Yet Another Cycling Forum

General Category => Audax => Topic started by: pompey phill on 26 November, 2008, 04:59:10 pm

Title: [LEL17] LEL equipment
Post by: pompey phill on 26 November, 2008, 04:59:10 pm
 hello all,
I’ve been riding Audaxes for about a year now, and very foolishly I singed up for the LEL soon after starting, (something to aim for),  I feel very confidant that I can complete this ride, what with my training I’ve started and also planned over the coming months.
However I have a few nagging questions that I hope you lovely helpful lot can help me with??
1. will a basic Garmin Etrex  hold enough waypoints/ track points (what are the differences)  to help me on the LEL ? I would like to use it as an aid to the route sheet and maps.
2.  What would be the best lighting solution? I’m very keen on the Dynohub approach, as I would like to incorporate it on to me daily commute bike as well, but as I ride on unlit country lanes I need a good bright light.

3. Will a big old Carradice saddle bag like the super C and a handlebar bag be adequate? I currently use the Barley and I love that.
 
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Hummers on 26 November, 2008, 06:03:10 pm
Phil,

Have you done much in the way of long distance rides already?

I'm sure someone will jump in with an opinion on answer to all of your questions but a lot of the questions you ask will only be answered if you try things out for yourself - especially through longer rides and riding through the night.

If it helps:

1. I don't use a GPS so can't help there.
2. Some people use dynohub lighting and some battery powered lighting for riding through the night.  As you long as you use a technology that allows you to see well enough to keep up a reasonable pace, the decison is down to personal preferrence and both do the same job.
3. I have seen people use rack and handlebar bags and I have seen people with nowt but a Barley. It depends on how much kit you normally carry or feel you need for a 1400k ride with one free bag drop at Dalkeith.

If you are based in Pompey, I go out on a ride every Wednesday night which would be an ideal opportunity for you to try out different drinking lighting solutions.

PM me for details.

H
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: daveb on 26 November, 2008, 06:08:29 pm
On the subject of GPS, have a look at the GPS board in The Knowledge and at the AudaxUK GPS pages.

The short answer is yes, you should be able to manage with an Etrex. Whether you use tracks or routes is probably down to personal preference.

Hummers seems to have answered the other questions.

Dave

PS You could have a look at the dynamo lights thread in the knowledge for some idea about dynamo lighting. Also, look for the thread about the IQ Cyo, which seems to be the best price/performance compromise at the moment.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: frere yacker on 26 November, 2008, 06:14:23 pm
hello all,
I’ve been riding Audaxes for about a year now, and very foolishly I singed up for the LEL soon after starting, (something to aim for),  I feel very confidant that I can complete this ride, what with my training I’ve started and also planned over the coming months.
However I have a few nagging questions that I hope you lovely helpful lot can help me with??
1. will a basic Garmin Etrex  hold enough waypoints/ track points (what are the differences)  to help me on the LEL ? I would like to use it as an aid to the route sheet and maps.
2.  What would be the best lighting solution? I’m very keen on the Dynohub approach, as I would like to incorporate it on to me daily commute bike as well, but as I ride on unlit country lanes I need a good bright light.

3. Will a big old Carradice saddle bag like the super C and a handlebar bag be adequate? I currently use the Barley and I love that.
 

1. Yes, likely
2. Hornets nest.  I use dynohub, others use battery setups (particularly lithium)
3. Yes.  LEL has a bag drop facility
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: MSeries on 27 November, 2008, 08:53:34 pm

3. Will a big old Carradice saddle bag like the super C and a handlebar bag be adequate? I currently use the Barley and I love that.
 
Depends on how much stuff you want carry and how you plan your bag drops. It would be enough for me. In 2005 I used a small rack pack only. USe the rides before hand to test various pieces of equipment to decide what you will and will not need to carry. Travel light.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Drone on 02 December, 2008, 01:01:21 pm
Vorsprung's post gives some top tips to which I would add that even though you will sleep less than normal on a long ride such as LEL try to sleep in the middle of your usual sleep period.  eg if you normally sleep 11pm till 5am then 12.30 till 3.30 will just feel like a short night's sleep.

I find that my body is happy to function well enough for cycling on three hours per night but you will only find that out by riding a SR series yourself. 


Barley should be enough with the bag drop.

Quality lighting set ups are getting cheaper all the time but I would not recommend something specially for LEL.  If you have a light set up that works for you on a reasonably long dark commute then it will probably be OK for LEL (as long as the power source isn't a car battery!) 
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: chris on 06 December, 2008, 10:12:53 am
I thinking about a DIY bag drop, taking an old pannier to one of the earlier controls possibly Lincoln with a change of kit, some energy drinks, snacks etc. and leaving it there to pick up on the way back. The bag drop included in the entry will be left further up the road.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: radelwombat on 09 December, 2008, 09:51:51 pm
Hi

I need new shoes for the coming season and LEL could somebody recommend me a pair?
I hava a comfortable pair of racing shoes with a carbon sole but they're no use for walking in and I have a horrible pair of runner-like MTB shoes that my feet get really hot in and always cause ankle problems on long hauls. Is there something in between?...touring shoes?

Any feedback welcome

Radelwombat
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: border-rider on 09 December, 2008, 09:55:54 pm
The big hit of PBP was SPD sandals

Stylistically foul, but for 4-5 days of wet roads they can't be beaten.  Some people with real shoes & socks suffered quite horrible foot rot.  :sick:

Otherwise a decent pair of SPD shoes.  I've used Diadoras but there's a world of choice depending on your budget and foot shape
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: vorsprung on 10 December, 2008, 10:14:55 am
Hi

I need new shoes for the coming season and LEL could somebody recommend me a pair?


My favourite shoes for the summer are specialized comp MTB

They are very rigid, they have recessed cleats so you can walk on them if you so desire and they have mesh panels for cooling

Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: The Mechanic on 10 December, 2008, 10:28:48 am
+1 for the Spesh MTB shoes.  I think mine are the Sport ones, approx 60 quid.  Very comforable.  I use them with either M520 spds or A520 touring pedals.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Charlotte on 10 December, 2008, 10:40:28 am
The big hit of PBP was SPD sandals

Stylistically foul, but for 4-5 days of wet roads they can't be beaten.  Some people with real shoes & socks suffered quite horrible foot rot.  :sick:

+1 on the sandals.  If you've never tried them, I highly recommend them.  I did PBP and TRAT in sandals, as well as a lengthy tour this summer and have never suffered a moment's foot trouble with them.  Mind you - if you wear 'em all summer, this (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b187/vicechair/TRAT%2008/P5310831.jpg) happens  :)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Mr Larrington on 10 December, 2008, 10:55:31 am
<mode Dissent=On>
When suffering from what was later determined to be Persil-induced foot-BLEAN, I effected the purchase of a pair of SPanDals and accompanying pedals.  To one who has been using Looks for fifteen years the itty-bitty clippy bit was an absolute sod to clip into and the sandal itself caused my right foot to go numb five km into a 300.  The moral here is to never buy shoes on teh Intarwebs.

Thing 1 is now the owner of said kit and has not yet killed me, so I imagine him to be happy.  With it.
<off>
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: border-rider on 10 December, 2008, 11:01:34 am
  Mind you - if you wear 'em all summer, this (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b187/vicechair/TRAT%2008/P5310831.jpg) happens  :)

 :o

The horror, the horror !

I hope that never happens to my toenails.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Really Ancien on 10 December, 2008, 11:11:14 am
I have daft feet with very high arches which collapse after extended exercise, causing serious pain. I find that having an orthotic insert under the arches helps, I got the biggest ones I could from Scholls and transfer them between shoes. Rigid soles are useless unless the foot has contact with the insole and is capable of resisting twisting moment via the pedal, otherwise strain is placed on the tendons of the ankle joint. All this adds up to size 50 Sidis in the wide 'mega' fitting, so that I can experiment with insoles, and Look cleats to keep the feet in position.

Damon.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Ivo on 10 December, 2008, 07:33:09 pm
I need new shoes for the coming season and LEL could somebody recommend me a pair?
I hava a comfortable pair of racing shoes with a carbon sole but they're no use for walking in and I have a horrible pair of runner-like MTB shoes that my feet get really hot in and always cause ankle problems on long hauls. Is there something in between?...touring shoes?

I'm completely satisfied by the own brand Decathlon MTB shoes. A decent thick and stiff sole with enough space to use inserts if needed. And to top it off, a very nice price.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: radelwombat on 11 December, 2008, 10:44:03 am
thanks for the feedback!
maybe the sandles are the way to go with wooly socks for the hills  ;D
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: border-rider on 13 December, 2008, 05:20:34 pm
At Mel's request the LEL equipment & LEL preparation threads have now been split, so she can try to address the issues separately.

If I've messed up and left a post in the wrong thread (it's not a directly straightforward split) let me know.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 27 December, 2008, 11:47:24 am
1. will a basic Garmin Etrex  hold enough waypoints/ track points (what are the differences)  to help me on the LEL ? I would like to use it as an aid to the route sheet and maps.

As long as it is software version 3.xx then it will be ok (check by going to Setup -> System). The version 2.xx software only allows one route of 50 points.

I've got a basic Garmin Etrex and I've used it for all rides including an SR series with no problems. I'm also planning on using it for LEL. With a pre-planned route there just isn't any need for mapping or auto-routing. I'll just carry a map and routesheet as a backup.

I use routepoints placed one per routesheet instruction. I don't bother with tracks made up of trackpoints, other people do.

The basic Etrex can take up to 20 routes with a total of about 1000 points with no route containing more than about 120 points. I was going to split the route into 5 or 6 chunks at controls to keep within these limits.

[EDIT] For example, here's the route I used for London (we started by Clapham Common) to Thorne. 167 points (150 from Cheshunt). The further North you go the fewer points you'll need as roads get more sparse. I had to split this into two to get it into the GPS.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: radelwombat on 02 January, 2009, 05:59:04 pm
I use routepoints placed one per routesheet instruction. I don't bother with tracks made up of trackpoints, other people do.

How do you generate the Waypoints?
I have a blue Garmin Legend which has a limted map and track capacity but works fine. I've been using the opens street maps on my unit but I notice the route fo LEL isn't completely in OSM yet. Is there anybody active here? I haven't entered streets yet in OSM but I'm going to give it a go soon with some roads I gathered over christmas. The OSM maps are much nicer on the my GPS than the original Mapsource maps.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: innermoss11 on 28 January, 2009, 11:16:58 pm
hello all,

I am planning to do the ride on a "singlespeed". Granted that gear choice is entirely driven by personal choice and ability, I would be very interested to know if anyone else is aiming to ride singlespeed as well and what their gear choice is going to be.

My current gearing is 48x19 but I may drop down to 48x22.  I am using a white industry double cog freewheel - 17/19 and I am probably going to put a 22 (white industry freewheel single cog) on the other side of the hub for comfort's sake.  My tyre choice should be 700x25.  The three cogs should give me the following range in gear inches (rounded down) - 57/66/74.

I have my reasons for doing it this way and it would be a delight to find others who are thinking along the same lines.

cheers
inner
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 28 January, 2009, 11:35:50 pm
Planning to do it on fixed. Never done LEL before and I've only got one SR (albeit fixed) under my belt.

46x18 for the Northern section (67" on 25mm tyres). May drop down to a 17T cog (I have a Miche Sprocket Carrier) for the flatlands to the south for 71". (I've done the bottom 300km from Cheshunt to Thorne already and it is trivially easy on one gear.)

Have done various hilly Audaxes on fixed so far (71" did me fine on the Dean - 3900m climbing in 300km) and the 67" gear will be getting an outing on the Elenith (4700m climbing in 300km) and Bryan Chapman Memorial (8300m climbing in 600km) this year. I reserve the right to change my mind after doing either of these rides.

My hilly training route is close to 1000m climbing in 50km and I can happily do this on 67" and maintain 20kph average although I do have to walk a couple of bits that go over 15%. I plan on doing this route at least 20 times on fixed before LEL.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: nuttycyclist on 29 January, 2009, 12:47:13 am
  Mind you - if you wear 'em all summer, this (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b187/vicechair/TRAT%2008/P5310831.jpg) happens  :)

 :o

The horror, the horror !

I hope that never happens to my toenails.


It's happened to fatbloke  ;D ;D ;D (http://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=13933.msg250159#msg250159)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Fixedwheelnut on 29 January, 2009, 01:43:21 am
Here you go all in the one Carradice 23 l saddlebag
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3404/3235611082_23d6787e43.jpg) (http://flickr.com/photos/fixedwheelnut/3235611082/)

If you click on the photo it goes to the flickr page that has notes describing the contents.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: vorsprung on 29 January, 2009, 10:28:17 am
I am planning to do the ride on a "singlespeed". Granted that gear choice is entirely driven by personal choice and ability, I would be very interested to know if anyone else is aiming to ride singlespeed as well and what their gear choice is going to be.

My current gearing is 48x19 but I may drop down to 48x22.  I am using a white industry double cog freewheel - 17/19 and I am probably going to put a 22 (white industry freewheel single cog) on the other side of the hub for comfort's sake.  My tyre choice should be 700x25.  The three cogs should give me the following range in gear inches (rounded down) - 57/66/74.

I ride single speed for commuting but I've never done over 100 miles on it.  It has a 66" gear.

The "interesting" thing about LEL is that the Northern bit has a lot of ascent but there is a large flat bit cambridge/ lincoln/ york.   

I guess if you start off in 66" or 57" for the nasty steep gravelly crappy lanes in the first bit, then switch to 74" for the flat bit, then back to 66 or 57 at the end of that

I'll be riding a bike with campag 10 speed 30" to 100" gears
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: border-rider on 29 January, 2009, 11:04:39 am
It depends on the wind, to some extent

The first 300 is seriously fast, and if the wind isn't a problem I'd be inclined to gear up if anything.  The Northern 800 loop is lumpy, but the only hill you'd struggle on is the cobbled one through Alston on the way back. 

I rode it in 2001 on 50x20, and in 2005 on 44x17.  I didn't feel the need to change that at all, and if I were riding this year I'd stay with 44x17.  I'd probably have an 18T in reserve in case of headwinds though.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 29 January, 2009, 11:20:17 am
Those first lumps out of Cheshunt really aren't that much, especially given the hours of flatland riding all the way to Coxwold that follow. The biggest single climb (to Brickenden) is well under 100m of height gain and you'd probably lose more time faffing around changing gears after the final real lump (between Rushden and Wallington at 40km) than you would just riding the bigger gear for that first section anyway, especially as Gamlingay (63km) is just a stamp and go control on the way out and no-one will be stopping for long.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: red marley on 29 January, 2009, 11:57:30 am
I rode fixed 76" on PBP and took along a sprocket giving me 67" should have needed it. In the end though I never changed it. The hassle of changing it outweighed any benefits I might have got. I am planning to stick with either 72" or 76" for LEL (not sure which yet). I think gearing up to allow you to stick with a group more easily on the flat bits is probably more important than gearing down to avoid grinding up the steeper hills.

