The spiral bridges are wonderful. There should be one in ever kids' playground. But they do not belong on cycle paths.Fatalities in the last 12 months, usually.
What do the numbers on them refer to?
It all depends on whether you'd rather share the path with spotty 17 year olds doing 50 mph on nicked motocross bikes.
... The solution to such abuse is policing, not disproportionately inconvenient barriers that don't actually stop the problem.
Diamond Geezer has some images of the Wandle Trail (http://www.flickr.com/photos/dgeezer/sets/72157594322107695/), including these two, which may be what you're referring to. That does look like a spectacularly stupid design.
(http://farm1.staticflickr.com/102/266320852_3e40b1fcee.jpg)
(http://farm1.staticflickr.com/93/266320864_490a8494a5.jpg)
As for the problem of motorcycles on cycle paths, if these are really a problem* then why not adopt the design used on rural bridleways of the muddy, horsey type: a padlocked gate which can be swung open for maintenance access, but in its closed position has a large cutout with a lip a few inches high. Just high enough to stop a motorbike (or other wheeled vehicle) crossing it, but easy for a horse to step over. Obviously, you can't cycle over this - but it's quite easy for most people to lift most cycles over, even a tandem. It would, of course, still be a problem for many disabled people unless they had an able-bodied companion, and might require unhitching a trailer. It's far from perfect, but it's got to be a lot better for cyclists (and cheaper to install) than those spirals (or even lots of bollards and chicanes currently in use).
As for the problem of motorcycles on cycle paths, if these are really a problem* then why not adopt the design used on rural bridleways of the muddy, horsey type: a padlocked gate which can be swung open for maintenance access, but in its closed position has a large cutout with a lip a few inches high. Just high enough to stop a motorbike (or other wheeled vehicle) crossing it, but easy for a horse to step over. Obviously, you can't cycle over this - but it's quite easy for most people to lift most cycles over, even a tandem. It would, of course, still be a problem for many disabled people unless they had an able-bodied companion, and might require unhitching a trailer. It's far from perfect, but it's got to be a lot better for cyclists (and cheaper to install) than those spirals (or even lots of bollards and chicanes currently in use).
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3763/9902116896_0502309270.jpg) (https://www.flickr.com/photos/nikki_pugh/9902116896/)
Silly Sustrans Gate (https://www.flickr.com/photos/nikki_pugh/9902116896/) by Nikki Pugh (https://www.flickr.com/people/nikki_pugh/), on Flickr
Exactly the thing. How much of an obstacle was it for you - and your companions? Was it worse or better for a recumbent than a knupwrite? I can see you're pretty laden there - was that a big problem? And how did Barakta cope with it, if she was with you?
ETA: Odd, but I don't recall ever having used one of those myself.
There is a very real chance that if I was cycling along there I would not have seen that gate and taken a flyer.
Probably worth making that point to Sustrans etc, as I doubt it's occurred to them.As for the problem of motorcycles on cycle paths, if these are really a problem* then why not adopt the design used on rural bridleways of the muddy, horsey type: a padlocked gate which can be swung open for maintenance access, but in its closed position has a large cutout with a lip a few inches high. Just high enough to stop a motorbike (or other wheeled vehicle) crossing it, but easy for a horse to step over. Obviously, you can't cycle over this - but it's quite easy for most people to lift most cycles over, even a tandem. It would, of course, still be a problem for many disabled people unless they had an able-bodied companion, and might require unhitching a trailer. It's far from perfect, but it's got to be a lot better for cyclists (and cheaper to install) than those spirals (or even lots of bollards and chicanes currently in use).
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3763/9902116896_0502309270.jpg) (https://www.flickr.com/photos/nikki_pugh/9902116896/)
Silly Sustrans Gate (https://www.flickr.com/photos/nikki_pugh/9902116896/) by Nikki Pugh (https://www.flickr.com/people/nikki_pugh/), on Flickr
There is a very real chance that if I was cycling along there I would not have seen that gate and taken a flyer.
As for the problem of motorcycles on cycle paths, if these are really a problem* then why not adopt the design used on rural bridleways of the muddy, horsey type: a padlocked gate which can be swung open for maintenance access, but in its closed position has a large cutout with a lip a few inches high. Just high enough to stop a motorbike (or other wheeled vehicle) crossing it, but easy for a horse to step over. Obviously, you can't cycle over this - but it's quite easy for most people to lift most cycles over, even a tandem. It would, of course, still be a problem for many disabled people unless they had an able-bodied companion, and might require unhitching a trailer. It's far from perfect, but it's got to be a lot better for cyclists (and cheaper to install) than those spirals (or even lots of bollards and chicanes currently in use).
