DNF rate

[mrcharly-YHT]

There is a reason the TDF lot wanted to come back to that area to race. The terrain makes for challenging riding that can break up a peloton and really add interest to a race.

Charlie Wegelius ex TdF domestique and later a DS for various teams used to live in our village near Malton on the edge of the Wolds and beginning of the Howardian Hills. He told me this area was a right PITA to train in as the hills were smaller but more vicious than most of the ones on continental tours and broke up your rhythm badly.

'Vicious' is a good description.

I have lived in a couple of hilly areas; on Ilkley moor, above Holmfirth. Could ride up any gradient but was utterly useless at spinning out a gear at a good pace.

I've seen pictures of people's bikes (for LEL) and thought "You are going to regret those gears".

[LittleWheelsandBig]

According to some, it is a matter of Rule 5, the bowdlerised version being “Harden up, princess!”? Get fitter than the average LRM finisher or expect to fail LEL?

Any particular reason why LEL needs to be noticeably harder than the vast majority of LRM brevets? Do we want to winnow out the weaker riders from entering or do we just tell them up front that they are not likely to finish in time?

[fimm]

I once started a 200km in February or March in which it snowed and only 3 of the starters finished. It went over the Forth Bridge and I don't remember where it was supposed to go after that.

[alwyn]

According to some, it is a matter of Rule 5, the bowdlerised version being “Harden up, princess!”? Get fitter than the average LRM finisher or expect to fail LEL?

Any particular reason why LEL needs to be noticeably harder than the vast majority of LRM brevets? Do we want to winnow out the weaker riders from entering or do we just tell them up front that they are not likely to finish in time?

You can froth and swear all you like on here. Your opinion on this matter is ill-informed and largely worthless.

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Your event, your organisation, your decisions.

Who does have worthwhile opinions about this, other than you?

[Notfromrugby]

Your event, your organisation, your decisions.

Who does have worthwhile opinions about this, other than you?

Aside from being extremely rude in most of your posts, you are effectively criticising someone who puts thousands of hours of work into this event as a volunteer. You talk as if you somehow owned LEL, as if somehow you had any rights over it.
I suggest you talk to the AUK supremos and see if you can take over as organiser or alternatively set out your own LRM, with a route that suits you better

[toontra]

Organisation wise, the difference between 2009 and subsequent years is night and day.  It's now a professional-standard event but run by volunteers.  It puts some paid-staff events (e.g. Ride London) to shame.

The Yad Moss closure, and at such short notice, must have been a body-blow to the orgs.  They have my sympathy.

[FifeingEejit]

I once started a 200km in February or March in which it snowed and only 3 of the starters finished. It went over the Forth Bridge and I don't remember where it was supposed to go after that.

Is this the legendary year on the Forth and Tay?
IIRC the first North Coast Classic 600 only had 2 riders make the 2nd control in time, and that was the flat bit!

[LittleWheelsandBig]

There is a person on my very-short blocked list posting quite a lot on this thread. Is it worth the effort to read those contributions?

[vorsprung]

There is a person on my very-short blocked list posting quite a lot on this thread. Is it worth the effort to read those contributions?

Remember, you blocked them for a reason

[LittleWheelsandBig]

Organisation wise, the difference between 2009 and subsequent years is night and day.  It's now a professional-standard event but run by volunteers.  It puts some paid-staff events (e.g. Ride London) to shame.

The Yad Moss closure, and at such short notice, must have been a body-blow to the orgs.  They have my sympathy.

Agreed on both points.

[fimm]

I once started a 200km in February or March in which it snowed and only 3 of the starters finished. It went over the Forth Bridge and I don't remember where it was supposed to go after that.

Is this the legendary year on the Forth and Tay?
IIRC the first North Coast Classic 600 only had 2 riders make the 2nd control in time, and that was the flat bit!

Sounds right, yes. I was hoping someone would remember more about it than I do...

[GavinC]

I've cobbled together a route from London to Edinburgh (Fourth Road Bridge anyway) which combines the best bits (in my opinion  ) of all the LEL's from 2005 onwards, plus a few of my own changes.  I do this every June (at audax speeds so roughly 2 days of 350k) so it's had multiple tweaks in that time.

It follows the more westerly route akin to LEL's 2005/9 which in my opinion were preferable, and it's a damn sight less hilly than 2013 onwards  .  Probably not long enough or with suitable control points for today's much larger LEL though.

Sounds good. I don’t suppose you have a gpx of the route do you?

[Rupert]

I am currently on tour following the LEL route between Humber Bridge to Alston and back.

FWIW the Yad Moss road is and has been open to cyclists.  The works in place are putting down a new cattle grid and there is a gate at the side where you can get by.  I came back that way this morning.

I followed the official route yesterday and the decent down to St.Johns Chapel was scary especially with some very tired riders that I encountered.  The pop-up cafe at St.Johns Chapel and again at The Nook just north of Alston were simply brilliant though.

I gave out a lot of encouragement to many as they passed through Alston last night and again this morning.  I was the one wearing a purple YACF jersey.

[GavinC]

FWIW the Yad Moss road is and has been open to cyclists.  The works in place are putting down a new cattle grid and there is a gate at the side where you can get by.  I came back that way this morning.

I think the concern was about hundreds of cyclists going through.

[L CC]

FWIW the Yad Moss road is and has been open to cyclists.  The works in place are putting down a new cattle grid and there is a gate at the side where you can get by.  I came back that way this morning.

I think the concern was about hundreds of cyclists going through.