I agree that headwind might be an issue, but when I did the windy Border Raid 600 last year, which covers some of the LEL route, I'm not sure a few gear inches would have made much difference in the face of such an extreme headwind.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: vorsprung on 29 January, 2009, 12:09:24 pm
Those first lumps out of Cheshunt really aren't that much, especially given the hours of flatland riding all the way to Coxwold that follow. The biggest single climb (to Brickenden) is well under 100m of height gain and you'd probably lose more time faffing around changing gears after the final real lump (between Rushden and Wallington at 40km) than you would just riding the bigger gear for that first section anyway,
The obvious comment is...I have a little lever marked "Centaur" which reducing faffing under these circumstances
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Tiger on 29 January, 2009, 12:12:45 pm
Here you go all in the one Carradice 23 l saddlebag
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3404/3235611082_23d6787e43.jpg) (http://flickr.com/photos/fixedwheelnut/3235611082/)

If you click on the photo it goes to the flickr page that has notes describing the contents.

Personally I think prayer mats are a bit of a luxury and might be left behind.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 29 January, 2009, 12:14:36 pm
Those first lumps out of Cheshunt really aren't that much, especially given the hours of flatland riding all the way to Coxwold that follow. The biggest single climb (to Brickenden) is well under 100m of height gain and you'd probably lose more time faffing around changing gears after the final real lump (between Rushden and Wallington at 40km) than you would just riding the bigger gear for that first section anyway,
The obvious comment is...I have a little lever marked "Centaur" which reducing faffing under these circumstances

Well yes, but that's against the spirit of fixed/single-speed riding innit.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: frankly frankie on 29 January, 2009, 01:10:05 pm
I rode it ... in 2005 on 44x17.  I didn't feel the need to change that at all

(http://www.aukweb.net/pix/tqz2y4ge_mon_aug_29_18_55_27_2005.jpg)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 29 January, 2009, 02:10:19 pm
I plan on taking on the bike (probably in a rackpack):-

Leg warmers, rain jacket, arm warmers will all go in the sidepockets of the rackpack when not in use.

Probably about 6kg of stuff at most, it's not much more than I carry on longer Audaxes anyway.

In the Dalkeith bagdrop I'll have:-

In the other bag drop (probably Thorne) I'll have:-

Scenario 1 (minimum distance per day) for an 8am start:-

End day 1 at Thorne. Shower and change clothes there. Sleep on airbed in sleeping bag liner. Leave dirty stuff in dropbag. Put on clean set of clothes and stuff another clean set in the bag (as I'm unlikely to make it to Dalkeith on day 2). Replenish batteries/tubes supplies from dropbag.
End day 2 at Eskdalemuir. Shower (if possible) and change clothes. Sleep wherever in sleeping bag liner. Replenish supplies.
End day 3 at Alston/Langdon Beck/Middleton Tyas (depends on distance). Shower if possible. Sleep wherever. Change into clean clothes that were collected from Dalkeith.
End day 4 at Lincoln (or Thurlby). Shower if possible. Change into clean clothes (including LEL top) collected on the way from Thorne bagdrop (and drop off dirty stuff). Sleep on airbed collected from Thorne (I don't mind carrying it for this last leg) but it is about 1kg.
Day 5 is a gentle pootle from Lincoln/Thurlby back down to Cheshunt.

The more hopefuly scenario is to get to Coxwold on day 1 having collected stuff at Thorne. Then make Dalkeith at the end of day 2. From there I've got 3 days to do the journey back and can take it easy (or romp along depending on the weather and how I feel).

More likely is to just sleep wherever I feel the need to. Shower if showers are available and I'm within time and feel like a shower. Swap dirty stuff for clean stuff at dropbag locations. Replenish supplies if necessary. Don't worry if I end up doing a second day in the same jersey/shorts/etc, it's not going to kill me.

Not that I've thought about it or anything...
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: MSeries on 29 January, 2009, 02:17:16 pm
Greenbank, not really wishing to rain on your parade but if the drop bags are the same size as the 2005 ones, you'll not get all that stuff into them. In 2005 one was not permitted to use ones own bag for the bag drops.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 29 January, 2009, 02:22:00 pm
Greenbank, not really wishing to rain on your parade but if the drop bags are the same size as the 2005 ones, you'll not get all that stuff into them. In 2005 one was not permitted to use ones own bag for the bag drops.

From the FAQ:

"
Yes. there will be two bag drops, one at Dalkeith (Edinburgh) and one at a control yet to be decided. You will be provided with an official LEL bag for your items and only these bags will be accepted on the bag drop. These bags will be large enough to hold sleeping mats and blankets, a change of clothing and a towel. A spare light and batteries is also a good idea.
"

The inflatable bed thingies I have are much much smaller than one of those rolled up sleeping mats. I'd have no problem getting everything I need into something smaller than a Carradice Barley, let alone the amount of space taken up by a sleeping mat.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: MSeries on 29 January, 2009, 02:23:25 pm
Good. Far too early for me to worry about that sort of thing just yet.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 29 January, 2009, 02:42:25 pm
I'm only thinking about it because my friend is bugging me with these kinds of questions (about LEL and other Audaxes this year) so I may aswell have an idea of what I'm doing.

I thought about ditching the rack and just using a saddlebag but the B&M D'Toplight rear light attached to the rack is excellent (and includes a large area of reflector) that I may aswell use it. The smallish size of the rackpack will also help me not bringing the kitchen sink with me.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 29 January, 2009, 02:46:52 pm
I haven't though about bedding at all. Every time I stopped on PBP there was at least a blanket and something soft to lie on. From what I've seen, the LEL orgs have been a bit coy on what we can expect.

Either this is to hold back bad news, or hedge their bets!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 29 January, 2009, 03:53:34 pm
Reminds me, I need a trial pack of the rackpack to see how much space it all takes up.

As a hedge bet I'd be tempted to book a travelodge room for Middleton Tyas for the night of Tuesday 28th. They're still only £29 for a family room. Hmmm.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 29 January, 2009, 05:21:37 pm
i think the Middleton Tyas room is a good investment (especially split 2 or 3 ways). I assume it is v close to the route. Whatever your shedule, you can still crash there for a couple of hours and get a decent shower.

(I have family just over the hill from MT and on the route nr York, so a Travelodge would be a waste ... :) )
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 29 January, 2009, 05:28:01 pm
i think the Middleton Tyas room is a good investment (especially split 2 or 3 ways). I assume it is v close to the route. Whatever your shedule, you can still crash there for a couple of hours and get a decent shower.

One of the LEL controls is at the village school in Middleton Tyas, the Travelodge is less than a mile down the road by the A1/A66 junction. There's no Little Chef but there is a 24 hour petrol station.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: toontra on 29 January, 2009, 05:55:36 pm
Thanks for the tip on the Middleton Tyas Travelodge.  I'd (wrongly) assumed that the LEL route wouldn't be going near any Travelodges, being mainly rural.  Anyway, I've booked a room for Tuesday night and am happy to share if there is a convergence of YACF'ers.

I've also got a room booked for Edinburgh Musselburgh on the Monday night, which is only 4 miles from Dalkeith.  One way or another I'll get a long bath and a bit of comfort!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mike on 29 January, 2009, 06:01:13 pm
18T and 16T Miche sprockets to give me 67" for the hills or 74" for a tailwind on the flatlands. Flip/flop hub will have 19T sprocket bailout gear (63") and the initial 17T sprocket on the Miche carrier for the first 400km on 71"[/li][/list]

wouldnt it be easier just to ride a geared bike??  ;)




Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 29 January, 2009, 06:03:16 pm
Ideally I won't need to change at all from the default 71". The rest are just contingency (and the fact that the Miche carrier makes it easy to swap.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LEL on 29 January, 2009, 07:18:07 pm
Dear God Greenbank - just exactly how many visits from the p******e fairy are you expecting?

For info the moto crew and each control will have repair kits though moto crew will not have pumps.

As for the space blanket - please note that you may carry one but they are banned from use in controls.   :hand:

Yes we have been coy so far in saying what we have done - remember, until you have your route sheets sent to you in May along with the control detials and info, nothing is set in stone.  This is why we are not giving out too much info - it can (and probably will) change

And all controls that have showers will have shower gel provided. O:-)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 29 January, 2009, 08:13:20 pm
As for the space blanket - please note that you may carry one but they are banned from use in controls.   :hand:
:thumbsup:

(it might also be worth advising riders to not dump them at the roadside late in the ride)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 30 January, 2009, 10:42:57 am
Dear God Greenbank - just exactly how many visits from the p******e fairy are you expecting?

None. Be prepared and self-sufficiency and all that. I got through 2 inner tubes in one ride last year without getting a single p*nct*r* (the person I was riding with got 4 and only had 2 spare tubes). I'll only carry 2 on me at any time and use the bag drop stores to replenish stocks if I have used them or given them away.

As for the space blanket - please note that you may carry one but they are banned from use in controls.   :hand:

Good. Mine is for emergency use out on the road, and maybe not for me (if you see what I mean). I wasn't planning on using it inside the controls, not only because of the irritating rustling, but they're a pain to fold up again nice and small. And for only 50g of weight it's a useful thing to carry just in case.

If you're thinking about stuff to ban from inside controls I'd add "Loud snoring" and "Droning on about rides from years ago whilst people are trying to sleep."

And all controls that have showers will have shower gel provided. O:-)

Good.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: vorsprung on 30 January, 2009, 01:11:33 pm
Good. Far too early for me to worry about that sort of thing just yet.

Me too.  About as far as I've got is thinking that my current enormous bag is a bit too big and by getting a smaller one I could save a significant amount of weight.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: vorsprung on 30 January, 2009, 01:18:09 pm

If you're thinking about stuff to ban from inside controls I'd add "Loud snoring" and "Droning on about rides from years ago whilst people are trying to sleep."


Last time I asked Mal Volio what items he recommended taking aside from tools/ spares / clothes /food

The two things I remember were immodium and ear plugs

I didn't take either on LEL.  This was a mistake, the first sleep stop was noisey along with it's other faults.
I didn't get the trots however so that was ok
On PBP I took the earplugs and used them to good effect.
I didn't get the trots on PBP either
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 30 January, 2009, 01:24:15 pm
I've got stocks of Immodium and Diarolyte left over from my trip to South America (where I did get the trots). Ear plugs are also on my list. I'll expand what I've got in my first aid kit...
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: border-rider on 30 January, 2009, 01:26:41 pm

I didn't get the trots however so that was ok

I did. Good job I took my own advice :)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 30 January, 2009, 01:42:38 pm
It'll also be a novelty riding without a SON wheel as I'm going for maximum daylight riding and using two1 battery powered B&M Ixon IQ lights mounted on a space bracket hanging down from the tri-bars (Like the Solidlights are setup here (http://www.greenbank.org/bikes/tempo/tempo6.jpg)). Tri-bars, GPS and routesheet holder will be like that too although I've got to get the crosstop levers moved outwards slightly as I can't fit the tri-bars as it stands, easily done when I next get the bar tape done.

Somewhere I've got my nice large flanged System-X hub front wheel that came with the Tempo (http://www.greenbank.org/bikes/tempo.jpg). I think it's only ever done about 100km.

1. One as a backup and also for long/fast descents.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: scottlington on 30 January, 2009, 05:53:31 pm
...I'm going for maximum daylight riding and using two1 battery powered B&M Ixon IQ lights mounted on a space bracket...

Amen to that! Still the best battery powered lights for the price I reckon. You can get them for about £70 so great value. I will certainly be purchasing another prior to BCM and giving the dual setup a runout.

I've also picked a couple of those Frog jobbies for front and rear. The only issue I have re the Ixon is lack of a flashing mode. Even at low power it's over the top for city / lit road usage and, given the need to preserve battery life, I'm gonna simply switch it off on lit roads and use the Frog which costs about 6p.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LEL on 30 January, 2009, 06:06:28 pm

If you're thinking about stuff to ban from inside controls I'd add "Loud snoring" and "Droning on about rides from years ago whilst people are trying to sleep."


Last time I asked Mal Volio what items he recommended taking aside from tools/ spares / clothes /food

The two things I remember were immodium and ear plugs

I didn't take either on LEL.  This was a mistake, the first sleep stop was noisey along with it's other faults.
I didn't get the trots however so that was ok
On PBP I took the earplugs and used them to good effect.
I didn't get the trots on PBP either

All riders will get a pair of ear plugs.  ;D 

We know the controls are noisy.  Not much we can do about this.  its all part of the challenge.....

And as for the controls 'other faults',  at least you will now be prepared for them.....
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: red marley on 30 January, 2009, 06:31:23 pm
All riders will get a pair of ear plugs.  ;D 

And don't forget, when you leave the control, to hand back your used earplugs so the next riders can use them  :sick:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: rogerzilla on 30 January, 2009, 06:34:13 pm
Last time I asked Mal Volio what items he recommended taking aside from tools/ spares / clothes /food

The two things I remember were immodium and ear plugs

Why do you need Immodium when you already have earplugs?  Think multi-purpose, people, and travel light.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 30 January, 2009, 06:37:14 pm
Last time I asked Mal Volio what items he recommended taking aside from tools/ spares / clothes /food

The two things I remember were immodium and ear plugs

Why do you need Immodium when you already have earplugs?

Because earplugs are really hard to swallow.

</Airplane gag>
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: toontra on 30 January, 2009, 07:29:17 pm
It'll also be a novelty riding without a SON wheel ....

What's the reason for not using the Son?  I was under the impression that the additional drag was minimal (especially when off), and would have thought LEL was the perfect ride for a hub dynamo light.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 30 January, 2009, 08:01:38 pm
It'll also be a novelty riding without a SON wheel ....

What's the reason for not using the Son?  I was under the impression that the additional drag was minimal (especially when off), and would have thought LEL was the perfect ride for a hub dynamo light.

Because I plan on doing a minimal amount of night riding. I can't see much point dragging a SON wheel around for just a few hours where it may be useful. Much easier to carry 4 AA batteries giving you 4 hours of the same quality light.

Daylight in late July will be from about 5.15am to 9pm. That's almost 16 hours of daylight. Enough to do 300km in which is all you need to do a day for LEL (it sounds so easy put like this but it does ignore the fact that the 3rd 300 is pretty hilly).

I'll still be using my SON for all of the rides leading up to LEL, it does make much more sense on 400s or 600s where you can spend an entire night on the road.

