Author Topic: Chain Lube  (Read 13601 times)

bludger

  • Randonneur and bargain hunter
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #50 on: 07 April, 2019, 03:15:41 pm »
https://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/TOBST9WL/boeshield-t-9-waterproof-lubrication

Boeshield T-9



It's not the cheapest in the world (£15) but it really is the dog's dick as far as I can tell. Supposedly this was developed by Boeing to keep airplanes working while enduring the worst that 32,000 feet can throw at you. Allegedly it is a waterproof dry lube. All I know is that it's ruddy good stuff. I was round the dad's the other day and tried it on my bike, this is my new favourite chain lube for sure.

Bizarrely it has its own facebook page https://www.facebook.com/Boeshield/
YACF touring/audax bargain basement:
https://bit.ly/2Xg8pRD



Ban cars.

dat

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #51 on: 07 April, 2019, 03:54:03 pm »
In theory it ought to be possible to make a much more wear resistant 1/8" chain (for IGH/SS use) provided it has full (large area) bushings and a high film strength lube is used. However chains made this way are either dirt cheap with soft bushings ( e.g. KMC B1) or fantastically expensive, with bushings of unknown quality. In practice this means that -presumably because of economies of scale- a 3/32" bushingless chain of high quality (eg KMC X1) is most likely to have the longest (cost effective) wear life in such applications.
What about a bushed 3/32 chain like Wippermann's 7R8?
https://www.connexchain.com/en/product/connex-7r8.html

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #52 on: 07 April, 2019, 04:35:15 pm »
In theory it ought to be possible to make a much more wear resistant 1/8" chain (for IGH/SS use) provided it has full (large area) bushings and a high film strength lube is used. However chains made this way are either dirt cheap with soft bushings ( e.g. KMC B1) or fantastically expensive, with bushings of unknown quality. In practice this means that -presumably because of economies of scale- a 3/32" bushingless chain of high quality (eg KMC X1) is most likely to have the longest (cost effective) wear life in such applications.
What about a bushed 3/32 chain like Wippermann's 7R8?
https://www.connexchain.com/en/product/connex-7r8.html

good point; not tried a wippemann chain for years, maybe I should? They also do fully bushed 1/8" chains....

cheers

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #53 on: 07 April, 2019, 04:40:36 pm »
https://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/TOBST9WL/boeshield-t-9-waterproof-lubrication

Boeshield T-9



It's not the cheapest in the world (£15) but it really is the dog's dick as far as I can tell. Supposedly this was developed by Boeing to keep airplanes working while enduring the worst that 32,000 feet can throw at you. Allegedly it is a waterproof dry lube. All I know is that it's ruddy good stuff. I was round the dad's the other day and tried it on my bike, this is my new favourite chain lube for sure.

Bizarrely it has its own facebook page https://www.facebook.com/Boeshield/

It comes out fairly mediocre in the efficiency tests listed below, but that's not the whole story, as some of the lubes listed don't last as long and need topping-up often:

https://www.scribd.com/document/262044061/Velo-Friction-Facts-Chain-Lube-Efficiency-Tests
https://cyclingtips.com/2018/03/fast-chain-lube-that-saves-you-money/

Presumably as it's a dry lube it runs relatively clean?
Old enough to know better, but young enough to do it anyway

bludger

  • Randonneur and bargain hunter
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #54 on: 07 April, 2019, 05:07:05 pm »
Super clean. I'm going off to France to do Paris Roubaix this Thursday (160 km to Busigny, 172 km on the ride itself, plus another 80 to Dunkirk to get the ferry). I'll be taking some of the stuff in a mini soy sauce bottle in case of an emergency top up but I won't be bothering to do a degrease and re-oil before I head off.

That article pegs it as dry lube, but it's actually something between a dry lube and wax, so it doesn't wash off nearly as easily as proper dry lube.

Frankly I'm the sort of person who carries a mini frame pump, three spare tubes, a bagman, carradice saddlebag, frame bag, and a kitchen sink when I go touring, a loss of a few watts is no big deal for me. That test founds it 'adds' 1.7 watts resistance over the poshest of the posh lubes... I can live with that!



Great article though!
YACF touring/audax bargain basement:
https://bit.ly/2Xg8pRD



Ban cars.

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #55 on: 07 April, 2019, 08:41:14 pm »
I have found Purple Extreme to be excellent. Bear in mind that my chains never get subject to the sort of abuse as those subject to the tender mercies of derailleurs.

I first used in it 2015.

Found it really excellent. On a well used drivetrain, tiagra crankset which started with 35k km on it, I was getting about 9k km from chain before 0.75% wear way reached. Applied every 300-400km and rode a lot of 200-400km ride in 2015/16.

