Sky - gaming the system?

[rob]

Sutton was a work-a-day pro. His brother Gary had real class, World and Olympic champion on the track.

Gary was on telly riding the Kellogg’s city centre series in the 80s.

[giropaul]

There’s a huge amount of mud slinging, but no actual evidence. All, or very little, would be admissible in a court. It’s mainly a spectacle of old scores being dusted off and tried again, with no more evidence.
The Cooke deposition ended up as being that they had no evidence of Sutton using PEDs ,and that he had never offered Nicole any, or advised their use.
Palov’s deposition was that Sutton should have been aware of PEDs as an international professional rider. Well, who wasn’t? His claim that Sutton had used PEDs at the start of the Tour of Britain in Edinburgh became a changed story that he had not gone into McDonalds toilets with Sutton, but that there were discarded syringes in there. Freeman’s barrister then presented evidence that McDonalds had not opened any restaurants in Scotland until 2 years after.
£10,000 for PEDs for Sutton for the TdF ? The team had to borrow money for petrol, and had to sell equipment to get to the end of the Tour. In any case - why the hell spend money on a rider who had no real expectations of getting through the first week?
It’s good entertainment, but it’s a soap opera.

[Hot Flatus]

Its a sideshow to what is ostensibly the GMC accusing Freeman of being unfit to practise...for which there is plenty of evidence.

[drgannet]

What I find odd about this inquiry is the amount of time, effort and money going into trying to prove Freeman's guilt over 4 of the charges, when he has admitted to the other 18 which looks more than enough to have him struck off. Surely the GMC has better ways to spend its (?) money?

[Hot Flatus]

GMC'S QC doesn't seem to believe Freeman's story.

Freeman has admitted almost all charges

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/jan/25/dr-freeman-worked-with-sleepers-when-buying-testogel-tribunal-told?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

Nearly time for your public apology, Veloman 😉

[The Family Cyclist]

Whatever the truth be Sutton not gonna admit if the testosterone really was for that use is it!

[Hot Flatus]

GMC QC is suggesting that Freeman set up Sutton as the fall-guy   

ie. He covered his own arse and got revenge on Sutton.  If true, Freeman really is quite a piece of work*


*which means he will have fitted in perfectly at Team Sky

[drgannet]

The prosecution is hardly likely to say anything else...

[Hot Flatus]

  This is a pretty specific allegation coming towards the end of a very long tribunal, so in the sense of how the 'trial' has unfolded, then yes, but in terms of possible avenues not so much.

[sojournermike]

It seems a mixture of appropriate conclusions (T purchased to dope a rider and Freeman welcomed/learned from doping doctor Leinders) and some naivety (Sky, Sutton, Peters didn’t know).

Doping has been at the heart of cycling and other elite sport since it began. Cycling has a particular long term relationship. To be honest, this just looks like a bunch of nasty pieces of work who really did want it more than the others. Not all dopers are unpleasant or bullies...

[basset]

Well this does not look like it will be over anytime soon

[Hot Flatus]

and some naivety (Sky, Sutton, Peters didn’t know).

Yerrite 

Sutton is a notorious doper.

It's just not feasible to think that Sky employed Leinders not knowing that he had been doper-in-chief at Rabobank. It is exactly why they employed him. And it was a good move...look what happened to Team Sky's results after he worked for them...

[Davef]

GMC QC is suggesting that Freeman set up Sutton as the fall-guy   

ie. He covered his own arse and got revenge on Sutton.  If true, Freeman really is quite a piece of work*


*which means he will have fitted in perfectly at Team Sky

Seems an odd argument from GMC, suggesting Freeman ordered testogel to get Sutton in the shit as it sort of contradicts the accusation they are trying to prove that he bought to supply a rider. It does explain the glaring paper trail he chose to leave rather than purchasing the drugs off the internet using his wife’s PayPal account.