And there will also be the psychological boost that I won't have any extra drag (however minimal).
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: simonp on 09 February, 2009, 01:29:53 pm
On PBP I did basically 4 nights on the road.  I'd like to do better than that on LEL, but I think I'll stick with the SON.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LEL on 09 February, 2009, 08:20:24 pm
Hi, I'm just giving some consideration to LEL with respect to kit etc.Does
> anybody have any idea as to what will be inspected /checked at the
> registration on the  Sat. afternoon.Without stating the obvious basic
> requirements will it be a question of spare bulbs,batteries tool-kit ? Will
> there  be any requirement to wear a reflective tabard after reading about
> the  ankle band?.At least if we have a few months notice of any special
> needs that we would not usally take on a long ride we can prepare.Are there
> any lighting minimum requirements? If nothing it will give us something to
> discuss until the weather improves.

This question was asked on the Audax Yahoo group.

This is my reply - I have also put it under equipment.

There is no bike inspection for LEL - we have the very simple statement that
the bike should be roadworthy and fit for purpose.  Mudguards are not
compulsory though are highly recommended - a cold dry rider is less likely to
quit than a cold wet one.

As for reflective  gear,  we are stating that  all riders must wear something
reflective at night.  LEL will be issuing riders with reflective ankle straps
as a minimum.  Anyone who  is found not wearing these during the hours of
sunset adn sunrise runs the risk of having their brevet card removed and no
longer being a part of the event.

Lighting - sensible lighting which  will last  through the night with
sufficient spares for he  event is recommended.  The AUk website  is the best
source of info for  AUK lighting, including battery power.  All riders must
comply with UK  law regarding lighting.  remember - there are sheep on a unlit
roads in only quarter moonlight.  And it could be cloudy.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: RichForrest on 10 February, 2009, 01:32:37 am
LEL will be issuing riders with reflective ankle straps
as a minimum.  Anyone who  is found not wearing these during the hours of
sunset adn sunrise runs the risk of having their brevet card removed and no longer being a part of the event.

I'll wear these, but on the recumbent they will only be seen from the side, so will be of bugger all use for cars coming from the front or behind ;D

Rich.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Andrij on 10 February, 2009, 07:25:29 am
LEL will be issuing riders with reflective ankle straps
as a minimum.  Anyone who  is found not wearing these during the hours of
sunset adn sunrise runs the risk of having their brevet card removed and no longer being a part of the event.

I'll wear these, but on the recumbent they will only be seen from the side, so will be of bugger all use for cars coming from the front or behind ;D

Rich.

Don't forget low flying aircraft.  ;)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: frankly frankie on 10 February, 2009, 09:53:15 am
The new chic
(http://images.french-property.com/1/3/1/3/cms1313.jpg)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LEL on 10 February, 2009, 11:17:40 am
LEL will be issuing riders with reflective ankle straps
as a minimum.  Anyone who  is found not wearing these during the hours of
sunset adn sunrise runs the risk of having their brevet card removed and no longer being a part of the event.

I'll wear these, but on the recumbent they will only be seen from the side, so will be of bugger all use for cars coming from the front or behind ;D

Rich.

Ah, I had quite forgotten the recumbents were different -  we have not yet decided what will happen to you - if you have any (reasonable) suggestions, these would be welcome.

Mel
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Mr Larrington on 10 February, 2009, 11:22:44 am
LEL will be issuing riders with reflective ankle straps
as a minimum.  Anyone who  is found not wearing these during the hours of
sunset adn sunrise runs the risk of having their brevet card removed and no longer being a part of the event.

I'll wear these, but on the recumbent they will only be seen from the side, so will be of bugger all use for cars coming from the front or behind ;D

Rich.

Ah, I had quite forgotten teh recumbents were different -  we have not yet decided what wll happen to you - if you have any s(reasonable) suggestions, these would be welcome.

ACP took no account of this chiz in spite of my tailbox being plastered with reflective Stuffs :(  Though the Sam Brown was actually quite useful as I could tuck the pouch containing route sheet & brevet card under it instead of having it flapping in the breeze.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: frankly frankie on 10 February, 2009, 01:09:26 pm
Ah, I had quite forgotten the recumbents were different

How could you - the words "vocal" and "minority" spring all too readily to mind  :demon:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: vorsprung on 10 February, 2009, 04:20:51 pm
Ah, I had quite forgotten the recumbents were different

How could you - the words "vocal" and "minority" spring all too readily to mind  :demon:

1) never look down
2) put on a bit of pace uphill
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Fixedwheelnut on 10 February, 2009, 10:06:28 pm
 Lord Larrington I can get you some blank number plate reflective sheets if you want that can be attatched to the back of the bike, yellow or white.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LEL on 11 February, 2009, 03:11:39 pm
Ah, I had quite forgotten the recumbents were different

How could you - the words "vocal" and "minority" spring all too readily to mind  :demon:

Good point.... ;D

However, if Fixed Wheel Nut (or other forum HPV owners) can suggest a practical alternative and possible supply for around 15 HPV machines, so much the better.

Ankle straps were chosen as they are highly visible, do not require removal like a Sam Browne when donning additional layers and have the least irritation/impact on rider factor.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Fixedwheelnut on 11 February, 2009, 07:41:20 pm
 How about a piece of number plate, reflective as well.
(http://img3014.photobox.co.uk/1458334897fed04d0aa4b5523e523a4343089e53bc4dd91e7cda8250ac0e004a4c628d9e.jpg)

(http://img3014.photobox.co.uk/328191220c5c1ea85218dfbbf2f5cce14875a8816f9c5c98953f6a3065ae6387eab3cf0a.jpg)

 That bike is fixed now but the mudguard still resides on another bike  :)

 that is the sort of thing it looks like, I can quite easily cut smaller strips off old number plates we change at work, if the recumbent guys let me know what size and where they can fit bits let me know and I will see what I can do.
cheers
 Steve
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: RichForrest on 12 February, 2009, 01:22:24 am
I've not really got any suggestions of what to do with reflectives on the bike.
Mine hasn't really got anything to stick stuff on at the back.
Mudguard can have stuff stuck on but I suppose the ankle straps are used because they move and catch your eye.
When viewed from behind there are no moving parts to be seen, you can only see the bag on the seat and my head and shoulders (not the shampoo I don't need that  ;))
Arms are held forwards so the straps would not be much use there either.

Rich.

Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mikewigley on 12 February, 2009, 09:08:30 am

Ankle straps were chosen as they are highly visible, do not require removal like a Sam Browne when donning additional layers and have the least irritation/impact on rider factor.


They are a good idea.  The Highway Code requires that "At night your cycle must have ... amber pedal reflectors if manufactured after 1/10/85", which is just about impossible to comply with, but ankle reflectors at least meet the spirit of this rule
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on 12 February, 2009, 09:13:27 am

Ankle straps were chosen as they are highly visible, do not require removal like a Sam Browne when donning additional layers and have the least irritation/impact on rider factor.


They are compulsory for RUSA events and recommended for Audax Oz events.  I'd prefer them to our compulsory reflective vests.  Audax Oz justifies vests for recumbenters by asking "But what about when they are off the bike?"
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Mr Larrington on 12 February, 2009, 11:10:13 am
Reflective ankle doofers on recumbents are this: bloody annoying ???
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: teethgrinder on 13 February, 2009, 07:39:43 am
Reflective ankle straps have a habbit of getting lost and sometimes they fall to bits, so it's worth carrying extra reflective gubbins, or riding fast in the day and sleeping at night.
The only thing I can think of for recumbents is a reflective flag. Recumbents are supposed to be aerodynamic, which by default means trying to reduce frontal surface area, therefore, not much to put reflective stuff on.
I'm not sure what good ankle relectores would do on a fully faired Quest recumbent. :D
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Mr Larrington on 13 February, 2009, 09:35:09 am
They tried to make us use flags on PBP, but after some correspondence 'twixt one of the Aussie Darksiders and ACP, they were made "advisory".  Which is a Good Thing, as there's nowhere on the Speedmachine to fit one.

All the silver bits on the tailbox:

(http://www.legslarry.org.uk/BikeStull/Tailbox.jpg)

are reflective, and jolly effective.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LEL on 13 February, 2009, 09:42:41 am
Would it be worth for HPV riders , instead of giving them the refelctive ankle straps, saying they must provide something refelctive  which can be seen fromt he rear on their machine?

It seems from this thread that most of you have something anyway  and being recumbent riders and aware of the dangers of motorists being unable to see  a large (often faired) machine (vehicle) immediately in front of them, have taken adequate steps.

Although bike checks are not part of registration perhaps I should make a  compulsory check of HPV machines to ensure riders comply with a  regulation that says something along the lines of ' HPV's must be visible in teh dark  from behind.'?  This is a slightly difficult one as I don't want to 
a   have loads of rules and regs
b   have unwrokable rules and regs
c   have regs that  create too much discrimination.

Suggestions?
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Chris N on 13 February, 2009, 12:30:53 pm
Will there be any facilities for washing kit at any of the controls (other than a sink/shower), such as driers?  I can't shell out for more than two pairs of shorts (cheapest I've seen my preferred Assos Mille F1s is £75/pair - and that's the old model) but will need 5 pairs for the whole ride so I'm going to have to get them clean somehow.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 13 February, 2009, 02:49:47 pm
Can't you rolll your shorts in a towel, then peg them to something on your bike's exterior? 10 hours' daytime cycling will dry almost anything... (Most things weill dry in a couple of hours actually.)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: MSeries on 13 February, 2009, 02:54:54 pm
Will there be any facilities for washing kit at any of the controls (other than a sink/shower), such as driers?  I can't shell out for more than two pairs of shorts (cheapest I've seen my preferred Assos Mille F1s is £75/pair - and that's the old model) but will need 5 pairs for the whole ride so I'm going to have to get them clean somehow.

Why ? What happens if you wear something else or if you wear the same shorts for 2 days ? Have you tried it ? NOW is the time to try it, to see if it is really an issue.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 13 February, 2009, 03:07:37 pm
I've not quite done the LEL distance but I found some areas in contact with my shorts could get sore if not kept clean and in contact with clean clothing.
There's a lot of sweat in 100 hours' cycling and that can be very salty, sticky and irritating.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Chris N on 13 February, 2009, 05:37:50 pm
Why ? What happens if you wear something else or if you wear the same shorts for 2 days ? Have you tried it ? NOW is the time to try it, to see if it is really an issue.

Cos I get a sweaty, spotty, sore arse.  Clean shorts every day makes me feel much, much better.

1 on, 1 washed/drying is how I'd normally do it when touring - as long as the weather's dry it's no big deal.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 13 February, 2009, 05:40:41 pm
Why ? What happens if you wear something else or if you wear the same shorts for 2 days ? Have you tried it ? NOW is the time to try it, to see if it is really an issue.

Cos I get a sweaty, spotty, sore arse.  Clean shorts every day makes me feel much, much better.

1 on, 1 washed/drying is how I'd normally do it when touring - as long as the weather's dry it's no big deal.

You are not alone.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LouiseC on 13 February, 2009, 05:50:51 pm
One good idea is to buy shorts from different manufacturers and design as the seams end up in a different places on your bum. The type of insert also makes a difference. Make sure that the shorts are run in over many hundreds of miles and washed properly a number of times before you first use them.

Experiment with different combinations of cream and inserts between now and July.

Having numerous pairs of shorts may be expensive but a worthwhile investment. It is the quality of the
insert and the fit that is important and not necessarily the material or the manufacturer.

Used shorts can be sent home but make sure that they are addressed to the other half.

Washed shorts will dry on the handlebars in next to no time even if the sun is not shining. It is sometimes useful to take a couple of pegs or even just some paper clips as they are lighter. They can be safety pinned to ones back but will not dry as quickly.

 :thumbsup:




 
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: MattH on 13 February, 2009, 07:29:20 pm
Would it be worth for HPV riders , instead of giving them the refelctive ankle straps, saying they must provide something refelctive  which can be seen fromt he rear on their machine?

It seems from this thread that most of you have something anyway  and being recumbent riders and aware of the dangers of motorists being unable to see  a large (often faired) machine (vehicle) immediately in front of them, have taken adequate steps.

Although bike checks are not part of registration perhaps I should make a  compulsory check of HPV machines to ensure riders comply with a  regulation that says something along the lines of ' HPV's must be visible in teh dark  from behind.'?  This is a slightly difficult one as I don't want to 
a   have loads of rules and regs
b   have unwrokable rules and regs
c   have regs that  create too much discrimination.

Suggestions?


Do you really need a regulation/check for extra reflectives? Is it needed for insurance or some other reason?

Surely as long as there is the correct legal reflector then that is all that is required. You could suggest fitting extra ones, possibly with examples (such as the good Mr Larrington's machine).

Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: frankly frankie on 14 February, 2009, 09:41:06 am
Quote
Having numerous pairs of shorts may be expensive but a worthwhile investment. It is the quality of the insert and the fit that is important and not necessarily the material or the manufacturer.

You people inhabit a different universe.

Not only from me, but more especially from Brigitte Kerlouet, who rode the 1995 PBP in 44h14.
She didn't achieve this by changing her shorts every 5 minutes, even though (so the legend goes) she wee'd through them rather than stop and lose her fast bunch.
Dunno which dignitaries had the 'pleasure' of embracing her at the finish ...
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: MattH on 14 February, 2009, 10:02:09 am


You people inhabit a different universe.

Not only from me, but more especially from Brigitte Kerlouet, who rode the 1995 PBP in 44h14.
She didn't achieve this by changing her shorts every 5 minutes, even though (so the legend goes) she wee'd through them rather than stop and lose her fast bunch.
Dunno which dignitaries had the 'pleasure' of embracing her at the finish ...

Yebbut, it was easy for her - she didn't even have to wear them for two days :)

Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LEL on 14 February, 2009, 12:48:02 pm
Only a sink will be available for washing clothes.  You wll need to supply your own washing powder.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Hummers on 14 February, 2009, 03:29:10 pm

Washed shorts will dry on the handlebars in next to no time even if the sun is not shining. It is sometimes useful to take a couple of pegs or even just some paper clips as they are lighter. They can be safety pinned to ones back but will not dry as quickly.

 :thumbsup:



Even better - why not wear them on your head.

H
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Fixedwheelnut on 14 February, 2009, 03:33:55 pm
Only a sink will be available for washing clothes.  You wll need to supply your own washing powder.

 I just used my shower gel on my shorts as well  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: simonp on 14 February, 2009, 08:43:10 pm
Only a sink will be available for washing clothes.  You wll need to supply your own washing powder.