And that's the whole issue with free routing- any one of us can make a personal judgement on suitable roads for us- but The Route has to be OK for hundreds of riders, from all over, day & night, and pass by places willing to host them. The Yad Moss closure was just unlucky.
It's not 2009 any more.

[rogerzilla]

The descent to St John's Chapel has a cattle grid at the fastest bit.  It goes "BRP" at 48mph.  I couldn't go any faster as I was on an MTB with a headwind.  I would have thought that hill is good for 70mph on a good day.

Must be awful having to do Harthope Moss and Killhope Cross within an hour of each other.  Yad Moss was one easier climb instead of two evil ones.

[Flite]

The locals would not want hundreds of cyclists using the stock gate at Yad Moss CG because of the probability of it being left open.
Riders assuming those behind will close it, when those behind don't know it needs to be shut.
Especially in  the dark....
When a CG was being repaired not too far away, the farmer got so sick of the stock gate being left open he padlocked it.
And would riders need to be warned of gates - yet more to remember.

And yes, our good CGs make a very satisfying noise when taken at speed!

[toontra]

I've cobbled together a route from London to Edinburgh (Fourth Road Bridge anyway) which combines the best bits (in my opinion  ) of all the LEL's from 2005 onwards, plus a few of my own changes.  I do this every June (at audax speeds so roughly 2 days of 350k) so it's had multiple tweaks in that time.

It follows the more westerly route akin to LEL's 2005/9 which in my opinion were preferable, and it's a damn sight less hilly than 2013 onwards  .  Probably not long enough or with suitable control points for today's much larger LEL though.

Sounds good. I don’t suppose you have a gpx of the route do you?

Sure - I'll PM them.

[GavinC]

Thanks 

[Fidgetbuzz]

FWIW the Yad Moss road is and has been open to cyclists.  The works in place are putting down a new cattle grid and there is a gate at the side where you can get by.  I came back that way this morning.

i am sorry to point out that this is an unthinking comment .. 1500 riders each way .. 3000 going  thru the gate .. velomobiles , recumbents  . ??   Do i close the gate or not .. I think there is someone not far behind me !!!!  One person easy .. 3000 not permitted .. Stop and think please
we did not want to lose Yad Moss .. we were forced to .. we  had hours of conversations with the relevant engineer etc. . never mind the similar foolish input from our own riders who insisted that going through  the gate is easy

[Flâneur]

I was there.  Admittedly not riding, but controlling secretly somewhere along that section.  Many riders commented on the terrain, some with irritation (and possibly a slight realisation that in fact they'd bitten off more than they could chew) and some with enthusiam about the staggering views.  Few with quite the charm you have displayed!  Perhaps you were expecting a KoM?

But they didn’t bite it off, it was rammed in their mouth by the organiser and his advisers within 2 weeks of the event and entry fees/flights/ accommodation were paid for, when Yad Moss became unavailable. And I say that as someone who has been over Killhope Cross and Chapel Fell today.

If you were officially controlling today, might have been an idea to refer to that and/or have AUK banners rather than just hand out water

[The French Tandem]

But they didn’t bite it off, it was rammed in their mouth by the organiser and his advisers within 2 weeks of the event and entry fees/flights/ accommodation were paid for, when Yad Moss became unavailable. And I say that as someone who has been over Killhope Cross and Chapel Fell today.

Could we please stop blaming the organisers for things that are obviously out of their control? Danial and his team are doing a wonderful job, and they don't even get paid for that. I do not believe that anyone in a similar situation could do anything better.

A

[Peter]

I was there.  Admittedly not riding, but controlling secretly somewhere along that section.  Many riders commented on the terrain, some with irritation (and possibly a slight realisation that in fact they'd bitten off more than they could chew) and some with enthusiam about the staggering views.  Few with quite the charm you have displayed!  Perhaps you were expecting a KoM?

But they didn’t bite it off, it was rammed in their mouth by the organiser and his advisers within 2 weeks of the event and entry fees/flights/ accommodation were paid for, when Yad Moss became unavailable. And I say that as someone who has been over Killhope Cross and Chapel Fell today.

If you were officially controlling today, might have been an idea to refer to that and/or have AUK banners rather than just hand out water

The route of which you speak was "rammed in the mouths" of the organisers by the engineers, who wanted the road closed, understandably and with very little notice.  As far as I'm concerned, the organisers had no choice but to send the ride the way they did when faced with that sudden alteration.  And they got the information out as fast as they could. 

I was actually volunteering (and was in place a day early putting up the very banners with which you threaten me!) on the Helmsley to Osmotherley section which everyone has known about for ages., so there!  I've never controlled anything in my life and that includes my mouth, though I, at least, try.  If I was cheerful to you when you came through, I'm sorry - I take it back.

[Fidgetbuzz]

[

But they didn’t bite it off, it was rammed in their mouth by the organiser and his advisers within 2 weeks of the event and entry fees/flights/ accommodation were paid for, when Yad Moss became unavailable. And I say that as someone who has been over Killhope Cross and Chapel Fell today.

when you see this sort of mindless critical comment .. I  really do wonder why I put so  many hours a week for nearly 3 years to try to provide the Uk premier ride for so many riders .  instead of saying we rammed the diversion into the event , when clearly that had never been our intention.. can you suggest any other alternative route that would not have involved huge extra distance on fast dangerous roads.  We could not even cancel the whole event .. as large amounts had already been spent or committed .. so there could have been no full refund. pardon my bluntness .. but the use of rammed in your post suggests that we had other options available to us .. which is complete bollocks.
It was that or nothing