Author Topic: Making vehicle drivers give you more room  (Read 1026 times)

Riggers

  • Mine's a pipe, er… pint!
Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« on: 22 November, 2021, 10:09:16 am »
I'm thinking of: unnecessary close passes made by dozy/lazy/inattentive/bellend drivers. And I have, on more than one occasion, been pondering buying a 'lollipop' to stick out the side on the seat downtube. However, a friend, as a recent birthday present, gave me a https://passpixi.com '. You can either: magnetically position it over one of the rear cycle shirt pockets or, as I do, have it on the back of my small back pack.

Results: I am very very impressed! On a couple of recent 3.5-hour road rides I was given a heck of a lot more 'passing room', not only by the usual modern-family-saloon-bigger-that-some-vans but, commercial vehicles were incredibly respectful*.

Okay, to be fair, with regard to the hundreds of cars that must surely have passed me, not everyone played the game, but it really was a significant amount to be noticeable.

*with vehicle drivers, this word is used loosely. It's most likely a recognition that they might appear on YouTube or their company's bosses are made aware of, or possibly – though don't hold your breath – a visit from the police!
Certainly never seen cycling south of Sussex

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #1 on: 22 November, 2021, 11:19:29 am »
Happy Burpday Riggers.


It's funny, but I think any change makes a benefit.    As I've posted before, I added more and more hi-viz and lights and stuff and it got worse and worse and worse on my commute.   When I made the "awkward" choice to cycle just as a human in normal clothes the change was dramatic and the incidents reduced dramatically.  I've been in casual clothes and minimal legal lighting at night pretty much since then.

I don't think any hi-viz or cameras would have prevented my last "off" when I tried turning left on a patch of oil.  (and thanks to wearing normal shorts and t-shirt there was no damage to delicate lycra, just normal knees and knuckles ).

I am wondering though, whether just sticking a CCTV logo on the back of the bike wouldn't be too much effort; after all, most houses and shops and roads I cycle along will have a camera nowadays  ;)

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #2 on: 22 November, 2021, 11:21:31 am »
Just strap an umbrella (or similar pointy object) horizontally across the rear rack.  Or ride a recumbent trike.

If you look like a normal cyclist, the only thing that makes a real difference seems to be riding further from the kerb.

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #3 on: 22 November, 2021, 11:21:40 am »
Isn't this similar to the old

"POLITE"

hi viz vests?

Riggers

  • Mine's a pipe, er… pint!
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #4 on: 22 November, 2021, 11:49:23 am »
Thank you Nutters. It was one of those 'so-called' significant birthdays that make you think: "Okay, let's move on folks nothing to see here!"

My normal reaction to a too-close pass nowadays is the wildly-jabbed right arm outstretched (and used to employ two fingers as well but stopped that) but, as I say, as an experiment, the results from the two rides has been positive for me. I may yet employ a 'lollipop' – who knows! I think this Kimmers, unlike an umbrella, might be the first approach to employ on my Roberts road bike!  :)

Though, like many others on here, I've thought of employing an everyday object. It isn't a case of drivers afraid to hit you, as we all know – it's the damage their car will suffer scraping past that object the cyclist's carrying.
Certainly never seen cycling south of Sussex

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #5 on: 22 November, 2021, 11:50:31 am »
Isn't this similar to the old

"POLITE"

hi viz vests?

That was the first thing that came to my mind.

It's interesting to read of Riggers' experience, but I remain skeptical that such a thing would make any difference round my way. As per Kim, I find the only thing that makes any difference is riding further out from the kerb.

When drivers are determined to pass, they will do so - even if it means going all the way across double white lines on a blind bend.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #6 on: 22 November, 2021, 11:52:20 am »
Seems as much an invitation for aggro as a deterrent.

Also if someone does knock you off they’ll know they need to come back and steal your camera.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #7 on: 22 November, 2021, 11:57:50 am »
I've been in casual clothes and minimal legal lighting at night pretty much since then.
Having no lights at all seems, from observation, to result in wider and more cautious passes. I think this is because drivers assume that you're going to be careless. But this is in a well lit urban area; I think it would be different in a rural area or even in the suburbs, where speeds are generally higher.
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #8 on: 22 November, 2021, 12:19:26 pm »

If you look like a normal cyclist, the only thing that makes a real difference seems to be riding further from the kerb.

That is my experience too.

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #9 on: 22 November, 2021, 02:03:12 pm »
Wasn't there a peer reviewed experiment I read about many moons ago as part of the h*lm*t threads where a male university professor conducted several similar rides, and found that close passes were a thing with a h*lm*t, fewer things without a h*lm*t and reduced further when he was wearing a wig with flowing locks (both with and without h*lm*t?

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #10 on: 22 November, 2021, 02:08:17 pm »
I've been in casual clothes and minimal legal lighting at night pretty much since then.
Having no lights at all seems, from observation, to result in wider and more cautious passes. I think this is because drivers assume that you're going to be careless. But this is in a well lit urban area; I think it would be different in a rural area or even in the suburbs, where speeds are generally higher.

I'd agree, but cannot condone the behaviour, that riding unlit is safer.

the reason I abandoned hi-viz/excessive lights was an experience where I was nearly knocked off by a driver pulling out of a layby.  I spoke politely at the next set of lights and he was very apologetic.  As I've posted before his statement was that he'd seen the other cyclist but not me.