I was never again going to use anything else. The new bottle seemed different and there was some formula change to do with flight restrictions.
New lube was dreadful, in spite of no long rides, chain was done in 2k km.

Never again. Unless they change the formula

bludger

  • Randonneur and bargain hunter
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #56 on: 30 May, 2019, 05:07:10 pm »
https://www.planetx.co.uk/deals/q/deal-TOBST9WL

Boeshield now on sale for £10/bottle. It's usually £15 so this is a bargain. This is the lube I really really recommend.
YACF touring/audax bargain basement:
https://bit.ly/2Xg8pRD



Ban cars.

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #57 on: 30 May, 2019, 07:45:34 pm »
https://www.planetx.co.uk/deals/q/deal-TOBST9WL

Boeshield now on sale for £10/bottle. It's usually £15 so this is a bargain. This is the lube I really really recommend.

"Dries to a wax film".    Hmmm.

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #58 on: 31 May, 2019, 10:38:48 am »
I've been happy using Progold (ordinary not Gold) for a number of years.
Seems to last well enough for a 600km unless it's really tipping down.  I carry an eyedropper full just in case it needs topping up, but that's only ever been used on really long rides or when the rain has been really heavy. 
Otherwise a quick wipe to keep things clean after each ride and re-apply every 200km or so.

Tried Rock'nRolll but the bottle I got seemed to have separated, and no amount of shaking would get it remixed.  I concluded I was mostly adding the solvent to the chain and very little lubricant, so went back to Pro-gold.

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #59 on: 31 May, 2019, 10:57:19 am »

Tried Rock'nRolll but the bottle I got seemed to have separated, and no amount of shaking would get it remixed.  I concluded I was mostly adding the solvent to the chain and very little lubricant, so went back to Pro-gold.

quite a lot of chain lubes are like this. Depending on what solvent is in the lube (and temperature, amount added etc) the solvent-contaminated lube may persist for some time and until the solvent has gone, the chain lubricant may not work at all well. Worse yet using the chain in this state may help push all the lube (including what was there before you started) out of the chain bushings.

Typically a solvent borne lube will be between 50 and 75% solvent, and until the solvent has gone, the lubricant properties tend towards those of the solvent not the neat lube.

So I'd definitely advise carrying a non-solvent bearing chain lube if you plan to use it mid-ride and use the bike straight away.

FWIW I've seen a new chain which was degreased and then badly lubed which wore out incredibly quickly. In this case a wax-based lube was used and for whatever reason the lube didn't actually penetrate the bushings in any noticeable way. I don't know this for sure but I  suspect that when the lube was applied the chain was warm enough (having been dried with warmth perhaps) to flash the solvent off quickly, but not so warm that the wax melted and penetrated the chain. The outside of the chain was covered in blobs of wax but there was none in the bushings.   Anyway the chain wore (to about 1% elongation) in less than 200  miles..... :o

cheers

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #60 on: 31 May, 2019, 12:52:26 pm »
I just bought some Squirt (it's not yet arrived). The instructions say to degrease the chain before use (presumably to clear out all the other stuff that would otherwise get in the way. I need to put a new chain on the road bike anyway - what do people usually use for degreasing a (new) chain?

bludger

  • Randonneur and bargain hunter
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #61 on: 31 May, 2019, 01:19:30 pm »
Stick it in an old milk bottle with white spirit and shake thoroughly. I then pour the spirit left over back into the WS bottle with no remorse.
YACF touring/audax bargain basement:
https://bit.ly/2Xg8pRD



Ban cars.

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #62 on: 31 May, 2019, 01:41:36 pm »
Due to a recent unavailability of purple extreme I decided to try some squirt. I put three applications on a newly cleaned chain the did two rides. One 35km the second 280km with the last hour of the second ride in torrential rain. The bike was then put in a hotel store room for three days until I went home. The chain was fine when I got home. So squirt is now my backup lubricant.

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #63 on: 31 May, 2019, 07:54:27 pm »
I think it is worth mentioning that summer rain is not anything like the wet that gets onto a chain in the winter;  in the winter there is road salt and some lubes that perform well in summer rain turn out to be worse than useless when exposed to road salt.

  I think a similar difference can be seen in some areas if the soil chemistry renders the water lying in the road either acidic or alkaline.  Acid is both worse than alkaline and more commonplace; many plants tolerate pH 6-7, i.e. the acid side of neutral. 