 I just used my shower gel on my shorts as well  :thumbsup:

Lifeventure All Purpose Soap 350ml at Ultimate Outdoors (http://www.ultimateoutdoors.co.uk/item/Lifeventure_LifeventureAllPurposeSoap350ml_0_30_15185_2.html)

Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 14 February, 2009, 08:50:57 pm
You need nothing bulky. Most of the water north of Lincoln is soft and a little bar soap rubbed into the crotch of your shorts will lather sufficiently to clean the whole garment.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: simonp on 14 February, 2009, 10:09:44 pm
The small lifeventure bottles are tiny, about the same as a bar of soap but much less messy.  Good for washing self, clothes, dishes and fruit.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 14 February, 2009, 10:18:12 pm
I didn't follow the link but 350ml seemed a tad excessive...
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 14 February, 2009, 10:31:37 pm
Lifeventure All Purpose Soap 350ml at Ultimate Outdoors (http://www.ultimateoutdoors.co.uk/item/Lifeventure_LifeventureAllPurposeSoap350ml_0_30_15185_2.html)

Good stuff that, we took it on our 2 month trip round Argentina and Chile. Have about 50ml left which will be perfect for LEL.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: annie on 14 February, 2009, 11:43:54 pm
I have a little tub, about the sixe of a matchbox, in it are strips of soap powder.  If anyone is interested I can post a link?

Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Hummers on 15 February, 2009, 07:51:02 pm

Washed shorts will dry on the handlebars in next to no time even if the sun is not shining. It is sometimes useful to take a couple of pegs or even just some paper clips as they are lighter. They can be safety pinned to ones back but will not dry as quickly.

 :thumbsup:
 

You are absolutely spot on there.

I used this approach for PBP as this picture shows:

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d96/HummersOriginal/P7190006.jpg)

H
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Chris N on 15 February, 2009, 10:33:09 pm
Lifeventure All Purpose Soap 350ml at Ultimate Outdoors (http://www.ultimateoutdoors.co.uk/item/Lifeventure_LifeventureAllPurposeSoap350ml_0_30_15185_2.html)

Good stuff that, we took it on our 2 month trip round Argentina and Chile. Have about 50ml left which will be perfect for LEL.

That's what I'll be taking too.  Very good for washing almost anything.  Doesn't work as mind bleach though - thanks Hummers.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 17 February, 2009, 06:52:14 pm

Washed shorts will dry on the handlebars <SNIP>

You are absolutely spot on there.

I used this approach for PBP as this picture shows:

With some pictures, you don't need to scroll down to know what's in em.
Title: Kit & Stuff?
Post by: ramchip on 01 November, 2016, 04:34:08 pm
Just wondered from those that have done LEL before what kit etc they carried with them and what they had in their 2 drop bags?
Title: Re: Kit & Stuff?
Post by: LMT on 01 November, 2016, 06:31:25 pm
The kit I had on the bike when I done PBP was:

Two innertubes, tyre levers, multi tool, pliers, spoke wrench, spokes, pump, ibuprofen, hydration tabs, sun cream, shot blocks, arm warmers, leg warmers, overshoes, eye mask, toothbrush, 18650 batteries, AA batteries, toothpaste, ear plugs, light waterproof jacket.

And on me I had my phone, passport, money and brevet card.

Will be probably be the same more or less when I do LEL, save for not carrying so many tools as they are not needed, only a multi tool until you can get to the next control.

In the drop bags I'll probably go with change of clothes, some shot blocks, and some spare batteries.
Title: Re: Kit & Stuff?
Post by: vorsprung on 01 November, 2016, 07:30:37 pm
When I last did it I think there was a drop bag.  But I carried most stuff with me.  I just carried the same kind of things as I would for any ride

Drop bags are good for changes of clothes though
Title: Re: Kit & Stuff?
Post by: CrazyEnglishTriathlete on 01 November, 2016, 07:53:38 pm
Just wondered from those that have done LEL before what kit etc they carried with them and what they had in their 2 drop bags?

Assume it will be cold and wet on the northern section.  If it's dry then it can easily be single figure celsius in the hills even in the middle of summer, so I rode in with bib tights, a base layer, long sleeved jacket and waterproof.  That served me well on the way up and on the way back I was glad I had long fingered winter gloves for the 10 hours of wind and rain (in 2009).  In 2013 those in shorts arriving at Barnard Castle looked cold...  but then they probably recovered for the 30C on the last day.  Now, its possible that the whole of the UK will have a heatwave for the whole 5 days of the ride.  Then again, it is in the school holidays so that's probably a long-odds shot. 

I think I only used one drop bag, at Edinburgh, and that had an equivalent set to what I'd ridden up in, so that I could have a full change.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: cygnet on 02 November, 2016, 12:17:01 am
marcusjb has a pretty good pack list for on the bike stuff from PBP.
And some up thread advice from 2009 now this has been merged
Drop-bags wise in 2013 both bags had a complete changes of kit (long finger gloves, shirt, shorts, base layer, arm warmers, socks) probably three inner tubes, food, drink powder, electrolyte tabs, spare batteries in cases. Probably some spare med kit and caffine.
Think I made used one kit change (northern drop bag, heading south) but could have been worse in bad weather. (Actually used both pairs of socks, would put two pairs in each bag if riding again just because it feels better)
Didn't use a lot of the food (fig rolls, malt loaf, peanuts etc) and ended giving it to the Arrivee caterers  for later finishers.
Oh and most importantly the LEL jersey in the first/last drop bag for carrying back to London and wearing after the finish :D
Title: Re: Kit & Stuff?
Post by: L.Lagopus on 03 November, 2016, 09:05:41 pm
Just wondered from those that have done LEL before what kit etc they carried with them and what they had in their 2 drop bags?
In 2013, in addition to the kit I was wearing I carried on the bike: rain jacket, long sleeve wool jersey, leg and arm warmers, full fingered gloves, four tubes, tire levers, pump, multi-tool, spare tire, chamois creme, wallet, etrex gps, printed cue sheets, toothbrush and paste.
In each drop bag I had a pair of shorts, long sleeve and short sleeve jersey, two tubes, AA batteries, and a few Snickers Bars.
I was comfortable in all the weather I encountered, except for the absurd heat on the last day. (Seriously, the Brits complain about the weather so much, it never occurred to me that it might get uncomfortably hot and sunny). I went through 6 of my 8 available tubes on the ride.
I made the intentional decision not to bring a camera or phone. My phone did not work in the UK, and I thought I would be able to enjoy the ride more if I was not worried about documenting it. I now kind of regret not having brought a camera along. It would be nice to have a few pictures that might clear up some of the sleep deprived haze of the latter half of the ride.
Title: Re: Kit & Stuff?
Post by: Kim on 03 November, 2016, 11:56:18 pm
Seriously, the Brits complain about the weather so much, it never occurred to me that it might get uncomfortably hot and sunny.

You've evidently not been paying enough attention to Brits complaining about the weather.  Complaining about it being too hot is an important (but perhaps not entry-level) part of that[1], as well as complaining about all the knock-on effects that come from things going wrong due to unexpectedly non-mediocre weather[2].

The catch is that we have a quota of exactly 2 weeks of hot weather per year - traditionally this is scheduled around major sporting events such as Wimbledon[3] and international cricket, and timed to overlap with the mass exodus to ABROAD in search of warmer weather.  A day or two of freakishly warm weather may occasionally be deployed in early spring, as long as they don't coincide with the Easter holidays.

So there's a blink-and-you-missed-it-effect with British heatwaves.  Things to look out for include tabloid headlines along the lines of "Phew, what a scorcher!"; railway disruption due to warping rails and dehydrated passengers (rather than the more traditional excuses (https://uktra.in/Excuses)); any successful attempt at a barbecue; weather forecasters suddenly expressing an interest in the seaside; and sun-burnt Mancunians (https://youtu.be/QFWP62EoU4g).

Brits venturing outdoors know to carry both factor-50 sunblock and arctic weather gear at all times.


[1] Useful phrase:  "It's not the heat, it's the humidity."
[2] Designing infrastructure to cope with extreme weather conditions is considered un-patriotic.
[3] In 2009, a retractable roof was fitted to Centre Court in order to prevent Cliff Richard (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_Wimbledon_Championships#Cliff_Richard.27s_impromptu_concert) from singing.  Further research is needed on its precise effect on the climate.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: The French Tandem on 04 November, 2016, 07:00:05 am
^^POTD


Seriously, British weather is not that bad. The temperature range you should expect all year round is considerably narrower than in many other places. 
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 04 November, 2016, 12:18:20 pm
but the range on LELs in living memory has been approximately 0-32C, (32-90F) which is quite wide for late July/early August.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 04 November, 2016, 12:34:15 pm
but the range on LELs in living memory has been approximately 0-32C, (32-90F) which is quite wide for late July/early August.
Indeed.

The UK is certainly at the bottom of world rankings for "extreme"* weather, but it is considerably more unpredictable than the vast majority of nations.

I think it's the Lonely Planet guide which, in it's intro section has a bit about weather and clothing:

"Basically, whatever month you visit, just bring all your clothes."


*Although it's fair to say that 0'c and 32'c are both conditions where the outdoor endurance athlete can seriously come to grief if not properly prepared. You don't need proper extremes to get into trouble. Or to slow you down!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 04 November, 2016, 01:16:28 pm
Fit young soldiers have come to grief in BRITISH weather.
BE PREPARED! Keep comfortable even if you think it makes you look silly!
Title: Re: Kit & Stuff?
Post by: L.Lagopus on 04 November, 2016, 03:57:19 pm
Seriously, the Brits complain about the weather so much, it never occurred to me that it might get uncomfortably hot and sunny.

Brits venturing outdoors know to carry both factor-50 sunblock and arctic weather gear at all times.



[/sub]

In Alaska in the summer time you have to carry gear both summer and winter gear. In the winter, you don't have to bother with the summer gear.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: redfalo on 04 November, 2016, 04:14:40 pm
I discussed my PBP kit here: https://cycling-intelligence.com/2015/07/26/paris-brest-paris-2015-my-kit-list/#more-920 It all worked out nicely.

I have not ridden LEL yet, but I guess my stuff in 2017 will be rather similar, but I will also pack some warm gloves.

As there will be bag drops on LEL, I won't carry the spare clothes on the bike. Probably just arm warmers, leg warmers, one extra layer Merino, the windproof gilet and the waterproof jacket.

I have not fully made up my mind about the sleeping kit, but as of now, I think I will take it with me (maybe put it in first bag drop, but have the ability to carry it later).
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: The French Tandem on 04 November, 2016, 07:26:55 pm
I think it's the Lonely Planet guide which, in it's intro section has a bit about weather and clothing:

"Basically, whatever month you visit, just bring all your clothes."

As people in Brittany* say, There is no bad weather here, there are only inappropriate clothes

*: Probably true in Scotland too.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 04 November, 2016, 07:48:31 pm
And I thought that was a Norwegian saying....

I suspect many nationalities claim provenance!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Kim on 04 November, 2016, 07:50:28 pm
And all of them are lying :)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 04 November, 2016, 07:59:17 pm
 ;) ;D

Google suggests Canute/Norwegian/German/Wainwright.

'Two men say they're Jesus Christ
One of them must be wrong'...
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Phil W on 05 November, 2016, 05:10:02 pm
Toothbrush and paste, razor and shaving oil used at least every 24 hours. Each bag drop had 2 sets of cycling kit, plus spare inner tubes; so fresh kit every 300km.

On the bike, usual toolkit. Leg and arm warmers , spare pair of socks, plus long finger gloves. Short sleeve waterproof jacket. Head torch. Emergency silver blanket.  Emergency rations. ID and emergency contact details. Cash and bank card.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: ramchip on 08 November, 2016, 11:36:52 am
Thanks! So where did you have your bag drops? Such a great idea to have 2 x sets of cycling kit in each bag. Thanks again!

Toothbrush and paste, razor and shaving oil used at least every 24 hours. Each bag drop had 2 sets of cycling kit, plus spare inner tubes; so fresh kit every 300km.

On the bike, usual toolkit. Leg and arm warmers , spare pair of socks, plus long finger gloves. Short sleeve waterproof jacket. Head torch. Emergency silver blanket.  Emergency rations. ID and emergency contact details. Cash and bank card.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Phil W on 08 November, 2016, 12:10:03 pm
Thanks! So where did you have your bag drops? Such a great idea to have 2 x sets of cycling kit in each bag. Thanks again!

Market Rasen and Barnard Castle.  My reasoning for Barnard Castle was that it was before / after the highest point of the route at Yad Moss.  If the forecast going north was rubbish I could take some extra warm layers. Returning south if the weather had been rubbish then I had dry kit to put on and dump the warmer layers.  Market Rasen as just before / after the Fens and wanted to finish in relatively fresh kit on the last day.

So this time round (if I was riding) I'd choose from Barnard Castle or Brampton coupled with Louth or Pocklington resp. The later gives a better spread over the distance (Brampton to Brampton is almost bang on 300k) but I still like the idea of dry kit as soon as possible after the Yad Moss crossing returning south.

The other thing in my bags was plastic bags to seal the smellies being dumped.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: CrazyEnglishTriathlete on 08 November, 2016, 12:45:00 pm
LEL is during the school holidays, which every parent of school age children knows is a recipe for unsettled weather.  There is a meteorological basis for this superstition.  Our weather is Atlantic dominated and it takes until end of July/August for the Atlantic to get hot enough to generate more stormy and unsettled weather.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: martint235 on 10 January, 2017, 12:09:55 pm
For what it's worth, one of the key things I learnt on 2013 was that I carried too much stuff on the bike and that if I ever rode LEL again I would use bag drops. In my saddle bag I had 5 changes of kit, 6 inner tubes, batteries for lights etc, spare phone, some food (most of which actually made it home with me), plus all the usual stuff of pump, multitool etc. I think in total it weighed about 7 kilos. I wouldn't say I struggled with it but it would have been easier to use the bag drops for most of it.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Planet X Paul on 10 January, 2017, 01:04:43 pm
For what it's worth, one of the key things I learnt on 2013 was that I carried too much stuff on the bike and that if I ever rode LEL again I would use bag drops. In my saddle bag I had 5 changes of kit, 6 inner tubes, batteries for lights etc, spare phone, some food (most of which actually made it home with me), plus all the usual stuff of pump, multitool etc. I think in total it weighed about 7 kilos. I wouldn't say I struggled with it but it would have been easier to use the bag drops for most of it.