The other cyclist was an elderly gent, on his 1950's bike with glimmering dynamo lights, and wearing his dark long coat.   I was following him in hi-viz jacket with built in lighting, flashing LEDs on each front fork, legal filament bulb light on the crown, bright lights on the handlebars, and I think also a head torch.    the driver saw the "cyclist" in front of me, then pulled out into me!

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #11 on: 22 November, 2021, 02:46:07 pm »
Wasn't there a peer reviewed experiment I read about many moons ago as part of the h*lm*t threads where a male university professor conducted several similar rides, and found that close passes were a thing with a h*lm*t, fewer things without a h*lm*t and reduced further when he was wearing a wig with flowing locks (both with and without h*lm*t?
Indeed. Someone from the University of Bath I think. Ian Walker possibly ?
Rust never sleeps

Cudzoziemiec

  • Моя планета голубая, я люблю тебя и обнимаю
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #12 on: 22 November, 2021, 02:54:14 pm »
Wasn't there a peer reviewed experiment I read about many moons ago as part of the h*lm*t threads where a male university professor conducted several similar rides, and found that close passes were a thing with a h*lm*t, fewer things without a h*lm*t and reduced further when he was wearing a wig with flowing locks (both with and without h*lm*t?
Indeed. Someone from the University of Bath I think. Ian Walker possibly ?
Yes. I believe he also holds some sort of distance record. At any rate a serious cyclist as well as researcher.
Riding a bike through a city is like navigating the collective neural pathways of a vast global mind.

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #13 on: 22 November, 2021, 03:20:09 pm »
Wasn't there a peer reviewed experiment I read about many moons ago as part of the h*lm*t threads where a male university professor conducted several similar rides, and found that close passes were a thing with a h*lm*t, fewer things without a h*lm*t and reduced further when he was wearing a wig with flowing locks (both with and without h*lm*t?
Indeed. Someone from the University of Bath I think. Ian Walker possibly ?

Rings a massive bell in my mind.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #14 on: 22 November, 2021, 04:38:31 pm »
Massive bells, meanwhile, are completely useless for getting a decent amount of space on the road.

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #15 on: 22 November, 2021, 05:00:46 pm »
Massive bells, meanwhile, are completely useless for getting a decent amount of space on the road.

...unless it is pedestrianised.
If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is...

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #16 on: 22 November, 2021, 05:04:12 pm »
Massive bells, meanwhile, are completely useless for getting a decent amount of space on the road.

...unless it is pedestrianised.

Ah yes.  Bells are only 66% useless around pedestrians.

Adam

  • It'll soon be summer
    • Charity ride Durness to Dover 18-25th June 2011
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #17 on: 22 November, 2021, 05:34:04 pm »

Okay, to be fair, with regard to the hundreds of cars that must surely have passed me, not everyone played the game, but it really was a significant amount to be noticeable.


A friend has one of those stuck onto the side of her offside pannier, and said she noticed an appreciable reduction in close passes.  Not eliminated entirely but far less stress.
“Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving.” -Albert Einstein

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #18 on: 22 November, 2021, 06:00:47 pm »
Yes. I believe he also holds some sort of distance record. At any rate a serious cyclist as well as researcher.
For a mad moment, I thought you meant "... for the widest pass ever of a cyclist".

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #19 on: 22 November, 2021, 06:06:55 pm »
Massive bells, meanwhile, are completely useless for getting a decent amount of space on the road.

How massive are we talking?
https://create180.co.uk/projects/christmas-ding-dong-bell-costume

Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #20 on: 22 November, 2021, 06:29:28 pm »

When drivers are determined to pass, they will do so - even if it means going all the way across double white lines on a blind be  their wing-mirror taking skin off your elbow, or you ending
up in a ditch.

Gattopardo

  • Lord of the sith
  • Overseaing the building of the death star
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #21 on: 22 November, 2021, 06:34:44 pm »
Am I still the forum petrolhead ;)

People get it cars and become absolute terrible people.  Drivers forget that being able to use the road is a privilege and most people using it have passed the bare minimum to be on it.

Riggers

  • Mine's a pipe, er… pint!
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #22 on: 22 November, 2021, 06:47:16 pm »

Okay, to be fair, with regard to the hundreds of cars that must surely have passed me, not everyone played the game, but it really was a significant amount to be noticeable.


A friend has one of those stuck onto the side of her offside pannier, and said she noticed an appreciable reduction in close passes.  Not eliminated entirely but far less stress.

I believe the positioning of mine – on the rear of a back pack – plays its part in being more noticeable by them that have to be in HUGE family cars and those lovely chaps in commercial vehicles. I can only report positive results!
Certainly never seen cycling south of Sussex

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #23 on: 22 November, 2021, 07:47:21 pm »

Isn't the cheap option to strap a pool noodle across your rear rack (if you have one?)

And yes, it was Dr Ian Walker who did the tests referred to above.

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Adam

  • It'll soon be summer
    • Charity ride Durness to Dover 18-25th June 2011
Re: Making vehicle drivers give you more room
« Reply #24 on: 22 November, 2021, 08:21:44 pm »

Isn't the cheap option to strap a pool noodle across your rear rack (if you have one?)

J

I really must dig out my reading glasses - I was initially thinking the poodle would wriggle too much.
“Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving.” -Albert Einstein