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3763/9902116896_0502309270.jpg) (https://www.flickr.com/photos/nikki_pugh/9902116896/)
Silly Sustrans Gate (https://www.flickr.com/photos/nikki_pugh/9902116896/) by Nikki Pugh (https://www.flickr.com/people/nikki_pugh/), on Flickr
Most barriers are more of a problem to those with mobility issues, children or luggage than to young fit chaps on motorbikes.While most of the motorbikers causing problems probably are young fit chaps, I doubt you have to be particularly fit to get a motorbike over most of those barriers - after all, it has far more power than any cyclist, and in effect a barrier in that style is just a kerb. Width-based restrictions won't keep out a trailie bike unless they're so narrow they also cause problems for everyone else legitimately using the path. I expect what seems to keep motorbikes off the Bristol-Bath path is its popularity and the availability of more attractive off-road options (equally illegal, such as Purdown) nearby.
Exactly the thing. How much of an obstacle was it for you - and your companions? Was it worse or better for a recumbent than a knupwrite? I can see you're pretty laden there - was that a big problem? And how did Barakta cope with it, if she was with you?
Heading into Birmingham.
(http://www.meiring.org.uk/plogger/plog-content/images/cycling-stuff/cycling-for-jo/cycle-for-josheffield-to-birmingham-232s.jpeg)
As for the problem of motorcycles on cycle paths, if these are really a problem* then why not adopt the design used on rural bridleways of the muddy, horsey type: a padlocked gate which can be swung open for maintenance access, but in its closed position has a large cutout with a lip a few inches high. Just high enough to stop a motorbike (or other wheeled vehicle) crossing it, but easy for a horse to step over. Obviously, you can't cycle over this - but it's quite easy for most people to lift most cycles over, even a tandem. It would, of course, still be a problem for many disabled people unless they had an able-bodied companion, and might require unhitching a trailer. It's far from perfect, but it's got to be a lot better for cyclists (and cheaper to install) than those spirals (or even lots of bollards and chicanes currently in use).
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3763/9902116896_0502309270.jpg) (https://www.flickr.com/photos/nikki_pugh/9902116896/)
Silly Sustrans Gate (https://www.flickr.com/photos/nikki_pugh/9902116896/) by Nikki Pugh (https://www.flickr.com/people/nikki_pugh/), on Flickr
It takes a bike around 50 m to get to very near its maximum speed. Surely to have effective speed limiting, barriers would have to be every 100 m or less. Is that what is being done?
It takes a bike around 50 m to get to very near its maximum speed. Surely to have effective speed limiting, barriers would have to be every 100 m or less. Is that what is being done?
He uses a three wheeled bike, which is low to the ground and has a large turning circle, ...What a sensible description. You might think it was written by a journalist who actually wanted to impart information in a way that everyone would understand!
Salvaging something positive from the write up:QuoteHe uses a three wheeled bike, which is low to the ground and has a large turning circle, ...What a sensible description. You might think it was written by a journalist who actually wanted to impart information in a way that everyone would understand!
My thought was that it explains in a way everyone can understand what's different about a "recumbent tadpole trike" and why he rides it. I didn't watch the video but yes, other users with other needs, problems and solutions would be a good demonstration, even – maybe especially – people on normal bikes with no disabilities but just the right side of clumsy to have to foot it round those barriers.
You can imagine how these things are planned:
- how wide's a bike?
- about 18 inches?
- yeah, but that's just the straight bit you hold onto. How wide's the rest?
- about a foot?
- OK then...
From that report, Kim: "Cardiff Council say that the barriers are intentional, and were put in place to limit the speed of two wheeled cyclists. "
I remember being gobsmacked the first time I discussed barriers with the traffic engineer responsible for cycle lanes. I pointed out that they severely degraded the cycling environment and slowed journeys massively. He replied "that's the point".
Is it really necessary to slow cyclists on a path that wide?