What was your logic for NOT using the bag drops last time.  Just curious really, as why carry all that stuff when you didn't have to ?
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: martint235 on 10 January, 2017, 01:08:03 pm
For what it's worth, one of the key things I learnt on 2013 was that I carried too much stuff on the bike and that if I ever rode LEL again I would use bag drops. In my saddle bag I had 5 changes of kit, 6 inner tubes, batteries for lights etc, spare phone, some food (most of which actually made it home with me), plus all the usual stuff of pump, multitool etc. I think in total it weighed about 7 kilos. I wouldn't say I struggled with it but it would have been easier to use the bag drops for most of it.

What was your logic for NOT using the bag drops last time.  Just curious really, as why carry all that stuff when you didn't have to ?
I just thought it would be too much faffing. I don't own a car so I would have had to go and collect the bags, then ferry them back to Loughton then pick up all the returned stuff the day after the finish. It just seemed easier to ride with everything I needed.
Title: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: Phil W on 27 February, 2017, 07:27:23 pm
You might want to consider carrying an emergency silver blanket. They can be a Godsend if you do get stranded and need an extra means of retaining warmth. I always carry one on any brevet I expected the possibility of either night time or cold temperatures. They take up very little space and are cheap to purchase. Wrap over you they can also keep the worst of the rain out.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Camping-Hiking-Safety-Survival-Gear/Foil-Blanket-reflective-thermal-first-aid-1st/B004O793JY
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: DrMekon on 27 February, 2017, 07:34:21 pm
I use a sol emergency bivvy 99g for £15 and reusable. They do a breathable one for £50 that weighs 50g more

https://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/equipment-c3/first-aid-emergency-c5/emergency-rescue-c6/heatsheets-emergency-bivy-sleeping-bag-p61

Having had my sister fall apart on top on Kidstones in the rain at 2 in the morning and struggled to get her to Kettlewell, I wouldn't be without one again. Really, we should have quit and sheltered, but it was too cold to stop, and she was too slow for me to stay warm.
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: mmmmartin on 27 February, 2017, 08:22:45 pm
I use a sol emergency bivvy 99g for £15 and reusable.
Be aware that the use of that bag shown on its packaging is wrong and dangerous: you shouldn't lie down on the ground as you'll lose heat very quickly. You should sit on a rucksack or other insulating item to keep off the ground.
These are far better and used by mountain rescue teams: http://www.blizzardsurvival.com/section.php/6/
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: Somnolent on 27 February, 2017, 08:40:29 pm
One more problem many of us from here have to encounter is that , we will be landing there from a very hot summer of 30 C avg temperature. So the affect of cold is going to be very significant.

This is probably the biggest problem even experienced randonneurs from warmer parts of the world will face.
One both PBP2015 and LEL2013 we've mostly been quite comfortable in short-sleeve jersey & shorts and not infrequently come across Asian riders who are wearing all their layers, including waterproofs and still finding it too cold.
The converse is also true, northern europeans actually start to melt above 25°C  ;)
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: Feline on 27 February, 2017, 10:05:30 pm
Not sure how helpful my experience is here- but I am a 'cold' person who gets cold very easily. As a long audax proceeds I feel colder and colder (mostly when stopped) as my thermoregulation seems to go wrong. I tend to ride the last day in leg warmers and arm warmers even if is warm- although in LEL 2013 it was so hot in daylight hours that I didn't have that problem.

I'm not sure that a warm layer is something you really want to be leaving in a bag drop. There are several nights in the ride, and you may need that kit on any or all of them no matter how far north you go. Personally I used the bag drops to store the next-to-skin layer kit that I was going to change, battery packs, inner tubes and bum cream. The warm layer went with me all the time. I think I dumped a lot in the final bag drop since it was so hot on the last day and I knew I wasn't going to need it.
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: toestrap on 28 February, 2017, 09:28:32 am
I don't have any arm/leg warmers, but I can't imagine they're so bulky as to merit being left in a bag drop rather than being carried just in case.

I've had arm warmers for many years but only used them in spring/autumn - until this winter. It has been a revelation, easily the most versatile piece of kit worn under/over a base layer. I hadn't realised just how much warmth I was losing through my arms. Must be high on the all time warmth effectiveness table.
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: Nelson Longflap on 28 February, 2017, 09:51:25 am
Slightly OT I carry a small plastic ice cream tub containing tools, various spares, kitchen sink, etc. Back OT I squash a silver blanket on top which stops everything rattling, and has been used to insulate me from draughts; a vital bit of kit.

Don't stop me and expect to buy an ice cream, but I might be able to provide a gear cable!

PS ice cream tubs are also superbly waterproof, so good for a phone, etc. A bit bulky for some I'm sure, but no problem in my eponymous saddlebag  :)
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: Jacques on 28 February, 2017, 10:44:03 am
snipped ...Back OT I squash a silver blanket on top which stops everything rattling, and has been used to insulate me from draughts; a vital bit of kit.


Back off topic, anyone wrapped up in a silver blanket sleeping next to you makes it impossible to sleep. They certainly don't stop riders from rattling while they settle down. The number of controls I've had to get up and find a quieter spot due to these things of the devil is ..... well a lot. Use them in emergencies outside for sure, but inside a control?
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: Bunker22 on 28 February, 2017, 09:58:46 pm

The lowest temperature range I can endure is 12-15 C. I might need more layers if it gets below that. 


Can I have suggestions to fine tune my plan/stratergy ?


Better plan on quite a few layers then.  ;D
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: igauk on 01 March, 2017, 02:29:29 am
Ditto arm and leg warmers, carry them with me at all times.
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: Moleman76 on 01 March, 2017, 04:44:48 am
One more problem many of us from here have to encounter is that , we will be landing there from a very hot summer of 30 C avg temperature. So the affect of cold is going to be very significant.

I would suggest thinking about keeping your extremities warm, thinking from the top down:

+Head: a fleece (or wool) cap or balaclava, and possibly a "showercap" helmet or head cover to keep it dry up there (your hotel might have one you could take along).
+Neck: the balaclava (again), or a "buff"; you probably won't need one of the wicking neck coolers that those of us from cooler climates use in hot weather.
+Arms: the arm warmers, and/or a long-sleeve jersey
+Hands: nitrile or other plastic "exam gloves" can be a first layer and will cut wind on your skin (and also keep grease off in the event of on-the-road mechanical issues); then, long-fingered gloves and possibly overmitts.  You want to get some insulation onto your fingers and hands and wrists, and keep it dry, without a) being too tight/restrictive (cutting off circulation) or b) too really thick and bulky.  The air between gloves and overmitts is a bit of insulation.  The exam gloves will trap sweat (if you have any), and over time make your fingers look like you have been soaking in the bathtub too long.
+Legs, Knees: Leg or knee warmers, or tights; "rain legs" (which mostly cover the front of the leg) are also effective at cutting wind exposure.
+Feet: See the other thread about booties / shoecovers.  Note that the full covers also protect your ankles from wind; the toe-only covers not so much.  Socks: be aware if too thick, might restrict toe circulation.

A piece of "Tyvek" - perhaps from a UPS/FedEx or similar mailing envelope - can be slipped between jersey and jacket for another measure of wind protection for your chest, somewhat like racers of old and the newspapers they used.

A "baselayer" tee-shirt (especially if wool) may help both with cold and hot.

Putting on new dry socks at a control, before sleeping, might help you get more rest.  Then ride on, with those socks on.
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: madcow on 01 March, 2017, 09:08:13 am
Given that the night-time is usually the coldest part of the day,particularly between 3and 5 a.m,riders who are faster will more than likely be in bed . If you are likely to be getting on the road before sunrise , or riding through the night, then some gloves will be useful.The thickness of glove depends on how much you feel the cold.
 In summer,I can usually get away with either thin liner gloves or a single layer, non windproofed glove.

If ,like Mileater, you are really going to feel the cold, then look at a lightweight,insulated gilet, such as the Rab Microlight gilet or the Alpkit Filoment and make sure you have a saddlebag big enough to carry it.
Neither are particularly bulky and when worn under a rain jacket will keep your body core warm.
A merino wool baselayer (www.howies.co.uk) will double the insulation.
As ESL says above, the long descents can be your undoing,especially if you are sweating at the top of the climb, so stop at the top and put on the extra layers before you get cold.

Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: redfalo on 01 March, 2017, 08:50:31 pm
What Madcow says.

A few more thoughts: Starting again after a longer rest in the cold is particularily unpleasant, as the body cools down during the break and it can take quite a while to "re-heat" sweaty base layers (I sweat quite a lot, even in cold nights...) The issue is reduced by a Merino base layers, which keeps warm(er) even when wet.  But what works best for me on longer winter rides is the following procedure: carry a spare base layer. First thing when arriving at a control where I want to stop longer is replace the base layer I'm wearing with the dry one.

Another reason to have a spare base layer on board is the risk of rain. If you get really soaked, trying to get sleep wearing wet clothes can be tricky. Same goes for a spare pair of socks, plus Gore Tex socks to use them in wet shoes. A couple of spare buffs (which can double up as a hat to keep the head warm)  and a spare pair of gloves (putting wet gloves on after a break is super-annoying) also do no harm.

Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: Mile Cruncher on 02 March, 2017, 04:10:25 pm
I'm extremely thankful for the suggestions that have flown in here. They will help me in planning more sensibly.

I have already ordered a Merino base layer ..( tough it is , while struggling arrange funds for trip )

I'm yet to acquire gloves ( for protection in cold) and a proper rain jacket. I survived with a basic one from Decathlon all these days. Seems like,it will will not hold good there.

Any opinions on Poncho just for rain protection ?
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: The French Tandem on 02 March, 2017, 04:19:28 pm
I hate ponchos. Not only they will horribly slow you down in windy areas, but they tend to get caught into wheels, chains, etc., sometimes with catastrophic consequences. A snugly fit rain jacket is the right tool for the job.
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: GPS on 02 March, 2017, 04:28:15 pm
I hate ponchos. Not only they will horribly slow you down in windy areas, but they tend to get caught into wheels, chains, etc., sometimes with catastrophic consequences. A snugly fit rain jacket is the right tool for the job.

+1 on all that !
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: toestrap on 02 March, 2017, 05:42:02 pm
I tried a poncho once.

I use some waterproof knee length shorts (Endura - not sure which stye) over my lycra shorts if it starts raining. It stops the rain from draining straight off my jacket into my lap, but gives far better air circualtion than full length waterproof overtrousers. (Also looks less quirky than rain legs - which may or may not be an advantage)
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: Kim on 02 March, 2017, 06:09:12 pm
Any opinions on Poncho just for rain protection ?

They have their uses, but I'd suggest that most of those uses are closer to a 2 mile ride to the shops, rather than a 900 mile ride against the clock.  The wind resistance will kill you, unless its a stonking tailwind, at which point it might technically be cheating.

For audax, it's better to be warm and wet in quick-drying fabrics.

I believe that some women cyclists put ponchos to good use in places where there really aren't any hedges to inspect, but that doesn't apply to most of the LEL route.

Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: arabella on 02 March, 2017, 07:42:51 pm
Once upon a time I decided that, as it was dark and the road quiet, a hedge was not required.  Naturally at this point along comes a baker's van (or somesuch).  Who goes past, clocks person apparently sprawled and a not-upright bike and so stops, and reverses, and stick his head out of the window to see if I am OK.   :-[
I've filed it under 'I'd be glad for that to happen if I really did need help'.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Veloman on 02 March, 2017, 08:46:38 pm
I went to a lecture by Josie Dew many years back and she said she only carried a poncho for the emergency toilet situation and had a very similar situation where someone stopped to help while she pretended to fix her bike and ....!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: madcow on 02 March, 2017, 08:47:54 pm
I'm extremely thankful for the suggestions that have flown in here. They will help me in planning more sensibly.

I have already ordered a Merino base layer ..( tough it is , while struggling arrange funds for trip )

I'm yet to acquire gloves ( for protection in cold) and a proper rain jacket. I survived with a basic one from Decathlon all these days. Seems like,it will will not hold good there.

Any opinions on Poncho just for rain protection ?

Mile Cruncher, put a post in the "Wanted " thread in Classified. You might be surprised at what fellow YACFers have hiding in their wardrobes. I am sure someone could help and get it to the start for you.
 What size are you?
Title: Re: Equipment, was bag drops
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on 02 March, 2017, 08:49:41 pm
Any opinions on Poncho just for rain protection ?

For audax, it's better to be warm and wet in quick-drying fabrics.

This is true.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Mile Cruncher on 03 March, 2017, 08:43:51 am
Mile Cruncher, put a post in the "Wanted " thread in Classified. You might be surprised at what fellow YACFers have hiding in their wardrobes. I am sure someone could help and get it to the start for you.
 What size are you?

Thank you very much. A very helpful suggestion. I'm still trying to arrange them myself. But in case I couldn't do it , I will definitely post in there. Very glad to know that people are there to lend a hand for needy.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: chrisbainbridge on 03 March, 2017, 09:19:49 am
Decathlon equipment is widely used in the UK and I would not dismiss their rain jackets.

Gloves do not have to be special and a pair of woollen gloves under large washing up gloves will do very well for warmth and keeping dry.

You may be better off with a couple of pairs of cheaper gloves which can be swapped if one gets wet.

Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: jsabine on 03 March, 2017, 10:25:25 am
Mile Cruncher, put a post in the "Wanted " thread in Classified. You might be surprised at what fellow YACFers have hiding in their wardrobes. I am sure someone could help and get it to the start for you.
 What size are you?

Thank you very much. A very helpful suggestion. I'm still trying to arrange them myself. But in case I couldn't do it , I will definitely post in there. Very glad to know that people are there to lend a hand for needy.

I'd repeat madcow's question: what sort of size are you?

I'm not the only one with plenty of spare kit that I'd be happy to lend ... but it won't fit well if you're five foot six, or at all if you're six foot six ...

(The list includes a good Gore waterproof jacket, barely worn because I don't like it as much as my other one ...)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Exit Stage Left on 03 March, 2017, 10:30:34 am
I wondered what clothing you might buy on the way. I recall a visit to Tesco in Dumfries on a Scottish Audax, where people bought gloves, thermal vesst and women's tights. The only big shop I can think of in the Northern part of the route is Tesco in Thirsk, but that's not a big branch. I wonder what they sell in the clothing line, their hours are 6am to 12pm.

There's a Lidl opposite, but you can never tell what they sell from week to week,
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: madcow on 03 March, 2017, 11:13:33 am

There's a bike shop in the middle of Thirsk, not far off the route
http://www.venture.bike/clothing/ (http://www.venture.bike/clothing/)

Ditto Pocklington http://www.cyclelane-ltd.co.uk/CycleLaneLimited/Home.html (http://www.cyclelane-ltd.co.uk/CycleLaneLimited/Home.html)

Outdoor shop in Moffat  http://www.moffatoutdoors.co.uk/ (http://www.moffatoutdoors.co.uk/)

On my schedule, I will be in all those places during shop opening hours.