[Hot Flatus]

No, no...misunderstanding. AIUI the claim is that Freeman ordered the gel to dope a rider, but once outed claimed it was to treat Sutton's erectile dysfunction....thereby refuting that he had comitted a doping offence AND getting revenge on Sutton by implying he is a limp-dick (which, for a self-styled alpha-male Aussie hardman would really hit Sutton hard)

If anything, and if true, I think Freeman should be cleared of all charges in reward for his exemplary trolling skillz.

[Cudzoziemiec]

If anything, and if true, I think Freeman should be cleared of all charges in reward for his exemplary trolling skillz.

Well that made me burst out laughing. 

[basset]

If anything, and if true, I think Freeman should be cleared of all charges in reward for his exemplary trolling skillz.

Well that made me burst out laughing. 

  only if he tells me what was really in that Jiffy bag 

[giropaul]

and some naivety (Sky, Sutton, Peters didn’t know).

Yerrite 

Sutton is a notorious doper.

It's just not feasible to think that Sky employed Leinders not knowing that he had been doper-in-chief at Rabobank. It is exactly why they employed him. And it was a good move...look what happened to Team Sky's results after he worked for them...

Sutton has never failed a dope rest. He has never had a warning of being close to the line on a dope test. He has never avoided a dope test.
The “ evidence” at the Freeman hearing became no evidence under examination.

I don’t see how that can make him “ notorious”.

[Hot Flatus]

Yeah, ok Angus. 

[sojournermike]

and some naivety (Sky, Sutton, Peters didn’t know).

Yerrite 

Sutton is a notorious doper.

It's just not feasible to think that Sky employed Leinders not knowing that he had been doper-in-chief at Rabobank. It is exactly why they employed him. And it was a good move...look what happened to Team Sky's results after he worked for them...

Sutton has never failed a dope rest. He has never had a warning of being close to the line on a dope test. He has never avoided a dope test.
The “ evidence” at the Freeman hearing became no evidence under examination.

I don’t see how that can make him “ notorious”.

Lance never failed a dope test.  Nor did Mo (though he did avoid a few). The list of ‘athletes of concern’ that never failed a dope test is very long. Longer in fact than the list of those that did fail or were successful and weren’t ‘of concern’. Sutton does have a bit of a rep around ye olde pot belge.

As HF says, look at the impact Leinders had on their performance.

[hubner]

Who is Mo?

Lance Armstrong failed a dope test in his first Tour win but it was covered up by the UCI because $$$$$$$$$$$$. But of course he never officially tested positive.

You have to wonder who else got this "special exemption".

[sojournermike]

Mo Farah - highly suspicious

There are plenty more. In athletics we know that the previous IAAF regime took money from athletes to cover up positive tests. It took far too long for the current president to stop trying to cover up for the ‘sake of the sports reputation’ - even though there i strong evidence that he knew what was going on - and for athletics to start letting some stars fall. The last couple of years have seen many tests leading to loss of previous medals.

Is cycling cleaner than athletics. I don’t know, but we do know that testing alone is not effective in catching dopers.

[DuncanM]

We have a (part of a) verdict:
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/mar/12/dr-richard-freeman-found-guilty-of-ordering-banned-testosterone-for-unnamed-rider

[rogerzilla]

Does this taint the whole Brailsford operation?

[hubner]

Well at least now it's "official" that Sky and British Cycling doped. Whether through TUEs or  undetected doping.

Brailsford would probably claim he didn't know what individuals were up to, like Freeman didn't know about testosterone's performance enhancing effects (both would laughed out of court).

It's only a medical tribunal, so he's going to get struck off or banned from cycling, hardly punishment as he's at retirement age anyway.

[toontra]

Whether he's the fall guy or not, there was obviously something deeply flawed going on at Sky/BC if such a duplicitous cretin was in a position of trust.  His testimony (excuses) was so preposterous it's a wonder he could keep a straight face, as was his repeated practice of issuing his own doctor's notes to avoid/delay appearing.