Oh gawd. If you ever ride from Remiremont up to the Col de Bussang stick to the road. The cycle path follows the old railway track and crosses around 50 roads in its 30k length. Each intersection is "protected" either side by overlapping half-barriers at gut height: these are made of tree-trunks about 8" in diameter, some of which have splintered ends.I rode that 2 years ago to see the TdeF. I thought it was fabulous, bearing in mind I am comparing with the UK. The barriers are set at just the right height and spaced apart just nicely so I could run a trike wheel (upright) underneath and barely slow down. Sight lines were good, so the only places I had to look hard were the few place where the track crossed real roads as opposed to local access to fields etc. On the way down I was trudling along nicely at 20mph, calling out to the few pedestrians who neatly sidestepped to make room. A real contrast to the very very few times I've used comparable tracks in the UK. The road itself is not to be recommended except at weekends because it is a major access road into Germany. If anybody goes there, there is an absolutely stunning boulangerie in Ramonchamp, and a very nice very basic campsite too - 4 Euros a night.
Presumably it's about political will from non-cyclists.A few of these decisions need to be properly challenged. E.G. Reading Broad Street, two polls in favour of making the whole road mixed use then after the event it's declared not a clear majority - no requirement for a winning margin stated before the poll. English law is founded on what is reasonable, is that? Woking town center was made entirely shared use off the back of 'Cycling Towns' funding. This has now been reversed in some places off the back of.... I don't know what, certainly nothing in the public domain. I suspect there may have been a few complaints, I would like to see the Council required to justify their action in response to those few complaints vs the number of foot and cycle journeys not resulting in a complaint. This one in Cardiff looks bloody hard to justify, were any other measures considered or was 'slow the cyclists' a knee jerK?
I expect barriers are effective, as they discourage cyclists from using the path.
How wide is my trike? We should measure that so I know.
Looks weird. I'm guessing the intent is to make it difficult to get a trail motorbike's handlebars through by leaning it. Wonder how bad it'd be with a modern mtb with wide bars. Obviously you could lift it over the fence, but...
(edit) it might even allow a single child trailer through straight on?
The idea was that the grooves would catch on the foot-pegs and the A-frame would stop the m/c from being lifted over.
The idea was that the grooves would catch on the foot-pegs and the A-frame would stop the m/c from being lifted over.
And then you've got a Silly Sustrans Gate™ with a motorbike stuck in it? Not sure that's an improvement.
...
They are all grouped with a kissing gate and a standard gate with a RADAR key for wheelchair users etc.
...
...
They are all grouped with a kissing gate and a standard gate with a RADAR key for wheelchair users etc.
...
... and how would any motorcyclist possibly get hold of a Radar key (https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=radar+key) ?
(Not having a go at you, yorkie, just at the utter stupidity of it).
Putting this one here because it's infrastructure so poor it might as well be an obstruction:
(http://www.ductilebiscuit.net/gallery_albums/obstructions/2019_09_04_15_26_30.sized.jpg)
(The stairs are welcome new access to the Birmingham & Worcester Canal at Selly Oak, which provides a useful pedestrian route to the new retail park from the High Street. There's level access to the canal via a convoluted route on the other side of the Bristol Road, which is un-fun to cross at this point.)
Two cyclists came down the stairs carrying their bikes while I was taking photos. I commented that they weren't using the splendid new wheeling ramp. One replied to the effect that it was so steep they were concerned about doing a Basil.
Doesn't the ramp interfere with using the hand rail for some (probably smaller and less mobile) people?
Putting this one here because it's infrastructure so poor it might as well be an obstruction:
(http://www.ductilebiscuit.net/gallery_albums/obstructions/2019_09_04_15_26_30.sized.jpg)
(The stairs are welcome new access to the Birmingham & Worcester Canal at Selly Oak, which provides a useful pedestrian route to the new retail park from the High Street. There's level access to the canal via a convoluted route on the other side of the Bristol Road, which is un-fun to cross at this point.)
Two cyclists came down the stairs carrying their bikes while I was taking photos. I commented that they weren't using the splendid new wheeling ramp. One replied to the effect that it was so steep they were concerned about doing a Basil.
At least she didn't reverse down the steps :thumbsup:
And what standard was that built to? Not even wide enough if she'd met anyone coming the other way.
Parental advisory warning for Sweary Barakta :thumbsup:
Posted previously on the rant thread:
These barriers are on all the access points (6 from memory) to Hob Moor in York.
They are all grouped with a kissing gate and a standard gate with a RADAR key for wheelchair users etc.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190815/f16cf5d30b7f3bbf7929f0d67b26f6a4.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190815/e31cd33e73df53bd72a16c211071c69d.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190815/5d85201d0ad2770a5eca24d4dd1eabf6.jpg)