BBC or Met office weather forecasts are pretty accurate nowadays. They will be able to predict the general weather pattern for the next 7 days.
That should help last minute planning.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: The French Tandem on 03 March, 2017, 12:15:44 pm
There is a bike shop in Longtown, spot on the route,  a few miles north of Brampton. We bought a new cycle computer there after ours decided to die in the middle of the ride. The chap was kind enough to fit the new computer free of charge  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 03 March, 2017, 12:37:54 pm

There's a bike shop in the middle of Thirsk, not far off the route
http://www.venture.bike/clothing/ (http://www.venture.bike/clothing/)

Ditto Pocklington http://www.cyclelane-ltd.co.uk/CycleLaneLimited/Home.html (http://www.cyclelane-ltd.co.uk/CycleLaneLimited/Home.html)

Outdoor shop in Moffat  http://www.moffatoutdoors.co.uk/ (http://www.moffatoutdoors.co.uk/)

On my schedule, I will be in all those places during shop opening hours.

BBC or Met office weather forecasts are pretty accurate nowadays. They will be able to predict the general weather pattern for the next 7 days.
That should help last minute planning.

 :thumbsup:

This sort of info would be really useful all gathered together (ideally with opening times, as folks will pass through at all sorts of times-of-day).

The Pocklington folks were quite helpful when we ran the control there.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Planet X Paul on 03 March, 2017, 01:13:36 pm
I'm staggered by the people who suggest wearing washing up gloves to use as waterproof gloves on the bike.  Your hands will sweat and ultimately get very cold as they are not breathable.   Buy a pair of proper cycling windproof/waterproof gloves.  Planet X sell gloves for not too much if you don't want Rapha.  I can't believe that people who can afford the cost to enter LEL, plus all the travel and training events are so hard up that they cannot afford a decent pair of gloves  :facepalm:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Kim on 03 March, 2017, 01:21:48 pm
I'm staggered by the people who suggest wearing washing up gloves to use as waterproof gloves on the bike.  Your hands will sweat and ultimately get very cold as they are not breathable.

It seems like a good bodge for those caught out in bad weather who have access to a supermarket.  I wouldn't plan on using it deliberately.

All gloves end up soaked if you cycle in them for an hour, and the rubber gloves should be admirably windproof (and therefore reasonably warm), but the lack of breathability means your hands are going to get fairly nasty if you use them for prolonged periods.


Quote
Buy a pair of proper cycling windproof/waterproof gloves.  Planet X sell gloves for not too much if you don't want Rapha.  I can't believe that people who can afford the cost to enter LEL, plus all the travel and training events are so hard up that they cannot afford a decent pair of gloves  :facepalm:

Agreed.  But I have sympathy for those from hot countries where such things are unobtanium, and weak currency makes buying them internationally an expensive gamble if they don't know what fits.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 03 March, 2017, 01:31:42 pm
I'm staggered by the people who suggest wearing washing up gloves to use as waterproof gloves on the bike.  Your hands will sweat and ultimately get very cold as they are not breathable.

It seems like a good bodge for those caught out in bad weather who have access to a supermarket.  I wouldn't plan on using it deliberately.

All gloves end up soaked if you cycle in them for an hour, and the rubber gloves should be admirably windproof (and therefore reasonably warm), but the lack of breathability means your hands are going to get fairly nasty if you use them for prolonged periods.


Quote
Buy a pair of proper cycling windproof/waterproof gloves.  Planet X sell gloves for not too much if you don't want Rapha.  I can't believe that people who can afford the cost to enter LEL, plus all the travel and training events are so hard up that they cannot afford a decent pair of gloves  :facepalm:

Agreed.  But I have sympathy for those from hot countries where such things are unobtanium, and weak currency makes buying them internationally an expensive gamble if they don't know what fits.
Agreed^2. To which I would just add:

there are very many VERY expensive "waterproof" gloves around that are really no more effective than the marigolds* tactic.
(If you buy stuff that doesn't have "cycling" in the name you can usually save 50%, but there is still plenty of expensive shit).

Given £40-£60, I'd rather spend it on new tyres,  some food, plus marigolds and 2 pair thin wool gloves.


*UK brand of rubber washing-up gloves - ED
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: wilkyboy on 03 March, 2017, 02:04:22 pm
All gloves end up soaked if you cycle in them for an hour, and the rubber gloves should be admirably windproof (and therefore reasonably warm), but the lack of breathability means your hands are going to get fairly nasty if you use them for prolonged periods.

^ This ^

I've tried a number of different waterproof gloves over the years, which have been fine for commuting and pretty bad on audax rides — they eventually wet through and then get cold, but they don't breathe well enough to dry out, so stay cold and wet even after the rain stops.  Instead I use windproof gloves and accept that my hands will get wet, but once I'm turning the big gear then I'm naturally warm, and the gloves dry in a few minutes after the rain stops.  I have a thick-ish pair for winter and a thin pair for the rest of the year.  I only wear them when it's cold — for warm and wet then I just wear normal summer fingerless gloves.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: wajcgac on 03 March, 2017, 02:12:44 pm

There's a bike shop in the middle of Thirsk, not far off the route
http://www.venture.bike/clothing/ (http://www.venture.bike/clothing/)

Ditto Pocklington http://www.cyclelane-ltd.co.uk/CycleLaneLimited/Home.html (http://www.cyclelane-ltd.co.uk/CycleLaneLimited/Home.html)

Outdoor shop in Moffat  http://www.moffatoutdoors.co.uk/ (http://www.moffatoutdoors.co.uk/)

On my schedule, I will be in all those places during shop opening hours.

BBC or Met office weather forecasts are pretty accurate nowadays. They will be able to predict the general weather pattern for the next 7 days.
That should help last minute planning.

 :thumbsup:

This sort of info would be really useful all gathered together (ideally with opening times, as folks will pass through at all sorts of times-of-day).

The Pocklington folks were quite helpful when we ran the control there.

I'll add

http://www.louthcyclecentre.co.uk/ (http://www.louthcyclecentre.co.uk/)

about a mile away from the control.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Planet X Paul on 03 March, 2017, 02:16:10 pm
Yes, you can pay silly money for any type of outdoor gear.  Is a waterproof that costs £400 that much better than one that costs £150 ?  Probably not.

Similarly, you don't have to spend silly money on good cycling gloves.  I bought a pair of Endura Deluge gloves for £25 and have kept me comfortable on wet, cold winter rides.  I have PX insulated winter gloves that have also done the job on cold dry days, and I normally suffer with my extremities.

Yes, water will eventually get in, but they will still be a darn sight more comfortable that washing up gloves.

As I said, surely no one doing LEL is that hard up.

Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Exit Stage Left on 03 March, 2017, 03:42:29 pm


As I said, surely no one doing LEL is that hard up.

People dropped out from 2001 onwards, when the price was £50, but you paid separately for food. The demise of the Thorne start pushed the price up a lot.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 03 March, 2017, 03:53:52 pm
Maybe washing up gloves are not great.

But they, and thin thermal gloves, are sold by most garages in the UK. A pair of thin thermals under some baggy oversized washing up gloves (lets the air circulate and reduces condensation from sweat) can keep you going when your other gloves are saturated and icy cold, or you've unaccountably lost one.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: wilkyboy on 03 March, 2017, 04:59:22 pm
... or you've unaccountably lost one.

Which I did on LEL2013 — I expect it's still there, on the side of the road, waiting for me to find it again ... unfortunately we don't go that way this year  :facepalm:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Veloman on 03 March, 2017, 05:00:07 pm
Most garages have disposable gloves that you wear beneath your normal gloves to keep fingers warm. Yes, your hands can get very moist, but warm wet is nay bother, cold wet is bother. You also use the gloves for toes too by just using the palm portion of the glove inside your shoes. Cheap, cheerful and great in an emergency. Also carry some. I tend to use them between 2 pairs of thin gloves and very good for the dry cold riding too.

On a long walk multi-day walk across England many years ago my friend and I purchased 4 sliced loaves just for the bags to keep our hands warm!  Again, warm wet was far better than cold wet.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 03 March, 2017, 05:41:02 pm
Can't think of anything worse than wearing any type of non-breathable gloves on a long ride.

On long rides I generally carry 3 pairs of gloves, two pairs of fingerless cycling mitts (different makes that have gel pads and seams in slightly different places) and a pair of cotton inner gloves which can be worn over the top of the mitts for extra warmth. Some combination of these will keep my hands warm even if they get soaked.

The big mistake is taking wet items off and leaving them to get cold. Body heat will dry most lightweight cycling items (base layers, arm/leg warmers, mitts, cotton inner gloves, etc) in next to no time when stopped at a control, either keep them on until dry or, for gloves, stick them up the legs of your shorts. There's always a chance of a sneaky radiator or even an open fire somewhere (at a control or a separate cafe stop).

Only on really cold rides (rides encountering snow - Elenith or The Dean in 2008) I've got some Altura Waterproof gloves that haven't failed to keep my hands warm (even when they get soaked from 15+ hours or rain). They don't dry out so quickly though, so I had to swap between those and my mitts/inner-gloves with the other pair drying in a jacket pocket (using my body heat).
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: postrestant on 03 March, 2017, 06:12:20 pm
Here's a vote for neoprene gloves (the Castelli version can be had for £18 at the moment). I find them the best gloves between 4C and 10C, wet or dry. Keep you very warm, and not too thick. And comfy (and not slippery) on the bars / levers. Drawback -- your hands get that neoprene pong.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Exit Stage Left on 03 March, 2017, 06:39:17 pm
Can't think of anything worse than wearing any type of non-breathable gloves on a long ride.



I can. The pain of circulation returning to hands that have been too cold for too long, or being unable to change gear or brake, because there is no feeling or strength in your hands.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Mile Cruncher on 03 March, 2017, 07:41:18 pm

I'd repeat madcow's question: what sort of size are you?
Five foot seven :) and Medium
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: igauk on 04 March, 2017, 08:55:56 pm
Neoprene gloves + silk glove liners =  :)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: madcow on 04 March, 2017, 09:22:21 pm

I'd repeat madcow's question: what sort of size are you?
Five foot seven :) and Medium

I have a Freestyle cycling jacket in Activent that you can have for free. Breathable fabric and heavy enough for summer use.
Might have something heavier if I ask Mrs M . You are same size as she is.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: vorsprung on 04 March, 2017, 09:54:25 pm
In the unlikely event that wall to wall rain is predicted for LEL I will take 4 sets of gloves ( mitts + 3 x winter gloves) and be prepared to buy some more garage gloves if necessary.

But

TBH it is a summer ride so I would imagine 2x mitts for comfort changes and 1 pair lightweight long fingered would be just fine
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: GPS on 06 March, 2017, 10:51:14 am
Can't think of anything worse than wearing any type of non-breathable gloves on a long ride.



I can. The pain of circulation returning to hands that have been too cold for too long, or being unable to change gear or brake, because there is no feeling or strength in your hands.

Been there, done that ... and then had to pack because I couldn't carry on safely or even drink from my bidon ...
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Exit Stage Left on 06 March, 2017, 11:01:49 am
Can't think of anything worse than wearing any type of non-breathable gloves on a long ride.



I can. The pain of circulation returning to hands that have been too cold for too long, or being unable to change gear or brake, because there is no feeling or strength in your hands.

Been there, done that ... and then had to pack because I couldn't carry on safely or even drink from my bidon ...

I competed in a hedgelaying competition yesterday. It lashed it down from the start, and turned to sleet after an hour. The only way to cope with the conditions was to work flat out. I finished after three hours, with three hours left. I removed as much wet clothing as I could, then sat in the car until it stopped raining, and tidied the job up a bit. I won my class, which was bonus.

I apply the lessons I've learned from working outdoors with chainsaws to managing clothing on the bike. In extreme circumstances it can be a good idea to turn around on a hill to warm up by climbing, but misery inhibits that sort of rational thought.

The dangerous time is when it has stopped raining, as evaporative cooling starts then.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: hellymedic on 06 March, 2017, 12:17:35 pm
The dangerous time is when it has stopped raining, as evaporative cooling starts then.

<pedant> I thought evaporative cooling also occurs when it's raining but the danger is increasing it by removing wind and waterproof clothing when the rain stops.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Exit Stage Left on 06 March, 2017, 12:29:41 pm
The dangerous time is when it has stopped raining, as evaporative cooling starts then.

<pedant> I thought evaporative cooling also occurs when it's raining but the danger is increasing it by removing wind and waterproof clothing when the rain stops.

The rate of cooling will increase as the differential in humidity increases. When it's raining it's obviously 100%. Evaporation is then due to the heat input from work. When it stops raining, then wicking is the cooling effect.

It's right to point out that wind and waterproof clothing lowers the rate of evaporation, especially if it's not breathable. Neoprene can be a real culprit, as it holds water. The moment it stops raining you should change into dry gloves.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: lookeo on 10 March, 2017, 11:25:32 am
Thoughts please on double AA battery powered light options outside of the Hope 1 option? I can't justify a dynamo setup this year.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Karla on 10 March, 2017, 11:38:18 am
Get a USB light that you can charge and leave some USB power packs in your drop bags? 

Alternatively, get a light with replaceable 18650 cells and take some / leave some in your drop bags.

If you do want AA, the Fenix BT10 is an alternative to the Vision 1.  I haven't used it but have used its bigger brother the 18650-powered bigger brother the BT20, which was an excellent light that put the beam just where you needed it.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 10 March, 2017, 06:28:06 pm
Thoughts please on double AA battery powered light options outside of the Hope 1 option? I can't justify a dynamo setup this year.
Do you mean 2xAA? Not many of those with a decent output (sadly IMHO), but

with 4xAA this is posssibly the best around (at least with a shaped beam, reliable manufacturer etc - but see other reviews of which there are plenty!)
 https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/busch-mueller-ixon-iq-led-28755?currency=3&delivery_country=190&gclid=COm9iKbHzNICFQ4TGwod_eYOHw

(someone please tell me if that isn't the latest/best Ixon IQ - I find the model names very confusing).


_SOME _of us find it plenty adequate bright for all night-riding. (I'm not saying I don't also use a "main beam" for descending ... but I can manage without if I have to.)

(n.b. I haven't used the Fenix BT10)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Ivo on 10 March, 2017, 06:45:32 pm
Thoughts please on double AA battery powered light options outside of the Hope 1 option? I can't justify a dynamo setup this year.
Do you mean 2xAA? Not many of those with a decent output (sadly IMHO), but

with 4xAA this is posssibly the best around (at least with a shaped beam, reliable manufacturer etc - but see other reviews of which there are plenty!)
 https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/busch-mueller-ixon-iq-led-28755?currency=3&delivery_country=190&gclid=COm9iKbHzNICFQ4TGwod_eYOHw

(someone please tell me if that isn't the latest/best Ixon IQ - I find the model names very confusing).