Whether the contaminant is road salt or soil based, as the resultant 'water' dries, the solution strength can increase dramatically, and this causes corrosion. I have occasionally seen severe pitting and salt crystals on bikes that have been used in the winter (even just once) and then stored without being washed first.

cheers

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #64 on: 31 May, 2019, 08:21:23 pm »
some anecdata from my recent tour in dry weather. i lubed the chain before the 600k audax, rode it no problem, the chain was still quiet after that. there was another 600k ride after, and i didn't remember in time or had the means to clean the chain, so lubed it again just before the ride without cleaning (it was fairly clean). it lasted fine, no noise, squeaks etc. i have wiped the chain off and rode a further 500k after that with no lubrication as it was still quiet. so 1100km on a single application of lube and would be possibly more, but cleaned the chain properly and re-lubed after returning back home. i've used prolink pro gold oil which will run out either end of this or next year. might get the same again as it works well for me.

pdm

  • Sheffield hills? Nah... Just potholes.
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #65 on: 09 June, 2019, 09:55:18 pm »
Further to my last, since April, I've been experimenting with paraffin wax.

Pros:
Super clean - NO black chain/gears.
Pretty easy to do once you have a "system"
Cheap
Lasts well over 500km of dry riding. (Some people report 1500+km  :o)
Did I say it was super clean?

Cons:
Need to re-lube after a days wet riding. (but, thus far, never during a ride, even long wet ones). On wet multi-day rides away from home, I wipe dry and top up the lube with "Squirt" lube as needed - this seems to be compatible with paraffin wax, it is clean and thus far seems to work very well.
Need to de-grease chains and clusters before embarking on system. (shake it up in white spirit and let dry)
Need to remove chain to proper re-lube.

System:
I am fortunate to have an Aga and a nice metal jug. The jug is big enough for the chain to be submerged when 1/2 full of simple paraffin wax. The wax expands about 20% when melted and warm.
I have pairs of rotating chains. (I use spare 10 speed and 11 speed chains). When a chain that is in use needs lubing, it is spun through a cloth to get any bits off it, removed from the bicycle (very easy with the nice little pliers made for the job and squeezing the Quicklinks together; no mess since the chain is sparkling clean anyway) and replaced by the other ready lubed chain - actually easier to do than usual since the wax makes it super clean and slightly "stiff" so it is very easy to handle and thread, Quicklinks on, and its done - takes less than a minute. Don't even bother with gloves.
To re-lube the chain, an end chain link is threaded onto a bit of (expertly crafted) wire together with the Quicklinks and plonked in the jug of wax with the end of the wire hooked over the edge. The jug then goes into the bottom oven of the Aga (100C) until the wax melts and is up to temperature - usually about a couple of hours or so but its quite safe to leave it in there overnight! (Some enthusiasts recommend a temperature controlled crock pot - £19.99 from Amazon - if you don't have an Aga) The newly waxed chain is then hung up with the other spare in the garage for the next time it is needed (small splash tray under to catch the initial drips).

So far so good, a couple of thousand km in and I am currently well hooked on this system. It is quick, easy, cheap and very clean with the presence of "Squirt" lube making rare multi-day wet rides away from home possible. The gear train looks spotless all the time.
Before, I had to wipe the chain, clean the cogs of the muck on them, lube the chain, run it for some revolutions and then wipe off the excess oil with a cloth to keep it from getting too gunged up. A dirty process that needed the use of gloves or cleaning hands afterwards - the process used to take longer than to replace a nice clean waxed chain with this system...
YMMV, though.

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #66 on: 09 June, 2019, 11:08:11 pm »
Further to my last, since April, I've been experimenting with paraffin wax.
...

thank you for this detailed post. i'm interested if you get any wax flaking off and get stuck to the shoes and carried around the house, rubbed onto the e.g. floor boards or carpet. the reason i ask is that i keep my "best" bikes inside and would not want any wax particles anywhere else than on the chain as they can be very difficult to clean/scrub. in particular when using the bike indoors on a turbo trainer.
my chains are usually sparkling clean on the outside (with light oil lubrication), but if touched they transfer black marks, however none of that black stuff gets on the floors etc.

also - what would the strategy be for a long trip, say 2000km plus?

pdm

  • Sheffield hills? Nah... Just potholes.
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #67 on: 10 June, 2019, 10:44:29 am »

thank you for this detailed post. i'm interested if you get any wax flaking off and get stuck to the shoes and carried around the house, rubbed onto the e.g. floor boards or carpet. the reason i ask is that i keep my "best" bikes inside and would not want any wax particles anywhere else than on the chain as they can be very difficult to clean/scrub. in particular when using the bike indoors on a turbo trainer.
my chains are usually sparkling clean on the outside (with light oil lubrication), but if touched they transfer black marks, however none of that black stuff gets on the floors etc.

also - what would the strategy be for a long trip, say 2000km plus?

