziemiec]

I'd echo Peter's question. Is 'deemed selective' an actual phrase in Kent or has the school made it up?

[nicknack]

They forgot to mention that if you don't buy the correct uniform from their "approved supplier" then you'll be out on your ear.

[citoyen]

I'd echo Peter's question. Is 'deemed selective' an actual phrase in Kent or has the school made it up?

I just googled the phrase "deemed selective" and it seems to be a London Borough of Bexley thing. File alongside fronted adverbials in the folder marked Horrendous Educationalist Jargon.
https://www.bexley.gov.uk/services/children-families-and-education/education-and-services-children/school-admissions/selection-tests

I've never heard it before though. My son did the 11+ in East Kent, which is a different LEA, and it was some years ago so I can't remember what euphemisms they used to skirt around openly stating that they were weeding out the thickos.

This is what is says on the KCC website:
"If you want to apply for a year 7 place at a Kent grammar school, you can register your child for the Kent Test. The test assesses whether grammar school is a suitable option for your child."

[hellymedic]

Is being 'Deemed Selective' a Statement of Snootiness?

I tend to think of a selective person being fussy to the point of snobbery but maybe my use of English is not like others.

[Redlight]

It is, admittedly, a peculiarly awful piece of text. I feel sure the school in question features an 'executive leadership team.'

The ad's a tad premature in any case - the tests were only a couple of weeks ago and the results aren't due for another two weeks.

(I don't know about Beths' governance but it is known as one of the better schools in this part of SE London and so there's fierce competition for places there, especially from neighbouring boroughs like Lewisham and Greenwich where there are no grammar schools and few good comprehensives.  I'm surprised they even need to advertise the open days. )

[Redlight]

Back on topic - can I propose a ban on the phrase "of all time"?   So far as I am aware, the world has not yet ended so "all time" will, hopefully, have some time still to run.

[ian]

It's all bizarre to me. I went to the local comprehensive because that was the only school there was.

[Redlight]

It's all bizarre to me. I went to the local comprehensive because that was the only school there was.

As the father of a 10 year-old, I can vouch for the fact that it's a complete f----ing shambles 

[ian]

I'm glad that I only have cats. Them don't need no schoolin'.

It does seem a nightmare that mostly seems built to cater to middle-class parents craving for status rather than their kids' educational needs.

When I grew up there was a high school 'down Nottingham' I suppose, though I didn't know anyone who breathed that rarified air of educational attainment. We just bumbled to the local comp got stratified into the thickies (just sit there and try to be quiet for the next five years, OK? Please...), the merely mediocre motoring for the bottom quartile of the GCSE grading curve, and the smart-ish kids.

Mind you, I remember when I told my dad I was going to university. He gave it a bit of thought. And then asked 'why?'

It only took him another twenty-eight years to ask me what I studied.

Yes, yes, I was one of the smart kids, so shut up.

[T42]

Back in the day my mum was forbidden a university education because a girl at Queen's Belfast got "herself into trouble"*.  That would have been in the 1920s.

*NB "herself". Must have been parthenogenesis. Cringeworthy these days.

[citoyen]

I'm surprised they even need to advertise the open days. )

I had the same thought. It's not just that it's one of the "better" schools, it's that there are far more candidates "deemed selective" than there are places in grammar schools  - mainly because the population has increased but the number of grammar school places hasn't, which is why the Tories are intent on changing the rules to allow new grammar schools (rather than improving the standard of education at comprehensives).

[mcshroom]

People writing tonne when they mean ton, as in it cost a tonne of money. It's a wonder they don't write it cost a tonne (0.984 Imperial long tons) of money.

One of my colleagues does this all the time. If I'm editing his copy, I usually change it to 'loads' or something else to avoid the issue.

I think it's a form of hypercorrection, whereby all units are pedantically expressed in metric even if used figuratively.

See also: hide your light under 36.387 litres, go the whole 8.23 metres, give them 2.54cm and they'll take 1,6km...

I recall wandering around Sri Lanka in the 1980s & noticing that railway stations had the altitude on the main name sign.

In metres, in multiples of 3.05. 

At least it wasn't in multiples of 3.048.

We have height restriction barriers at work which are labelled as "Maximum height 5.334 m".

[Cudzoziemiec]

Archbishop of Canterbury "can't give a straight answer on gay sex," which made me smile, even if it was accidental.

Asked by Campbell if gay sex was sinful, Welby said: “You know very well that is a question I can’t give a straight answer to. Sorry, badly phrased there. I should have thought that one through.”

But then he spoils it by talking about "enormity".

In his GQ interview, Welby also said he hoped he would not have to preside over the Queen’s funeral. “It’s enormous whoever does it – God willing someone else – because it is an enormous public event. But as a parish priest, at every funeral you think about the enormity of it.

I don't think he really means that. Or maybe he does?