_SOME _of us find it plenty adequate bright for all night-riding. (I'm not saying I don't also use a "main beam" for descending ... but I can manage without if I have to.)

(n.b. I haven't used the Fenix BT10)

Yours is the lower end version, this is the current best one: https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/busch-mueller-ixon-iq-premium-led-accumulator-headlamp-139355

Two of these on your bikes and a set of spare batteries per night will see you through LEL perfectly. With two of them on the bike you don't have to stop to change batteries and you can add a 2nd one for the fast descents. Considering sleepstops, short nights in Scotland and some area's with streetlights/ or groupriding where you can keep the lights on lowbeam and the initial double set of batteries plus 4 spare sets would be enough for the entire LEL (if not, replacements are easily available at any roadside supermarket).
I use one of them as back up light in case I have an issue with my primary setup.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Greenbank on 10 March, 2017, 08:19:23 pm
I used two B&M Ixon IQs (2009 vintage) for LEL'09 and PBP'11.

One in low power mode was good enough for most of the night riding, high power for descents. I only put the second one on when the first was flashing it's "running out of power" red light and then changed the batteries in the depleted one at the next control. I liked having a second one as a backup.

On PBP I loaned one of them to an Italian recumbent rider who's lights had failed and that got him to the finish. Only having one didn't affect me at all.

I think I used three or four sets of AA batteries during each event, so only one or two actual changes.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mmmmartin on 12 March, 2017, 11:36:23 am
I used two B&M Ixon IQs (2009 vintage) for LEL'09 and PBP'11.
On the grounds that if it's good enough for Greenbank it's good enough for me, I looked up these on the interwebs: they are surprisingly cheap at about £40 to £50 each - am I looking at the right ones?
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 12 March, 2017, 11:55:24 am
Just make sure you buy a "PREMIUM". Ivo linked to one. They're about 45 Euros +6P&P there:


Yours is the lower end version, this is the current best one: https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/busch-mueller-ixon-iq-premium-led-accumulator-headlamp-139355

Two of these on your bikes and a set of spare batteries per night will see you through LEL perfectly. With two of them on the bike you don't have to stop to change batteries and you can add a 2nd one for the fast descents. Considering sleepstops, short nights in Scotland and some area's with streetlights/ or groupriding where you can keep the lights on lowbeam and the initial double set of batteries plus 4 spare sets would be enough for the entire LEL (if not, replacements are easily available at any roadside supermarket).
I use one of them as back up light in case I have an issue with my primary setup.

(the spec of the Premium isn't massively different, but it's well worth having!)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: coll_coll on 20 March, 2017, 04:53:05 pm
a friend sent me this link... https://youtu.be/flk_dVHJWnk

I think he may be winding me up
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 20 March, 2017, 07:02:43 pm
Are we still talking about wet-weather gloves? Oh good ...

I'm staggered by the people who suggest wearing washing up gloves to use as waterproof gloves on the bike.  Your hands will sweat and ultimately get very cold as they are not breathable.

It seems like a good bodge for those caught out in bad weather who have access to a supermarket.  I wouldn't plan on using it deliberately.

All gloves end up soaked if you cycle in them for an hour, and the rubber gloves should be admirably windproof (and therefore reasonably warm), but the lack of breathability means your hands are going to get fairly nasty if you use them for prolonged periods.


Quote
Buy a pair of proper cycling windproof/waterproof gloves.  Planet X sell gloves for not too much if you don't want Rapha.  I can't believe that people who can afford the cost to enter LEL, plus all the travel and training events are so hard up that they cannot afford a decent pair of gloves  :facepalm:

Agreed.  But I have sympathy for those from hot countries where such things are unobtanium, and weak currency makes buying them internationally an expensive gamble if they don't know what fits.

A video posted elsewhere today/yesterday from the India Pacific Race clearly shows a rider wearing bright yellow rubbery gloves with long cuffs. It's chucking it down with big winds. Dunno if he's happy with them, but he doesn't look any more miserable than the other wet riders!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 20 March, 2017, 08:52:27 pm
His comments (on video) were "They fill up with water but then the water warms up and your hands don't get any colder"
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mmmmartin on 20 March, 2017, 09:05:14 pm
These are without doubt far and away the very best handwear for riding in the wet and cold. Flexible enough to allow braking and gear change and when wet they remain warm. I've used them in the very coldest conditions on and off the bike. Cycling gloves all get wet and they all then cool your hands, especially the fingers, in the wind caused by cycling. Mittens don't do that, and these are lined with fibre pile not cheap fleece.

http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/buffalo-pile-mitt-a3214123?id_colour=124
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Planet X Paul on 20 March, 2017, 09:18:34 pm
I remember having the same discussion some years ago when on the ultra running circuit.  There is an event called The Fellsman; a tough 61 mile moorland challenge held in April when the weather can throw anything at you.  The year in question was one of the worst, and at about 1am on the Sunday morning when most were over 40 miles into the course, the event was cancelled and runners were evacuated off the course.  On another event held on the same day in the Lake District, a runner actually died because of the conditions.  In the days preceding the event, on the Fellrunner forum, people were actually talking about using Marigolds as their waterproof gloves for the event.  Just utterly un-bloody-believable.  You cannot take 'stupid' out of some people.  That is why I am aghast at similar suggestions being made on this forum for the sake of spending £20 on a proper pair of gloves !!!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Redlight on 20 March, 2017, 10:27:51 pm
These are without doubt far and away the very best handwear for riding in the wet and cold. Flexible enough to allow braking and gear change and when wet they remain warm. I've used them in the very coldest conditions on and off the bike. Cycling gloves all get wet and they all then cool your hands, especially the fingers, in the wind caused by cycling. Mittens don't do that, and these are lined with fibre pile not cheap fleece.

http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/buffalo-pile-mitt-a3214123?id_colour=124

I'm intrigued that you can change gear wearing them. I have a pair of "lobster" mittens that I wear when skiing but on the one time that I tried them on the bike I found it very hard to change gear (I am using Campag shifters, which are a bit more fiddly than the Shimano ones).
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mmmmartin on 20 March, 2017, 11:02:38 pm
the ultra running circuit
I wore Buffalo mitts on the four times I started the High Peak Marathon, which is 42 miles in winter across Bleaklow, round the Derwent watershed, and it usually snows. Temperatures are often below freezing: Buffalo mitts are without doubt the best.

They are flexible enough to change gear using Shimano levers: obvs gear end shifters are easier. When soaking wet I have rtaken them off, squeezed them out and put them back on: still not cold.

But no one will listen to me on this: word of mouth is not as powerful as the marketing behind expensive gloves full of cheap synthetic insulation that will get wet and make your hands very cold.

BTW marigolds were used for ice climbing: windproof, waterprrof and if big enough you can wear thin woollen gloves underneath. IMO better than the expensive cycling gloves.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 20 March, 2017, 11:08:07 pm
I have a buffalo summer sleeping bag. It punches above it's weight. I've used it for hammock camping and camping on the ground, without a tent. Sheds light rain, never felt damp in it, never woke with that clammy dampness, even when rained on. Can well believe buffalo mitts are the same on bike.
I hanker after a gilet made of the exact same material, reckon it would be ace for cycling.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Planet X Paul on 20 March, 2017, 11:11:38 pm
the ultra running circuit
High Peak Marathon, which is 42 miles in winter across Bleaklow,

Been there, done that.  May have got the T-Shirt but can't remember. It was a while ago.  Buffalo mitts are good.  My partner has bad circulation and still uses a pair she must have had for 20 years and still swears by them.  Wouldn't be too different from using lobster type gloves and would certainly keep you warm.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: igauk on 21 March, 2017, 01:22:43 am
I've got a pair of Lowe Alpine Strom mitts. They've got internal fingers and work surprisingly well on the bike in extreme conditions, bit over the top for even the worst weather LEL could throw at you though.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: lookeo on 21 March, 2017, 08:52:08 pm
Thanks for all your thoughts on lighting.

Next I'll be pondering clip on TT bars.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: dasmi on 29 March, 2017, 06:19:42 pm
These are without doubt far and away the very best handwear for riding in the wet and cold. Flexible enough to allow braking and gear change and when wet they remain warm. I've used them in the very coldest conditions on and off the bike. Cycling gloves all get wet and they all then cool your hands, especially the fingers, in the wind caused by cycling. Mittens don't do that, and these are lined with fibre pile not cheap fleece.

http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/buffalo-pile-mitt-a3214123?id_colour=124

These are really good and weigh very little  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mmmmartin on 29 March, 2017, 10:45:41 pm
I hanker after a gilet made of the exact same material, reckon it would be ace for cycling.
like ]this?
http://www.buffalosystems.co.uk/products/teclite-gilet/

also found these cycling specific mitts on the Buffalo website: http://www.buffalosystems.co.uk/products/hi-vis-mitt/

must say - i wouldn't recommend a Buffalo shirt for riding because they don't pack down that small and TBH if you need to wear one there's probably ice on the road so you shouldn't be on a bike. My Big Shirt has been very warm in all sorts of conditions that can best be described as "Scottish".
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on 08 April, 2017, 08:06:37 pm
I hanker after a gilet made of the exact same material, reckon it would be ace for cycling.
like ]this?
http://www.buffalosystems.co.uk/products/teclite-gilet/

also found these cycling specific mitts on the Buffalo website: http://www.buffalosystems.co.uk/products/hi-vis-mitt/

must say - i wouldn't recommend a Buffalo shirt for riding because they don't pack down that small and TBH if you need to wear one there's probably ice on the road so you shouldn't be on a bike. My Big Shirt has been very warm in all sorts of conditions that can best be described as "Scottish".
So - when I was riding a couple of weeks ago, it was hovering between zero and -1 with rain and sleet, you wouldn't have been riding? I would have described that as perfect weather for Buffalo gear.

Those mittens look good. The gilet is close to what I'd want but for bike use I would want to be able to snug down the armpit holes and around the waist.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Wobbly on 17 April, 2017, 07:56:45 am
A bit late to this particular topic.

If you do want AA, the Fenix BT10 is an alternative to the Vision 1.  I haven't used it but have used its bigger brother the 18650-powered bigger brother the BT20, which was an excellent light that put the beam just where you needed it.

(n.b. I haven't used the Fenix BT10)

I have a BT10 and it's a cracking little light. Plenty powerful enough for night riding and it has a quirky double beam one of which aims a bit further up the road then the other. A neat idea IMO.

The only two problems with the BT10 are:

1. Fenix no longer make them. There are a couple (new) on Ebay at the mo' for just shy of £100.
2. The battery box has no indication which way round the batteries are supposed to go. Nor does it indicate how to line up the lid when you screw it back on. I solved that by scratching markings on the box and lid.

There are more powerful lights but the safety of having a decent light that runs off plain old AAs far outweighs any lack of lumens IMO.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: vorsprung on 17 April, 2017, 08:37:36 am
These are without doubt far and away the very best handwear for riding in the wet and cold. Flexible enough to allow braking and gear change and when wet they remain warm. I've used them in the very coldest conditions on and off the bike. Cycling gloves all get wet and they all then cool your hands, especially the fingers, in the wind caused by cycling. Mittens don't do that, and these are lined with fibre pile not cheap fleece.

http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/buffalo-pile-mitt-a3214123?id_colour=124

I've used gloves like this for cycle commuting in the middle of winter but for LEL they would be too warm

For summer rides (even overnight) I find that lightweight wind proof gloves are good.  Usually I take mitts + a pair of full length windproof gloves on a 400/600 or mitts + 2 pairs long gloves if rain is expected

If the temperatures are higher lightweight liner gloves are good




Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Wobbly on 17 April, 2017, 01:19:06 pm
..
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: veloboy on 17 April, 2017, 07:34:58 pm
Have used these now for years:

https://goo.gl/FLCqGd (https://goo.gl/FLCqGd)

Shower-roof for sure, though you hands will get wet in sustained rain; but at least they dry out (almost) as quickly!
Can also use a very thin pair of silk liners, when the temps really drop below 0 degrees - not bad for gloves I purchased over six years ago and still going strong!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Wobbly on 05 May, 2017, 05:48:09 pm
So, here's the "equipment" I've bought for LEL. It arrived only today.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C_E3yyeXoAAzjG8.jpg:large)

...is there a "bike porn" thread on YACF?  ;D
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Veloman on 05 May, 2017, 05:52:24 pm
^^^^^^^^^^^^  Lightweight!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on 05 May, 2017, 06:47:37 pm
Nice! I'd thought about riding one of them next PBP.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: veloboy on 05 May, 2017, 08:55:37 pm
Love that sea tube angle - looking just soooo relaxed!!   8)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Wobbly on 05 May, 2017, 09:29:41 pm
It's strange. Photos don't do the Guv'nor justice; the wheelbase is sooo long.

I've only ridden it about 200 metres so far. The desperation's building!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: jsabine on 06 May, 2017, 05:30:14 am
Does this one come with a mounting clip for the lump hammerfine adjuster?
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 06 May, 2017, 11:56:53 am
It's strange. Photos don't do the Guv'nor justice; the wheelbase is sooo long.

I've only ridden it about 200 metres so far.
Did you make the time limit?
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Wobbly on 06 May, 2017, 03:57:53 pm
I shall not dignify either MattC or jsabines comments with a reply.

You're both clearly very, very jealous.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Mile Cruncher on 07 May, 2017, 10:25:01 am
1. I got this Ibex Merino wool base layer . I'm planning to use it from Brampton-Brampton.(300 Km)

https://www.amazon.com/Ibex-Merino-Woolies-Sleeve-Medium/dp/B00YSGUZMA/ref=sr_1_1?s=outdoor-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1488032854&sr=1-1&keywords=ibex%2Bwoolies%2B1&th=1&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.com/Ibex-Merino-Woolies-Sleeve-Medium/dp/B00YSGUZMA/ref=sr_1_1?s=outdoor-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1488032854&sr=1-1&keywords=ibex%2Bwoolies%2B1&th=1&psc=1)

Can anyone let me know if this can withstand the cold ? ( Combined with a  jersey and gillet)

Loughton- Brampton and back, I'm planning to use my normal btwin base layer. I have used it in few winter brevets ,where temperature  was around 10 C. Should I get another merino base layer for riding in nights till Brampton or will the btwin base layer be sufficient ?