I've found that excess wax flakes off only for the first 5km or so of a ride. Once back, the chain is pretty much excess wax free and clean. Before the ride, the excess wax has not had much chance to flake unless you spin the cranks. I use neat paraffin wax without any oil additives so cool wax is not sticky; the flakes that do form and fall off under the bike stand while fitting the chain are swept up with a brush and pan. Only dripping hot wax will stick to the floor unless stepped on and ground in. Not had a problem yet with carrying wax into the house.
Some punters recommend wiping the chain with kitchen roll paper as you remove it from the hot wax bath to get rid of the excess - not tried it myself but it makes sense. Others recommend spinning the cranks and using a washing up brush to brush any flakes off, which can be swept up.
"Squirt" recommend using such a brush to get rid of bits of wax and dirt before doing a re-lube although running the chain through a soft cloth is probably as good. "Squirt" will drop wax unless you are careful. I can't say I have found the need to do so...

This is what my geartrain looks like after a post wax ride:




WRT long 2000km rides - I've not even contemplated any that length since going wax  :D; the longest I've been away is a week of leisurely rides - I took along a bottle of "Squirt" which was not used (only rode through a couple of very short showers). I suspect that if I did, a bottle of "Squirt" would suffice - Scouring the interweb reveals that there is a loyal Squirt following. Most appear to simply wipe clean and re-apply Squirt after a wet ride day year round. Squirt is water based and apparently works best if left to dry for a few hours; you have to remember to apply when reaching your evening stop, not just before leaving in the morning...

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #68 on: 10 June, 2019, 03:10:54 pm »
wax is very interesting but I suspect that road salt will make mincemeat of it. I shall be interested to see how you get on in the wintertime.

FWIW it occurs to me that any residual grot on the sprockets could presumably be removed by simply tipping a kettle full of hot water over them; the wax should melt and carry the dirt away.

BTW in your photo your mudguard stays look a bit unhappy; the eye is 'flaring' and something bad may happen. A bigger washer may sort it.

cheers

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #69 on: 10 June, 2019, 07:15:18 pm »
Paraffin wax did very well in these tests: https://www.scribd.com/document/262044061/Velo-Friction-Facts-Chain-Lube-Efficiency-Tests

Has anyone tried Molten Speed Wax?: https://moltenspeedwax.com/

It's basically paraffin wax mixed with PTFE and molybdenum

Seems to give even better results than pure paraffin wax according to another test Velo magazine did: http://www.lillylube.com/uploads/Link_to_Velo_Article.pdf

Also did well in durability tests: https://cyclingtips.com/2018/03/fast-chain-lube-that-saves-you-money/
Old enough to know better, but young enough to do it anyway

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #70 on: 10 June, 2019, 10:25:59 pm »
yeah, no testing in conditions that simulate a UK winter, sadly.

cheers

pdm

  • Sheffield hills? Nah... Just potholes.
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #71 on: 11 June, 2019, 09:39:54 am »
Molten Speed Wax and Squirt are >10x more expensive than paraffin wax.... I suspect they don't last 10x longer!
God willing, I will report back next spring.  :)

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #72 on: 12 July, 2019, 06:08:33 pm »
experimentation continues. put on a new chain on my ss bike and decided to lubricate only when it starts making noise. more than 1500km later (of dry weather cycling) the chain is still quiet and no measurable wear so far. all i was doing is wiping the chain off with a dry rag after every ride.
i'm tempted to continue, however don't want to wear out the chain sooner than necessary, so will start lubing after another ride or two.

pdm

  • Sheffield hills? Nah... Just potholes.
Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #73 on: 05 September, 2021, 02:17:47 pm »
Follow-up 2 years later.
I am currently cycling about 20-25000km per year since retiring.
I am still using my wax system on my 4 bicycles and turbo trainer (Now using a crockpot due to wifely complaints about "finding things in the oven") and it works well - no intention of going back to other lubes.
Usually swap chains every 600km but some have lasted over 1000km per waxing.
I wipe the hot chains through paper toweling as I withdraw them from the crockpot to remove excess wax before hanging them up on a suitable hanger for later use.
Chain life is definitely improved.... ~16000km indoors. 6000km (and still going strong) outdoors.
Winter grit - no problems so far the grit goes the same way as other dirt - it just flakes off with the wax - I do top up the wax more frequently after wet winter rides more frequently.
Oh - did I mention that it was a CLEAN system?

Re: Chain Lube
« Reply #74 on: 05 September, 2021, 05:53:02 pm »
Can you clue me in...I tried waxing (with paraffin wax) this year and couldn't get it to work. Liked the cleanliness, but suffered from a lot of chain noise, a waxed chain would barely make it to 100km before it became intolerable. Used a thermometer to ensure adequate temps were reached, so it's not that.
"There are proven ways; play on the certain knowledge of their superiority, the mystique of secret covenant, the esprit of shared suffering"