2. Riding with Crocs - I know many don't prefer it. But I'm worried about riding with wet shoes if it rains. I got pissed off in my first ever 400 BRM, where it rained for nearly 24 hours. Since then, I started riding with Sandals in rainy season. I did a 1000 too, with Sandals. So my idea is to use woollen socks if it is dry and cold and waterproof socks, if it rains and gets cold. Will this work ? or does people usually prefer riding with wet shoes even if it is very uncomfortable ? Please suggest.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: jsabine on 07 May, 2017, 07:51:42 pm
Sandals provoke mixed reactions. I use them - albeit Exustar  SPD sandals, not Crocs - a lot and have ridden a few long brevets with them, and some very experienced riders also swear by them.

Others - probably far more, if I'm honest - either don't understand the attraction, or just think it's a very eccentric choice.

As for clothing choices, layers are your friend. I'd rather carry an extra one and not use it, than need one more than I have - but I run fairly cold. A few days ago, I was too hot with two layers, while friends wearing four were too cold.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: igauk on 19 May, 2017, 10:03:49 pm
1. I got this Ibex Merino wool base layer . I'm planning to use it from Brampton-Brampton.(300 Km)

https://www.amazon.com/Ibex-Merino-Woolies-Sleeve-Medium/dp/B00YSGUZMA/ref=sr_1_1?s=outdoor-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1488032854&sr=1-1&keywords=ibex%2Bwoolies%2B1&th=1&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.com/Ibex-Merino-Woolies-Sleeve-Medium/dp/B00YSGUZMA/ref=sr_1_1?s=outdoor-recreation&ie=UTF8&qid=1488032854&sr=1-1&keywords=ibex%2Bwoolies%2B1&th=1&psc=1)

Can anyone let me know if this can withstand the cold ? ( Combined with a  jersey and gillet)

Loughton- Brampton and back, I'm planning to use my normal btwin base layer. I have used it in few winter brevets ,where temperature  was around 10 C. Should I get another merino base layer for riding in nights till Brampton or will the btwin base layer be sufficient ?

2. Riding with Crocs - I know many don't prefer it. But I'm worried about riding with wet shoes if it rains. I got pissed off in my first ever 400 BRM, where it rained for nearly 24 hours. Since then, I started riding with Sandals in rainy season. I did a 1000 too, with Sandals. So my idea is to use woollen socks if it is dry and cold and waterproof socks, if it rains and gets cold. Will this work ? or does people usually prefer riding with wet shoes even if it is very uncomfortable ? Please suggest.

Youll be fine with those base layers. Almost exactly my approach, which base layer goes in the bagdrop and which I start with will depend on the weather forecast (not that they can be relied on) but at any point in time I'll have base layer, jersey, gillet, waterproof, reflective vest. I've no experience of riding with sandals, but crocs would seem a bit soft, although they're very light and comfortable off the bike!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Moleman76 on 05 June, 2017, 04:46:07 am
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Senz-Dutch-Bicycle-Umbrella-With-Fitting-Bracket-Kit-Fits-to-your-Handlebars-/201943664746?category=0&buyerid=FpRekKD1aqDv5WwHo9CtOw==&emailtemplateid=131397735&sellerid=eJGfcJBwsRIaIamN3L6UOA==&refid=store&ssPageName=ADME:B:SEMK:UK:SHOWI (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Senz-Dutch-Bicycle-Umbrella-With-Fitting-Bracket-Kit-Fits-to-your-Handlebars-/201943664746?category=0&buyerid=FpRekKD1aqDv5WwHo9CtOw==&emailtemplateid=131397735&sellerid=eJGfcJBwsRIaIamN3L6UOA==&refid=store&ssPageName=ADME:B:SEMK:UK:SHOWI)

"You don't need to arrive in head-to-toe Goretex with bad hair, you can arrive in your dapper everyday clothes and stylish wig when you use the Senz bicycle umbrella!"

And in the event of a tailwind, raise the spinnaker accessory
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mmmmartin on 05 June, 2017, 09:23:17 am
Riding with Crocs
is utter madness for 1,400k. Cycling sandals, and specifically the very excellent Shimano ones, are great because they have a sole thick enough to protect your poor feet from the pressure of the pedals. Crocs just won't do it. And sandals allow your feet to expand a bit but cycling shoes don't. (Wearing socks with sandals is poo-pooed in the UK as being thoroughly uncool. Which is why the combination is so popular in audax circles. Socksd with union jacks on them are for numpties and UKIP supports thobut.

And riding in wet feet? Normal for UK. But those Sealskinz waterproof socks keep my feet warm in the coldest rain.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Wobbly on 05 June, 2017, 10:31:20 am
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Senz-Dutch-Bicycle-Umbrella-With-Fitting-Bracket-Kit-Fits-to-your-Handlebars-/201943664746?category=0&buyerid=FpRekKD1aqDv5WwHo9CtOw==&emailtemplateid=131397735&sellerid=eJGfcJBwsRIaIamN3L6UOA==&refid=store&ssPageName=ADME:B:SEMK:UK:SHOWI (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Senz-Dutch-Bicycle-Umbrella-With-Fitting-Bracket-Kit-Fits-to-your-Handlebars-/201943664746?category=0&buyerid=FpRekKD1aqDv5WwHo9CtOw==&emailtemplateid=131397735&sellerid=eJGfcJBwsRIaIamN3L6UOA==&refid=store&ssPageName=ADME:B:SEMK:UK:SHOWI)

"You don't need to arrive in head-to-toe Goretex with bad hair, you can arrive in your dapper everyday clothes and stylish wig when you use the Senz bicycle umbrella!"

And in the event of a tailwind, raise the spinnaker accessory

Do I really need to post my LEL 2013 I-took-a-golf-umbrella-to-Edinburgh-and-back picture again?

 ;D
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: vorsprung on 06 June, 2017, 08:24:35 am

Loughton- Brampton and back, I'm planning to use my normal btwin base layer. I have used it in few winter brevets ,where temperature  was around 10 C. Should I get another merino base layer for riding in nights till Brampton or will the btwin base layer be sufficient ?
merino tends to be too hot and doesn't wick well.  I sometimes wear two in the middle of winter when it's  less than -10 degrees.  Clearly you have a very different tolerance of heat/cold to UK riders

Quote
2. Riding with Crocs - I know many don't prefer it. ..or does people usually prefer riding with wet shoes even if it is very uncomfortable ? Please suggest.
Crocs seem very unsuitable to me.  Agree that wet shoes are bad but this isn't the answer.  I'll be taking overshoes to keep the worst of the rain out and lots of spare socks
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mattc on 06 June, 2017, 01:11:02 pm
Merino comes in a range of thicknesses.

The 100g is rare (anyone seen a good cycle-specific base-layer recently? let me know!), 150-200g seems to be most common for stuff sold as "base-layer". I've certainly seen 250g, and maybe makers of very warm stuff just stop quoting that figure, not sure. (it's probably irrelevant for a "jumper")

Anyways .. I've worn my paper-thin base layer in stinky heat, and indeed that is one of the marketed applications. And I've worn 2 layers in sub-zero!

(I think it probably wicks pretty well - the thing is, it is very slow to completely dry. Of course it stays very warm even when soaked, that's one of its 2 USPs.)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: redfalo on 06 June, 2017, 05:06:27 pm
I'm with Vorsprung regarding Merino. The thin versions work very nicely even in the hottest of summer (35 degrees plus).

As for Milecruncher's baselayer question: I think general advise is really difficult to give, as it hinges on your personal ability to cope with low temperatures as well as the actual weather during the event, and of course the rest of the clothing you are wearing. It may be too much, it may be ok, it may be too little. As others have said, layers will be your friend.

I'd be skeptical about any advice Brits give you about temperatures. Everything above 25 degrees is quickly considered a "heat wave" in this country, and even in December you can see posties delivering mail in shorts (seriously!). For whatever reasons, British people tend to have a much higher tolerance for cold temperatures than continental Europeans.

I am a continental European and think I have a moderate tolerance for low temperatures. As a reference point, here's what I wore on a 400 Audax in East Anglia over the last weekend:


- base layer: Icebreaker Meriono tank top (150 g fabric weight)
- short sleeved lycra cycling jersey
- short bib shorts

That worked fine during the day. At around 8pm, I put on merino armwarmers, and a windstopper gilet. After sunset, I added my PBP reflective vest and legwarmers. After midnight, I also  added a long-sleeved merino jersey (probably similar to your merino baselayer), my waterproof rain jacket, long windstopper gloves, waterproof Gore socks on top of my merino socks (against the cold) and a merino buff. Temperatures at night dropped to around 9 degrees, and the kit was just enough. Had it been less, I would have wished for another layer, especially if you think of having to fix a mechanical in the dark. Or if it had rained. I'll most probably carry all this kit plus one more layer (a short sleeved merino jersey) on my bike on LEL.

Cycling in crocs? Just don't even think about it. It's unlikely that it will rain 12 or 24 hours non-stop. Your feet might get soaked, but if you carry spare socks, and maybe waterproof socks (which won't keep the rain out if it chucks down heavily, but will still keep your feet warm), you should be fine. Top tip for dealing with wet shoes: stuff them with newspapers while at a control - they will dry out much quicker.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Veloman on 06 June, 2017, 05:22:37 pm
Last time I was helping at a control on LEL we did not have newspaper so best bring your own!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: jsabine on 07 June, 2017, 01:37:51 am
Cycling in crocs? Just don't even think about it.

Don't forget that Mile Cruncher has already ridden at least one 1000km brevet (and probably several more shorter ones) with sandals, so s/he's used to them. I'll certainly be in sandals - SPD rather than regular, admittedly - and unashamedly wearing socks with them if needed.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Kim on 07 June, 2017, 01:57:45 pm
Cycling in Crocs is best done by onesie-clad children at the Mildenhall rally.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Chris N on 07 June, 2017, 03:06:55 pm
I recall a rider (Bob Bialek, maybe?) on Yr Elenydd a few years ago using red crocs with flat pedals, so it's obviously possible to ride long distances in them.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Mile Cruncher on 10 June, 2017, 05:45:10 am
Thanks a lot Redfalo for sharing your experience and suggestions about base layers. I will plan something similar.

Regarding, shoes or sandals,I'm awaiting a delivery of waterproof socks. If I get them, shoes. Else sandals. No more confusion.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: aidan.f on 11 June, 2017, 10:21:45 pm
Control list: carrier bag for water bottles, valuables cycling shoes* clothing that you want to take off/put on in the warm and light inside.
Top tip. Shoes off at every opportunity.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Tomsk on 12 June, 2017, 08:24:38 am
Control list: carrier bag for water bottles, valuables cycling shoes* clothing that you want to take off/put on in the warm and light inside.
Top tip. Shoes off at every opportunity.

 :thumbsup: to carrier bags. Also good for sitting on damp ground, tyre boots...and shopping! Carry, or acquire, a spare en-route - they can get a bit manky with leaks from bidons, mud off shoes etc. I have a very compact rucksack that I take on tour [crushes to about the size of an orange] - I may find room for that to sling stuff in to keeps hands free in controls, but still use carrier bags for the potentially messy stuff that will go in. I used to take my bar bag in, but it's rather a lump.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Divingrob on 13 June, 2017, 09:59:25 am
This might be a daft question but do I need to bring a towel? I know there are many controls with showers.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Fidgetbuzz on 13 June, 2017, 10:54:49 am

This might be a daft question  .. yes....  I agree with you

We are aiming to provide some towels at every control .. BUT ..if you can tell us how to predict the towel demand at each control both northbound and southbound .. then you are  a better man than I am Gunga Din.

If it is important to you .. then either shower at the controls where you have a drop bag .. which has a towel in .. or carry a small travel towel with you.

Common sense would tell you that this is impossible for us to get 100% accurate .
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Divingrob on 13 June, 2017, 10:58:48 am
I'm a better man than a lot of people
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: rob on 13 June, 2017, 11:20:33 am
Make sure your carrier bag isn't too rattly, though.   A few people in the same room as me at Fougeres on the return on PBP got the hump as I failed, repeatedly, to find my earplugs in the dark.    :facepalm:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: The French Tandem on 13 June, 2017, 11:59:15 am
We are aiming to provide some towels at every control .. BUT ..if you can tell us how to predict the towel demand at each control both northbound and southbound .. then you are  a better man than I am Gunga Din.

My impression is that the towel service in 2013 was pretty good, in spite of the towel supplier who let you down at the last moment, so if no supplier let you down this time, I expect the service to be excellent!
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: igauk on 20 June, 2017, 12:48:05 am
I got myself one of those micro towels from a camping shop for PBP, packs to the size of a tennis ball in it's own little stuff sack. Had it hanging off my saddlebag until someone nicked it at the start, scrotes. Wouldn't have needed it in the end but might be handy to have.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Kim on 20 June, 2017, 12:48:49 am
I got myself one of those micro towels from a camping shop for PBP, packs to the size of a tennis ball in it's own little stuff sack. Had it hanging off my saddlebag until someone nicked it at the start, scrotes. Wouldn't have needed it in the end but might be handy to have.

You should always know where your towel is... (http://hitchhikers.wikia.com/wiki/Towel)
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: igauk on 22 June, 2017, 12:26:38 am
I got myself one of those micro towels from a camping shop for PBP, packs to the size of a tennis ball in it's own little stuff sack. Had it hanging off my saddlebag until someone nicked it at the start, scrotes. Wouldn't have needed it in the end but might be handy to have.

You should always know where your towel is... (http://hitchhikers.wikia.com/wiki/Towel)

Damn right.."any man who can hitch the length and breadth of the Galaxy, rough it, slum it, struggle against terrible odds, win through and still knows where his towel is, is clearly a man to be reckoned with. "
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Kim on 22 June, 2017, 12:38:12 am
Do note that hitch-hiking with alien spacecraft is considered cheating under AUK regulations.  For the benefit of other riders, any recitation of Vogon poetry should be done between controls.  The infinite improbability drive may be deployed at any time on the return leg of the ride.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: mmmmartin on 22 June, 2017, 10:51:06 pm
And travelling with the aid of a Ford Prefect is also against Auk rules, I believe.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: eddum on 23 June, 2017, 09:32:25 am
Ah so... at the risk of getting a fine.... is it stated somewhere which controls have showers ?  :smug:
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: jsabine on 23 June, 2017, 10:30:13 am
The FAQ (https://londonedinburghlondon.com/faq/) helpfully tells you that "Controls at Innerleithen/Traquair, Eskdalemuir and Great Easton will have no showers available."

Extrapolating from that data may be left as an exercise for the reader.
</straight bat>

Phil's riding in Ireland at the moment so your wallet is probably safe.
Title: Re: LEL equipment
Post by: Fidgetbuzz on 23 June, 2017, 01:43:19 pm
But the money man is still around ,, a query that has been on FAQ for 6 months .. that is not £100 ......  it was defined as £500 ages ago. Debit card details please ? Roger